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Burke To Have Contract Discussions Today With MacArthur

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07-05-2011, 11:17 AM
  #76
ThreeHundred
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I'd move Kadri to that line instead

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07-05-2011, 11:19 AM
  #77
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Originally Posted by Anthrax442 View Post
This. Short term - show us what you can do over 3 year span, then you get the big bump.
There is no friggin way he'll take 2.5 for 2 years after posting 62 points while being paid 1.1.

It'll be nice, don't get me wrong, but I fail to see why we should get such an incredible discount. I get it that it's only one season but what you propose is an insult MacArthur to be frank.

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07-05-2011, 11:20 AM
  #78
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Kulemin will get like a 4 year 16-18M deal if he scores around the same points again.
That would be ideal. Definitely a player to keep for a long time.

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07-05-2011, 11:22 AM
  #79
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If MacArthur signs at a price lower than 3m I'll be very surprised.

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07-05-2011, 11:26 AM
  #80
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I still think Mac will be gone due to Burke not able to give him long term money due to having to re-sign core guys going forward. I see a sign and trade coming.

Also because Mac's spot just makes sense for Kadri moving forward.

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Old
07-05-2011, 11:27 AM
  #81
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Originally Posted by topched View Post
Of course.

But thats my point. The numbers are there, they are comparable but not quite the same. For the guys out there saying MacArthur should get 4mill + or Leino/Upshall money, they should look at that and give theres head a shake

Clarke will likely get under the 3.75 that Krejci fetched, and more realistically in and around 3.25
If Mac gets 3.5 as Upshall and Gagne did, do Leafs match? Leino's 4.5 is hard to figure out, he's not worth 1 mill more than this group. If the Leafs take it, they should have gone after Upshall unless they value both at 2.75 - 3 max.

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07-05-2011, 11:29 AM
  #82
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3 x 3 or 3.5 x 2 are my guesses. Knowing Burke it will be 3x2

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07-05-2011, 11:30 AM
  #83
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MacArthur is looking for 3+ years. Burke is only willing to give 2 years. If they go to arbitration, Mac will only get one year.

I don't think it makes sense for Mac to go to arbitration. He's looking for term, which he will not get in arbitration. I think a deal gets done soon. 2-3 years.

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Old
07-05-2011, 11:33 AM
  #84
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Still wouldn't sign him for more than 2 years. If he consistently puts up these numbers, I don;t care if he gets 5 after that.

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07-05-2011, 11:33 AM
  #85
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Interactif View Post
If Mac gets 3.5 as Upshall and Gagne did, do Leafs match? Leino's 4.5 is hard to figure out, he's not worth 1 mill more than this group. If the Leafs take it, they should have gone after Upshall unless they value both at 2.75 max.
What?

Upshall is half the player EDIT: MacArthur is. Upshall is a 3rd liner, who has underwhelming point totals even by MacArthur's standards. He's also 2 years older.

MacArthur and Leino are quite similar, but again Leino is 2 years older and only just broke out, where as Macs best season happened at 24. If MacArthur gets valued higher than what Burke wants to pay, he'll sign him to a one year deal at the arbitrated cap hit and extend him if he puts similar numbers up again.

On top of that in UFA you're usually competing with 5-6-7 other teams in the bidding for a single player. That drives the price up significantly. RFA's have one option and one option only. If you're MacArthur you should be inclined to sign a deal for the same or less than the arbitrated money in a place where you've had success. If the Leafs walk on him itll be the second time in two years this has happened, and he could be stuck with an underwhelming contract in comparison to his value (the leafs signed him for half his arbitrated salary last year).


Last edited by topched: 07-05-2011 at 11:38 AM.
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Old
07-05-2011, 11:35 AM
  #86
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I still get shivers from the Blake signing. One amazing season and big-time contract. Too fresh in my mind. I appreciate the cautious approach we're taking.

That said MacA brings much more to the table when he's not scoring than Blake did (I'm a MacA supporter).

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07-05-2011, 11:35 AM
  #87
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Quote:
Originally Posted by topched View Post
Upshall is half the player Upshall is.
That's... somewhat hard to believe

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Old
07-05-2011, 11:37 AM
  #88
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Lightsol View Post
That's... somewhat hard to believe
Haha nice catch

What better comparible to Upshall then Upshall?

This is OBVIOUSLY who I meant

http://www.hockeydb.com/ihdb/stats/p....php?pid=94436

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07-05-2011, 11:38 AM
  #89
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I think Mac wants to stay, he will take lower to make that happen. 3yrs for 9m. I would go 3.5 x 2.75 x 2.75 it's probably close to what the Leafs would be willing to offer.

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07-05-2011, 11:39 AM
  #90
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Can Bozak and Schenn go to arbitration?

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07-05-2011, 11:40 AM
  #91
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I'd give him 3.5 easily.

He's the real deal, and the total package.

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Old
07-05-2011, 11:41 AM
  #92
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RFA's can start comparing themselves to the money that UFA's have received this summer when they're UFA's themselves.


Last edited by StarBurns RIP: 07-05-2011 at 11:47 AM.
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07-05-2011, 11:44 AM
  #93
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Originally Posted by Leafssss View Post
Can Bozak and Schenn go to arbitration?
Bozak can. Normally, you have to wait 4 years before you can go to arbitration, but Bozak has an exception; he signed his first contract after he turned 20.

Schenn, OTOH, doesn't have enough years in the NHL to go to arbitration yet.

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07-05-2011, 11:46 AM
  #94
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Quote:
Originally Posted by topched View Post
What?

Upshall is half the player EDIT: MacArthur is. Upshall is a 3rd liner, who has underwhelming point totals even by MacArthur's standards. He's also 2 years older.

MacArthur and Leino are quite similar, but again Leino is 2 years older and only just broke out, where as Macs best season happened at 24. If MacArthur gets valued higher than what Burke wants to pay, he'll sign him to a one year deal at the arbitrated cap hit and extend him if he puts similar numbers up again.

On top of that in UFA you're usually competing with 5-6-7 other teams in the bidding for a single player. That drives the price up significantly. RFA's have one option and one option only. If you're MacArthur you should be inclined to sign a deal for the same or less than the arbitrated money in a place where you've had success. If the Leafs walk on him itll be the second time in two years this has happened, and he could be stuck with an underwhelming contract in comparison to his value (the leafs signed him for half his arbitrated salary last year).
This is the question is Mac a 14-17 goal 30 pt guy or is he a 60 pt guy? I don't think you can 100% be sure until he does it again. This is why Burke is reluctant to paying him Leino or even Gagne money. Upshall's production is very similar to Mac's before last year, he does bring other attributes to the table which I like. In terms of goals last year they are almost the same with Scotty scoring 22 to Mac's 21. The problem with Mac is his production stalled late in the year, he looked like a certain 30 goal man once. This is a reasonable worry for Leafs Mgt.


Last edited by Interactif: 07-05-2011 at 11:52 AM.
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Old
07-05-2011, 11:46 AM
  #95
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Quote:
Originally Posted by topched View Post
Yeah UFA's are different.

This is who I see as the best comparable to MacArthur this offseason:

David Krejci, Drafted in 2004
2007–08 Boston Bruins NHL 56 6 21 27
2008–09 Boston Bruins NHL 82 22 51 73
Signed a 3 year 3.75 million/yr deal as an RFA after that season.

Clarke MacArthur, Drafted in 2003
2009-10 Sabres/Thrashers NHL 81 16 19 35
2010-11 Toronto Maple Leafs NHL 82 21 41 62


Now Macarthur didn't have the same year as Krejci did in his final RFA season, point totals are similar over the two years, even though Krejci played less games. I wouldn't expect MacArthur to get 3.75 as he is not as good a player as Krejci IMO, and his big RFA season was when he was 2 years older than Krejci, but I think this is a solid comparable. I would expect MacArthur to get in the 3-3.5range. 3.25 over two years would be fine by me.
Thank you for this post. It's nice to know at least one other person has read and understands the way the CBA works in controlling RFA negotiations.

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Old
07-05-2011, 11:46 AM
  #96
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Am I the only fan who thinks Burke is more likely to walk away from a Bozak arbitration win than a MacArthur arbitration win? Burke has already shown the ability to make dispassionate decisions on fairly recently added FA's like Hanson and Irwin.

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07-05-2011, 11:48 AM
  #97
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I would hope we get something reasonable to keep him here. As someone pointed out, if we let it go to arbitration and we take the one year deal and Mac proves that he can by the same player he was for us last season, then we're going to have invest a lot of money to lock him up which will be hard because his linemates will be due for a raise as well (something I had previously forgotten about). I'd say start with a higher price and offer at 2 years and then bargain for a lower cap hit if an extra year is tacked on. If he's a fluke, we can figure out later what to do with him.

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Old
07-05-2011, 11:50 AM
  #98
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I really like Mac's game, I'm really hoping for a reasonable 3 yr deal. He did put up over 100 hits for a smaller guy that is solid. He forechecks decently, and he is a very underrated playmaker.

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07-05-2011, 11:52 AM
  #99
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Quote:
Originally Posted by StarBurns View Post
Am I the only fan who thinks Burke is more likely to walk away from a Bozak arbitration win than a MacArthur arbitration win? Burke has already shown the ability to make dispassionate decisions on fairly recently added FA's like Hanson and Irwin.
I hope not. Bozak is a great third liner with 2nd line potential for sure. Bozak will get like a 1.5M deal.

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Old
07-05-2011, 11:54 AM
  #100
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3.25M on a 2 year contract with team option for 3rd year at 3.75

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