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LMHF Game Report #4, aka, my first ranting report.

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Old
10-21-2003, 08:03 PM
  #1
LoudmouthHemskyfan#1
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LMHF Game Report #4, aka, my first ranting report.

Mike York had just scored...we were all on our feet going nuts, the Oilers were up 3-0, and on the verge of pummelling the St. Louis Blues and going to 4-and-0 at home for the first time in it seems like ever. They looked like a hockey team. They looked like they KNEW they were a hockey team, and a good one.

Then 3 things happened:

1- Our master strategist, MacT, turns off the offence. The scoring players don't get as many shifts, and the pressure is gone.

2- Raffi Torres takes a completely BONEHEADED penalty behind our own net

3- Eric Brewer plays probably the worst 10 seconds I've ever seen an NHL defenceman play, resulting in a double minor.


Goal...Goal...Goal...Goal...Goal

Judging by the first part, you'd think the score is now 8-0 for Edmonton.

It's not. The score is 5-3.

And not for the Oilers.

Tommy Salo stays at least 2 goals too long, and then the bleeding finally stops.

Our coach finally realizes that our offensive lines need to play again.

Of course, it's too little too late, at the end of the game, missed chance after missed chance later, Barret (I'm the most overrated young d-man in the league) Jackman puts a wimpy wrister into the Edmonton net, and the fans go home bewildered.

WHAT A WASTE.

Player Report Time:

Lagging Behind:

Raffi Torres: Missed chances all over the place, a STUPID penalty that killed a ton of Mo, somehow stayed on the first line, but that's not his fault, that's MacTavishes.

Eric Brewer, Jason Smith, Scott Ferguson: All played horrendous. Brew doesn't look like he even cares anymore, Smith got beat an absolute ton of times and let people in behind, Ferguson is simply to slow and unskilled to take a spot away from our young d-men.

Shawn Horcoff: If this guy's value is still high, I'd deal him. Bumbling the puck around, skating into the wrong places, making horrible puck decisions, just plain BAD.

And lastly, and most likely worst, Tommy Salo. Tommy was slow, out of position, playing tentatively, making bad reads and not trusting his instinct. Should've been gone after 3, if not earlier. Couldn't even beat his d-man to a rebound that was a foot away from him. Ty starts for me in Colorado.

Middle of the pack:

Moreau, Isbister (tired of the excuses), Steve Staios, Cory Cross, Jason Chimera, Fernando Pisani, Georges Laraque. All lackluster.

Ahead of the middle:

MAB- despite 2 very bad breaks, he's definately one of the reasons we stayed in, and plays with so much guts and determination. This guy is really somethin. If Ferguson's in and he's not, there should be picketing outside Skyreach.

Mike York: He played fairly well, should've been better, but did contribute, which he needs to do on a more regular basis.

Radek Dvorak: Saw some BIG-TIME fire out of him tonight. He really wanted a goal to help the team. Too bad Radek, bring it again next game.

Ryan Smyth: Say this so often, Smytty was Smytty.

Leading the way:

Ales Hemsky: Another great game in what seems like an endless string. The amount of things he did tonight, even with the mistakes was just astonishing. Give him a winger other than Raffi Torres and he has a 4-point night. Him and Smyth were both undershifted tonight.

Marty Reasoner: Played an excellent game. Marty's really earning his place.

Ty Conklin: I really like the way Ty plays for us. He starts for me in Colorado.


GAME THOUGHTS:

We were flat-out outcoached tonight. Massive props to JQ. MacTavish was the anti-Colorado version tonight. Boneheaded decisions such as overyplaying Horcoff and leaving Torres at #1 winger.

Tommy stunk. NOT GOOD.

The core of our defence needs a wake-up call. They are way too secure in their jobs and are slacking. Especially Eric Brewer.

FOR THE LOVE OF WHATEVER YOU WANNA CALL IT, STOP TURNING OFF THE OFFENCE WHEN WE GET ROLLING!!!!!

UGGHHHHH

What a total waste.

That game shoulda been at least 6-0.

I'm out.

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10-21-2003, 08:36 PM
  #2
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Well i agree with ALMOST everything you said...IMO Dvorak was up there with Hemsky...Dvorak was explosive and really was unlucky and could of had a few...

One Step Ahead-

Stoll- Great warmup looked very solid out there

Hemsky- has 7 points in 6 games without playing IMO a good game...simply scary...

Staios- was really good...very consistant best oiler dman on the ice...

Reasoner- This guy was good from start to finish...just had a great game.

York- He had IMO his best game this year...still room for improvment but has the talent to really be big time for this team..

Middle of the Pack

Bergeron- had a bad game had some bad bounces go over his stick and just wasnt himself IMO tonight...This guy is definatly a keeper however and hopefully will evolve into top 4 guy...(which i think he will)

Smyth-Smyth was decent and IMO with one more good hockey player on a line with him and Hemsky they will dominate.

Moreau-Great on the PK...solid game from Ethan...not much more to say

Conklin-Conklin was solid in the little rubber that was shot his way.

Laraque-Plays with so much intensity...this guy really can turn momentum so fast...

One Step Behind

Cross-Nothing great, a few giveaways

Pisani-Made some bad descisions in the offensive zone...plays could have resulted in goals...

Smith-Was beat all over...turned up the hitting towards the end...

Old and Slow-(Ferguson) what else is there to say...old and slow...he didnt do anything terrible but i woiuld MUCH rather have Semenov in the lineup...this guy has to be one hell of a leader to still be in the lineup somehow

More Than One Step Behind

Eric Brewer- What was he doing out there tonight? #1 said Brewer played the worst 10 seconds of NHL hockey he has ever seen an NHL defenceman play....I almost agree but unfortunatly i have seen Igor Kravchuk play in calgary

Torres-Takes a HORRIBLE penalty which let the blues score their first goal of the game which started the shift in momentum....

Isbister...is this guy going to be anything? he has the size but IMO doesnt have the power forward mindset he needs...he can sometimes beat the winger on the outside then lets a little floater of a shot go...He doesnt drive to the net WHY BRAD WHY????

Horcoff- He should have been wearing #7 out there because even Cleary has better games than that, that is simply horrible.

Chimera-He doesnt seem like he uses all the speed he has (which is a hell of alot) to burn guys outside which he is perfectly capable of...i expect much better of him...

Salo- Tommy Tommy Tommy...you just were slow tonight...I cant blame the loss on you but you just looked behind all night...Tommy was very hesitative all night..you better work on that bench door because if you keep playing like this you will see alot more of it....

This brings me to my last question...HOW DO YOU LOSE A HOCKEY GAME WHEN YOU HAVE A 3-0 LEAD????

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10-21-2003, 08:42 PM
  #3
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Good to see #1 and #2 seeing eye to eye!

I agree with most points

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10-21-2003, 08:54 PM
  #4
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I agree that Salo should have been gone after the third goal, and that Edmonton blew it. But as for blaming it on MacT that he stopped with putting the scorers out.... I can't. The whole team stopped skating after they went up 3-0. Except for Laraque and Isbister. Torres' penalty wasn't a good one, agreed, but then Torres got pasted from behind, where was the call for that? IN FACT... I thought that was what was being called. I was SURPRISED that Torres got a penalty, and St.Louis didn't. Smyth missed a golden oppurtunity on the pp, sweet pass from Hemsky, so did York. But what hurt the most out of all of this was as soon as the Blues yanked Johnson, the Oilers all stopped skating. The Blues carried the play for five straight goals. Terrible effort guys. If your not going to play 60mins of hockey, then tell MacT ya don't feel like playing a whole game and we can send ya down to Toronto, or trade ya, and get some guys THAT WILL!!!!!!!!!!

 
Old
10-21-2003, 08:55 PM
  #5
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Just as an additional supplement, as something that came up tonight, I thought I'd comment on one of my main pet peeves....

All the people yelling SHOOOOOOOOOT all the freaking time.

2 words, SHUT UP!

You yell when players can't/won't/couldn't shoot.

You yell when they have 1 hand on their sticks.

You yell when they cross the blue line.

You yell when 3 guys are draped on them.

You yell when there's a man wide open for a pass.

You yell on the PP when there's a wall of killers in the way.

You yell when one pass would set up an easy goal.

You yell when there is NO DECENT POSSIBILITY OF A GOAL.

It's pathetic.

It is PAINFULLY obvious that MOST of you doing this know little to nothing about hockey, have never played the game at any kind of high level (and obviously for a reason), and do not understand what it takes to score a goal.

You cannot score by ramming a shot into a shot-blocker's pads.

The object of a powerplay is to set up an easy goal.

Scoring with 3 men on you at once and one hand on your stick while facing away from the net is not likely.

Shooting is often the worst decision the player can make.

Bad shooting costs teams chances, which costs teams games.

Bad shooting is one of the single biggest problem on our powerplay.

PLEASE, PLEASE learn about the game and STOP YELLING SHOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOT! already.

and remember, this is not directed at everyone that yells, only those that do it constantly and at the wrong times. You know who you are.

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10-21-2003, 08:57 PM
  #6
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Admittedly, not a bad synopsis from the Loudmouth's #1 & #2!

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10-21-2003, 09:34 PM
  #7
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I guarantee you if Mact calls a time out to chill things down after York scores we either win this one or at worst lose it in OT. But then again, such a move would require a good coaching mind. (right after weight scored, i turned the TV off because ive seen this movie before, therefore i was not surprised to see a 6-4 final score)

btw, that Torres penalty wasnt a penalty, it was not a hold, he simply pushed someone to the ice who was weaker than he was. As Ray Ferraro stated on sportsnet "Raffi got a penalty because hes stronger than ________"

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10-22-2003, 05:03 AM
  #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by windowlicker
I guarantee you if Mact calls a time out to chill things down after York scores we either win this one or at worst lose it in OT. But then again, such a move would require a good coaching mind. (right after weight scored, i turned the TV off because ive seen this movie before, therefore i was not surprised to see a 6-4 final score)

btw, that Torres penalty wasnt a penalty, it was not a hold, he simply pushed someone to the ice who was weaker than he was. As Ray Ferraro stated on sportsnet "Raffi got a penalty because hes stronger than ________"
You're right about the bad call on Torres. That was the turning point - imo. With that call, we appeared 'lost', thinking 'why?' instead of 'game plan', again their focus was shot to ****. The Blues saw this, stepped it up and the Oilers couldn't keep up till it was too late.

The boys got schooled in this one, they better be doing their homework.

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10-22-2003, 07:40 AM
  #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LoudmouthHemskyfan#1
Then 3 things happened:

1- Our master strategist, MacT, turns off the offence. The scoring players don't get as many shifts, and the pressure is gone.

2- Raffi Torres takes a completely BONEHEADED penalty behind our own net

3- Eric Brewer plays probably the worst 10 seconds I've ever seen an NHL defenceman play, resulting in a double minor.
I have to disagree with a couple of your points here:

- # of shifts (1st period)
  • Smyth - 7
  • Hemsky - 6
  • Dvorak - 7
  • York - 9
  • Moreau - 6
  • Reasoner - 7
  • Horcoff - 8
  • Laraque - 5
  • Isbister - 4
  • Pisani - 6
# of shifts (2nd period)
  • Smyth - 6
  • Hemsky - 6
  • Dvorak - 7
  • York - 6
  • Moreau - 4
  • Reasoner - 8
  • Horcoff - 7
  • Laraque - 4
  • Isbister - 4
  • Pisani - 3
Judging by that, IMO it's difficult to assert that MacT basically turned the game over to the 3rd and 4th lines in the 2nd period...seems to me like the RPM line (except Reasoner, likely for faceoff duties) played less, and the Smyth/Hemsky combo had pretty much the same amount of chances to make a difference.

- If you're going to rag on Torres for a 'boneheaded' penalty when we were up 3-0 which led to the Blues' first goal, you should at least be fair and rag on Hemsky for his holding penalty in the neutral zone that led to the PP that gave the Blues a 2 goal lead late in the 2nd period. IMO that was just as damaging if not more so.

Maybe I'm wrong, but it seems to me like you've been riding Torres from the minute he arrived at camp, harshly criticizing him when he does bad, and only giving him praise grudgingly or in a backhanded manner when he does good. To each their own, it's just an observation.

- Agree totally about Brewer...when even Rod is forced to admit a bad play involving Brewer, you know he ****ed up harsh.

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10-22-2003, 08:43 AM
  #10
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Hemsky's penalty was a bunch of BS!! Weight went down very easy and it just looked bad..

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10-22-2003, 09:10 AM
  #11
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Now I like this thread much better than the out for Salo's head one. I think these are pretty fair breakdown's. About everyone yelling Shoooooooot- I completely agree. This yelling is the residual reaction from last year's powerplay when we were having major problems and blowing chances to even get the puck at the net. When the boys start lighting it up on the PP I'm pretty sure it will stop.

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10-22-2003, 09:28 AM
  #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Digger12

- If you're going to rag on Torres for a 'boneheaded' penalty when we were up 3-0 which led to the Blues' first goal, you should at least be fair and rag on Hemsky for his holding penalty in the neutral zone that led to the PP that gave the Blues a 2 goal lead late in the 2nd period. IMO that was just as damaging if not more so.

Maybe I'm wrong, but it seems to me like you've been riding Torres from the minute he arrived at camp, harshly criticizing him when he does bad, and only giving him praise grudgingly or in a backhanded manner when he does good. To each their own, it's just an observation.

You aren't the only one who noticed that. He also never has anything good to say about Eric Brewer.

Maybe LoudmouthHemskyfan is Mike Milbury.

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10-22-2003, 10:18 AM
  #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LoudmouthHemskyfan#2
Hemsky's penalty was a bunch of BS!! Weight went down very easy and it just looked bad..
Hemsky had his hand off his stick and on Weight's right shoulder. Zebras call this. Big surprise.

Regarding the Torres is stronger deal: Laraque gets this a lot also. And the reverse in that another player drapes himself over Laraque and isn't charged for holding because Laraque doesn't fall down. I guess Forsberg just isn't very strong or a very good skater because he frequently gets the call on similar size mismatches.

If Laraque were a dishonorable pansy, he'd learn something from that play too. Maybe he could just back into the smallest opponent and try to push his way to the net and then fall down then the other guy reaches around or tries to pull him off the puck.

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10-22-2003, 10:21 AM
  #14
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Originally Posted by thome_26
Good to see #1 and #2 seeing eye to eye!
I agree with most points
Hmm, looks like a budding LMHF wannabe. I wonder what the franchising fees are for a LHMF#3?

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10-22-2003, 11:01 AM
  #15
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Originally Posted by LoudmouthHemskyfan#1
1- Our master strategist, MacT, turns off the offence. The scoring players don't get as many shifts, and the pressure is gone.
Well, just want to point something out. I haven't really posted much in the past few days. Midterms and all.

But I don't think you can necessarily blame MacT for turning down the offense. If you want to blame him for calling the timout too late, pulling Salo too late, or not shoring up our defensive responsibilities after the first intermission that's fine. But I think the main problem with last night was that the boys got a little too full of themselves and... well, COASTED.

They saw a quick 3-0 lead and they stopped working. They missed their defensive assignments, and stopped skating. It was only when the players knew they had their backs against the wall in the third period, did they dominate in the last 10 minutes. And boy, did they dominate. It wasn't an issue of toning down the offense... IMO, it had a lot more to do with their lack of focus and concentration.

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10-22-2003, 11:19 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by momentai
Well, just want to point something out. I haven't really posted much in the past few days. Midterms and all.

But I don't think you can necessarily blame MacT for turning down the offense. If you want to blame him for calling the timout too late, pulling Salo too late, or not shoring up our defensive responsibilities after the first intermission that's fine. But I think the main problem with last night was that the boys got a little too full of themselves and... well, COASTED.

They saw a quick 3-0 lead and they stopped working. They missed their defensive assignments, and stopped skating. It was only when the players knew they had their backs against the wall in the third period, did they dominate in the last 10 minutes. And boy, did they dominate. It wasn't an issue of toning down the offense... IMO, it had a lot more to do with their lack of focus and concentration.
Sometimes you're scary. You nailed it. This is a major side effect of having a young, 'headstrong' team. I do think that our boys are pretty smart and will learn something from last night, tho. Time will tell the tale.

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10-22-2003, 11:59 AM
  #17
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Originally Posted by IceDragoon
Sometimes you're scary.
I try.

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Old
10-22-2003, 01:02 PM
  #18
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Digger12

- If you're going to rag on Torres for a 'boneheaded' penalty when we were up 3-0 which led to the Blues' first goal, you should at least be fair and rag on Hemsky for his holding penalty in the neutral zone that led to the PP that gave the Blues a 2 goal lead late in the 2nd period. IMO that was just as damaging if not more so.

Maybe I'm wrong, but it seems to me like you've been riding Torres from the minute he arrived at camp, harshly criticizing him when he does bad, and only giving him praise grudgingly or in a backhanded manner when he does good. To each their own, it's just an observation.

- Agree totally about Brewer...when even Rod is forced to admit a bad play involving Brewer, you know he ****ed up harsh.
Main difference in the penalties -Weight took an obvious dive, even prompting someone to yell "are you takin lessons from Forsberg!!!!" in the crowd. Torres did not have any reason to knock the guy over, there was no point, it was not going to help in the prevention of a goal or get the puck out, and that's why I thought it was a boneheaded penalty to take. It also had HORRIBLE timing, which is maybe what I have a bigger problem with. And I will admit, Tommy shouldn't have allowed the goal anyway.

As for my stance on Torres, I expect alot more from someone who is being given the chance and praise he is. I do not expect him to miss many chances if he's going to have the opportunity to play on a scoring line, and again, maybe I'm placing the blame in the wrong place here and it should be on MacTavish. Wherever he plays, I expect him to work hard every shift and do the simple things right, because that is supposed to be his job on this team. Also, this is a guy who was essentially guaranteed a roster spot, and was acquired for Janni Niinimaa, along with Brad Isbister. Frankly, I don't care that it's not fair to either of them to say this, but you've got to live up to that. I guess what it comes down to is, I really don't like alot of things I've seen from him, not so much in the last few games, he's been quite good in a couple, which is a great sign and hopefully I'm wrong.

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10-22-2003, 01:03 PM
  #19
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Brock
You aren't the only one who noticed that. He also never has anything good to say about Eric Brewer.

Maybe LoudmouthHemskyfan is Mike Milbury.
That's because Eric Brewer is playing like a total schmuck that doesn't care if we win or lose.

And I'm obviously not Mike Milbury, because if I was, the Islanders would be the best team in the league .

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10-22-2003, 01:10 PM
  #20
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Quote:
Originally Posted by momentai
Well, just want to point something out. I haven't really posted much in the past few days. Midterms and all.

But I don't think you can necessarily blame MacT for turning down the offense. If you want to blame him for calling the timout too late, pulling Salo too late, or not shoring up our defensive responsibilities after the first intermission that's fine. But I think the main problem with last night was that the boys got a little too full of themselves and... well, COASTED.

They saw a quick 3-0 lead and they stopped working. They missed their defensive assignments, and stopped skating. It was only when the players knew they had their backs against the wall in the third period, did they dominate in the last 10 minutes. And boy, did they dominate. It wasn't an issue of toning down the offense... IMO, it had a lot more to do with their lack of focus and concentration.
I will respectfully disagree.

When hockey players start to feel confident, especially elite hockey players, they don't lay back and not forecheck unless they are told to or have a HUGE lead (we're talkin 6 or 7 here) in general. This has always been my experience and that of those people I know or know through acquaintances and so on. When a team learns to know it is THAT GOOD, it won't coast, it will roll you.

With reference to the last 10 minutes, they just prove my point. Hockey players can't turn it on and off like that. The ability to do what they did the last 10 was there the entire time, and therefore, there has to be a reason they weren't. I sincerely believe that reason is that MacT, after the 3rd goal, or maybe even St. Louis' first, said to play defence first. And where's the logic in changing your game plan when you're dominating? There was a marked change in patterns and tactics after that goal, not just some swing in momentum, and this is why I believe this to be true, also because it has all the trademarks of when this has happened before, and when even MacT, albeit begrudgingly, admitted he told his players to back off.

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10-22-2003, 01:43 PM
  #21
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LoudmouthHemskyfan#1
When hockey players start to feel confident, especially elite hockey players, they don't lay back and not forecheck unless they are told to or have a HUGE lead (we're talkin 6 or 7 here) in general. This has always been my experience and that of those people I know or know through acquaintances and so on. When a team learns to know it is THAT GOOD, it won't coast, it will roll you.
Indeed it happens with elite players and elite teams with loads of confidence and experience. However, the Oilers do not necessarily adhere to these categories. They are indeed young and, like us Oiler fans, are subject to inconsistencies and the proverbial "rollercoaster rides". When good teams know they are *that good*, they will roll you. However, the Oilers' confidence is not in the league as say a Detroit... Why? Experience.

I believe the Oilers were forechecking... However, they were not skating as hard nor putting out as much attention to detail as they were in the beginning of the game. And combining that fact with St. Louis turning their intensity up a notch... it was no surprise to see St. Louis perform well. It looked like the Oilers were "shell-shocked". Besides, this is not really anything new here. It happened last year when they kept giving up 3 goal leads last year against the Kings and Sharks. They stopped doing what was effective earlier in the period/game.

Young teams can coast. They can get full of themselves and believe that since everything is working up to that point.. They do not have to have the same intensity as that of a 2-2 game. IMO, the Oilers coasted after their third period lead and the St. Louis players took full advantage.

And, yes I believe teams can turn it up a notch when their backs are to the wall... The Oilers saw the clock was waning and they started rushing at the Blues. Not an uncommon thing in life to get a rush of adrenaline and a bit of panic when time is running out.

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