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Old
06-30-2011, 06:27 AM
  #101
PredsV82
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Originally Posted by codeyh View Post
ahem.....
Ill take a crows wing with some smoky bbq sauce please.

But, just because a grievance is filed doesn't mean we will lose.

If we are exonerated, ill be back with the rest of the bird and some serving tongs.

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06-30-2011, 06:36 AM
  #102
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Originally Posted by nophun View Post
Why do you guys think one year?
I am sure it is 2 from reading the CBA and it is what Bobby Mac and Co. have been saying.

http://tsn.ca/nhl/story/?id=369291

-BOB MCKENZIE

Only place I see people saying "Weber can take 1 year and be a UFA" is random blogs. (by people from teams like the Canucks)

I really don't think he can ...
The date for determining you age for a given year is either sept 1 or sept 15. Besides, he is in the same draft class as suter and that class will be ufa next year

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06-30-2011, 06:51 AM
  #103
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Originally Posted by kypredsfan View Post
Can we ever go through 1 ****ing summer without some kind of speedbump for this franchise?
The answer would be: NO.

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06-30-2011, 07:00 AM
  #104
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So, the ruling would have to come today, right?
Darren Dreger
NHL legal team going over the facts of PA's grievance over Nash Q.O offers this am. Arbitrator expected to see case and rule in early July.


...and there it is.

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06-30-2011, 07:10 AM
  #105
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"Early July" is pretty vague. Just guessing, but I'd imagine if the NHL's legal team says the PA has a case, Poile would make offers to sign the players ASAP. Hopefully, they aren't too inflated.

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06-30-2011, 07:59 AM
  #106
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I'm so sick of this ****. As if the summer is long enough. We have to always find a way to make it absolutely suck. I swear if this is just the freakin' NHLPA trying to start **** where **** didn't exist I might come unglued. I already don't like Fehr...

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06-30-2011, 08:19 AM
  #107
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Originally Posted by ThirdManIn View Post
I'm so sick of this ****. As if the summer is long enough. We have to always find a way to make it absolutely suck. I swear if this is just the freakin' NHLPA trying to start **** where **** didn't exist I might come unglued. I already don't like Fehr...
while I dont think the NHLPA would make something up out of thin air i do think there is probably some element of them trying to show that they have some relevance.

The way it has unfolded so far is that, unlike the Chicago situation where the Hawks admitted they screwed up, the preds feel they have a case and so it will be interesting to see what the arbiter does.

Three other things come to mind.... someone obviously had to tell the NHLPA... wonder which player(or more likely which players agent) blew the whistle??

second, if the arbiter doesnt rule until say, july 7th or 8th, you gotta figure a lot of teams will have already done their FA shopping. that will help

and third, if any of these players were eligible for arbitration, what does this do to their ability to file? When is the deadline for players to file for arbitration? if they go ahead and file I assume that would commit them to us...

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06-30-2011, 08:34 AM
  #108
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The deadline for teams to file for arbitration has long passed. I'm pretty sure it was the 7th of June or something.

This year's UFA pool is terrible. Even if it weren't, teams try to sign their bigger named FA acquisitions early. After a week of FA being open you seem more of the lower level guys signed. Guys like Spaling, Halischuk, and O'Reilly. SK could even be thrown in there, though I could see teams going after him early if he were available. I'm not too concerned with losing O'Reilly as I didn't expect to bring him back anyway. Halischuk would be nice to have around, but he's replaceable. Spaling and SK we definitely need to keep for obvious reasons. I don't think Spaling would try to inflate his salary too much, but I could definitely see SK trying.

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06-30-2011, 08:40 AM
  #109
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Hopefully Poile is proactive and starts signing these guys now.

I would guess this would mean Koistitsyn is long gone. He'll likely be the one looking for a really big raise and will bend Poile over. Just a guess on my part. Poile will then use excuses in the paper as to why he was let go.

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06-30-2011, 08:40 AM
  #110
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Originally Posted by PredsV82 View Post

second, if the arbiter doesnt rule until say, july 7th or 8th, you gotta figure a lot of teams will have already done their FA shopping. that will help
This will also hurt us if they do become free agents and we need to get someone to replace them.

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06-30-2011, 08:50 AM
  #111
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So, what will happen to them until the ruling? Remain RFAs?

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06-30-2011, 09:00 AM
  #112
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Originally Posted by PredsV82 View Post
while I dont think the NHLPA would make something up out of thin air i do think there is probably some element of them trying to show that they have some relevance.

.....other things come to mind.... someone obviously had to tell the NHLPA... wonder which player(or more likely which players agent) blew the whistle??
Yeah, there's got to be at least something there for them to file a grievance. Of course unions are always looking for test cases, but this doesn't seem like one of those situations were they might be testing the "we sent it out by the deadline" versus the "player must receive by the deadline" situations or else they would have included more than just the Preds in this matter because no way every player around the world received their QO in time.

The interesting thing is that the PA is going to file on behalf the membership...but you might actually have the situation were the players involved don't actually care if the deadline was missed. But of course that has no bearing on the PA's responsibility to the membership as a whole so they file anyway. Who tipped the PA is a good question. Other than SK then maybe Cal O, the rest of the guys are kind of lucky to have NHL jobs. My point is that I can't imagine that any of the players are really in a position to bite the hand that feeds them other than SK who clearly could be making boat loads more money if he could go UFA. I really have to believe that it was an agent, most likely SK's, that brought this to the attention of the PA to....wait for it...make more money. Nobody thinks the (alleged) late filing was intentional, but it would take a money grubbing, self interested agent to make this an issue.

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06-30-2011, 09:11 AM
  #113
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Originally Posted by ThirdManIn View Post
The deadline for teams to file for arbitration has long passed. I'm pretty sure it was the 7th of June or something.

This year's UFA pool is terrible. Even if it weren't, teams try to sign their bigger named FA acquisitions early. After a week of FA being open you seem more of the lower level guys signed. Guys like Spaling, Halischuk, and O'Reilly. SK could even be thrown in there, though I could see teams going after him early if he were available. I'm not too concerned with losing O'Reilly as I didn't expect to bring him back anyway. Halischuk would be nice to have around, but he's replaceable. Spaling and SK we definitely need to keep for obvious reasons. I don't think Spaling would try to inflate his salary too much, but I could definitely see SK trying.
deadline for players to file isnt until after they receive their QOs

and yeah, SK is the one that would really benefit from this if it goes through

but thats still a big IF


also, whatever happened to the poile comment that we had re-signed Oreilly?? I am guessing that was a slip of the tongue by Poile

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06-30-2011, 09:35 AM
  #114
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Originally Posted by hohenwaldpredfan View Post
I think I speak for everyone here when I say:
****

Pretty much! This is seriously busch league, I want an explanation!


Quote:
Originally Posted by hohenwaldpredfan View Post
So, what will happen to them until the ruling? Remain RFAs?
Anyone know the answer to this? I'm curious too.


Thank God we filed for arbitration with Weber. If he was affected by this I would ****ing die.

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06-30-2011, 09:39 AM
  #115
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Originally Posted by AEM6729 View Post
Pretty much! This is seriously busch league, I want an explanation!




Anyone know the answer to this? I'm curious too.


Thank God we filed for arbitration with Weber. If he was affected by this I would ****ing die.
If that would've happened I probably would've renounced my fan card & become a Canes fan permanently

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06-30-2011, 09:40 AM
  #116
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I would think they remain RFA's until a ruling is passed. Wouldn't make sense otherwise.

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06-30-2011, 09:59 AM
  #117
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Originally Posted by PredsV82 View Post
The date for determining you age for a given year is either sept 1 or sept 15. Besides, he is in the same draft class as suter and that class will be ufa next year
It's 27 or 7 accrued seasons to become a group III UFA. On June 30, 2012, Weber will only be 26 and he will only have 6 accrued seasons (Weber did not get an accrued season in 2005-06; he only played 28 regular season games and a skater needs 40+ NHL games on the active roster in one season for an accrued season).

September 15 is the date for determining your age with regards to an ELC (Article 9.2). It is defined as age as of June 30th for determining UFA status (Article 10.1 (a)(i)).

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06-30-2011, 10:04 AM
  #118
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[QUOTE=AEM6729;34350719]Pretty much! This is seriously busch league, I want an explanation!




Anyone know the answer to this? I'm curious too.


Thank God we filed for arbitration with Weber. If he was affected by this I would ****ing die.[/QUOTE]

Whoa, in the hoopla around the QO filing deadline it hadn't occurred to me about the huge stroke of luck that this happened. Assuming that the switch in agents is what led Weber to delay which led to Poile filing for arbitration, and them not seeing this QO deadline thing coming, then for the first time in Preds history, you guys actually caught a lucky break! (At least a lucky break with Weber safe that offsets some of the bad luck on this filing hiccup.)

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06-30-2011, 10:15 AM
  #119
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Something tells me that had the team not filed for arbitration with Weber we wouldn't be in this mess. Weber would have been top priority for a QO, so it seems to me that whoever was in charge of sending out the QOs (Fenton?) wouldn't have waited to the last minute, assuming that is indeed what happened.

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06-30-2011, 10:15 AM
  #120
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Originally Posted by Preds Partisan View Post
Yeah, there's got to be at least something there for them to file a grievance. Of course unions are always looking for test cases, but this doesn't seem like one of those situations were they might be testing the "we sent it out by the deadline" versus the "player must receive by the deadline" situations or else they would have included more than just the Preds in this matter because no way every player around the world received their QO in time.

The interesting thing is that the PA is going to file on behalf the membership...but you might actually have the situation were the players involved don't actually care if the deadline was missed. But of course that has no bearing on the PA's responsibility to the membership as a whole so they file anyway. Who tipped the PA is a good question. Other than SK then maybe Cal O, the rest of the guys are kind of lucky to have NHL jobs. My point is that I can't imagine that any of the players are really in a position to bite the hand that feeds them other than SK who clearly could be making boat loads more money if he could go UFA. I really have to believe that it was an agent, most likely SK's, that brought this to the attention of the PA to....wait for it...make more money. Nobody thinks the (alleged) late filing was intentional, but it would take a money grubbing, self interested agent to make this an issue.
yes, is this a ploy to get more $ out of Poile, if SK wants to stay.... I like this theory

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06-30-2011, 10:17 AM
  #121
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Originally Posted by Sam View Post
It's 27 or 7 accrued seasons to become a group III UFA. On June 30, 2012, Weber will only be 26 and he will only have 6 accrued seasons (Weber did not get an accrued season in 2005-06; he only played 28 regular season games and a skater needs 40+ NHL games on the active roster in one season for an accrued season).

September 15 is the date for determining your age with regards to an ELC (Article 9.2). It is defined as age as of June 30th for determining UFA status (Article 10.1 (a)(i)).
I believe the 7 accrued seasons rule was for the first year of the new CBA and has since decreased to four accrued seasons.

and if you are right about the RFA thing I will be pleased but I still think you are mistaken.

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06-30-2011, 10:20 AM
  #122
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I would think they remain RFA's until a ruling is passed. Wouldn't make sense otherwise.
thats correct. with the NHL issuing their statement, the players are RFA in the leagues eyes until the arbiter says otherwise.

everyone needs to take a deep breath and remember that the preds are contesting this, which is again unlike the Chicago situation.

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06-30-2011, 10:20 AM
  #123
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Welcome back to the lineup.. J....P... DUUUUUUUUUMOOOONNTT

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06-30-2011, 10:26 AM
  #124
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I believe the 7 accrued seasons rule was for the first year of the new CBA and has since decreased to four accrued seasons.

and if you are right about the RFA thing I will be pleased but I still think you are mistaken.
CBA Article 10.1
Quote:
For (A) the 2005-06 League Year, any Player who is 31 years of age or older and has four (4) Accrued Seasons as of June 30 of the end of the 2004-05 League Year, (B) the 2006-07 League Year, any Player who either has eight (8) Accrued Seasons or is 29 years of age or older as of June 30 of the end of the 2005-06 League Year, (C) the 2007-08 League Year, any Player who either has seven (7) Accrued Seasons or is 28 Years of age or older as of June 30 of the end of the 2006-07 League Year, and (D) the 2008-09, 2009-10, 2010-11 League Years, any Player who either has seven (7) Accrued Seasons or is 27 years of age or older as of June 30 of the end of the 2007-08, 2008-09, 2009-10 League Year, shall, if his most recent SPC has expired, with such expiry occurring either as of June 30 of the applicable League Year or June 30 of any prior League Year, become an Unrestricted Free Agent. Such Player shall be completely free to negotiate and sign an SPC with any Club, and any Club shall be completely free to negotiate and sign an SPC with such Player, without penalty or restriction, or being subject to any Right of First Refusal, Draft Choice Compensation or any other compensation or equalization obligation of any kind.

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06-30-2011, 10:26 AM
  #125
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The date for determining you age for a given year is either sept 1 or sept 15. Besides, he is in the same draft class as suter and that class will be ufa next year
No, not for UFA. It's the age as of July 1. Suter was born in January, Weber in August. That's why Suter is a UFA next year and Weber has 2 years left of RFA status. He's 25 now and currently has 5 seasons of ''accrued'' NHL service (40 games). You need 7 accrued season to be a UFA or be 27 years old.

Oops, I realize this was just posted above me. But yeah, it just re-inforces what I think. Weber has 2 years of service time left. The Predators waiting to call him up in 2005-06 was very smart.

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