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Does The Connolly Signing Make Grabovski Expendable?

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Old
07-02-2011, 06:48 PM
  #51
seanlinden
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Originally Posted by robdicks View Post
So the only reason is because Joffrey is the wrong type of roll right now? Do you have any evidence that a big bodied forward that can work the cycle down low and crash the crease is available?

Ryder is only 750K less than Lupul. Surely being overpaid by 750K is not the difference from being a good move and a senseless contract.

Besides its pretty obvious they only aquired Lupul as a salary dump for Jake Gardiner.
Well yeah, players need to be acquired to fill certain roles. It's Burke's job to make an effective winger for Kessel available.

The fact that Lupul's overpaid is just icing on the cake. Players must be acquired for a reason (the lack of which is what makes some deals senseless). Generally, good reasons to acquire a player are a) if you need a player of that type, like we did with Conolly, b) his contract is so good that you adjust your team around him, or c) the return is so good that you make it work.

None of those were present for Lupul. He doesn't fit the profile of our needs now or in the projectable future. He's overpaid by about $750k. The return of Gardiner was probalbly about Beauchemin's worth, so no reason to take back Lupul.

Besides it's pretty obvious that we lost Francois Beauchemin in that deal, who could've problably garnered a gardiner-level prospect with no salary dump.

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Old
07-02-2011, 06:53 PM
  #52
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Burke is not an idiot. There is no way that he thinks Connolly is the answer to the Leafs #1 centre need. Connolly is a good option as a playmaking #2 centre who can kill penalties, we know that, and Burke knows that.

We also know that Burke likes to get the most he can out of the players that he doesn't consider part of the core. I'm only guessing, but he may not consider Grabovski and Kulemin part of the core going forward. We all know how he prefers North American players, and shipping out two valuable assets entering the primes of their respective careers may be what he's thinking.

There was talk that Kulemin was involved in the Richards trade discussion (although no one knows what really happened there). Kulemin and Grabovski will also be up for big pay raises soon, which Burke may not feel comfortable giving them.

All of this makes me wonder if these two (or just Grabovski) will be shipped out this summer in a package to acquire a star #1 centre that the Leafs still desperately need.

Thoughts?
I think that every time the Leafs acquire a player someone starts a thread thinking that it means that someone else is going to leave.

Thanks for keeping the tradition going.

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07-02-2011, 06:54 PM
  #53
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For some reason I expected you to hate this signing.
He lead the charge. Great analysis again Sean.

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07-02-2011, 06:54 PM
  #54
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See, I'm crazy but I would have traded Beach for Lupul 1-1, Gardiner is just sort of....

Burkies deal with Anaheim were some of my favourites, lol.

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07-02-2011, 06:55 PM
  #55
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Simple really, it just means Richards didn't sign with us.

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Old
07-02-2011, 06:55 PM
  #56
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Originally Posted by seanlinden View Post
Well yeah, players need to be acquired to fill certain roles. It's Burke's job to make an effective winger for Kessel available.

The fact that Lupul's overpaid is just icing on the cake. Players must be acquired for a reason (the lack of which is what makes some deals senseless).
That you can't see that Lupul fits a need is senseless.

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07-02-2011, 06:59 PM
  #57
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Originally Posted by mooseOAK View Post
That you can't see that Lupul fits a need is senseless.
Don't provoke him, too late here comes the rant.

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07-02-2011, 07:01 PM
  #58
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Originally Posted by seanlinden View Post
Well yeah, players need to be acquired to fill certain roles. It's Burke's job to make an effective winger for Kessel available.

The fact that Lupul's overpaid is just icing on the cake. Players must be acquired for a reason (the lack of which is what makes some deals senseless). Generally, good reasons to acquire a player are a) if you need a player of that type, like we did with Conolly, b) his contract is so good that you adjust your team around him, or c) the return is so good that you make it work.

None of those were present for Lupul. He doesn't fit the profile of our needs now or in the projectable future. He's overpaid by about $750k. The return of Gardiner was probalbly about Beauchemin's worth, so no reason to take back Lupul.

Besides it's pretty obvious that we lost Francois Beauchemin in that deal, who could've problably garnered a gardiner-level prospect with no salary dump.
Players with the ability to score 20 goals a season aren't salary dumps.


Also you need to change your avatar bro, Giguere came off the books.

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07-02-2011, 07:02 PM
  #59
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I hope we keep Grabo!!

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07-02-2011, 07:03 PM
  #60
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Lupul looks underpaid considering what everyone else got in this market.

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07-02-2011, 07:03 PM
  #61
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Originally Posted by mooseOAK View Post
That you can't see that Lupul fits a need is senseless.
this.

Even if its not the EXACT type of player we need, its a nice stop-gap until we find one. Tim Connolly isn't the EXACT type of center we need either. We need one who is much more skilled than Connolly. We just are using Connolly as a stop-gap until we find said center, whether its filled by Kadri/Colborne, or by someone else.

Sometimes what you are looking for can't be found, and then after that you have to just go with the next best thing.

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07-02-2011, 07:09 PM
  #62
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I don't really understand why signing Connolly makes Grabovski expendable.

ridiculous thread

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Old
07-02-2011, 07:37 PM
  #63
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i think connoly makes bozak expendible. i know we needed a no1 centre and for the time being we have connoly but i really think he will if he stays could be a great 3rd line shoutdown guy and pk specialist. That imo would be his perfect role especially since he can also sub in on the first two lines in case of injury.

its a good pick up given what was available the term is good no point expecting him to be a superstar first line centre. We have him for the time being and he may fit in very well down the road...

What i really like about this signing is that if we dont pick up a great no1 centre connoly is a reasonable stop gap and if we do eventually get a no 1 connoly will still fit in nicely

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07-02-2011, 08:00 PM
  #64
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No, it doesn't.

Grabovski might be traded at the deadline for whatever the reason, but right now he's here to stay for sure.

No reason to think he can't improve a bit on what he's done last year.

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07-02-2011, 08:17 PM
  #65
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No.

It makes Bozak expendable. Bozak still has lots of potential, we may get more back from him if a GM is willing to take a chance on him. Grabo is as good as he's gonna get...I'm not saying its not good. Grabo is great, but we may get more back with Bozak.

My two cents.

I mean honestly, he's gonna be bumped down to the third line, theres no way Wilson or Burke is gonna break up that Kule-Grabo-Mac line. Bozak is expendable. He can be a good PK man, but so can Armstrong, and I'd rather Armstrong than Bozak.

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07-02-2011, 08:17 PM
  #66
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what this signing really does is it gives Colborne and Kadri time to develop rather than being rushed. Now they can spend an extra year or two in the Marlies. Also it gives possibile trade deadline bait.

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07-02-2011, 08:23 PM
  #67
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grabovski is going to make BANK in free agency so i don't see him resigning with us

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07-02-2011, 08:30 PM
  #68
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We only had one quality line all last season, in large part due to Grabovski. You can't just dump players that make a difference unless (as mentioned) he's packaged for that top tier talent.

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07-02-2011, 08:30 PM
  #69
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I think it's just safest to say it gives management a few more options.

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Old
07-02-2011, 08:51 PM
  #70
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Grabo > Connolly

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07-02-2011, 08:52 PM
  #71
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I want Grabo to stay, he has a whole lot of potential which I like.

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07-02-2011, 08:54 PM
  #72
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No. It just means that Kadri, Schenn, etc. aren't being expended.

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07-02-2011, 10:20 PM
  #73
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you know what ilike about Connolly, ever since he got hurt his stats have gotten better lol. He went from a .5 ppg player to like a 1.0 ppg player almost with those shortened years, even tho all were min half seasons. Shows he has the talent if he's healthy

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Old
07-02-2011, 10:30 PM
  #74
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Grade 1 math is all you need to answer this question. With 4 center spots on an NHL roster and only TWO centers signed -- Grabo and TC -- how the heck does any center become expendable?

Even when Bozak is signed they are still going to have to go get one more.

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Old
07-02-2011, 10:49 PM
  #75
seanlinden
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Edgeworth View Post
Players with the ability to score 20 goals a season aren't salary dumps.


Also you need to change your avatar bro, Giguere came off the books.
Players with the ability to score 20 goals and who are paid more than equivalent players in free agency are salary dumps.

I don't need to change my avatar, just because Giguere is off the books doesn't mean it wasn't a senseless contract acqusition on Brian Burke's record.

Quote:
Originally Posted by robdicks View Post
this.

Even if its not the EXACT type of player we need, its a nice stop-gap until we find one. Tim Connolly isn't the EXACT type of center we need either. We need one who is much more skilled than Connolly. We just are using Connolly as a stop-gap until we find said center, whether its filled by Kadri/Colborne, or by someone else.

Sometimes what you are looking for can't be found, and then after that you have to just go with the next best thing.
If Joffrey Lupul was just a slightly not good enough version of the winger Kessel needs, then it wouldn't be a problem. But he's not, he's basically the complete opposite of the type of player we need. When you're trying to build a team and manage a cap, fit always comes first because skill level is loosely determined by cap hit.

Of course, the perfect winger for Kessel is problably Rick Nash, which ins't happening... so you go down the list of players who fit the style of play required...that's what we did with Tim Connolly. Is he the 80+ point centre we'd like? no, but he's a playmaker who has a decent 2-way game, and the best playmaker available to us. The Leafs need to pay for size and crease crashing ability opposite Phil Kessel, not a guy to go to the middle of the ice. Heck, we'd have been better with Alexei Ponikarovsky on Kessel's wing than we would have with Lupul.


Last edited by seanlinden: 07-02-2011 at 10:58 PM.
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