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Burke To Have Contract Discussions Today With MacArthur

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07-05-2011, 08:37 AM
  #26
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Auliewantsisplayoffs View Post
Evidence of UFA signings is inadmissible in the arbitration process. There's no way he'd be given a judgement as high as 4.5 per. There was a poster the other day that put up some really great comparables in terms of RFAs coming off of breakout years and the consensus seems to be an award of anywhere from 3 to 3.8 (max).

The real problem with letting him go to arbitration is that we then only have him under contract for one year and at the end he's a UFA (26 y/o) which, if he turns out to be the real deal, could cost us some serious coin a season from now. Maybe it's better to give the better term, say 3 years, and eat up a few of his UFA years at a lower hit ... something like the above posters are thinking in the Grabovski range.
As nice as it is to have this cap room this year Burke has be careful as (I think) both Kulemin and Grabo's contracts end next season as well as a few other RFA's that I can't recall. No doubt this is playing into this drawn out process. I'm sure Burke would love to keep that line intact without crippling our cap.

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07-05-2011, 08:38 AM
  #27
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I really don't expect Mac to be back this year.

I like him as a player, but he will likely want too much, and if he re-signs, there isn't an open spot for competition in camp.

Our top 9 would be more or less set without an opportunity to Frattin etc to get in the lineup.

I think KAdri fill Mac's role which opens a spot on the the 3rd line for someone to make the team out of camp.

If Lombardi is ready, we could argue our top 9 is set without MAcarthur.

Can Lombardi play wing? Man, Kulemin - Grabo - Lombardi is some serious speed that the opposition would have to deal with!

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07-05-2011, 08:40 AM
  #28
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He should be getting the average of his 2 linemates that were the main reason he eclipsed the 60 point barrier. 2 or 3 years @ 2.625m

And he should be happy to get it since he wasn't going to get 2nd line minutes on any other team in the NHL last year.

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07-05-2011, 08:40 AM
  #29
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bullet Proof View Post
Yup for next 4 years.
Please read the two posts immediately above yours. Then if you aren't convinced, feel free to go and look into the CBA rules surrounding arbitration rights. If you're still unclear as to why your posts deserve a , then I don't know how to help you.

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07-05-2011, 08:41 AM
  #30
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Auliewantsisplayoffs View Post
Evidence of UFA signings is inadmissible in the arbitration process. There's no way he'd be given a judgement as high as 4.5 per. There was a poster the other day that put up some really great comparables in terms of RFAs coming off of breakout years and the consensus seems to be an award of anywhere from 3 to 3.8 (max).

The real problem with letting him go to arbitration is that we then only have him under contract for one year and at the end he's a UFA (26 y/o) which, if he turns out to be the real deal, could cost us some serious coin a season from now. Maybe it's better to give the better term, say 3 years, and eat up a few of his UFA years at a lower hit ... something like the above posters are thinking in the Grabovski range.
Agreed with pretty much everything u said but I was only referring to MacArthur being worth 4 million at the very least since there were a lot of borderline 2 liner in UFA market who got 4 mil for 4 years or so.

That being said Lets hope he signs for anything under 4 million.

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07-05-2011, 08:43 AM
  #31
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2 years at 3.5 per is the max I would give.

I like his versatility. he can play on any of the top 3 lines in different roles.

But like others have said..if the money and especially the term is too long, he can be replaced by Kadri or Frattin.

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07-05-2011, 08:43 AM
  #32
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bullet Proof View Post
Agreed with pretty much everything u said but I was only referring to MacArthur being worth 4 million at the very least since there were a lot of borderline 2 liner in UFA market who got 4 mil for 4 years or so.

That being said Lets hope he signs for anything under 4 million.
These comments are making my head hurt.

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07-05-2011, 08:45 AM
  #33
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Originally Posted by Bullet Proof View Post
Yup for next 4 years.
In other words, it's irrelevant.

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07-05-2011, 08:45 AM
  #34
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Originally Posted by Drew311 View Post
Brady and Lang mentioned it this morning. Said we'll know by the end of the day if MacArthur and possibly Bozak will go to arbitration.
I wasn't aware that Bozak had any arbitration rights.

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07-05-2011, 08:47 AM
  #35
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Originally Posted by tpc77 View Post
I really don't expect Mac to be back this year.

I like him as a player, but he will likely want too much, and if he re-signs, there isn't an open spot for competition in camp.

Our top 9 would be more or less set without an opportunity to Frattin etc to get in the lineup.

I think KAdri fill Mac's role which opens a spot on the the 3rd line for someone to make the team out of camp.

If Lombardi is ready, we could argue our top 9 is set without MAcarthur.

Can Lombardi play wing? Man, Kulemin - Grabo - Lombardi is some serious speed that the opposition would have to deal with!
I think the thing that we all have to remember is that we need as much talent as possible to make the playoffs this year.

Burke and co. don't have the time or patience to have multiple rookies given spots before training camp even starts and sit through their struggles all year.

Having a rookie in our top 6, where we have only one all-star as it is, wont get us into the playoffs. Once guys like Kulemin, Grabovski and Macarthur prove that they're the real deal, then we can afford to have rookies with growing pains in our lineup as we know that we have established players who can pick up the slack.

I think Kadri and Frattin will be in competition for one spot out of camp. And its on the 3rd line wing. Whoever gets sent down will be the first call up, and given the fact that injuries are going to be quite common, I wouldn't be surprised at all if the odd man out still gets 20-30 games in the NHL this year.

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07-05-2011, 08:47 AM
  #36
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bullet Proof View Post
Agreed with pretty much everything u said but I was only referring to MacArthur being worth 4 million at the very least since there were a lot of borderline 2 liner in UFA market who got 4 mil for 4 years or so.

That being said Lets hope he signs for anything under 4 million.
I think I've discovered our misunderstanding. You're saying he's worth 4m/yr not that he'll be awarded it. I can agree with that, but he only gets that on a free market which he doesn't have the benefit of until next year (or if we're forced to walk away). If it reaches arbitration the highest he'll be awarded is around 3.5 IMHO, but if Burke can sign him for a couple of extra years at 2.75-3 before he gets there then that would be ideal.

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07-05-2011, 08:49 AM
  #37
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Originally Posted by Auliewantsisplayoffs View Post
I think I've discovered our misunderstanding. You're saying he's worth 4m/yr not that he'll be awarded it. I can agree with that, but he only gets that on a free market which he doesn't have the benefit of until next year (or if we're forced to walk away). If it reaches arbitration the highest he'll be awarded is around 3.5 IMHO, but if Burke can sign him for a couple of extra years at 2.75-3 before he gets there then that would be ideal.
Yeah that was my point.

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07-05-2011, 08:50 AM
  #38
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I need to find a job where I can receive 3 mil+ a year and still be sour about it. Should have learnt how to skate well and fight on the ice, make at least 500k.

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07-05-2011, 08:51 AM
  #39
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Originally Posted by imthinking View Post
I need to find a job where I can receive 3 mil+ a year and still be sour about it. Should have learnt how to skate well and fight on the ice, make at least 500k.
And you don't even need to learn how to skate that well. If you're a good enough fighter you'll get 500k and only have to play 40 games a year.

What a life

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07-05-2011, 08:53 AM
  #40
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i would much rather pay mac a little more on a 1 year deal to prove that he is legit then argue over money/term. im sure if burke offered him $4 million on a 1 year deal he would take it.

as for bozak, i think he will get his **** together. i think he is an ideal 3rd line center for us. i hope burke gets a deal done with him. im thinking $1.5 x 2 years is a good deal for bozak.

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07-05-2011, 08:54 AM
  #41
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Quote:
Originally Posted by imthinking View Post
As nice as it is to have this cap room this year Burke has be careful as (I think) both Kulemin and Grabo's contracts end next season as well as a few other RFA's that I can't recall. No doubt this is playing into this drawn out process. I'm sure Burke would love to keep that line intact without crippling our cap.
This is a very good point. In fact, Grabo is a UFA at the end of next season and his is probably the contract that is most affected by the ridiculous numbers being thrown about right now. Kulemin will still be an RFA and again that gives me good confidence that his number won't go higher than the 3.5/yr range (and he'd have to be magical to make that happen ... and therefore worth every penny).

If it's looking like Grabovski will require to big a paycheck, that isn't something we should worry about because it means his value in general will be very high as well. A prospect that means he'd likely help us toward a package for the real #1C we're looking for (or some stunning packages at the trade deadline and we can have Kadri/Colborne shift into his spot).

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07-05-2011, 08:55 AM
  #42
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Originally Posted by gabeliscious View Post
i would much rather pay mac a little more on a 1 year deal to prove that he is legit then argue over money/term. im sure if burke offered him $4 million on a 1 year deal he would take it.

as for bozak, i think he will get his **** together. i think he is an ideal 3rd line center for us. i hope burke gets a deal done with him. im thinking $1.5 x 2 years is a good deal for bozak.
This seems most realistic. Burke has also done very well resigning players to relatively cheap contracts where as a lot people were expecting huge hikes.

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07-05-2011, 08:55 AM
  #43
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I wonder how firm Burke will dig himself into the ground if it's a term they don't really agree with, even at one-year. Say they are a couple 100,000 off.

If it's in the high 3's, I know some here would say take the deal for one-year, but maybe Burke doesn't.

His philosophy on RFAs heading to arbitration seems like he has a motto that the process won't bully him into getting a deal done - and that he has the option to walk. I wonder if he does that with MacArthur (walks), just to keep his principles on the arbitration process in place for future RFAs.

I'm interested to see who this all plays out. Even with other teams RFAs, who they may potentially walk from. Burke may be looking to jump on those players with the available cap space he has.

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07-05-2011, 08:56 AM
  #44
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He'll probably get 3.5 or 4 in arbitration, and that's too much. If he was a proven 60 point guy that would be different, but he's not. And look at the deal a guy like Leino got...one decent year and cashed in huge. we can't do a deal like that.

Ideally I'd like him at 2.5 on a 2 year deal, but we won't get him that cheap.

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07-05-2011, 08:56 AM
  #45
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GilmourClarkScores View Post
He should be getting the average of his 2 linemates that were the main reason he eclipsed the 60 point barrier. 2 or 3 years @ 2.625m

And he should be happy to get it since he wasn't going to get 2nd line minutes on any other team in the NHL last year.
This

Until Grabo and Kulie make more, Mac shouldn't be making significantly more. It's just one more year, make him prove himself. If he refuses, meh he's expendable.

HARD BALL !! You don't stay under the cap by giving everyone a blank cheque

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07-05-2011, 08:58 AM
  #46
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Auliewantsisplayoffs View Post
This is a very good point. In fact, Grabo is a UFA at the end of next season and his is probably the contract that is most affected by the ridiculous numbers being thrown about right now. Kulemin will still be an RFA and again that gives me good confidence that his number won't go higher than the 3.5/yr range (and he'd have to be magical to make that happen ... and therefore worth every penny).

If it's looking like Grabovski will require to big a paycheck, that isn't something we should worry about because it means his value in general will be very high as well. A prospect that means he'd likely help us toward a package for the real #1C we're looking for (or some stunning packages at the trade deadline and we can have Kadri/Colborne shift into his spot).
Absolutely agree on that. We're in an awkward transition that could pay off big or hurt us. One of the best case scenarios would be trading Grabo + for an elite center and having Colborne or Kadri hitting their stride on a second line role as a cheap option.

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07-05-2011, 09:02 AM
  #47
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gabeliscious View Post
i would much rather pay mac a little more on a 1 year deal to prove that he is legit then argue over money/term. im sure if burke offered him $4 million on a 1 year deal he would take it.

as for bozak, i think he will get his **** together. i think he is an ideal 3rd line center for us. i hope burke gets a deal done with him. im thinking $1.5 x 2 years is a good deal for bozak.
Yes Mac would absolutely take that, but we shouldn't offer it. Arbitration will never be that high and we lose him at the end of the season anyway. The big problem with this "prove that he is legit" business is that he's a UFA at the end of the season regardless. In other words, if he does prove it, he can rake us over the coals a year later.

We should give him a little more term in return for a friendly cap hit and have faith that he wasn't a flash in the pan. What's the worst case scenario here? He turns out to be the solid 3rd line player we thought we were getting in the first place and at 3m/yr is a steal relative to the contracts that are out there right now.

As for Bozak, I completely agree with you, 1.5/yr over two years. He'll still be a UFA at the end, which sucks, but by then we'll know what's going on with Grabo/Kadri/Colborne/etc. and shouldn't be hurting down the middle like we are now.

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07-05-2011, 09:03 AM
  #48
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If BB can't sign him I think he would be crazy not to accept the arbitration and let the season play out.

IF Mac is putting up similar numbers then they can negotiate an extension.
If he isnít then they can wait until the offseason and possibly sign him for less $$.
If he is and the Leafs donít want to sign him long term or are out of the playoffs, they can deal him at the deadline for assets.

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07-05-2011, 09:08 AM
  #49
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A lot of you guys are really understating the importance of MacArthur last season.

I'd give him 3.5.

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07-05-2011, 09:09 AM
  #50
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Volcanologist View Post
He'll probably get 3.5 or 4 in arbitration, and that's too much. If he was a proven 60 point guy that would be different, but he's not. And look at the deal a guy like Leino got...one decent year and cashed in huge. we can't do a deal like that.

Ideally I'd like him at 2.5 on a 2 year deal, but we won't get him that cheap.
Leino's deal has nothing to do with Macarthur's award in arbitration. Please see the rest of the thread for explanation ...

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