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Old
07-20-2011, 05:01 PM
  #1
VanSciver
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Matt Carle article

For all the Carle fans in the house

http://www.broadstreethockey.com/201...are-matt-carle

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07-20-2011, 05:08 PM
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DumpyD
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We should forward this article to other teams so that maybe we can get some value in return for him.

In all seriousness though, he had some nice assists on Bruins goals during the playoffs. Woot Carle.

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07-20-2011, 05:11 PM
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Originally Posted by DumpyD View Post
We should forward this article to other teams so that maybe we can get some value in return for him.

In all seriousness though, he had some nice assists on Bruins goals during the playoffs. Woot Carle.
Matt Carle was on the ice for 12 goals against in the Boston Series. He made a mistake in coverage or a turnover and was responsible for 2 out of those 12 goals against. All the other goals were mistakes or misplays by other players.

But let's not cloud up the internet with facts here or let facts get in the way with a good story. All the facts support Carle as being a very good NHL defenseman.

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07-20-2011, 05:16 PM
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Originally Posted by VanSciver View Post
Matt Carle was on the ice for 12 goals against in the Boston Series. He made a mistake in coverage or a turnover and was responsible for 2 out of those 12 goals against. All the other goals were mistakes or misplays by other players.

But let's not cloud up the internet with facts here or let facts get in the way with a good story. All the facts support Carle as being a very good NHL defenseman.
You're completely right. Let us all blow each other over some skewed stats in a pro-Flyers website's fluff piece. Yay us.

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07-20-2011, 05:20 PM
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You're completely right. Let us all blow each other over some skewed stats in a pro-Flyers website's fluff piece. Yay us.
I'm not a big believer in advanced statistics. But there is no fluff there. There is only facts. And yes I'm completely right. Feel free to offer some substance to prove that I'm not right.

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07-20-2011, 05:28 PM
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This is hopeless. No one here is ever going to give Carle the credit he deserves.

He is far from perfect, but I would have killed to have a guy exactly like him on the team in the LOD days.

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07-20-2011, 05:57 PM
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Considering his height to weight ratio, he SHOULD be a lot of physical than he is. I wonder if this off season we can get it into his head to maybe take the body more often?

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07-20-2011, 06:21 PM
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Didnt he give up the turnover on the Krecji OT goal? But regardless, now we have proof that Carle is a beast! Empirical evidence!

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07-20-2011, 06:27 PM
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Originally Posted by SolidSnakeUS View Post
Considering his height to weight ratio, he SHOULD be a lot of physical than he is. I wonder if this off season we can get it into his head to maybe take the body more often?
I'd be happy with a willingness to take a hit to make a play.

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07-20-2011, 06:31 PM
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Matt Carle is simply underrated, great puck mover, awesome passer, not the best defensively but whatever. I'm happy to have Matt Carle on the Flyers

He's not a #1 or a #2, but defiantly a solid #3/#4

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07-20-2011, 06:50 PM
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Originally Posted by VanSciver View Post
For all the Carle fans in the house

http://www.broadstreethockey.com/201...are-matt-carle
Im not going into a Carle argument, because we all know where you stand on that point. I am going to say though is watch out how much you read into their articles. They do present facts, but it is how they compare them to is where they fault at. Do you agree with comparing Carle to Hedman or Schenn?

BSH is known to be particularly bias in regards to certain players. Examples are the likes of Brian Boucher, and Kevin Marshall. If I am not mistaken Carle is also one of their favorites. The word "elite" is saved for very few defenseman out there and here they claimed like he played as one, while comparing his facts to non-elite defenseman....unless you consider Schenn, Hedman, and Yandle elite.

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07-20-2011, 07:08 PM
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The reason I would trade Carle isn't because he's a bad player. If he's in a #3/#4 role, he's good. My thoughts are that he's going to get Wisniewski money on the open market and that his value is very high. Thus, explore trade options.

That being said, given the make-up of this team, I wouldn't be looking to trade him right now. Maybe see how things are going near the deadline, but I think the time to trade him has passed.

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07-20-2011, 07:13 PM
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Looks like a whole bunch of offensive stats, last I checked he's paid to play defense first.

Granted, I'm glad he stuck around this season to keep the defensive depth intact after the rest of the team being imploded. Next season though...See ya Matty

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07-20-2011, 07:14 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sa cyred View Post
Im not going into a Carle argument, because we all know where you stand on that point. I am going to say though is watch out how much you read into their articles. They do present facts, but it is how they compare them to is where they fault at. Do you agree with comparing Carle to Hedman or Schenn?

BSH is known to be particularly bias in regards to certain players. Examples are the likes of Brian Boucher, and Kevin Marshall. If I am not mistaken Carle is also one of their favorites. The word "elite" is saved for very few defenseman out there and here they claimed like he played as one, while comparing his facts to non-elite defenseman....unless you consider Schenn, Hedman, and Yandle elite.
BSH is right in what they present. They're all very good writers and analysts of advanced numbers. However, any internet blog is like watching Penn & Teller on Sho-Time, pounding the fact that support their argument.

I've been a known critic of Carle, but considering how the market shifts when it comes to defensemen, the contract is not as bad as it was. These guys are right, the numbers don't lie for what he does during the course of the regular season and at even-strength, but he was the focal point of two areas where the team imploded - power play and playing a team familiar with him. Yes, he played well in a re-scaled role without Pronger, but in the playoffs you from playing a team 4 times over 6 months, to 4 times in a week, and a lot of things change, and it changed for him. My past major criticisms remain the same as most others have stated in the past while giving him credit for where he excels. That's probably not going to be worth the $6M someone's going to give him next year though. If he's in demand, I'd still prefer to move him while getting an NHL defenseman in return somehow.

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07-20-2011, 07:28 PM
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Originally Posted by Jtown View Post
Didnt he give up the turnover on the Krecji OT goal? But regardless, now we have proof that Carle is a beast! Empirical evidence!
i love how jester uses this solely for stats and not actual observation of the player


edit: dont get me wrong, i think carle is a great player who is actually worth his contract...but the guys on that list are better.

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07-20-2011, 08:00 PM
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i love how jester uses this solely for stats and not actual observation of the player


edit: dont get me wrong, i think carle is a great player who is actually worth his contract...but the guys on that list are better.
Okay.

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07-20-2011, 08:01 PM
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I will take the under on that 6million. I am saying like 4.5 if he has another good year.

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07-20-2011, 08:22 PM
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I eat Carle.

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07-20-2011, 08:26 PM
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carle gets overhyped and overcriticised alot. i dont think hes elite but i wouldnt classify luke schenn in that category either

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07-20-2011, 08:47 PM
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Originally Posted by Giroux tha Damaja View Post
I will take the under on that 6million. I am saying like 4.5 if he has another good year.
Yeah, $6 million would be an overestimate. I could see him getting $5 million though from a lower-market team. That's something we cannot afford if we're going to be in the market for #1 defensemen to replace Kimmo and Pronger.

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07-20-2011, 09:03 PM
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Originally Posted by Ghost of Downie View Post
Yeah, $6 million would be an overestimate. I could see him getting $5 million though from a lower-market team. That's something we cannot afford if we're going to be in the market for #1 defensemen to replace Kimmo and Pronger.
Id give carle 4 for 5 if he'd take that (I really think he likes it here, and wants to win. Him and giroux are close)

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07-20-2011, 09:06 PM
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I eat Carle.

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07-20-2011, 09:06 PM
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Originally Posted by sa cyred View Post
Im not going into a Carle argument, because we all know where you stand on that point. I am going to say though is watch out how much you read into their articles. They do present facts, but it is how they compare them to is where they fault at. Do you agree with comparing Carle to Hedman or Schenn?

BSH is known to be particularly bias in regards to certain players. Examples are the likes of Brian Boucher, and Kevin Marshall. If I am not mistaken Carle is also one of their favorites. The word "elite" is saved for very few defenseman out there and here they claimed like he played as one, while comparing his facts to non-elite defenseman....unless you consider Schenn, Hedman, and Yandle elite.
Yes, right now, Carle is better than Schenn or Hedman. In the future we'll see.
Wouold I classify Carle as elite? Not at all. Would I classify him a very good all around defenseman who is underappreciated by majority of the fanbase? yes, I would.

Quote:
Originally Posted by GKJ View Post
BSH is right in what they present. They're all very good writers and analysts of advanced numbers. However, any internet blog is like watching Penn & Teller on Sho-Time, pounding the fact that support their argument.

I've been a known critic of Carle, but considering how the market shifts when it comes to defensemen, the contract is not as bad as it was. These guys are right, the numbers don't lie for what he does during the course of the regular season and at even-strength, but he was the focal point of two areas where the team imploded - power play and playing a team familiar with him. Yes, he played well in a re-scaled role without Pronger, but in the playoffs you from playing a team 4 times over 6 months, to 4 times in a week, and a lot of things change, and it changed for him. My past major criticisms remain the same as most others have stated in the past while giving him credit for where he excels. That's probably not going to be worth the $6M someone's going to give him next year though. If he's in demand, I'd still prefer to move him while getting an NHL defenseman in return somehow.
It changed for a lot of players on the Flyers in the playoffs. Playing a team 4 times a week versus 4 times in 6 months has nothing to do with it. A good player is a good player regardless.

If Carle is going to demand 6M then I would move him also. But I think that's an exaggeration

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07-20-2011, 09:28 PM
  #24
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Let's change up this thread a bit...what WOULD you give Carle?

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07-20-2011, 09:30 PM
  #25
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4.5 mil at the most.

6 mil would be pretty insane..if Carle deserves 6 mil, then Mike Green deserves 8.

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