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Old
08-08-2011, 07:20 PM
  #351
McDorian2
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Originally Posted by workedforme View Post
Annoying.Congrats on attending a hockey game.
No doubt. I guess none of my opinions anywhere on these boards count for anything because I haven't attended most of the games. Same with football. Haven't been to a live Esky game for a bit, so I guess I should put my thoughts on here regarding those games. And God forbid I bring up any past great Oilers like Gretzky or Messier in the playoffs. I couldn't get tickets to those games neither, so anything I say regarding the past Oilers dynasty is basically a moot point that does not qualify as a reasonable opinion.

I now feel really bad about giving my opinion on anything I have not watched live, as my opinion accounts for diddly squat. I guess I shouldn't comment on the new arena plan either, as I have not been to any council meeting and am not privy to that information.

Oh yeah, I'll shut my yap about the Mosquito population, pot holes and snow removal, as well as any LRT expansion and city infrastructure because I'm not at those sites and am not a civil engineer working on these projects.

/End Rant? /Perhaps

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08-08-2011, 07:38 PM
  #352
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ok guys, make a caricature if you will. Like I said I'm done.

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Old
08-08-2011, 07:58 PM
  #353
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Originally Posted by Dorian2 View Post
No doubt. I guess none of my opinions anywhere on these boards count for anything because I haven't attended most of the games. Same with football. Haven't been to a live Esky game for a bit, so I guess I should put my thoughts on here regarding those games. And God forbid I bring up any past great Oilers like Gretzky or Messier in the playoffs. I couldn't get tickets to those games neither, so anything I say regarding the past Oilers dynasty is basically a moot point that does not qualify as a reasonable opinion.

I now feel really bad about giving my opinion on anything I have not watched live, as my opinion accounts for diddly squat. I guess I shouldn't comment on the new arena plan either, as I have not been to any council meeting and am not privy to that information.

Oh yeah, I'll shut my yap about the Mosquito population, pot holes and snow removal, as well as any LRT expansion and city infrastructure because I'm not at those sites and am not a civil engineer working on these projects.

/End Rant? /Perhaps
This attitude of "unless you are/were physically at ${LOCATION} your opinion about ${TOPIC} is invalid" has oozed insidiously into all sorts of threads the last little while.

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Old
08-08-2011, 08:03 PM
  #354
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I was at the game on Saturday. I will state again what I saw from Nuge. He looked like he was going at half or three quarters speed and was given very little ice time. Didn't make any bad plays but wasn't very noticeable offensively. He won almost all his faceoffs, played on the PK and was being very responsible in his own end. He looked a bit sluggish at times and lost a few battles in the corners but he would never relent and kept going.

I saw absolutely nothing wrong with his play, as he's been working in the gym since his season finished with little to no time on the ice through the summer. He looked completely fine IMO and obviously the coaches were trying to play the lesser known commodities more.

It was just a summer development game. You can really take very little away from that game. To believe anything else and form a strong opinion after watching that would be foolish.


Last edited by Philly85: 08-08-2011 at 08:10 PM.
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Old
08-08-2011, 08:08 PM
  #355
McDorian2
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Originally Posted by ales83fan View Post
ok guys, make a caricature if you will. Like I said I'm done.
OK. Will this do?


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Old
08-08-2011, 08:24 PM
  #356
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Originally Posted by Dorian2 View Post
OK. Will this do?

I just laughed so hard at this.

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Old
08-08-2011, 08:32 PM
  #357
Jek McPorkins
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Originally Posted by Mowens View Post
His dad is a pretty big wheel down at the cracker factory.
Hurtin' hearts need some healing.

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Old
08-08-2011, 08:40 PM
  #358
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Surprised no one's brought up the "playing the lesser-known players" argument until now.

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Old
08-08-2011, 08:50 PM
  #359
ales83fan
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Originally Posted by Dorian2 View Post
OK. Will this do?

Haha. I definitely earned it!

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Old
08-08-2011, 09:39 PM
  #360
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I do not even agree with the point that he did not dominate offensively. In the first scrimmages on Thursday white scored 2 goals. RNH was in on both of them. In the game in Edmonton, White scored 5 goals and RNH had 2 goals. He did not factor in the 2 goals in Fort Mcmurray. So of the 9 goals scored RNH was in on 4 of them.

Sorry, if I fail to see the struggle here!

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Old
08-08-2011, 09:45 PM
  #361
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Originally Posted by ales83fan View Post
ok guys, make a caricature if you will. Like I said I'm done.
But you said that before.

How can we possibly trust you now?

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Old
08-08-2011, 10:03 PM
  #362
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People basing their entire opinions on RNH's ability to succeed at the NHL level just from watching a single SCRIMMAGE live need to give their head a shake. Some comments in this thread are hilarious. Unable to control and carry the puck? He made great reads all night, distributed the puck out of the defensive zone like a veteran showing NO panic at all. Was always in the perfect position for break outs and made quick touch passes to his wingers, this does not mean RNH is UNABLE to carry the puck, he was just making a quick play which is sometimes the right answer.

One of the reasons RNH was a first over all pick is because of his ability to carry and control the puck, please don't base your entire opinion on the player because of a scrimmage, it makes it look like you never watched RNH at all in JR.

The kid got no PP time and barely any ES, as previously mentioned in this thread the team candada management probably wants to get an extended look at some of the less elite players who don't have a guaranteed spot on the roster. RNH won almost every faceoff he took, had a great PK with Schwartz where they controlled the puck shorthanded in the offensive zone for about 20-30 seconds straight and made some great reads throughout the game (broke up a few of team reds break outs and intercepted a pass, almost had another one but it bounced away too far off his stick). Then finally scored the tieing and game winning goal in clutch fashion.

What more did people expect given his limited ice time? Him to physically dominate kids bigger then him?

Team Red and Oleksiak AND Gudbranson on D, he's not going to win a physical battle against those monsters.

I agree he looked small in person (because he is) but that doesn't mean he won't be able to contribute at the NHL level.

Let's give him pre-season and his 9 game try out before we declare that he should go back to Junior because he can't handle or control the puck.

Ridiculous!

Quote:
Originally Posted by okgooil View Post
Some one correct me if I am wrong, but RNH is guaranteed to be on team Canada if he is available, this reminds me of NHL training camp when every one complains about every older player that they look like ****, and how every young player they never heard of looks great. It is becuase the vets are gliding out there and don't care and every young player is playing like it is game 7 of the Stanley cup finals. Any way, I am just guessing RNH isn't exactly going all out for a team he is garunteed to make. I mean he was just playing in the play-offs a month or two ago, I am pretty sure he is just working on his game. I don't think he is taking this all that serious. Besides all the announcers have said he has looked great.
Great points + post.

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Old
08-09-2011, 12:33 AM
  #363
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Keep it on topic and off of personal stuff.

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Old
08-09-2011, 12:41 AM
  #364
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Originally Posted by Giant Moo View Post
This attitude of "unless you are/were physically at ${LOCATION} your opinion about ${TOPIC} is invalid" has oozed insidiously into all sorts of threads the last little while.
It's getting up there with the old "dude, look at your post count compared to mine" argument. Lame.

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Old
08-09-2011, 01:10 AM
  #365
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Originally Posted by Philly85 View Post
I was at the game on Saturday. I will state again what I saw from Nuge. He looked like he was going at half or three quarters speed and was given very little ice time. Didn't make any bad plays but wasn't very noticeable offensively. He won almost all his faceoffs, played on the PK and was being very responsible in his own end. He looked a bit sluggish at times and lost a few battles in the corners but he would never relent and kept going.

I saw absolutely nothing wrong with his play, as he's been working in the gym since his season finished with little to no time on the ice through the summer. He looked completely fine IMO and obviously the coaches were trying to play the lesser known commodities more.

It was just a summer development game. You can really take very little away from that game. To believe anything else and form a strong opinion after watching that would be foolish.
I was at the game as well and this pretty much sums up my thoughts

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Old
08-09-2011, 12:19 PM
  #366
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Originally Posted by okgooil View Post
I like how every one goes on and on about size, untill some one points out that Kane is small, to which the reply is ya.... but that is Kane and so and so isn't Kane.

Any way, Kane is a perfect example of the fact we vastly over rate size, and can RNH be as good as Kane, hell ya, will he? who knows, that is what makes sports fun, guess you we will have to wait and find out.
Gretzky was small too, why not compare RNH to Gretzky then? RNH's junior campaign is a shadow of what Kane did. Kane scored goals at more than twice the rate of RNH and he even got assists 33% faster.

Fact is that RNH is a small-ish young man with a lot of skill/potential and just because P Kane survived his first year in the nhl doesn't mean RNH will. Kane is fast and he can turn on a dime, it's as if he only weighs ten pounds. RNH is not just like P Kane just because he is also a small player.




What can RNH prove in 2 scrimmages?

The Nuge is a shoo in for the wjc but I think people are looking for evidence that he'll be ready for the nhl next season because the wheels fell off his wagon when he came up against the 2nd best team in the dub. They want to see him dominate here and prove that he's better than the best that the chl has to offer. If he did that everyone knows it's not proof that he'll be an impact player in all 82 games next year, but everyone would also be a little happier with their shiny new toy.

I'd personally shine that thing up a bit and make sure it didn't get broken, some kids would take it right to the biggest ramp in town and go full bore. To each his own, but the draft wasn't held at Costco so we aren't getting our pick back.

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Old
08-09-2011, 01:45 PM
  #367
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Really judging whether a player can make it to the NHL based on a summer scrimmage is about as assinine as I can think of. I am not even going to go there.

But a couple things to keep in mind, the coaches were NOT using him in a primary offensive role in the scrimmages I watched in fact he did not even play on the PP until he played in Fort McMurray. He played every PK though and played well.

Despite that role he still scored one spectacular goal and one pretty nice one that just happened to be the game winner.

In the first scrimmages on Thursday he created all the offence that White was able to generate and it wasn't much as Red dominated in a big way.

I actually came away more impressed as he played well in the role he was used in and still created offence.

I really didn't see any negatives. I came away more impressed as not only can he perform offensively but he can also play defensively and dominate in the faceoff circle.

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Old
08-09-2011, 02:54 PM
  #368
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Originally Posted by Oi'll say! View Post
Gretzky was small too, why not compare RNH to Gretzky then? RNH's junior campaign is a shadow of what Kane did. Kane scored goals at more than twice the rate of RNH and he even got assists 33% faster.

Fact is that RNH is a small-ish young man with a lot of skill/potential and just because P Kane survived his first year in the nhl doesn't mean RNH will. Kane is fast and he can turn on a dime, it's as if he only weighs ten pounds. RNH is not just like P Kane just because he is also a small player.

It isn't really fair to compare draft year points between Kane and RNH because Kane played for the Knights in their system. Kane saw 2 minutes of PP time each PP. Kane got insane minutes and offensive opportunities. To put it in perspective, Gagner outpointed Stamkos, Hall and RNH when comparing draft years because he played in that system.

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Old
08-09-2011, 03:09 PM
  #369
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Originally Posted by s7ark View Post
It isn't really fair to compare draft year points between Kane and RNH because Kane played for the Knights in their system. Kane saw 2 minutes of PP time each PP. Kane got insane minutes and offensive opportunities. To put it in perspective, Gagner outpointed Stamkos, Hall and RNH when comparing draft years because he played in that system.
Your perspective completely obliterates the post you quoted. It's almost as if that post was meant to be deliberately misleading.

ps: That said, were you at the game? I can't trust your opinion unless you were at the game.

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Old
08-09-2011, 07:13 PM
  #370
Bryanbryoil
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Originally Posted by s7ark View Post
It isn't really fair to compare draft year points between Kane and RNH because Kane played for the Knights in their system. Kane saw 2 minutes of PP time each PP. Kane got insane minutes and offensive opportunities. To put it in perspective, Gagner outpointed Stamkos, Hall and RNH when comparing draft years because he played in that system.
Not to mention that Kane's entire line made it to the NHL. Kane, Gagner, and Kostitsyn.

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08-09-2011, 07:46 PM
  #371
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Originally Posted by Bryanbryoil View Post
Not to mention that Kane's entire line made it to the NHL. Kane, Gagner, and Kostitsyn.
Also they played huge minutes on a very offensive minded squad. Their job was to score goals and that was it. A little context destroys misleading stats.

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08-09-2011, 07:56 PM
  #372
Bryanbryoil
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Originally Posted by Tetriser View Post
Also they played huge minutes on a very offensive minded squad. Their job was to score goals and that was it. A little context destroys misleading stats.
Agreed, and this is why stats can be very misleading or very convenient to suit your side of the debate. In theory Kane should be by far the 2nd highest scoring NA player behind Crosby in the NHL because his junior numbers say so.

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08-11-2011, 02:48 PM
  #373
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RNH is going to be a terrific NHL player and I've been on the RNH bandwagon months before his drafting.

That said, even before he was drafted, I felt like there's no reason to rush him to the pros.

Another year in the WHL is going to let him mature physically and get up past 180 IIbs comfortably without having to be in some crazy rush to do so. He'll get an NHL training camp, maybe 9 games to play up with the guys, the World Juniors, and then another round of WHL playoffs ... it's going to be a great development tool for him.

And really, it buys us another year on his ELC contract and gives us breathing room between his contract and Hall/Eberle/MPSs. I think it's win-win all around and gives us another season to properly evaluate Gagner as well.

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Old
08-11-2011, 03:22 PM
  #374
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Originally Posted by Soundwave View Post
RNH is going to be a terrific NHL player and I've been on the RNH bandwagon months before his drafting.

That said, even before he was drafted, I felt like there's no reason to rush him to the pros.

Another year in the WHL is going to let him mature physically and get up past 180 IIbs comfortably without having to be in some crazy rush to do so. He'll get an NHL training camp, maybe 9 games to play up with the guys, the World Juniors, and then another round of WHL playoffs ... it's going to be a great development tool for him.

And really, it buys us another year on his ELC contract and gives us breathing room between his contract and Hall/Eberle/MPSs. I think it's win-win all around and gives us another season to properly evaluate Gagner as well.
i simply couldn't agree more with this post

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Old
08-11-2011, 04:40 PM
  #375
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Originally Posted by Soundwave View Post
That said, even before he was drafted, I felt like there's no reason to rush him to the pros.
there's a couple of reasons:
to develop chemistry with the rest of the team (particularly his future line-mates)
to adjust to the NHL game (speed/strength conditioning etc.)
to learn the Oilers system
to gain trust and loyalty to the Oilers

at this point, i'd still like to see him go back down after a 9-game trial. but i'd like to see those 9 games before making any final decision.

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