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Is our prospect pool okay or weak?

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Old
08-08-2011, 03:54 PM
  #26
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Originally Posted by habitue View Post
I wished he could have had least swap his 1st pick with St-Louis' one, draft Tinordi anyway, and then keep his 2nd draft pick (which he has traded to move up in the draft to get Tinordi). Just that would had made me satisfied. Of course, having Perron would had been safer than getting Eller.
Is St. Louis ready to move him ? Even if they were, I would have preferred Berglund over Perron. He's small, he's weak, but he's skilled. We already got that. We don't need another ****ing Perron. Now, he's broken.

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08-08-2011, 04:02 PM
  #27
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We have an excellent young core of players freshly graduated.. Price and Subban are franchise players, MaxPac will be a big piece of the puzzle.. I like Eller alot.. It will be interesting to watch Diaz and Emelin at camp.. Our actual prospects pool might not be filled of incredible talents but its still pretty good, alot of promising kids that have the potential to play in the NHL one day..

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08-08-2011, 04:50 PM
  #28
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The prospect pool is very weak due to low and few draft picks since 2007 and the wide swath of prospects that have graduated. The 25 and under youth is pretty good though.

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08-08-2011, 07:46 PM
  #29
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It's not sexy but it's not weak either. Leblanc, Beaulieu, Tinordi, Palushaj, Gallagher and Krysto make a solid group of NHL potential players. Appart from Beaulieu none of them as a 1st line/1st pairing potential though, it might be a good thing though: if they can be useful out of a proeminent role it means they have a better shot at making the league than busting.

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08-08-2011, 07:47 PM
  #30
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I'm sure it's my Habs tinted glasses interfering somewhat but considering the turnover we've had from the AHL to the NHL in the last 2 years I'd say we still have a great prospect pool.

We're lacking two things, a sure-fire first line player, and a goaltender, but we have a good mix of everything else.

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08-08-2011, 07:51 PM
  #31
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In all honesty, I really don't care if the prospect pool lacks high end talent. Those type of players usually go to the bottom feeders each season. My belief is that in order to succeed, the team needs to develop the bottom six forwards and lower pairing defense from within, thus allowing you to fill these spots at minimal cost and spend the money you have on the top-end talent. It is overpaying the 3rd and 4th liners because you needed to sign FA's for these positions that weaken the team's ability to spend more on the other positions. Sure you may hit a homerun by drafting a player in the late 1st round or 2nd round that will be a top liner but usually these players will have to come from outside the organization via trade or free agency. Look at the types of 3rd or 4th line FA's many wanted to sign this offseason, those are the players the team needs to be doing a better job of drafting and developing and they should be available where we select in the draft.

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08-08-2011, 08:37 PM
  #32
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Weak... below average by NHL standards. But these things don't just fluctuate with incoming new picks, they also fluctuate with the development of existing players, and I think we have quite a number of players who aren't really highly thought of now, but who have some intriguing attributes and may develop into more notable prospects in the coming year. (All teams can say that, basically, but we're part of "all teams", and maybe it will be our guys who progress above the norm).

It would indeed help to have a few extra kicks at the can, and if we didn't have to make deadline/mid-season trades to get guys like Moore, Wisniewski, Sopel, and Mara, it would help a bit. One of the reasons I'm a proponent of signing available experienced depth players right now to round out our roster.

The team has done ok picking up FA prospects... Nash, Engqvist, Diaz, Berger, Delmas... it's definitely great that the team is adding that way. The more the better in that respect, I say. It's one available avenue for making up for some of the traded picks. But it would be even more ideal to have the best of both worlds.

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08-08-2011, 08:37 PM
  #33
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The HF definition of prospects is totally out of whack with where a team stands in regards to it's future outlook. You have to look at all the young players in the organization, even if they're well established NHL players. The Habs are fine in terms of their young players because of Price, Subban, Pacioretty and Eller. That's some solid base to build around for years.

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08-08-2011, 08:40 PM
  #34
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I think it's weak. We have too many risky prospects that are either boom or bust. Fact is, if our prospect forwards can't produce offense, chance is that they won't play in the NHL. The only solid prospects we have are Leblanc, Beaulieu and Tinordi.

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08-08-2011, 10:54 PM
  #35
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Originally Posted by HABitual Fan View Post
In all honesty, I really don't care if the prospect pool lacks high end talent. Those type of players usually go to the bottom feeders each season. My belief is that in order to succeed, the team needs to develop the bottom six forwards and lower pairing defense from within, thus allowing you to fill these spots at minimal cost and spend the money you have on the top-end talent. It is overpaying the 3rd and 4th liners because you needed to sign FA's for these positions that weaken the team's ability to spend more on the other positions. Sure you may hit a homerun by drafting a player in the late 1st round or 2nd round that will be a top liner but usually these players will have to come from outside the organization via trade or free agency. Look at the types of 3rd or 4th line FA's many wanted to sign this offseason, those are the players the team needs to be doing a better job of drafting and developing and they should be available where we select in the draft.
I would add that the Bruins won the cup without any stars offensive players in their line-up so its possible to win it with a balanced and deep roster..

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08-08-2011, 11:00 PM
  #36
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Originally Posted by Blind Gardien View Post
But these things don't just fluctuate with incoming new picks, they also fluctuate with the development of existing players, and I think we have quite a number of players who aren't really highly thought of now, but who have some intriguing attributes and may develop into more notable prospects in the coming year. (All teams can say that, basically, but we're part of "all teams", and maybe it will be our guys who progress above the norm).

.
Agree, some of our best propects have the potential to come back on the map big time..

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08-09-2011, 12:17 AM
  #37
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If you factor in the recent graduates like Subban, Eller and Pacioretty, it's decent. If you don't, it becomes quite weak..

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08-09-2011, 08:51 AM
  #38
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Originally Posted by NewHabsEra View Post
I would add that the Bruins won the cup without any stars offensive players in their line-up so its possible to win it with a balanced and deep roster..
You are right...we have a similar structure too...

Thomas - Price
Chara - Subban or Markov
Krejci - Plekanec
Horton - Cole
Marchand - Gionta
...

What we don't, or didn't have last year is a good Gomez. The Bruins have Bergeron and good overall depth at centre. That, we'll have to see if we have it for the upcoming season. If Gomez returns, and Eller makes steps forward, we will be alright. If not, the Bruins could still have an edge on us.

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08-09-2011, 08:57 AM
  #39
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I'd say
Goaltending: Weak...to non existent...but I think we'll be okay for a while.

Forwards: Okay (Leblanc and Kristo are the only ones that really stand out...Avtsin maybe...Gallagher looks promising too)

Defense: Good (two years of first round defensemen can't be that bad for defense)

So overall...okay

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Old
08-09-2011, 10:09 AM
  #40
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There are two wildcards that I think we will see in the future.

Gallagher - he reminds me of our own hopefully to be Hab, Brad Marchand. Fiesty goes to the net, not the biggest, but has a scoring touch and not afraid of the dirty areas. Not intimidated by towering big shutdown dmen either. He has an in your face attitude and will get up in the faces of players. I think he will be a player like Gionta and St.Louis, play a fiesty side to their game and didn't let their size hold them back. Gionta plays with his heart of his sleeve and hits and gets dirty when needed.

Bournival - I think he is going to be a good 3rd line player. The guy is ripped at 6'0, but he could probably add on some weight to fill out and be a tank. I think he will be a good 3rd line future player.


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Old
08-09-2011, 05:16 PM
  #41
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Timmins does his best work in the 2nd round, with the possible exception of the last draft. PG has to exercise better judgment in trading those away.

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Old
08-09-2011, 05:22 PM
  #42
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Team Strengths: "Prospects" playing in the NHL (development, who would've thought?) and developing NHL players overall. (and/or scouting future NHLers)

Team Weakness: Having enough good prospects to replace those guys with.

We've cleaned the cupboard out honestly.

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Timmins does his best work in the 2nd round, with the possible exception of the last draft. PG has to exercise better judgment in trading those away.
*knock on wood* I have a gut feeling Tinordi but more importantly Beaulieu maybe the home run/grand slam Timmins has been looking for all along in order to prove himself in the 1st round. I'm really high on both players. Don't get me wrong I'd rather an equivalent potential big center instead. These were BPA's and if anything at worst could be used as trade bait for a legit superstar center once developed. Obviously it could go either way but both those guys if they make it will be legit. Subban, Tinordi, Beaulieu.... I doubt people will compare their D squads to ours if those guys pan out.

Plus Markov if he recovers, Gorges... it will be legit if these guys make it. Weber isn't too shabby either and could be a stop gap and/or trade bait.

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08-09-2011, 07:55 PM
  #43
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I would say our prospect pool is probably not as deep as it has been in the past but there are some interesting prospects. We have graduated and/or traded some younger talent and it takes time to re-stock the system.

The fact that Gauthier has had to patch together a team and trade a couple of draft choices in the past two seasons has slowed the process somewhat but he has tried to compensate for that with free agent signings.

Hopefully the team leaves no stone un-turned in their search for talent. Maybe a gem or two can be uncovered.

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08-09-2011, 08:39 PM
  #44
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It depends how you define weak but since I'd say we are in the lower tier, yes it is kind of weak. It has more to do with us trading high picks (2008' 1st and a few 2nd) than anything else. We lack top end talent and I would agree with most by saying Beaulieu is the only one with potential top 3/top pairing upside, although IMO, he will probably be a 2nd pairing player.

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08-09-2011, 09:51 PM
  #45
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Zaide View Post
I think it's weak. We have too many risky prospects that are either boom or bust.
It's the exact opposite. We have too many projects. All of the defensemen apart from Beaulieu are projects. Kristo is a project. Nattinen, Berger and Engqvist are projects. White and DD were, but they worked out.

I think we've done alright, but I really think they should grab a weak team's 1st before the season starts. I'd love to land Minny or Calgary's 1st. If we can give up Weber++ to land either, I'd be really happy. And yes I don't think it would affect this season's chances that much considering that we have some guys in the AHL and free agents.

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08-09-2011, 10:54 PM
  #46
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It's definitely below average, but that's because we have a lot of good graduates. If you include Price, Subban, MaxPac, Eller, Weber, White and DD as "prospects", suddenly things are very different.

The goaltending depth is nonexistent, which is logical as many of us see Price as a franchise player for years to come, though it's something that needs to be addressed eventually because there's always the slight risk of a Dipietro-like situation.

When it comes to defense we are in very good shape. Beaulieu has top pairing upside and Tinordi, while unlikely to be an elite player, already has that mix of size, toughness and speed that ensures he will have some role in the NHL, add in a 22 year old potential franchise player in Subban, and some NHL ready prospects like Weber, Emelin and Diaz with top 4 upside and it's hard to not feel confident in the future here.

Forward prospects are below average...we have a lot of good role players in the system but those with top 6 potential are longshots to reach it. Having Leblanc as our best forward prospect isn't that thrilling.

That being said considering we haven't had a high draft pick in a while, the Habs are in pretty good shape, this team is looking to win sooner rather than later.

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Old
08-10-2011, 08:08 AM
  #47
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Originally Posted by Et le But View Post
It's definitely below average, but that's because we have a lot of good graduates. If you include Price, Subban, MaxPac, Eller, Weber, White and DD as "prospects", suddenly things are very different.

The goaltending depth is nonexistent, which is logical as many of us see Price as a franchise player for years to come, though it's something that needs to be addressed eventually because there's always the slight risk of a Dipietro-like situation.

When it comes to defense we are in very good shape. Beaulieu has top pairing upside and Tinordi, while unlikely to be an elite player, already has that mix of size, toughness and speed that ensures he will have some role in the NHL, add in a 22 year old potential franchise player in Subban, and some NHL ready prospects like Weber, Emelin and Diaz with top 4 upside and it's hard to not feel confident in the future here.

Forward prospects are below average...we have a lot of good role players in the system but those with top 6 potential are longshots to reach it. Having Leblanc as our best forward prospect isn't that thrilling.

That being said considering we haven't had a high draft pick in a while, the Habs are in pretty good shape, this team is looking to win sooner rather than later.
I agree. I see Leblanc as a 3rd liner, a solid one but I don't see him making the top 6 (if he makes the NHL)

Kristo I see kind of as being a future Versteeg type played. 3rd liner who can play on the 2nd line. Depending on injuries he'll get top 6 time but will likely be a great 3rd liner (if he makes the NHL)

Honestly I think Kristo is going to make it though, same for Louis. I just don't think they'll be the top 6 forwards people are hoping for.

Still if they can be 15-25-40 type players or better that would be fine. What I believe our management is trying to build is a 1st line filled with 25-30 capable guys, 2nd line filled with 20-25 capable guys (Gomer impossible mind you but Gio will surely get closer to 30) and a 3rd line of 15-20 goal guys. If Kristo and Leblanc become those guys I won't complain. In reality that's a ton of production all by committee. I like it.

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Old
08-10-2011, 09:31 AM
  #48
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stormclouds are forming in front of Gauthier. He's got an average team with an impotent offense, a low ceiling prospect pool showing no signs they can be the successors of Gionta, Cammalleri, or Gomez let alone make this team better in the current window.

Add to that recent draft pick spends and I am not liking where this is headed.

Developing 3rd liners and picking up a Subban every decade or two doesn't make a successful development program. This team is not elite because it doesn't have an elite front office.

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Old
08-10-2011, 10:17 AM
  #49
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Im really high on tinordi and a little scouting from someone who saw im playin at the us camp
-There was a lot of nastiness in the game. Jarred Tinordi took 4 penalties and is definitely a mean-spirited player. He is 6 foot, 7 inches, can skate fairly well for a big guy, and when he body checks someone into the boards, they really rattle. I was standing right up against the glass the entire game, and more than once Tinordi destroyed someone right in front of me and I thought they were going to come right through the boards. If he continues to develop, Montreal will be extremely happy with Tinordi. I do not see him as an offensive guy at all, but he will be a terror to play against.[/B]

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Old
08-10-2011, 10:18 AM
  #50
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Louis Leblanc remains a very intriguing prospect in the Habs system and his development will go a long way in determining the future success of the club. In the case of Leblanc and most of our prospects, it's safe to say that they're all talented, but where Leblanc separates himself from the rest is in his tenacity and work ethic. It seems more and more in the "New NHL" that these certain intangibles dictate the success of players and consequently their teams.
If Louis can continue to show leadership, grit and net-presence at the next level(s), he'll make his line mates better and bring something to the center position that this team hasn't had in a long time

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