HFBoards

Go Back   HFBoards > NHL Eastern Conference > Metropolitan Division > New York Rangers
Notices

How does Richards compare to other elite centers?

Reply
 
Thread Tools
Old
07-02-2011, 07:12 PM
  #26
NYR Sting
Heart and Soul
 
NYR Sting's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2006
Location: Brooklyn, NY
Country: United States
Posts: 9,506
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by MSG the place to be View Post
How the hell is B Richards ahead of Staal? I'd also put Toews and Kesler ahead but I can understand how a 15 year old looking at stats wouldn't.
I'm not 15, buddy. How the hell is Brad Richards ahead of Staal? Easy. He's smarter and he's a better playmaker. He's also more consistent. And Toews and Kesler are better all-around players in terms of defense, but what I'm looking for most out of a #1 center is an elite puck distributor. Toews doesn't have to be one because he has one on his wing in Kane. Kesler plays on a team with the Sedins, and also faces lesser defensive pairings as a result. Richards is better offensively than bothm, especially in terms of vision.

Guess you'd have to know the game to understand how important that advantage is.

NYR Sting is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
07-02-2011, 07:31 PM
  #27
HockeyBasedNYC
Registered User
 
HockeyBasedNYC's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: Here
Country: United States
Posts: 12,862
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sting36e View Post
1) Crosby
2) Datsyuk





3) Malkin
4) Stamkos
5) Thornton
6) Getzlaf
7) Richards
8) Kopitar
9) Zetterberg
10) Staal
Thats pretty good for me, except i kinda see Getzlaf/Richards either swapped or tied. Not a huge deal.

I also believe that Datsyuk is a better player all around then Crosby.

HockeyBasedNYC is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
07-02-2011, 07:35 PM
  #28
HockeyBasedNYC
Registered User
 
HockeyBasedNYC's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: Here
Country: United States
Posts: 12,862
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Brian Boyle View Post
The whole 5,6,7,8,9,10,11, and 12 rankings are a giant cluster**** -- the difference between these players are marginal at best.
And thats really what we are splitting hairs over here. As Inferno said, Datsyuk and Crosby are a level above, the next 10-15 are studs and all have their own style. Richards is in that pack. It depends on how well that style fits into the team they are on, and what kinda of teammates surround them.

Put a guy like Zetterberg on say, the Florida Panthers of last season - and things kinda dont look as good for him. Still a great player - but hes on a team that fits him perfectly. For me, a guy like Richards is a little more adaptable then a Getzlaf which is why he might be valued a little higher.

HockeyBasedNYC is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
07-02-2011, 07:38 PM
  #29
Evgeni Giroux
Registered User
 
Evgeni Giroux's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2011
Posts: 2,762
vCash: 500
congrats on getting a top end player! MY guess would be he is in the 10-20 range

crosby
malkin
datsyuk
stamkos
Sedin
toews
getzlaf
E. Staal
Backstrom
Kopitar
Giroux
Richards?

seems about right to me. but they are all great players and after the top 6 they can be ranked anywhere

Evgeni Giroux is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
07-02-2011, 07:51 PM
  #30
DekeR
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Posts: 490
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sting36e View Post
1) Crosby
2) Datsyuk





3) Malkin
4) Stamkos
5) Thornton
6) Getzlaf
7) Richards
8) Kopitar
9) Zetterberg
10) Staal
Sting: good job in the evaluation of these players. Agree

DekeR is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
07-02-2011, 08:22 PM
  #31
satrabyk
Registered User
 
Join Date: Dec 2008
Posts: 1,865
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Shadowrunner View Post
The one stat that jumped out at me from that screen was his +/-. I know it's a contested stat, but his -61 is by far the lowest of anyone on that list. Digging a bit deeper, 46 out of those 61 came in the span of two seasons (2006-2008) on a terrible Tampa team.
Bad team or not this stat could haunt us as its def something of worry.

satrabyk is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
07-02-2011, 08:23 PM
  #32
satrabyk
Registered User
 
Join Date: Dec 2008
Posts: 1,865
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by DekeR View Post
Sting: good job in the evaluation of these players. Agree
Wow if hes better than Zetterberg i will be pretty happy.

My list would be as follows

Crosby
Datsyuk
Toews
Giroux
Getzlaf
Stamkos
Malkin
Zetteberg
Sedin-not very strong in playoffs
Thornton-not very strong playoffs

I think this would be the top center in the game right now is Brad Richards, Backstrom, Plekanec, Stall, Bergeron, Kreji, Carter, Parise, Stastny, Hall etc are all capable of challenging for the top 10 but are not quite at those guys levels and those are my top 10.

Luckily for us i dont think there is a goalie i would trade for Lundy at this point in his career and just his personality and passion about how we play makes me like him more. Hes a confident also and is not one of those goalies just worried about his play but he understands the value and play of his teammates. All this talk about captain if i had to pick one it would be him but id rather not because he doesent need anymore pressure.


Last edited by satrabyk: 07-02-2011 at 08:38 PM.
satrabyk is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
07-02-2011, 08:44 PM
  #33
satrabyk
Registered User
 
Join Date: Dec 2008
Posts: 1,865
vCash: 500
Id also like to add vision is great to have, but if there one thing ive seen that i like in Richards which is prob more important than anything else is spacing in the offensive zone. He seems to settle into the right spot to support his teammates or is in a good area to shoot. This is something that really makes a player is how well he position himself on the ice keep good positioning which is what i think Richards strongest asset could be and i hope him and Gabby can develop that type of chemistry and understand each other spacing on the ice. If it doesent he could always play with Avery and maybe dubi lol, but really for a couple shifts esp if Gaby were to get hurt. But lets see how things go.

satrabyk is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
07-02-2011, 08:52 PM
  #34
z1co80
The Incredible Hank
 
z1co80's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: Scotland
Country: Scotland
Posts: 4,899
vCash: 50
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sting36e View Post
1) Crosby
2) Datsyuk





3) Malkin
4) Stamkos
5) Thornton
6) Getzlaf
7) Richards
8) Kopitar
9) Zetterberg
10) Staal
Spot on

So glad we have him

Sting

How would your list differ if you were to rank the #1 centers on who would be the best in a playoff situation?

z1co80 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
07-02-2011, 09:08 PM
  #35
Shadowrunner
Registered User
 
Shadowrunner's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2003
Location: New York City
Posts: 1,200
vCash: 500
Send a message via ICQ to Shadowrunner Send a message via AIM to Shadowrunner
Quote:
Originally Posted by MSG the place to be View Post
How the hell is B Richards ahead of Staal? I'd also put Toews and Kesler ahead but I can understand how a 15 year old looking at stats wouldn't.
I could respond by saying that I'm 29 y/o and have been following hockey since 1997. I could also say that one great season from Kessler doesn't put him anywhere near a player that has been averaging a PPG for the better part of a decade. Or that I consider Richards and Staal to be neck in neck.

Or I could tell you to shove your condescending attitude where the sun don't shine, and don't bother joining in the discussion if you have nothing productive to offer.

Decisions, decisions...

Shadowrunner is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
07-02-2011, 09:11 PM
  #36
DelGriffith
Registered User
 
DelGriffith's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: St. Catharines
Country: Canada
Posts: 343
vCash: 500
Lol oh dear god some of you think he's better than staal

DelGriffith is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
07-02-2011, 09:19 PM
  #37
Shadowrunner
Registered User
 
Shadowrunner's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2003
Location: New York City
Posts: 1,200
vCash: 500
Send a message via ICQ to Shadowrunner Send a message via AIM to Shadowrunner
Quote:
Originally Posted by DelGriffith View Post
Lol oh dear god some of you think he's better than staal
And this is ludicrous why exactly? Each have their strengths (Staal is more of a scorer, Richards more of a playmaker), but going by production Richards is the superior performer. In fact, aside from one monstrous 100 pt season immediately following the lockout, when Jonathan freaking Cheechoo scored 50+ goals, Staal has only had one PPG season. Richards has had three.

Shadowrunner is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
07-02-2011, 09:26 PM
  #38
Gresch04
Registered User
 
Gresch04's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2009
Posts: 145
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by MSG the place to be View Post
How the hell is B Richards ahead of Staal? I'd also put Toews and Kesler ahead but I can understand how a 15 year old looking at stats wouldn't.
Because he's a better player than Staal - not by much but a bit better. He's also a much better player than Kessler, the only thing that makes Kessler a reasonable comparison is the last two seasons. Even now he's only at .6 PPG - not even in the same league as BR. This is pretty obvious yet you're throwing around the insults, pretty funny.

Gresch04 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
07-02-2011, 09:30 PM
  #39
Gresch04
Registered User
 
Gresch04's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2009
Posts: 145
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by DelGriffith View Post
Lol oh dear god some of you think he's better than staal
The condescension when it's clearly a valid debate is f-ing obnoxious. What a TOOL.

Gresch04 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
07-02-2011, 09:37 PM
  #40
HockeyBurd*
 
HockeyBurd*'s Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2004
Posts: 1,581
vCash: 500
He certainly can be invisible and a non factor for large stretches. But then again so can Malkin and the Sedins among others.

HockeyBurd* is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
07-02-2011, 09:43 PM
  #41
Darrelle Lundqvist
Swagelin
 
Darrelle Lundqvist's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2010
Location: NJ
Country: United States
Posts: 1,781
vCash: 500
Its fair to say Richards would be in the top 10. But he's still a step below Crosby, Datsyuk, Malkin and Stamkos.

Darrelle Lundqvist is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
07-02-2011, 09:49 PM
  #42
azrok22
Registered User
 
Join Date: Mar 2006
Posts: 9,428
vCash: 50
Regarding the "lols you think he's better than Staal" etc. comments, I think you need to distinguish whether he's better right now vs. whether he's better as an asset/long term.

Right now, for a single season, like the above poster, I absolutely think that Richards is a better player than Staal. However, once you take age into account, Staal is clearly the better long term investment/asset.

azrok22 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
07-02-2011, 10:06 PM
  #43
BobMarleyNYR
Registered User
 
Join Date: May 2004
Location: Alphabet
Country: Iraq
Posts: 2,908
vCash: 500
Send a message via AIM to BobMarleyNYR
Staal isn't in the Richards mold at all. IMO... he's in the new-wave scoring ilk, like Lecavalier when he was good... he's the first of a generation with guys like Toews, Stamkos, Seguin, even Duchene.

BobMarleyNYR is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
07-02-2011, 10:09 PM
  #44
MSG the place to be*
 
Join Date: Sep 2006
Posts: 1,783
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Shadowrunner View Post
And this is ludicrous why exactly? Each have their strengths (Staal is more of a scorer, Richards more of a playmaker), but going by production Richards is the superior performer. In fact, aside from one monstrous 100 pt season immediately following the lockout, when Jonathan freaking Cheechoo scored 50+ goals, Staal has only had one PPG season. Richards has had three.
I fail to see how barely breaking a ppg, hitting a ppg, or barely missing a ppg in each season is some sort of standard for comparing two of the leagues best players. If one batter hits .302, . 304, .305 is he better than a batter who hits .306, .305, .298 because the first guy has more .300 seasons?

I'm not saying Richards is bad. I'm not saying Richards was a bad signing. Richards is fantastic. And he was a great signing. But guess what, there is a reason why Staal makes 8.25 million and he doesn't get slack for it. It's because Staal is one of the few franchise players in the league. Richards you can say is a star, but hes not a franchise player.

edit: I just noticed the ridiculous spin job you tried to pull. You for some absurd reason subtract Staal's 100 point season but you gave Richards credit for getting a ppg in that season. Nice maneuvering there. Then, you also miscounted cause Staal has two ppg seasons besides the season you decided to eliminate (3 total).

MSG the place to be* is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
07-02-2011, 10:09 PM
  #45
BobMarleyNYR
Registered User
 
Join Date: May 2004
Location: Alphabet
Country: Iraq
Posts: 2,908
vCash: 500
Send a message via AIM to BobMarleyNYR
Richards is like Ryan Nugent-Hopkins............. lmfao

BobMarleyNYR is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
07-02-2011, 10:11 PM
  #46
RobBrown4PM
Pringles?
 
RobBrown4PM's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2009
Posts: 3,781
vCash: 500
I dont know how Richards can be grouped with any of the centres listed in some of these lists.

Richards is a career -77, iirc, he can be darn near invisible some nights, and I wouldnt exactly call him physical.

Richards may or may not work out with the NYR, time will tell.

RobBrown4PM is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
07-02-2011, 10:14 PM
  #47
JeffMangum
Ra shi da
 
JeffMangum's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2010
Location: Listening to music
Country: United States
Posts: 55,177
vCash: 300
Quote:
Originally Posted by RobBrown4PM View Post
I dont know how Richards can be grouped with any of the centres listed in some of these lists.

Richards is a career -77, iirc, he can be darn near invisible some nights, and I wouldnt exactly call him physical.

Richards may or may not work out with the NYR, time will tell.
+/-? Seriously? He's played with some awful defensive teams in his career, and he gets a lot of his points on the PP. Who cares about his +/-, so long as he's creating offense? When you put up 70+ points on average, you are a legit 1st line player. Richards is coming off of back to back PPG+ seasons. He is one of the best centers in the game, and was 3rd in center scoring overall this season, missing 10 games with a concussion.

__________________

#TannerGlass2014
SEEN YOUR VIDEO!
#SheWentToHarvard
JeffMangum is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
07-02-2011, 10:16 PM
  #48
BobMarleyNYR
Registered User
 
Join Date: May 2004
Location: Alphabet
Country: Iraq
Posts: 2,908
vCash: 500
Send a message via AIM to BobMarleyNYR
fair asessment.. jhe's a bit like jesus with a hint of the mother -****in pilsbury doughboy and a hint of omar gooding...............

BobMarleyNYR is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
07-02-2011, 10:19 PM
  #49
MSG the place to be*
 
Join Date: Sep 2006
Posts: 1,783
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Brian Boyle View Post
+/-? Seriously? He's played with some awful defensive teams in his career, and he gets a lot of his points on the PP. Who cares about his +/-, so long as he's creating offense? When you put up 70+ points on average, you are a legit 1st line player. Richards is coming off of back to back PPG+ seasons. He is one of the best centers in the game, and was 3rd in center scoring overall this season, missing 10 games with a concussion.
You do realize what +/- measures right? Being good isn't about scoring its about scoring more than the opposition.

Our PP better be freakin outstanding if Brad is gonna be a minus on this team and get away without criticism.

MSG the place to be* is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
07-02-2011, 10:21 PM
  #50
JeffMangum
Ra shi da
 
JeffMangum's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2010
Location: Listening to music
Country: United States
Posts: 55,177
vCash: 300
Quote:
Originally Posted by MSG the place to be View Post
You do realize what +/- measures right? Being good isn't about scoring its about scoring more than the opposition.
+/- is garbage. Richards isn't a stellar defensive player, we know this. But to say he's not as good as people are saying because of his +/- is ill-advised.

JeffMangum is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Forum Jump


Bookmarks

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off



All times are GMT -5. The time now is 05:17 PM.

monitoring_string = "e4251c93e2ba248d29da988d93bf5144"
Contact Us - HFBoards - Archive - Privacy Statement - Terms of Use - Advertise - Top - AdChoices

vBulletin Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
HFBoards.com is a property of CraveOnline Media, LLC, an Evolve Media, LLC company. 2014 All Rights Reserved.