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Roster Thoughts and Offseason Speculation for the 2011-2012 Season III

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Old
07-03-2011, 07:13 PM
  #76
BigBrown
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cnshockey View Post
I'm sorry but I'm really going to be that guy....


Is no one else worried about the bottom 6? I really think we are just that ONE person away from really having "the team" to beat. I don't know what it is. I just think we need a 3rd line RWer.

Oh and I also don't see Parse playing for us much, if at all. IMHO he either plays in the AHL, gets top 6 minutes due to injury, or gets traded.
I'm with ya. I made a fairly large post regarding the bottom six in the previous Roster Thoughts thread, but I guess it got lost once the new thread started. Basically I think we upgraded in bottom six skill but we're MUCH smaller, less gritty and less experienced. I'll post it again:

We're obviously quite content with our top six forwards, how do we feel about our bottom six?

Basically we got (just as an example):

Clifford-Stoll-Parse
Richardson-Lewis-Westgarth
Fraser

We know that Murray will likely play Westgarth for at least 50 games. I guess Loktionov could be in there somewhere as well, or some other Manchester kid. Not a lot of size, not a lot of grit, not a lot of scoring in my opinion.

Compare it to:

Ponikarovsky-Handzus-Simmonds
Clifford-Lewis-Westgarth
Richardson

from last season.. I definitely think we took a hit in the bottom six. I wouldn't change anything obviously, our team overall is clearly better, but I think we might need a boost in bottom six size/grit/scoring. Easier said than done, obviously. How do you feel about it? Confident?

Anyone still out there who could provide that boost?

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Old
07-03-2011, 07:19 PM
  #77
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BigBrown View Post
I'm with ya. I made a fairly large post regarding the bottom six in the previous Roster Thoughts thread, but I guess it got lost once the new thread started. Basically I think we upgraded in bottom six skill but we're MUCH smaller, less gritty and less experienced. I'll post it again:

We're obviously quite content with our top six forwards, how do we feel about our bottom six?

Basically we got (just as an example):

Clifford-Stoll-Parse
Richardson-Lewis-Westgarth
Fraser

We know that Murray will likely play Westgarth for at least 50 games. I guess Loktionov could be in there somewhere as well, or some other Manchester kid. Not a lot of size, not a lot of grit, not a lot of scoring in my opinion.

Compare it to:

Ponikarovsky-Handzus-Simmonds
Clifford-Lewis-Westgarth
Richardson

from last season.. I definitely think we took a hit in the bottom six. I wouldn't change anything obviously, our team overall is clearly better, but I think we might need a boost in bottom six size/grit/scoring. Easier said than done, obviously. How do you feel about it? Confident?

Anyone still out there who could provide that boost?
Hit it on the head.

We went from big, gritty, veterans to a small, younger group. I think a guy like Jamie Langenbrunner would be a good fit for a 3rd line role but last I heard he sucks now. Not sure who else would be out there. I really wish Evgeny Artyukhin was available but I think he signed a 2 year deal in the KHL. We need someone with size and grit. Just one guy really and we're set.

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Old
07-03-2011, 07:58 PM
  #78
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IMO we still need to go out and get a solid 3rd line winger, on a short term deal. Miettinen or Langenbrunner could be good. Or go out and trade one of our prospects or Parse for a Fehr type guy. Solid 3rd liner and Washington needs cap space for Alzner still. Then we could have Richardson and Lewis on the fourth line and rotate in one of 5 guys.

Clifford-Stoll-FA/trade
Richardson-Lewis-Holloway/Cliche/Clune/Westgarth/Parse

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Old
07-03-2011, 08:17 PM
  #79
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cnshockey View Post
I'm sorry but I'm really going to be that guy....


Is no one else worried about the bottom 6? I really think we are just that ONE person away from really having "the team" to beat. I don't know what it is. I just think we need a 3rd line RWer.

Oh and I also don't see Parse playing for us much, if at all. IMHO he either plays in the AHL, gets top 6 minutes due to injury, or gets traded.
So are you worried about the bottom6 or not? If you think we are just 1 player away then its not a bottom6 thing, its a one position thing....

And as I mentioned before you give a young guy a chance, if he can't hack it you ship a 3rd/mid prospect for a quality player at the deadline....a third liner winger isn't an issue that should concern people this much. Sounds like that soccer mom that is worried her 5 yo is only reading at a 4th grade level....

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Old
07-03-2011, 08:23 PM
  #80
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Originally Posted by KingLB View Post
So are you worried about the bottom6 or not? If you think we are just 1 player away then its not a bottom6 thing, its a one position thing....

And as I mentioned before you give a young guy a chance, if he can't hack it you ship a 3rd/mid prospect for a quality player at the deadline....a third liner winger isn't an issue that should concern people this much. Sounds like that soccer mom that is worried her 5 yo is only reading at a 4th grade level....
I guess its moreso a one position thing but it really goes hand in hand with worrying about the bottom 6. the 3rd line RW job determines who makes the 4th line and if a guy like Lewis gets the 3rd line RW job, it makes our 4th line weaker.

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Old
07-03-2011, 08:51 PM
  #81
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I think/hope Holloway will get a chance on the bottom 6 this year, I think he'd make a good showing for himself with his size and energy.

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07-03-2011, 09:06 PM
  #82
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Originally Posted by Kingsfan1 View Post
Kings should target Kyle Wellwood to play right wing on the 3rd line


He is 28 years old. Had 13 points in 35 games and was a + 10. Also had 7 points in the playoffs with a + 6 to go along with it.


He competes hard as well and can play right wing or center.


Clifford-Stoll-Wellwood


DO IT DEANO !
that would be an AWFUL signing.

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Old
07-03-2011, 09:08 PM
  #83
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cnshockey View Post
I'm sorry but I'm really going to be that guy....


Is no one else worried about the bottom 6? I really think we are just that ONE person away from really having "the team" to beat. I don't know what it is. I just think we need a 3rd line RWer.

Oh and I also don't see Parse playing for us much, if at all. IMHO he either plays in the AHL, gets top 6 minutes due to injury, or gets traded.
I think you are underrating Parse. The guy put up 24 points in 59 games in limited minutes two years ago(I think he was 2nd or 3rd in points per minute that year), and is the only option we currently have to move into top 6 winger if an injury were to strike(with Gagne and Williams I would guarantee it does). Clifford, Richardson, Lewis should never be top 6ers, and Stoll is best as a center. Parse adds skill to a third line, and I think a Parse - Stoll - Lewis is a deadly third line with speed, skill and great defensive awareness.

I think people are forgetting that there are option for some more size and grit to be added from Manchester. King, Holloway, Cliche, Nolan all are gritty players that go to the hard areas of the ice. King/Nolan would add some size and hitting, Cliche/Holloway some slid twoway play and much needed energy. Poni/Zues were often lethargic out there, a reason we had to see the reemergence of Zeiler's name to add some energy to the bottom 6.

Also remember that the top 6 is now much more complete and physical. With Penner, Kopitar, Richards, Brown we have a big strong intimating top 6 which will help offset. These guys play much bigger minutes than bottom 6(obviously) and are going to grind teams down. Despite what Johnny Utah says we already have one of the biggest toughest lineups in the league. Parse, Cliche, Richardson, Lewis, Gagne in bigger roles will be adding some much needed to speed to a lineup and in particular bottom 6 that we desperately needed. With our big physical top 6 we don't need to populate our bottom six with all grinders.

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Old
07-03-2011, 09:08 PM
  #84
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Originally Posted by Rod Buskas View Post
that would be an AWFUL signing.
No it wouldn't. He'd teach Doughty how to not be a fatty anymore

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Old
07-03-2011, 09:30 PM
  #85
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Wellwood is an interesting option. Guy is tireless, he's really taken his game in a new direction the last couple seasons.

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Old
07-03-2011, 09:36 PM
  #86
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Okay I'll play along... Assuming DL maintains the current roster, which I get this sneaking feeling he's working on something BIG. Penner, by far, is still the biggest ??? going into next season... I wouldn't mind seeing Loktionov get another shot on the left side next to Kopi. I think the oppostion match ups are going to spread out to cover our new found depth and should create more time and space for Loktionov to work his magic.

Moving Penner to third line duty creates a more balanced offense and solid top 9. Penner should excel with the lighter defensive coverage and hopefully regains chemistry with Stoll from his Edmonton days.

I do agree we've lost some physicality, not as much as others seem to think, but we've significantly increased the overall speed and skill compared to last year which is a trade off I'm more than happy to accept.

Is the Summer over yet????


CAPGEEK.COM CAP CALCULATOR

FORWARDS
Andrei Loktionov ($0.816m) / Anze Kopitar ($6.800m) / Justin Williams ($3.650m)
Simon Gagne ($3.500m) / Mike Richards ($5.750m) / Dustin Brown ($3.175m)
Dustin Penner ($4.250m) / Jarret Stoll ($3.600m) / Tyler Toffoli ($0.746m)
Kyle Clifford ($0.870m) / Trevor Lewis ($0.950m) / Brad Richardson ($1.050m)
Scott Parse ($0.900m) / Kevin Westgarth ($0.525m)

DEFENSEMEN
Drew Doughty ($6.800m) / Willie Mitchell ($3.500m)
Jack Johnson ($4.357m) / Rob Scuderi ($3.400m)
Alec Martinez ($0.950m) / Matt Greene ($2.950m)
Vyacheslav Voinov ($0.816m)

GOALTENDERS
Jonathan Quick ($1.800m) / Jonathan Bernier ($1.250m)

CAPGEEK.COM TOTALS (follow @capgeek on Twitter)
(these totals are compiled without the bonus cushion)
SALARY CAP: $64,300,000; CAP PAYROLL: $62,407,142; BONUSES: $347,500
CAP SPACE (23-man roster): $1,892,858


Edit: BLOCKBUSTER TRADE... Min trades Havlat to SJ for Heatley.


Last edited by GR81: 07-03-2011 at 09:44 PM. Reason: Edit: Trade Update
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Old
07-03-2011, 09:37 PM
  #87
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I think you can probably wait until the trade deadline to pick up an experienced bottom 6'er for cheap

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Old
07-03-2011, 11:38 PM
  #88
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Steve Bernier?

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Old
07-03-2011, 11:42 PM
  #89
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Originally Posted by Xtreme1995 View Post
Steve Bernier?
Thought about him. Pretty sure he's awful if Flordida isn't bringing him back...

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Old
07-03-2011, 11:50 PM
  #90
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In regards to the bottom six, this a chance for some of the young guys to fill those rolls and I believe since the kings start the season overseas they can carry a 25 man roster with 3 goalies. Which would give them a little extra time to look at the kids.
With that said at the deadline the kings could fill that bottom six with a prospect or two in a trade

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Old
07-04-2011, 12:07 AM
  #91
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Lewis, Richardson, Clifford and even Westgarth played pretty well in the playoffs. That was trial by fire and I thought they represented themselves well. Add Stoll to that group and I think it's looking pretty good. I would have to agree that Parse is probably going to get a shot on the third line. A youngster from the farm might be a possibility as well, but I don't think DL needs to make a move at this point.

With the old personnel from years past, the third line was the shutdown line and played a lot of minutes, but now that you have 2 elite 2-way centers in the top 2 lines and Gagne being underrated defensively, I would imagine the third line will play much less minutes this season than last. Either way, I would be fine starting the season with the roster as is. It's not like DL won't trade for a player if needed by the trade deadline.

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Old
07-04-2011, 12:27 AM
  #92
Ollie Weeks
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Let Lewis, Holloway, or whoever screw around in the 3RW spot until the deadline. Then it should be our first priority for an upgrade (and of course a generic depth defenseman). Which is a terrific problem to have.

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Old
07-04-2011, 12:44 AM
  #93
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ollie Weeks View Post
Let Lewis, Holloway, or whoever screw around in the 3RW spot until the deadline. Then it should be our first priority for an upgrade (and of course a generic depth defenseman). Which is a terrific problem to have.
This, I don't think it's as big of an issue that people are making. I would say Clune makes the team but his shoulder is trash . . .

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Old
07-04-2011, 12:44 AM
  #94
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I think we're good enough with the current bottom 6 group. Adding somebody obviously wouldn't hurt but I don't see real a NEED to do it. I think it's the right time to allow the young guys to prove themselves, and I think that time is now for Lewis and Parse. I'm all for easing guys in... But at some point the time's gotta be now! I think they'll step it up. My prediction is Lewis gets the spot at 3RW.

I really think a lot people under estimate Scott Parse's skill... I know you've heard it all before but he's got talent!


Also Hextall said we are likely done adding players... But of course he didn't rule it out.

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Old
07-04-2011, 12:46 AM
  #95
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Originally Posted by Cutty Sarkn3ss View Post
This, I don't think it's as big of an issue that people are making. I would say Clune makes the team but his shoulder is trash . . .
So are both of Loktis dog....and Lokti is still going to be awesome in the NHL one day.

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Old
07-04-2011, 01:04 AM
  #96
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It's too bad that King isn't more physical. The guys got good size and scoring touch but he needs to learn to utilize his size more and bring some intensity.

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Old
07-04-2011, 01:22 AM
  #97
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Originally Posted by GR81 View Post
Okay I'll play along... Assuming DL maintains the current roster, which I get this sneaking feeling he's working on something BIG. Penner, by far, is still the biggest ??? going into next season... I wouldn't mind seeing Loktionov get another shot on the left side next to Kopi. I think the oppostion match ups are going to spread out to cover our new found depth and should create more time and space for Loktionov to work his magic.

Moving Penner to third line duty creates a more balanced offense and solid top 9. Penner should excel with the lighter defensive coverage and hopefully regains chemistry with Stoll from his Edmonton days.

I do agree we've lost some physicality, not as much as others seem to think, but we've significantly increased the overall speed and skill compared to last year which is a trade off I'm more than happy to accept.

Is the Summer over yet????


CAPGEEK.COM CAP CALCULATOR

FORWARDS
Andrei Loktionov ($0.816m) / Anze Kopitar ($6.800m) / Justin Williams ($3.650m)
Simon Gagne ($3.500m) / Mike Richards ($5.750m) / Dustin Brown ($3.175m)
Dustin Penner ($4.250m) / Jarret Stoll ($3.600m) / Tyler Toffoli ($0.746m)
Kyle Clifford ($0.870m) / Trevor Lewis ($0.950m) / Brad Richardson ($1.050m)
Scott Parse ($0.900m) / Kevin Westgarth ($0.525m)

DEFENSEMEN
Drew Doughty ($6.800m) / Willie Mitchell ($3.500m)
Jack Johnson ($4.357m) / Rob Scuderi ($3.400m)
Alec Martinez ($0.950m) / Matt Greene ($2.950m)
Vyacheslav Voinov ($0.816m)

GOALTENDERS
Jonathan Quick ($1.800m) / Jonathan Bernier ($1.250m)

CAPGEEK.COM TOTALS (follow @capgeek on Twitter)
(these totals are compiled without the bonus cushion)
SALARY CAP: $64,300,000; CAP PAYROLL: $62,407,142; BONUSES: $347,500
CAP SPACE (23-man roster): $1,892,858


Edit: BLOCKBUSTER TRADE... Min trades Havlat to SJ for Heatley.
That would be a really slow third line outside of stoll

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Old
07-04-2011, 01:35 AM
  #98
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For the coming season I would like to see us bring up Kozun and Holloway to start. Our bottom 6 is set and should be filled from within.

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Old
07-04-2011, 01:44 AM
  #99
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Originally Posted by cnshockey View Post
So are both of Loktis dog....and Lokti is still going to be awesome in the NHL one day.
Lokti's dogs have shoulder problems?

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Old
07-04-2011, 01:54 AM
  #100
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Thought about him. Pretty sure he's awful if Flordida isn't bringing him back...
Florida was also the team that waived Grabner.

Just saying.

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