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07-20-2011, 02:05 PM
  #26
Chalfdiggity3
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Originally Posted by Provolone View Post
I'm not talking smack about Kreider, just said he didn't tear it up in college. His performance in international play is what has me psyched about him and i agree he has 65+pt potential. But for the sake of ranking team prospect pools, im sure you can say that about a lot of top prospects in each respective organization.
I understand what your saying about how he performed in college but you have to remember that at BC they have their seniors on the top 2 lines. Krieder was a junior and when given the ice time like in the international play, he is able to show how good he really is. Thats just how BC is, otherwise he wouldve been playing the top line. This year will be a good indication on how well he will perform since he will finally be getting 1st line minutes.

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I really wouldn't bet that McD turns out like Letang. Though it did take a few years for Letang to break out like the allstar he is, so i hope you're right about McD turning into him.
Why would you say that? The guy has talent and potential oozing out of his pores. Has very good positioning, outstanding wheels, great vision, passing and shooting skills are above average. I really think this kid could be a more offensive version of Marc Staal.

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I'm not big on this "we got a lot of boom/bust players" i've been seeing posted on these boards recently. It makes it sound like it's a 50/50 proposition, when in reality it's a 95% bust::5% boom ratio.
I get what your saying and there are definatly players that have those odds, but youll see there are a couple of prospects that have really played themselves into our top 10 the past year or two and you never know what they can become if they are able to put things together. Which from our scouting staff, i have faith in them since they have been targeting players not just with skill but a TON of heart and dedication to the game.

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I do think we're slightly above average compared to other teams, which IMO, is overachieving considering where we draft, so kudos to the staff and recent change of culture.
Ehh id honestly say that we are around the #10 spot. Especially given where we have drafted since the post lockout era.

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07-20-2011, 02:22 PM
  #27
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Personally, I never bother with Hockeybuzz, but I don't think it's worth going after the article until the author gets to his "in depth" analysis.

I don't agree that the Rangers are in the bottom-half when it comes to the prospect cupboard -- we've got a good system, if not great, which is somewhat mitigated by the fact that we have a very young team.

SBOB brings up a good point, though. Playing Devil's Advocate, the Rangers have almost no goaltending prospects of note (all due respect to Scott Stacjer -- he could turn out to be an NHL'er), not much in the way of high-end talent (kinda why, although I am pleased with JT Miller, I was hoping the Rangers might gamble a bit more on a guy like Armia), and no puck-moving defencemen after MDZ.

There are possible arguments why the Rangers would be ranked lower than we'd like to see -- though 19 out of 30 is a bit rough.

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07-20-2011, 02:32 PM
  #28
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There is no rhyme or reason to that list.

It's the same as if someone posted their arbitrary list on the main board.

He even says it's based mostly on personal opinion.

He's probably an HF Boards member. More specifically, a Leaf fan.

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07-20-2011, 02:32 PM
  #29
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I agree with the ranking, our pool is probably below league average. No top end guys, maybe 2nd pairing defensemen and 2nd line wingers.

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07-20-2011, 02:57 PM
  #30
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Originally Posted by Duskfamous View Post
I agree with the ranking, our pool is probably below league average. No top end guys, maybe 2nd pairing defensemen and 2nd line wingers.
Tim Erixon is better than a "maybe 2nd pair" defenseman. I'd argue that he, Chris Kreider and JT Miller are undoubtedly high-end players. One could argue that Thomas and McIlrath are potentially high-end players as well.

It's all opinion though. If you're not high on those players, then the system doesn't look nearly as good.

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07-20-2011, 03:04 PM
  #31
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if it isnt Hockey's future, I give it No credibility.

this has nothing to do with where NYR is ranked. this site is way above anything else out there on the intranets.

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07-20-2011, 03:18 PM
  #32
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Rangers are in the right spot. There are some teams that I would trade 2/3rds of our prospect pool for one player on another team. Philadelphia=Brayden Schenn....Edmonton=RNH... Florida=Jonathan Huberdeau... Colorado=Gabriel Landeskog.. Carolina=Ryan Murphy... Washington=Evgeny Kuznetsov... St.Louis=Vladimir Tarasenko... Nashville=Ryan Ellis... CBJ=Ryan Johansen...TML=Nazem Kadri... Phoenix=OEL...NJ=Adam Larsson

Bottom line is we have no top end talent on offense. Kreider had 24 points in 35 games this past season... putting him ahead of any of these players because he has exceptional skating and untapped potential is just wrong. Christian Thomas has many question marks. He put up unreal numbers in the O but in a very easy conference and I know for a fact he would not have put up those numbers in the other conference.
I would put them around the 15th spot because their defense is top 5 in the league prospect wise.

MDZ-McDonaugh
Erixon-McIlrath
Valetenko-Kundratek
Pashnin

They could almost make another team out of an entire new set of defense in a few years.

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07-20-2011, 03:24 PM
  #33
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Originally Posted by Emma Royd View Post
Tim Erixon is better than a "maybe 2nd pair" defenseman. I'd argue that he, Chris Kreider and JT Miller are undoubtedly high-end players. One could argue that Thomas and McIlrath are potentially high-end players as well.

It's all opinion though. If you're not high on those players, then the system doesn't look nearly as good.
I like Erixon and Miller, but I'm not going to set myself up for disappointing results like I did for Grachev and Sanguinetti. Erixon will likely become our 2nd pairing defenseman of the future, #3 guy who can both PK/PP, I was reading the Calgarypuck hockey forum before he was traded and joined a few weeks ago to get more information on him. They fully expected him to become a 2nd pairing defenseman, not one person claimed he'll be on their top pairing, which at the time was Regehr and Bouwmeester. They also said their management has big hopes for TJ Brodie, who was a PPG player in the pre-season and got called up to start the first few games of the season, who knows, maybe the Flames valued Erixon as an expandable asset since their defense core look decent at the moment.

As for Miller, he has proven nothing to indicate he will be a 1st line winger, look at his draft comparision; Mason Raymond. We'll see how he does in Plymouth.



As for Kreider, well this has been beaten to a dead horse so I'll not repeat it. McIlirath is a BIG project player, could end up like Beukeboom or another Huge Specimen.

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07-20-2011, 03:38 PM
  #34
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Originally Posted by SingnBluesOnBroadway View Post
Fair enough. They basically said their rankings are based around the criteria and are personal opinion.
So basically he doesn't like the Rangers?

Honestly, who cares what one idiot thinks? It makes ZERO difference.

The problem with the internet is: Every jackass on the planet thinks their opinion makes a difference. Everyone is a journalist, these days.

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07-20-2011, 03:59 PM
  #35
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Originally Posted by Duskfamous View Post
I like Erixon and Miller, but I'm not going to set myself up for disappointing results like I did for Grachev and Sanguinetti. Erixon will likely become our 2nd pairing defenseman of the future, #3 guy who can both PK/PP, I was reading the Calgarypuck hockey forum before he was traded and joined a few weeks ago to get more information on him. They fully expected him to become a 2nd pairing defenseman, not one person claimed he'll be on their top pairing, which at the time was Regehr and Bouwmeester. They also said their management has big hopes for TJ Brodie, who was a PPG player in the pre-season and got called up to start the first few games of the season, who knows, maybe the Flames valued Erixon as an expandable asset since their defense core look decent at the moment.

As for Miller, he has proven nothing to indicate he will be a 1st line winger, look at his draft comparision; Mason Raymond. We'll see how he does in Plymouth.



As for Kreider, well this has been beaten to a dead horse so I'll not repeat it. McIlirath is a BIG project player, could end up like Beukeboom or another Huge Specimen.
You want to know what KILLS ME about JT Miller? The video they showed of him as a HIGHLIGHT was him poking a puck away from a player, and going into the corner and trying to take a puck away from a defenseman. No big goals, no cool highlights. Just a couple of VERY VERY ORDINARY plays.

May mean NOTHING it may mean something. I am just still not enamored with the pick.

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07-20-2011, 04:06 PM
  #36
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Originally Posted by gotmonte View Post
You want to know what KILLS ME about JT Miller? The video they showed of him as a HIGHLIGHT was him poking a puck away from a player, and going into the corner and trying to take a puck away from a defenseman. No big goals, no cool highlights. Just a couple of VERY VERY ORDINARY plays.

May mean NOTHING it may mean something. I am just still not enamored with the pick.
The USHL doesn't have very many highlight sources. It's not the CHL.

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07-20-2011, 04:33 PM
  #37
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Originally Posted by gotmonte View Post
You want to know what KILLS ME about JT Miller? The video they showed of him as a HIGHLIGHT was him poking a puck away from a player, and going into the corner and trying to take a puck away from a defenseman. No big goals, no cool highlights. Just a couple of VERY VERY ORDINARY plays.

May mean NOTHING it may mean something. I am just still not enamored with the pick.
What does YouTube mean when it comes to potential? I'm sure you can find plenty of highlights of Alex Daigle, Patrik Stefan, Rico Fata, Pavel Brend and Jamie Lundmark.

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07-20-2011, 06:13 PM
  #38
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Originally Posted by Duskfamous View Post
I like Erixon and Miller, but I'm not going to set myself up for disappointing results like I did for Grachev and Sanguinetti.
I agree... Grachev and Sangs had some serious hype a few years ago. Now they are not around. More often than not, these prospects don't develop as anticipated.

However, Erixon seems to be real close to be an NHL player. Not sure yet with Miller as he is a prospect who has a few more years to develop.

All in all, the Rangers do not have the 19th ranked prospect system. They have to have as good as any of the teams listed in the top 5. (Kreider, Thomas, Erixon, McD, MDZ, Mcilrath, Miller). How many teams have better prospects than that?

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07-20-2011, 06:32 PM
  #39
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The Rangers have had 2 lifetimes of over-hyped prospects that did nothing. And Henrik was a nobody.

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07-20-2011, 06:34 PM
  #40
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Originally Posted by gotmonte View Post
You want to know what KILLS ME about JT Miller? The video they showed of him as a HIGHLIGHT was him poking a puck away from a player, and going into the corner and trying to take a puck away from a defenseman. No big goals, no cool highlights. Just a couple of VERY VERY ORDINARY plays.

May mean NOTHING it may mean something. I am just still not enamored with the pick.
When you're showing highlights for a guy who rarely scores you have to find something to put on the reel. lol

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07-20-2011, 06:35 PM
  #41
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Originally Posted by gotmonte View Post
You want to know what KILLS ME about JT Miller? The video they showed of him as a HIGHLIGHT was him poking a puck away from a player, and going into the corner and trying to take a puck away from a defenseman. No big goals, no cool highlights. Just a couple of VERY VERY ORDINARY plays.

May mean NOTHING it may mean something. I am just still not enamored with the pick.
I don't recall a bunch of highlight hype surrounding guys like Callahan and Stepan, either.

Dubinsky was supposed to be a 3rd liner at best after his mediocre 3rd WHL year

I understand he was a first round pick, but this was and is an iffy draft. I'm glad we got a kid like this instead of taking a stab in the dark at someone like Rask.

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07-20-2011, 07:16 PM
  #42
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Originally Posted by gotmonte View Post
You want to know what KILLS ME about JT Miller? The video they showed of him as a HIGHLIGHT was him poking a puck away from a player, and going into the corner and trying to take a puck away from a defenseman. No big goals, no cool highlights. Just a couple of VERY VERY ORDINARY plays.

May mean NOTHING it may mean something. I am just still not enamored with the pick.
Derp.

1. Not a lot of video coverage of the US NTDP.
2. Did you watch the draft? The "highlight" selection for a good bit of the first round was just as eventful.

Definitely may mean something....

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07-21-2011, 01:21 PM
  #43
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Originally Posted by SLU Hockey View Post
I don't recall a bunch of highlight hype surrounding guys like Callahan and Stepan, either.

Dubinsky was supposed to be a 3rd liner at best after his mediocre 3rd WHL year

I understand he was a first round pick, but this was and is an iffy draft. I'm glad we got a kid like this instead of taking a stab in the dark at someone like Rask.
I like Miller and hopefully he can become a Dubinsky or Callahan type player, but there is nothing to indicate he'll be more than a 2nd line player.

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07-21-2011, 01:31 PM
  #44
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Originally Posted by hightide85 View Post
So basically he doesn't like the Rangers?

Honestly, who cares what one idiot thinks? It makes ZERO difference.

The problem with the internet is: Every jackass on the planet thinks their opinion makes a difference. Everyone is a journalist, these days.
Perfectly said. Doesn't matter whether it's hockeybuzz, hockeysfuture, or geniushockeyinternetforumposters dot com. It's all opinion at this point.

As somebody already said, anybody who tells you they know whether McIlraith will turn into Jeff Beukeboom or Hugh Jessiman is just giving a barely-educated guess.

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07-21-2011, 01:55 PM
  #45
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This is yet again another shining example of how ridiculously poor Hockybuzz is.

Just prior to the draft Hockeysfuture releases these organization rankings.

http://www.hockeysfuture.com/nhl_organisation_rankings/

Here the Islanders are #6 and the Rangers are #7.
Just after that ranking the Rangers acquire Tim Erixon and draft JT Miller while the Islanders draft Strome, Mayfield and Sundstrom in their first two rounds. Now doubt both teams have improved yet Hockeybuzz shows the Rangers as #19 and the Islanders as 1st overall...hogwash and absolutely clueless. People need to stop reading Hockeybuzz and believing them to be knowledgeable about anything hockey related.

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07-21-2011, 02:12 PM
  #46
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Originally Posted by vipernsx View Post
This is yet again another shining example of how ridiculously poor Hockybuzz is.

Just prior to the draft Hockeysfuture releases these organization rankings.

http://www.hockeysfuture.com/nhl_organisation_rankings/

Here the Islanders are #6 and the Rangers are #7.
Just after that ranking the Rangers acquire Tim Erixon and draft JT Miller while the Islanders draft Strome, Mayfield and Sundstrom in their first two rounds. Now doubt both teams have improved yet Hockeybuzz shows the Rangers as #19 and the Islanders as 1st overall...hogwash and absolutely clueless. People need to stop reading Hockeybuzz and believing them to be knowledgeable about anything hockey related.
As has been said, it's just a different opinion...that's all. If you don't want to read a website because you don't like how they ranked your team, that's your choice...and your opinion. Doesn't mean everyone has to stop reading it.

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07-21-2011, 02:34 PM
  #47
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I look at it this way: the writer is from Ontario and is either a Leafs or Sens fan. Surprise, surprise that both are in the top-10.

The reason why the Rangers should be higher is because they have made the playoffs with a predominantly home-grown team, and have showed that they can draft and develop NHL talent who contribute to an above-average program.

I dont think we overrate our prospects as much as other fan bases. This isnt 2003 where we were clutching at straws with Falardeau and Nowak. The kids this organization has and is developing are turning into legit players, so this guy and his list can take a hike.

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07-21-2011, 03:34 PM
  #48
nyr2k2
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Did Hockeybuzz count McDonagh and Zuccarello as prospects? HF did, which could potentially explain the discrepancy.

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07-21-2011, 06:00 PM
  #49
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I wasn't expecting top 5, but 19th???? Preposterous

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07-21-2011, 06:18 PM
  #50
msv957
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Originally Posted by vipernsx View Post
This is yet again another shining example of how ridiculously poor Hockybuzz is.

Just prior to the draft Hockeysfuture releases these organization rankings.

http://www.hockeysfuture.com/nhl_organisation_rankings/

Here the Islanders are #6 and the Rangers are #7.
Just after that ranking the Rangers acquire Tim Erixon and draft JT Miller while the Islanders draft Strome, Mayfield and Sundstrom in their first two rounds. Now doubt both teams have improved yet Hockeybuzz shows the Rangers as #19 and the Islanders as 1st overall...hogwash and absolutely clueless. People need to stop reading Hockeybuzz and believing them to be knowledgeable about anything hockey related.
Who really knows with prospects and prospect rankings. Every fan base overrates their prospects. However, It was interesting that Hockeybuzz ranked this at #19. Not even close. Adding Erixon looks to be a great move.

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