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The Off-season Thread Part III (pre-season schedule w/TV in #472)

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Old
07-08-2011, 12:58 PM
  #76
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NYR have re-signed Anisimov and Sauer to pretty decent contracts, but with Callahan, Dubinsky and Boyle left to sign and two more defenders to add, they could still be tight against the cap. I mean, Callahan and Dubinsky should be paid rather handsomely considering some of the other deals handed out this summer, and Boyle is coming off a 20-goal season. Sending MZA down to the AHL saves quite a bit however.

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07-08-2011, 05:25 PM
  #77
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Originally Posted by Giroux tha Damaja View Post
I'm interested to see how they do this year also. Particularly how Markstrom does. I don't have confidence in him as an NHL player the way most do.
Is he due to start? Or does Theodore take the reigns for a bit?

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07-08-2011, 05:34 PM
  #78
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sobrien View Post
Is he due to start? Or does Theodore take the reigns for a bit?
I'm figuring Jose Theodore is their starter, but c'mon....it's Jose Three-or-four. I would bet a lot that Markstrom is gonna get some games. He's got slow feet and blocky movement for a guy who is supposed to become an NHL stud, but I've been wrong before and I wanna get a chance to watch some full games of him.

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07-08-2011, 09:40 PM
  #79
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I can guess we'll probably see something like this (if Couturier doesn't start the season):

CAPGEEK.COM CAP CALCULATOR

FORWARDS
Scott Hartnell ($4.200m) / Daniel Briere ($6.500m) / Jaromir Jagr ($3.300m)
James Van Riemsdyk ($1.654m) / Claude Giroux ($3.750m) / Jakub Voracek ($2.250m)
Andreas Nodl ($0.845m) / Brayden Schenn ($3.110m) / Wayne Simmonds ($1.750m)
Maxime Talbot ($1.750m) / Blair Betts ($0.700m) / Ben Holmstrom ($0.750m)
Jody Shelley ($1.100m) / Eric Wellwood ($0.580m)

DEFENSEMEN
Chris Pronger ($4.921m) / Matt Carle ($3.437m)
Kimmo Timonen ($6.333m) / Braydon Coburn ($3.200m)
Andrej Meszaros ($4.000m) / Erik Gustafsson ($0.900m)
Oskars Bartulis ($0.600m) / Andreas Lilja ($0.737m)

GOALTENDERS
Ilya Bryzgalov ($5.666m) / Sergei Bobrovsky ($1.750m)

CAPGEEK.COM TOTALS (follow @capgeek on Twitter)
(these totals are compiled without the bonus cushion)
SALARY CAP: $64,300,000; CAP PAYROLL: $63,785,595; BONUSES: $3,940,000
CAP SPACE (24-man roster): $514,405

What I love is, for all 4 lines, each winger will either hit well or become a beast on the puck.

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Old
07-08-2011, 11:40 PM
  #80
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SolidSnakeUS View Post
I can guess we'll probably see something like this (if Couturier doesn't start the season):

CAPGEEK.COM CAP CALCULATOR

FORWARDS
Scott Hartnell ($4.200m) / Daniel Briere ($6.500m) / Jaromir Jagr ($3.300m)
James Van Riemsdyk ($1.654m) / Claude Giroux ($3.750m) / Jakub Voracek ($2.250m)
Andreas Nodl ($0.845m) / Brayden Schenn ($3.110m) / Wayne Simmonds ($1.750m)
Maxime Talbot ($1.750m) / Blair Betts ($0.700m) / Ben Holmstrom ($0.750m)
Jody Shelley ($1.100m) / Eric Wellwood ($0.580m)

DEFENSEMEN
Chris Pronger ($4.921m) / Matt Carle ($3.437m)
Kimmo Timonen ($6.333m) / Braydon Coburn ($3.200m)
Andrej Meszaros ($4.000m) / Erik Gustafsson ($0.900m)
Oskars Bartulis ($0.600m) / Andreas Lilja ($0.737m)

GOALTENDERS
Ilya Bryzgalov ($5.666m) / Sergei Bobrovsky ($1.750m)

CAPGEEK.COM TOTALS (follow @capgeek on Twitter)
(these totals are compiled without the bonus cushion)
SALARY CAP: $64,300,000; CAP PAYROLL: $63,785,595; BONUSES: $3,940,000
CAP SPACE (24-man roster): $514,405

What I love is, for all 4 lines, each winger will either hit well or become a beast on the puck.
As giddy as we all are about actual cap space, I wouldn't carry 24 players, and jam up too many prospects in the rafters eating hot dogs rather than taking regular shifts in Adirondack. Also, I'm more inclined to break up the vets. Giroux - Jagr is pretty exciting, especially with JvR throwing his weight around. The downside is the anti-defense line of Hartnell - Briere - Voracek, by accounts of Voracek's defensive misadventures in Columbus.

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Old
07-08-2011, 11:45 PM
  #81
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Originally Posted by BernieParent View Post
As giddy as we all are about actual cap space, I wouldn't carry 24 players, and jam up too many prospects in the rafters eating hot dogs rather than taking regular shifts in Adirondack. Also, I'm more inclined to break up the vets. Giroux - Jagr is pretty exciting, especially with JvR throwing his weight around. The downside is the anti-defense line of Hartnell - Briere - Voracek, by accounts of Voracek's defensive misadventures in Columbus.
Don't worry, as long as Hartnell is a good skater, he can cover them.

He's a good skater, right?

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Old
07-09-2011, 12:08 AM
  #82
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Originally Posted by Beef Invictus View Post
Don't worry, as long as Hartnell is a good skater, he can cover them.

He's a good skater, right?
Oh yeah, he has the grace of a middle-aged Gerald Ford, and the power kick of Sunny Von Bulow.

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07-09-2011, 02:55 AM
  #83
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You can't carry 24 players anyway, 23 is the maximum roster size.

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07-09-2011, 03:02 AM
  #84
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You can't carry 24 players anyway, 23 is the maximum roster size.
I did it as showing who can just come in when need be.

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Old
07-09-2011, 09:17 AM
  #85
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Rather not even carry 23. Better to float as much cap space as possible for trade deadline day.

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07-09-2011, 11:39 AM
  #86
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Originally Posted by Beef Invictus View Post
Don't worry, as long as Hartnell is a good skater, he can cover them.

He's a good skater, right?
yup and Matt Carle is the best defenseman on this team. I mean hey he was a +30 right?

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07-10-2011, 01:28 PM
  #87
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yup and Matt Carle is the best defenseman on this team. I mean hey he was a +30 right?
Exactly!

However, I do think we need to keep Carle now. We lost a lot of offense this off season, and his ability to set up plays has suddenly become far more important.

Then again, it's possible that his defensive liabilities are going to become even bigger issues now that we've lost two very good two-way forwards. I'm hoping this shiny new goalie helps that.

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07-10-2011, 02:13 PM
  #88
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Originally Posted by Beef Invictus View Post
Exactly!

However, I do think we need to keep Carle now. We lost a lot of offense this off season, and his ability to set up plays has suddenly become far more important.

Then again, it's possible that his defensive liabilities are going to become even bigger issues now that we've lost two very good two-way forwards. I'm hoping this shiny new goalie helps that.
I'm very interested in seeing if Carle steps his game up to another level. People hate him a lot on here and he did crap the bed in the playoffs. However, the guy has just too much skill to not be an effective defenseman. It's funny because I see a lot of Desjardins in Carle's game. Desjardins was effectively run out of Montreal for not being a thumper and was considered a very soft defender. He even had that reputation for the first two or three seasons he was in Philadelphia. Eventually, Desjardins was able to put it all together. I'm expecting the same thing of Carle.

What the Flyers really need is for Coburn to be a shutdown guy and be that guy consistently, night in and night out. I think that's the real key to the success of the Flyers defense. If Coburn can be that beast of a stopper, then this team will go very far. If he can't handle that role, then there's going to be problems. Pronger can't be that guy anymore, Timonen can't be that guy anymore, and Carle just doesn't have the physical tools that Coburn does to be that guy. Meszaros has the physical tools, but he's also got a great set of offensive tools and to utilize him in that role as stopper would be a waste.

Maybe it's just me, but I'm not concerned about the forwards at all. Peter Laviolette has a great track record at working with young forwards, so there's no reason to believe that Schenn and Simmonds can't be successful under his watch. I also think Giroux takes his game to another level next year and gets close to or over the 100 point mark, while establishing himself as the premier forward on the team. JVR is ready to become the next great franchise left winger like Brian Propp.

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07-10-2011, 02:29 PM
  #89
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I don't think it's that simple that one guy needs to be the stopper and the other guys can sacrifice that in the name of offense. You need all your defensemen to be as good as they can at everything, because it's not like you can send out guys as the situation dictates.

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07-10-2011, 02:34 PM
  #90
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I've been waiting for Carle to stop being soft and begin taking stands on defense for a while, and he hasn't really indicated that will happen any time soon.

Now would be a great time to start though.

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07-10-2011, 02:38 PM
  #91
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Originally Posted by Giroux tha Damaja View Post
I don't think it's that simple that one guy needs to be the stopper and the other guys can sacrifice that in the name of offense. You need all your defensemen to be as good as they can at everything, because it's not like you can send out guys as the situation dictates.
It's not about one guy being a stopper and the other guys sacrificing defense in the name of offense. However, having a shut down guy/stopper would certainly make it easier for the rest of the defensemen in terms of what their roles would be. I think a guy like Carle would certainly benefit that much from being paired with a stopper. It would allow him the freedom to roam and pinch and allow him to be a potential game breaking offensive defenseman.

It would also lift the burden on a guy like Pronger who is expected to be both an offensive force and a stopper. It would also lift the burden on Timonen as well. Coburn being the new age Brad McCrimmon is something that the team needs. I think he could fit the role of stopper very well.

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07-11-2011, 05:30 PM
  #92
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Originally Posted by Beef Invictus View Post
I've been waiting for Carle to stop being soft and begin taking stands on defense for a while, and he hasn't really indicated that will happen any time soon.

Now would be a great time to start though.
I guess it all depends on your perspective and what you think you see. Carle is a solid defender and isn't close to being soft in any manner. And all the information available backs that up. A lot has been said about Carle on here in the negative and none of it has been substantiated with any evidence whatsoever, just with innacurate talk. Same as 90% of the posters stating that Carle should be moved for Cap space when it was obvious that, that was one of the last things that should have been done. Yet how many badly missed the boat with that suggestion?

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07-11-2011, 05:43 PM
  #93
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I guess it all depends on your perspective and what you think you see. Carle is a solid defender and isn't close to being soft in any manner. And all the information available backs that up. A lot has been said about Carle on here in the negative and none of it has been substantiated with any evidence whatsoever, just with innacurate talk. Same as 90% of the posters stating that Carle should be moved for Cap space when it was obvious that, that was one of the last things that should have been done. Yet how many badly missed the boat with that suggestion?
Let's not get this started again. Our positions are irreconcilable, and at this point I think we need to keep him because I don't think we are going to get anybody better back. He's going to need to score more than 1 goal this year though, and he's going to need to actually stand his ground when facing opposing forwards. Coburn is finally learning to do it, so it's not impossible for Carle to do it.

And let's be honest, Carter and Richards weren't moved instead of Carle because of Carle being indispensable. There were obviously other factors in play that we officially are in the dark about.

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07-11-2011, 06:08 PM
  #94
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Originally Posted by Beef Invictus View Post
Let's not get this started again. Our positions are irreconcilable, and at this point I think we need to keep him because I don't think we are going to get anybody better back. He's going to need to score more than 1 goal this year though, and he's going to need to actually stand his ground when facing opposing forwards. Coburn is finally learning to do it, so it's not impossible for Carle to do it.

And let's be honest, Carter and Richards weren't moved instead of Carle because of Carle being indispensable. There were obviously other factors in play that we officially are in the dark about.
Carle does stand his ground defensively. That's been proven. I agree, goal scoring is one area where Carle needs to take a step forward. All player has strengths and weaknesses and finishing his chances wasn't one last year for Carle. He's shown that ability in the past.

No player is indispensable unless your Crosby or Ovechkin. And I never said or hinted in any way that Richards and Carter were moved because Carle was indispensable. What I did say repeatedly and brung up were the reasons why a defenseman shouldn't be moved to gain Cap space. I was right all along. And that's further reinforced by the statements that Lukko and Holmgren of made that they wanted to keep their defense intact this off season. That situation was badly missed by many when the reasons not to trade Carle were obvious.

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07-11-2011, 06:26 PM
  #95
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Carle does stand his ground defensively. That's been proven. I agree, goal scoring is one area where Carle needs to take a step forward. All player has strengths and weaknesses and finishing his chances wasn't one last year for Carle. He's shown that ability in the past.

No player is indispensable unless your Crosby or Ovechkin. And I never said or hinted in any way that Richards and Carter were moved because Carle was indispensable. What I did say repeatedly and brung up were the reasons why a defenseman shouldn't be moved to gain Cap space. I was right all along. And that's further reinforced by the statements that Lukko and Holmgren of made that they wanted to keep their defense intact this off season. That situation was badly missed by many when the reasons not to trade Carle were obvious.


Seriously, let's not go down this bumpy road again. We'd save both our time if we just found the nearest boulder and headbutted it until our brains oozed out of our eyes. We disagree completely, let's just be satisfied about it and move on.

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07-11-2011, 06:31 PM
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Originally Posted by Beef Invictus View Post


Seriously, let's not go down this bumpy road again. We'd save both our time if we just found the nearest boulder and headbutted it until our brains oozed out of our eyes. We disagree completely, let's just be satisfied about it and move on.
If you seriously don't want to go down that road again, then why reply with the smiley face that implies that your laughing at my response? If I was you I wouldn't want to go down that road again either, when your as wrong as you are. Both about Carle as a player and whether he should of been the player to be traded. And you made the comments about Carle that I responded to, so I guess you did want to discuss it again. Like I said, I'm open to any information you can provide to back your statements of Carle as a player up. I've yet to read any.

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07-11-2011, 06:45 PM
  #97
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If you seriously don't want to go down that road again, then why reply with the smiley face that implies that your laughing at my response? If I was you I wouldn't want to go down that road again either, when your as wrong as you are. Both about Carle as a player and whether he should of been the player to be traded. And you made the comments about Carle that I responded to, so I guess you did want to discuss it again. Like I said, I'm open to any information you can provide to back your statements of Carle as a player up. I've yet to read any.
I'm laughing at the thought of doing all this over again for no purpose, not your point.

As for "all the info," I provided it a while ago. Many others agreed with it. You ignored it completely.

Like I said, I'm not doing this again. Find someone else to defend Carle's shining goodness to. This is my last post on the matter, because seriously, I'm not wasting time with it again. It's clear you care about defending Carle's honor than I care about his deficiencies.

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07-11-2011, 06:48 PM
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I'm laughing at the thought of doing all this over again for no purpose, not your point.

As for "all the info," I provided it a while ago. Many others agreed with it. You ignored it completely.

Like I said, I'm not doing this again. Find someone else to defend Carle's shining goodness to. This is my last post on the matter, because seriously, I'm not wasting time with it again.
I didn't ignore anything. I didn't see any factual info from you. I didn't see any credible evidence to back up your opinion. Why, because it doesn't exist. There isn't a need to defend him, there is only the facts.

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07-11-2011, 06:48 PM
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Carle does stand his ground defensively. That's been proven. I agree, goal scoring is one area where Carle needs to take a step forward. All player has strengths and weaknesses and finishing his chances wasn't one last year for Carle. He's shown that ability in the past.

No player is indispensable unless your Crosby or Ovechkin. And I never said or hinted in any way that Richards and Carter were moved because Carle was indispensable. What I did say repeatedly and brung up were the reasons why a defenseman shouldn't be moved to gain Cap space. I was right all along. And that's further reinforced by the statements that Lukko and Holmgren of made that they wanted to keep their defense intact this off season. That situation was badly missed by many when the reasons not to trade Carle were obvious.
You mean the same guys who made statements that Carter and Richards weren't getting traded?

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07-11-2011, 06:55 PM
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You mean the same guys who made statements that Carter and Richards weren't getting traded?
Yes, I did make that statement. I was wrong there. And considering the situation, I'd make it again every time. Based on all the speculation going on, it was a reasonable statement to make. And they were trades that were a surprise. There were rumors around, but they've been around every year, especially concerning Carter.


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