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J.T. Miller has Change of Heart, Going to OHL not NCAA

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Old
07-14-2011, 10:44 PM
  #101
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A little dissapointed here. My neice graduates UND this year. Im heading to there and would have gotten to see him live. Oh well...Good look in Jrs ole boy!

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07-14-2011, 11:12 PM
  #102
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Instead, he is expected to sign an entry-level contract with the New York Rangers and play for the Plymouth Whalers of the Ontario Hockey League.
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“You never want to lose a player that could potentially be a good piece to the puzzle,” UND coach Dave Hakstol said. “The timing is tough, but we’ll evaluate what we do from here — whether or not we feel there’s a player that makes sense to bring in. We’ll take time and evaluate that. We’ll go through the process and make a decision, whether we decide to bring someone else in or if it makes more sense to sit back and wait and use the next 12 months to go out and fill that spot.”
http://www.grandforksherald.com/even...roup/homepage/

We discussed the contract in the prospects thread. $277,500 signing bonus. 10% of the $925,000 max for 2011 draft picks. Miller plays in Plymouth. SPC slides and doesn't count against the 50 SPC limit.

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07-14-2011, 11:14 PM
  #103
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The nice signing bonus he will get im sure influenced his decision to go to the OHL.

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07-15-2011, 12:30 AM
  #104
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This is a bit of a surprise.

But you can bet this decision was heavily influenced by the Ranger brass, specifically Clark. Gordie must see this as the best path for Miller. I trust that Clark knows what he's doing.

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07-15-2011, 12:46 AM
  #105
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Originally Posted by Pizza View Post
This is a bit of a surprise.

But you can bet this decision was heavily influenced by the Ranger brass, specifically Clark. Gordie must see this as the best path for Miller. I trust that Clark knows what he's doing.
The Rangers have pushed the CHL for EVERY prospect they have drafted. Not just Miller.

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07-15-2011, 12:59 AM
  #106
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Gonna have to disagree with Jonathan. I don't think that the NCAA is the best route to the NHL. I have felt, and will always feel the best route is the CHL, then the AHL, and then the NHL.

Yes, in the NCAA he will be playing against older players. he will also not be focusing on hockey 100%. He won't be playing near as many games. and he won't get used to that pro grind. I think NCAA players get kinda shafted in that aspect.

For every Derek Stepan there's a Matt Gilroy. im not a big believer in the NCAA being a developmental league. every year significantly more players enter the NHL from the CHL than the NCAA, thats just a cold hard fact.

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07-15-2011, 01:47 AM
  #107
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This shouldn't be another NCAA vs OHL thread. It should be about the hockey programs. There are obviously a number of different pros and cons with them, but you can't base much off of that difference.

You have to focus on the actual hockey programs, because that's what's going to play the bigger role in J.T's development. And if you ask me, there's a day/night difference between the two.

I don't like Millers decision. You don't pass up playing, and developing in ND. We're talking about a top-notch school where he would have had a golden opportunity of really honing his skillset under a fantastic coaching staff.

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07-15-2011, 03:45 AM
  #108
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hard for me to gauge this news. what team is he going to? how is their depth and coaching? is he gonna to get some heavy ice time? if the team has like six 90 point 20 year olds, it might not be the best thing. it might still be the better thing. ah well. i am optimistic but wish i knew more about the situation.

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07-15-2011, 07:24 AM
  #109
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JT Miller looks to be in good hands

Quote:
If the Whalers add JT Miller, they're in pretty good shape for an OHL Championship run the next two years. Look at that roster.
https://twitter.com/#!/twharry/status/91567270505086976

Quote:
If Rickard Rakell plays center this year like he wants to, you're potentially looking at a first line of Miller-Rakell-Noesen
https://twitter.com/#!/twharry/status/91574008805457921

3 first round picks from three weeks ago.

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07-15-2011, 08:34 AM
  #110
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I think it's kinda funny that the Rangers' 1st round draft pick who is actually skipping college is probably going to end up being the "smarter" one.

The numbers dont lie -- the CHL is better at developing stars.

The top-40 scorers in the NHl last season, only one (David Backes -- 39th) played over two years of NCAA hockey. The handful of NCAA-trained scorers in the top-40 (Toews, Kessel, Pavelski, Kesler etc) all played two years or less.

And I didnt count MSL because he played in the NCAA during a time where it was developing stars who played three or four years.

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07-15-2011, 08:56 AM
  #111
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Originally Posted by Inferno272 View Post
For every Derek Stepan there's a Matt Gilroy. im not a big believer in the NCAA being a developmental league. every year significantly more players enter the NHL from the CHL than the NCAA, thats just a cold hard fact.
You can't compare Stepan to Gilroy. Stepan was a 2nd round pick. Gilroy wasn't even drafted. The fact that Gilroy has made it to the NHL is a point in favor of the NCAA, not against it.

The whole NCAA vs CHL thing is way overblown. There are pros and cons to both of them. In the end, it's up to the player to improve no matter where he's playing.

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07-15-2011, 09:07 AM
  #112
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Darnit! I wanted a Sioux JT Miller shirt!!

Oh well, if it gets him into a Rangers jersey faster..I can deal with it.

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07-15-2011, 09:41 AM
  #113
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Originally Posted by The Healthy Scratch View Post
Been hearing the same about the BC program for 3 years now. Kreider didnt improve much from season 1 to season 2.
Actually he did.

Stat surfing doesn't show you on ice development.

He came to BC as a primarily one-dimensional speedy scorer with grit.

Now he'd a legitimate two way player, that plays in all situations.

He was a top performer in the WJC his two years in the tournament. He showed flashes in the Men's WC. And every big game BC has had the last two years he was one of the top impact payers.

"Didn't improve" is what stat surfers say. He still put up double digit goals and passed 20 points. In NCAA hockey, in this era, is not bad.

Besides anything else, he still put up more points in less games then the year prior. While continuing to develop his two way game, id say that's improvement.

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07-15-2011, 09:48 AM
  #114
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Originally Posted by RangerBoy View Post
http://www.grandforksherald.com/even...roup/homepage/

We discussed the contract in the prospects thread. $277,500 signing bonus. 10% of the $925,000 max for 2011 draft picks. Miller plays in Plymouth. SPC slides and doesn't count against the 50 SPC limit.
Good to hear they will honor the deal they made with him about this situation.

I mentioned earlier in the thread that id expect/hope for the ELC to be announced in the coming days.

Miller said before he was drafted that if his drafting team requested he go the CHL route, he would want/demand a guaranteed ELC before the season starts. Which is smart, looking out for himself.

His plan is to get the NHL as quickly as possible.

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07-15-2011, 09:52 AM
  #115
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Originally Posted by RangerBoy View Post
JT Miller looks to be in good hands



https://twitter.com/#!/twharry/status/91567270505086976



https://twitter.com/#!/twharry/status/91574008805457921

3 first round picks from three weeks ago.
Ehh... and he in lies the problem.

If "Rakell WANTS to play center" then Miller, who is a natural two way playmaking center, will have to play on the wing or play in a lesser role.

Wonderful.

At UND, a team that lost most of its top players, he had the opportunity to possibly be the top line center.

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07-15-2011, 10:01 AM
  #116
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And why should Rakell be able to determine where he wants to play in the lineup? It shouldn't have to be earned?

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07-15-2011, 10:03 AM
  #117
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JT Miller all of a sudden looks like a fantastic pick.

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07-15-2011, 10:04 AM
  #118
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All the tweet said was "if Rakell plays center like he wants to." Nothing is set in stone. No need to jump the gun.

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07-15-2011, 10:04 AM
  #119
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JT Miller all of a sudden looks like a fantastic pick.
How does this move change anything?

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07-15-2011, 10:06 AM
  #120
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Originally Posted by SupersonicMonkey View Post
Actually he did.

Stat surfing doesn't show you on ice development.

He came to BC as a primarily one-dimensional speedy scorer with grit.

Now he'd a legitimate two way player, that plays in all situations.

He was a top performer in the WJC his two years in the tournament. He showed flashes in the Men's WC. And every big game BC has had the last two years he was one of the top impact payers.

"Didn't improve" is what stat surfers say. He still put up double digit goals and passed 20 points. In NCAA hockey, in this era, is not bad.

Besides anything else, he still put up more points in less games then the year prior. While continuing to develop his two way game, id say that's improvement.
We have enough two-way forwards and an elite goalie with a solid d-corps. He was drafted to be a scorer -- plain and simple.

The only time in the two years in which Kreider was used properly was at the two WJC's. Comes at no surprise that the two WJC's is why Kreider is a highly-touted prospect.

Kreider has not had a good career at BC outside of a few highlight goals. If it werent for the WJC, Kreider would be upsetting all of us for his lack of production.

This is why I hated his decision to go to BC from day One. It's obvious Kreider is super talented, but Jerry York cares more about his job security than he does about developing stars.

I compared Kreider (skill-wise) to Mike Gartner. Gartner didnt play a lick of defense. And guess what -- when he was scoring 45 goals a season, nobody cared.

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07-15-2011, 10:08 AM
  #121
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Originally Posted by SingnBluesOnBroadway View Post
How does this move change anything?
Research shows that players who pursue HL over NCAA after the draft end up making the NHL rosters and stay longer in the league.

NCAA route success rate sadly is just not as high.

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07-15-2011, 10:16 AM
  #122
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Originally Posted by poeman View Post
Research shows that players who pursue HL over NCAA after the draft end up making the NHL rosters and stay longer in the league.

NCAA route success rate sadly is just not as high.
I think "research" shows that the CHL puts more players into the NHL than the NCAA--as more of the highly-skilled prospects choose the Junior route than the college route. That means that Generic player A in the CHL would be a better bet than generic Player B in the NCAA to make the league, based purely on statistics. It DOES NOT mean that if Player B decided to then play CHL hockey, he'd somehow become a better prospect than he was...it just means that he'd join the larger group of touted prosepcts, and statistically have a better chance. It's no reflection on Player B himself.

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07-15-2011, 10:18 AM
  #123
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Originally Posted by Emma Royd View Post
I think "research" shows that the CHL puts more players into the NHL than the NCAA--as more of the highly-skilled prospects choose the Junior route than the college route. That means that generic player A in the CHL would be a better bet than generic player B in the NCAA to make the league, based purely on statistics. It DOES NOT mean that if player B decided to then play CHL hockey, he'd somehow become a better prospect than he was...it just means that he'd join the larger group of touted prosepcts.
And is that number based on players who played in the CHL or were drafted out of the CHL?

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07-15-2011, 10:21 AM
  #124
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Originally Posted by SupersonicMonkey View Post
Actually he did.

Stat surfing doesn't show you on ice development.

He came to BC as a primarily one-dimensional speedy scorer with grit.

Now he'd a legitimate two way player, that plays in all situations.

He was a top performer in the WJC his two years in the tournament. He showed flashes in the Men's WC. And every big game BC has had the last two years he was one of the top impact payers.

"Didn't improve" is what stat surfers say. He still put up double digit goals and passed 20 points. In NCAA hockey, in this era, is not bad.

Besides anything else, he still put up more points in less games then the year prior. While continuing to develop his two way game, id say that's improvement.
This.

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Originally Posted by German Way of War View Post
We have enough two-way forwards and an elite goalie with a solid d-corps. He was drafted to be a scorer -- plain and simple.

The only time in the two years in which Kreider was used properly was at the two WJC's. Comes at no surprise that the two WJC's is why Kreider is a highly-touted prospect.

Kreider has not had a good career at BC outside of a few highlight goals. If it werent for the WJC, Kreider would be upsetting all of us for his lack of production.

This is why I hated his decision to go to BC from day One. It's obvious Kreider is super talented, but Jerry York cares more about his job security than he does about developing stars.

I compared Kreider (skill-wise) to Mike Gartner. Gartner didnt play a lick of defense. And guess what -- when he was scoring 45 goals a season, nobody cared.
If you really feel this way then you must not have watched him much, if at all. I know he was drafted to be a scorer and he still is that, there's nothing wrong with him improving his 2-way game which he has done. I want Kreider to be fully developed when he is ready to turn pro. His stats arent astonishing because he hasnt been given huge minutes at BC as a freshman and sophomore. This upcoming year he is going to be the go to guy. In the WJC's he was very impressive and his offensive abilities shined. And clearly he had impressed enough to earn a spot on the world championships after this past season on a USA roster filled with NHL players.

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07-15-2011, 10:22 AM
  #125
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Originally Posted by German Way of War View Post
We have enough two-way forwards and an elite goalie with a solid d-corps. He was drafted to be a scorer -- plain and simple.

The only time in the two years in which Kreider was used properly was at the two WJC's. Comes at no surprise that the two WJC's is why Kreider is a highly-touted prospect.

Kreider has not had a good career at BC outside of a few highlight goals. If it werent for the WJC, Kreider would be upsetting all of us for his lack of production.

This is why I hated his decision to go to BC from day One. It's obvious Kreider is super talented, but Jerry York cares more about his job security than he does about developing stars.

I compared Kreider (skill-wise) to Mike Gartner. Gartner didnt play a lick of defense. And guess what -- when he was scoring 45 goals a season, nobody cared.
IMO, BC has been great for Kreider. His strengths are his speed, his size and his shot. He's not a tremendous stick handler. He isn't going to carry the puck the length of the ice very often. He excels in situations where there are turnovers and he can use his speed to break away from the defense. He excels at setting up in front of the goal and sniping.

He needs to know where to be without the puck. He needs to know how to play defense to create those turnovers. He isn't the type of player who will get the puck on his stick and go through 3 players or dangle around in the offensive zone.

His biggest difficiency coming out of HS was that he hadn't learned the team game. That's exactly what he's been learning at BC, and that's what will make him a successful pro. The most important thing for any player is the ability to think the game. If he can do that, with his physical tools, the offense will take care of itself.

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