Who ever said I wanted Mika to start? You just assume I'm a "Mika" guy? I'm a Sabres fan first, and basically I'm a "anybody but Marty" guy.
Let Mika and Miller battle it out, and let the best man win. I already know what Marty will get me, and that's anywhere from 9th to 12th in the conference. Let's see if another guy can do it, or do you just want to go with the old shoe that fits?
No, I'm for letting the best man win. So far that has been Biron.
I'm against getting rid of X so that it's easier for (insert favorite player here).
The team as a whole has been unable to get to the playoffs. Many people want to lay that all at Birons feet even though his record is up there with the other goaltenders of the week that people want to replace him with.
If we have to have one of the top 5 goaltenders in the league to just make the playoffs, maybe there are deeper problems...
The team as a whole has been unable to get to the playoffs. Many people want to lay that all at Birons feet even though his record is up there with the other goaltenders of the week that people want to replace him with.
If we have to have one of the top 5 goaltenders in the league to just make the playoffs, maybe there are deeper problems...
I'm not laying the blame all at his feet, if you read something I wrote earlier, I said:
"I need my teams starting goaltender to be a bigger part of the solution, then the problem. At times Marty has been a big part of the solution, but for long spurts, he is our biggest problem. That is called incosistancy, which is exactly what you get with this guy. In the end, them lapses add up and help cost this team the playoffs, year after year."
As far as your last comment, I agree the problems do run deeper. It's a heck of a lot cheaper to replace an average goalie, with a 6 million/year elite one, then it is to replace 6 forwards and 3 below average defensmen with better ones.
Once again, we need a better goalie to reach the playoffs. Seems pretty simple to me...
I'm not laying the blame all at his feet, if you read something I wrote earlier, I said:
"I need my teams starting goaltender to be a bigger part of the solution, then the problem. At times Marty has been a big part of the solution, but for long spurts, he is our biggest problem. That is called incosistancy, which is exactly what you get with this guy. In the end, them lapses add up and help cost this team the playoffs, year after year."
As far as your last comment, I agree the problems do run deeper. It's a heck of a lot cheaper to replace an average goalie, with a 6 million/year elite one, then it is to replace 6 forwards and 3 below average defensmen with better ones.
Once again, we need a better goalie to reach the playoffs. Seems pretty simple to me...
Maybe if we got Luongo (for instance) we would make the playoffs. Then what? If the rest of the team is still weak, we won't do much once we are there. Is it better to get bumped in the first round every year than to not make the playoffs at all?
I do disagree that Biron has been the biggest problem for long spurts. Does he make mistakes? Of course. Every goaltender has stretches when they make more mistakes than we would like, but it gets way over blown here because we haven't made it to the playoffs in 3 years.
Maybe if we got Luongo (for instance) we would make the playoffs. Then what? If the rest of the team is still weak, we won't do much once we are there. Is it better to get bumped in the first round every year than to not make the playoffs at all?
I do disagree that Biron has been the biggest problem for long spurts. Does he make mistakes? Of course. Every goaltender has stretches when they make more mistakes than we would like, but it gets way over blown here because we haven't made it to the playoffs in 3 years.
It seems as if we'll have to agree to disagree. I'm not going to convince you, and you aren't going to convince me.
I appreciate the fact that we could debate this, without throwing cheap shots at one another. That is why I like this board, and look forward to rooting our team on together.
In the end, if Marty is the starter come opening night, I will root him on like crazy. I want what's best for the Sabres, and if Marty proves to be that this season, I'll be just as stoked as I would be if it was Mika or Ryan.
It seems as if we'll have to agree to disagree. I'm not going to convince you, and you aren't going to convince me.
I appreciate the fact that we could debate this, without throwing cheap shots at one another. That is why I like this board, and look forward to rooting our team on together.
Welcome to the board. but stop using my lines! Just Kidding
What I find very interesting is that all the people who are Anti-Biron keep sticking up for Mika and want to see him be the starting goalie for the Sabres. Why all the love for Mika?
Ryan Miller just finished winning 41 games in the AHL. His track record is much more impressive than Mika's, and he defiently has not been given a chance with this team. I think he has a much better shot at earing the job this year.
What I find very interesting is that all the people who are Anti-Biron keep sticking up for Mika and want to see him be the starting goalie for the Sabres. Why all the love for Mika?
It's not necessarily love for Mika, at least from my standpoint, but since folks want to argue numbers, Mika's the only other goalie with a sufficient body of work with the Sabres to make comparisons with.
Personally, I'm more enthused about Miller than Noronen, but I'll take either over Biron at this point. Marty's had his chance to distinguish himself, and hasn't done so. It's time to move him along to some other team.
Just to clarify, I'm slightly anti-Miller...only versus the hype he has. I think he'd probably make a very decent 25-30 game a year backup. I'm not anti-Biron at all, I just think Mika will give the same/slightly better result for 1/3 the salary, and he's a few years younger. I also just have this feeling that Mika's going to break out soon.
We're all pretty reasonable and well-informed here. Yet we can't come to any kind of consensus on resolving the Sabres goaltending situation. Isn't it reasonable to assume that same debate is going on within the Sabres organization? I can't imagine the people on the scouting staff who pushed to select Noronen aren't still pushing for the guy. We also don't know where Larry Quinn stands on the matter. He's the one that'll probably ultimately make the call and he tried to get Hasek back in 2004!
What I find very interesting is that all the people who are Anti-Biron keep sticking up for Mika and want to see him be the starting goalie for the Sabres. Why all the love for Mika?
Ryan Miller just finished winning 41 games in the AHL. His track record is much more impressive than Mika's, and he defiently has not been given a chance with this team. I think he has a much better shot at earing the job this year.
I'll admit that I've been a Noronen fan since his Amerks days but though I usually don't bring up Miller I haven't discounted him from the equation. IMO, if I made the decisions, unless someone had an absolutely brilliant training camp where there was no doubt who #1 would be, I'd rotate Noronen and Miller in a two game on, two game off strategy for about 20 games or so and then evaluate afterwards.
We're all pretty reasonable and well-informed here. Yet we can't come to any kind of consensus on resolving the Sabres goaltending situation. Isn't it reasonable to assume that same debate is going on within the Sabres organization? I can't imagine the people on the scouting staff who pushed to select Noronen aren't still pushing for the guy.
to be fair, its fast becoming that only the die hard Biron fanboys want him to stay. everyone else, be they neutrals, or in the Mika or Miller 'camps' is moving towards dumping Marty.
this was shown clearly in the recent poll, which was 'won' easily by Biron.
i think your right tho. of course theres love for Biron in the Sabres camp... there always will be while Ruff and the 'Biron fetish' is there.
FACT- The Sabres have reached the playoffs ZERO times with Marty Biron as their starting goaltender.
As a fan of the team first, and individual players second, that is the ONLY fact I care about. All other stats are irrelevant, unless you're talking about a Roberto Luongo, where it is obvious he stands on his head night after night.
How many times has Luongo led his team to the playoffs?
to be fair, its fast becoming that only the die hard Biron fanboys want him to stay. everyone else, be they neutrals, or in the Mika or Miller 'camps' is moving towards dumping Marty.
this was shown clearly in the recent poll, which was 'won' easily by Biron.
i think your right tho. of course theres love for Biron in the Sabres camp... there always will be while Ruff and the 'Biron fetish' is there.
Considering all the empirical evidence supports Biron, it looks like you have it backwards. Any objective analysis of the stats supports Biron. The support for Noronen/Miller is based on feelings that are either pro-Noronon/Miller or anti-Biron with nothing in the way of evidence to back it up. That's not to say there isn't a contingent of Biron fans who would support him no matter what, but at this stage of the debate they have a better case.
Biron was well above .500 in his last season. Coaches always have a fetish for a winning record. The competition will be pretty wide open. There's uncertainty about how rusty Biron will be after not playing during the lockout along with little expectation he could have improved. Noronen's game looks like it matured during his season in Finland and it has to be seen whether that carries over to the NHL. A highly respected veteran player in Numminen will be there to lend support to Noronen, as well as fellow Finn, Lydman, who's certain to play on the top 4. Ruff can't afford to alienate those guys by showing favoritism to Biron. Miller looks like he's ready to be an NHL backup who will challenge for starts. I don't see him developing if a bad game means a bus trip to Rochester, so this better get resolved in camp.
Considering all the empirical evidence supports Biron, it looks like you have it backwards. Any objective analysis of the stats supports Biron. The support for Noronen/Miller is based on feelings that are either pro-Noronon/Miller or anti-Biron with nothing in the way of evidence to back it up. That's not to say there isn't a contingent of Biron fans who would support him no matter what, but at this stage of the debate they have a better case.
so this better get resolved in camp.
i was talking about general opinion of fans, and that was shown in the poll done recently. a landslide vote for moving Marty. be it because of his salary, or that people think he sucks.. whatever.
i agree with your last point too. i think every Sabres fan does, no matter which 'camp' they're in.
How many times has Luongo led his team to the playoffs?
That was my point...
He is the only goalie I could tolerate not making the playoffs with (along with Dom, obviously). It's so obvious that he is the best thing going on that team, night after night.
Thats crazy, I wonder if we did sign him how this would have affected our current goalie debacle???
If they signed Hasek, some fans would still go on about how even though there`s no facts to support it, they just know that Noronen would be better than Hasek if only he was given (without having to earn it) the starter role for a few seasons to help his confidence.
As far as Hasek goes, I'd say thanks for the good years, but no thanks. He's too much of an injury risk and adds drama to the team. That's one thing that the Sabres management does well enough, you don't need the players chipping in drama all over the place.
We're all pretty reasonable and well-informed here. Yet we can't come to any kind of consensus on resolving the Sabres goaltending situation. Isn't it reasonable to assume that same debate is going on within the Sabres organization? I can't imagine the people on the scouting staff who pushed to select Noronen aren't still pushing for the guy. We also don't know where Larry Quinn stands on the matter. He's the one that'll probably ultimately make the call and he tried to get Hasek back in 2004!
Just Kidding
