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Old
08-12-2011, 07:26 PM
  #1
this providence
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Analyzing 2012 and Beyond

While discussing a few of the more promising prospects, it's hard not to think to yourself just how different this team really could look in two seasons (or so) from now. While Fletcher has really turned around the prospect pool, in the coming years he's going to have his work cut out for him on how exactly to go about getting these kids the time they need to further their development.

Looking towards 2012, the team will have the players below either turning pro/heading to North America or have the opportunity to turn pro at the player's discretion.

Mikael Granlund
Johan Larsson
Brett Bulmer
Jonas Brodin
Sean Lorenz
Charlie Coyle
Jason Zucker

I could be forgetting some and that's not to say the Wild need to find room immediately on the NHL roster for these guys, but if they're going to have a contract, they need to be in a situation to succeed.

2012 Free Agents Include
Latendresse, RFA
Brodziak, UFA
Staubitz, UFA
Zanon, UFA
Lundin, UFA
Stoner, UFA
Harding, UFA

------
Genoway, RFA
Wellman, RFA
McIntyre, RFA
Palmer, RFA
Prosser, RFA
Endras, RFA
Almond, RFA
Falk, RFA

Taffe, UFA
Ortmeyer, UFA

McMillan, RFA
Peters, UFA
DiSalvator, UFA

Rau, RFA
Penner, RFA
Kassian, RFA


Out of the guys listed, do you see the Wild moving anyone this season (feel free to go with guys under contract for more years as well)? The Wild can only have 50 contracts so that's something to keep in mind as well. Where do you envision the incoming prospects at? Would you like to see the Wild be active in the 2012 free agency market? How about going after more established talent via trade? Have any sort of projection on where you'd like to see the Wild be in terms of conference standings?

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Old
08-12-2011, 07:44 PM
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I'm pretty much completely convinced Zanon will be moved for a pick at the trade deadline, and that Scandella will play in Houston until that happens. Brodziak is likely to be moved if we're out of playoff position, or if someone from Houston is ready to jump up to the big club. I think that management will try to move one or two impending RFA prospects if they can.

I expect Coyle and Zucker to be in Houston next year. Granlund should make the big team (if Bouchard's able, he'll play center with Granlund on the wing). I would love for Brodin to be ready, but I really have no idea about him. Larsson will come over and have a shot in training camp, but I think he might start the year in Houston, being called up for injury replacement.

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08-12-2011, 07:56 PM
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Dr Jan Itor
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Selfishly, I want to see this team make the playoffs this year. I don't want them to sacrifice young players to do it (i.e. trading Zucker for rental at the TD). I know that if this team is looking 2-3 years down the road (which I think they are), then it is in their best interest to get a top 10 pick. I get that. But if you give me the option of getting the 10th pick and missing the playoffs, and getting the 20th pick and making the playoffs, I'm hoping for the latter. Especially with this regimes (apparent) acumen on draft day.

I'm going to ignore the remote possibility of getting Parise or Suter or both in the offseason for now. I think if Lats gets 20+ goals next year, you have to look at re-signing him; 3-4 years at $3-$4 million would be about right. I believe I'm on the record of saying that I want Brodziak extended. I'm not sure how that plays out with Cullen, but I hope they can make it work.

Center depth:
2012 - Koivu - Granlund - Cullen - Brodziak
Thereafter - Koivu - Granlund - Coyle - Brodziak

Not bad, IMO.

Staubitz can be re-signed, or not. Doesn't make much of a difference to me if it's him or Kassian in that role. Zanon, gone. Harding, probably gone on his own accord. Lundin? I said earlier I was interested in seeing him this year to see if he has a future with us. Stoner as well. I think he could be a fixture as our #6 guy, provide toughness and be a good PKer.

What if Cuma plays really well in Houston this year? Plays #1 minutes, runs the PP, etc... That would throw a (great) wrench in our future on D.

I think it would be kind of fun to see a 2012 Houston Aeros team like this:

Larsson - Granlund - Wellman
Zucker - Coyle - Fontaine
Palmer - Phillips - Bulmer

Brodin - Cuma
Falk - Prosser

Hackett

Anyways, these are just a couple thoughts that have now taken the place of what I was supposed to be thinking about (contracts, the UCC and secured transactions).

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08-12-2011, 07:57 PM
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BuddyMcCormick
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I see the Wild letting these "prospects" walk:
DiSalvador
Ortmeyer
Rau
McIntyre
McMillan
Peters

I see all or most of these players as veterans, meaning they've most likely reached their ceiling. Going with Fletcher current philosophy, they will likely be trying to make Houston get younger as well. Letting those players walk would free up a few spaces for players like Coyle, Zucker, Bulmer, Foucault, Medvec and Haula. Not to mention that Fletcher will still likely pursue the college Free Agent route.

Possible trades:
Zanon
Brodziak
Latendresse
Bouchard

I basically have this listed in the likelihood I see each of these players being traded, the most likely being Zanon. I'm int he boat where I think Zanon is traded regardless at the deadline while players like Brodziak and Latendresse would only be traded if we're out of the playoff race. Bouchard, I think would be moved next offseason if he's to be moved at all.

As far as making a splash in free agency in 2012, I think there's only 1 player that worth grabbing. That being Parise. Given the contract I think other free agency will be getting.

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08-12-2011, 08:07 PM
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12-13

Heatley Koivu Setoguchi
Lats/pmb Cullen Granlund
Gillies Wellman Clutterbuck
Nystrom Almond Powe


Schultz *
Scandella Lundin/FA
Stoner/FA Spurgeron

Prosser/Falk/Cuma/Genoway/Brodin

Backstrom
Hackett

*if we are out of Playoffs at deadline this season, Zanon/Brodziak should be traded for picks, both will hold high value at that time. Maybe try to dump zidlicky and one of lats / bouchard aswell. situations may vary.

*grab topend dman in Free agency.

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08-12-2011, 08:08 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BuddyMcCormick View Post
I see the Wild letting these "prospects" walk:
DiSalvador
Ortmeyer
Rau
McIntyre
McMillan
Peters

I see all or most of these players as veterans, meaning they've most likely reached their ceiling. Going with Fletcher current philosophy, they will likely be trying to make Houston get younger as well. Letting those players walk would free up a few spaces for players like Coyle, Zucker, Bulmer, Foucault, Medvec and Haula. Not to mention that Fletcher will still likely pursue the college Free Agent route.

Possible trades:
Zanon
Brodziak
Latendresse
Bouchard

I basically have this listed in the likelihood I see each of these players being traded, the most likely being Zanon. I'm int he boat where I think Zanon is traded regardless at the deadline while players like Brodziak and Latendresse would only be traded if we're out of the playoff race. Bouchard, I think would be moved next offseason if he's to be moved at all.

As far as making a splash in free agency in 2012, I think there's only 1 player that worth grabbing. That being Parise. Given the contract I think other free agency will be getting.
I dunno about McMillan. He has made tons of strides and could develop into a solid bottom six cheap option

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08-12-2011, 08:14 PM
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grN1g
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dr Jan Itor View Post
Selfishly, I want to see this team make the playoffs this year. I don't want them to sacrifice young players to do it (i.e. trading Zucker for rental at the TD). I know that if this team is looking 2-3 years down the road (which I think they are), then it is in their best interest to get a top 10 pick. I get that. But if you give me the option of getting the 10th pick and missing the playoffs, and getting the 20th pick and making the playoffs, I'm hoping for the latter. Especially with this regimes (apparent) acumen on draft day.

I'm going to ignore the remote possibility of getting Parise or Suter or both in the offseason for now. I think if Lats gets 20+ goals next year, you have to look at re-signing him; 3-4 years at $3-$4 million would be about right. I believe I'm on the record of saying that I want Brodziak extended. I'm not sure how that plays out with Cullen, but I hope they can make it work.

Center depth:
2012 - Koivu - Granlund - Cullen - Brodziak
Thereafter - Koivu - Granlund - Coyle - Brodziak

Not bad, IMO.

Staubitz can be re-signed, or not. Doesn't make much of a difference to me if it's him or Kassian in that role. Zanon, gone. Harding, probably gone on his own accord. Lundin? I said earlier I was interested in seeing him this year to see if he has a future with us. Stoner as well. I think he could be a fixture as our #6 guy, provide toughness and be a good PKer.

What if Cuma plays really well in Houston this year? Plays #1 minutes, runs the PP, etc... That would throw a (great) wrench in our future on D.

I think it would be kind of fun to see a 2012 Houston Aeros team like this:

Larsson - Granlund - Wellman
Zucker - Coyle - Fontaine
Palmer - Phillips - Bulmer

Brodin - Cuma
Falk - Prosser

Hackett


Anyways, these are just a couple thoughts that have now taken the place of what I was supposed to be thinking about (contracts, the UCC and secured transactions).
i think that would be really cool to see for a Houston roster, and honestly think that would do wonders for everyone's development.

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Old
08-12-2011, 08:34 PM
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With how high everyone is on Granlund and the way the organization's trying to build excitement around him, I don't think there's any chance he plays 2012 in Houston. Plus we probably don't want to burn a year of his ELC in the minors.

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08-12-2011, 09:12 PM
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Definitely tough to gauge which of those guys join the Wild's pro organization next season. Believe Larsson's contract will be up with Brynas which would make it ideal for him to come over, and Granlund doesn't have anything left to prove but wants to finish his civil duties first, which should make him come over next year as well.

Coyle, he's NHL ready now. However, he's not signed now and that is a good thing. Think Sheppard, he was not completely overwhelmed his first season but ultimately never gained enough confidence to become a difference maker. Coyle will gain confidence playing college hockey, he still has work to do on his game. I do expect him to turn pro after this college season, possibly getting some experience down the stretch.

Zucker, he excelled as a freshman last season at DU. If he can continue that success this year, he'll have nothing left to prove at the NCAA level.

Brodin, he's already finished a year pro. But he's barely 18, his 19th birthday isn't until next offseason. There should be no pressure on him coming over after next season. He's playing in one of the best leagues in the world, competition is near the AHL.

Lorenz, Bulmer, they are all but locks to be in Houston. If we signed Medvec, one would have to think Lorenz will be signed as well. 2 other names that aren't mentioned in your post are Colton Jobke and Jordan Caron, who received ELCs and will be playing pro next year for us as well(Caron could've turned pro this year).

As for the free agents:
Brodziak and Zanon, they're deadline trade bait if we're out of it. Both fit the mold of deadline rentals and neither are crucial to our future success. I don't think Staubitz has much of a future, he was brought in on Todd Richards' request and he's gone now.

Lundin, he looks to be a 1-year stabilizer. Have a hard time seeing him dealt because it could hurt Fletcher's reputation. We appear to be high on Scandella, Prosser, Spurgeon, and Falk, but they can't all play this year.

Harding is in the same boat as Lundin, Hackett's ultimately our future and if he continues to build on his first pro season he'll be on the team in 12-13, which leaves no spot for Harding.

Stoner, his season will dictate his future. If he plays like he did last season, extension talks should begin prior to the deadline. He's an ideal bottom pairing d-man in his prime. However, if his play falls off I could see Falk taking his spot.

Latendresse is similar to Stoner in that he's got alot to prove this year. Now with him being an RFA and us likely having an excess of cap space, we're probably not going to cut him loose if he plays like he did in Montreal or doesn't play like he did last year, just elect arbitration and retain his services for another year, or deal him. But if he can play like he did in 09-10, he'll be looked at as a key cog for this team moving forward, and likely a big contract.

As for the Aeros;
I was surprised we brought back Penner this year, Fredheim played over him at times last year after we acquired him, and he's still without a contract. Disalvatore/Rau/Taffe are all good scorers, but with what's coming in its unlikely all 3 will return. Ortmeyer/Peters are strong characters who know what it takes to get to the next level, I'd like to see one of them brought back(preferably Peters because he's a beast on face-offs and should help our prospects there). Endras, well we promised him his contract, but I don't expect anything to come of it. Kassian's future likely depends on Yeo's interest in carrying a heavyweight.

Falk, we could lose him on waivers this year. And if Stoner/Prosser/Scandella/Spurgeon remain ahead of him, we could be talking the same situation next year. McIntyre will have to show something given NJ gave him up for a contract spot. Palmer will have to show something, he was a 4th liner in the AHL at 24 last year.

Wellman, he'll probably get a shot this year, as will Almond/Prosser, which makes them likely to remain. Genoway's in his first year pro so he'll likely get a 2nd. As for McMillan, we gave him a few games last year, and Yeo's familiar with him, and Yeo seemed to trust him with anyone on his wings on the Aeros 4th line last year, so he'll likely be back.

To sum it up
Prospects coming in(9, including Brodin/Zucker, who may not turn pro):
Granlund(NHL)
Coyle(NHL/AHL)
Zucker(AHL/NCAA)
Larsson(AHL)
Lorenz(AHL)
Bulmer(AHL)
Jobke(AHL/ECHL)
Caron(AHL/ECHL)
Brodin(SEL/AHL/NHL)

Current Aeros under contract 2012-13(8)(14 Wild players you should all know):
Hackett(NHL)
Cuma(AHL/NHL)
Fontaine(AHL)
Foucault(AHL)
Broda(AHL)
Bagnall(AHL)
Medvec(AHL)
Kuemper(AHL)

Gone:
Brodziak(deadline)
Zanon(deadline)
Lundin
Harding
Penner
Ortmeyer
Harding
Endras
Staubitz

Stay(7):
Latendresse(NHL)
Prosser(NHL/AHL)
Almond(NHL/AHL)
McMillan(AHL/NHL)
Wellman(AHL/NHL)
Genoway(AHL/NHL)
Peters(AHL)

To be determined(8):
Kassian(need?)(NHL/AHL)
Stoner(level of play/contract demands)(NHL)
Falk(clear/placed on waivers?)(NHL/AHL)
McIntyre(level of play)(AHL/NHL)
Palmer(level of play)(AHL/NHL)
Rau/Taffe/Disalvatore(production/contract demands/character, don't really know all the details, they're all Fletcher guys)(AHL)

Of course, we have the offspring of Trader Cliff, so moves will be made, which will change things.

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08-12-2011, 09:45 PM
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If the team is chugging along at a relatively safe playoff pace I don't know if they'd pack off any of our starters for picks, and I really doubt they'd throw down a good prospect for what security we could get for him (aging vet UFA most likely) as the team's focus has shifted to Future mode.

Bubble team...Again I don't see us dishing our prospects for rentals. But if something enticing enough comes along I could see one or two expiring contracts moved for picks

Out of the playoffs...Expiring contracts will be shopped hard, obviously, and probably even safer RFAs like Latendresse if something looks horribly wrong on the ice this year.

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08-12-2011, 10:30 PM
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If the team is chugging along at a relatively safe playoff pace I don't know if they'd pack off any of our starters for picks, and I really doubt they'd throw down a good prospect for what security we could get for him (aging vet UFA most likely) as the team's focus has shifted to Future mode.

Bubble team...Again I don't see us dishing our prospects for rentals. But if something enticing enough comes along I could see one or two expiring contracts moved for picks

Out of the playoffs...Expiring contracts will be shopped hard, obviously, and probably even safer RFAs like Latendresse if something looks horribly wrong on the ice this year.
I think Zanon gets moved no matter what. We essentially have 8 bottom 4 defenseman (I consider Schultz to be a good #2 guy). I still think Scandella starts in Houston, so when we move Zanon, he'll step up, so we might even improve defensively when we make a trade.

Brodziak only gets moved if we're either out of playoff contention or someone from Houston shows they can run with the big boys.

Latendresse would have to be an absolute monster to garner fair trade value. He looked fantastic with the Wild in 09-10, but that went against his history with the Habs, and now he missed a year due to injury. He'll have to prove a lot in order for us to get fair value for him.

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08-12-2011, 10:37 PM
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Dr Jan Itor
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Originally Posted by squidz View Post
I think Zanon gets moved no matter what. We essentially have 8 bottom 4 defenseman (I consider Schultz to be a good #2 guy). I still think Scandella starts in Houston, so when we move Zanon, he'll step up, so we might even improve defensively when we make a trade.

Brodziak only gets moved if we're either out of playoff contention or someone from Houston shows they can run with the big boys.

Latendresse would have to be an absolute monster to garner fair trade value. He looked fantastic with the Wild in 09-10, but that went against his history with the Habs, and now he missed a year due to injury. He'll have to prove a lot in order for us to get fair value for him.
And if he is a monster this year, wouldn't that be reason to hold onto him? He's still a young RFA, and if he starts playing well (again), then that's one role we don't have to fill.

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08-12-2011, 10:41 PM
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BuddyMcCormick
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And if he is a monster this year, wouldn't that be reason to hold onto him? He's still a young RFA, and if he starts playing well (again), then that's one role we don't have to fill.
The only reason I could think of trading Latendresse is if someone offered something we couldn't refuse. Much like the Burns trade.

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08-12-2011, 10:48 PM
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well the thing is if Lats has a monster year he'd probably be the player with the most return for the value that we'd part with. Kind of the same situation we had with Burns. Obviously not as valuable but he would get points for being a young RFA on top of the hypothetical monster year in which the Wild hypothetically are out of the playoffs anyway. It wouldn't be a good sign if we dished him, but...

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08-12-2011, 10:59 PM
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I have no idea right now; it depends on how everyone plays this year. I could see one of Lats or Butch being moved, or maybe we have an awesome third line next year with Granlund coming over and Clutter/Gillies. Who knows.

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08-12-2011, 11:04 PM
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BuddyMcCormick
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I have no idea right now; it depends on how everyone plays this year. I could see one of Lats or Butch being moved, or maybe we have an awesome third line next year with Granlund coming over and Clutter/Gillies. Who knows.
Hahahaha! Sorry, I just thought of Granlund and Gillies being on the same line. The line of David and Goliath. It might actually work out well.

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08-12-2011, 11:08 PM
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just for that picture i'm imagining a JS/JS pairing on D of John Scott and Jared Spurgeon.

i wonder if we could graft them together somehow in a Master Blaster (mad max) situation where Spurgeon steers John Scott around the ice.

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08-12-2011, 11:18 PM
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I think that Erik Haula will crack the NHL in two/three years and your guys will realize that the kid exist.

Thats all for me, hate predictions.

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08-12-2011, 11:20 PM
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I think that Erik Haula will crack the NHL in two/three years and your guys will realize that the kid exist.

Thats all for me, hate predictions.
If he has a great year this year, I'm sure we will all start paying closer attention. He started strong last year, but really fell off in the 2nd half. He may have been injured, I don't know, but a full, solid season as a Sophomore will put him back on everybody's radar.

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08-13-2011, 01:17 AM
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Zanon = gone almost 90% sure of that. His biggest asset is that he is a shot blocking machine who doesn't ever miss games.

Bouchard = If they can get a good offer, gone. Health injuries and the price he's at, he can be replaced with what would be coming up

Lats = If he is lazy this year, Gone

Brodziak = I think he's staying to be honest...they'll just wait until Cullen's contract is up and that is whent he big Center shakeup will happen

Nystrom = gone

Wellman = most likely will be gone. I'm not impressed outside of speed and his backchecking.

Harding = Gone

And we still have Leighton (spelling?) in Sweden that wants to come over but will only play in the NHL because of his stints in the AHL already. From the Boston folks, he could be a 20-30 goal scorer as well

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08-13-2011, 01:32 AM
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Zanon = gone almost 90% sure of that. His biggest asset is that he is a shot blocking machine who doesn't ever miss games.
You say those things like they're not really important assets.

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08-13-2011, 02:02 AM
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Zanon = gone almost 90% sure of that. His biggest asset is that he is a shot blocking machine who doesn't ever miss games.

Bouchard = If they can get a good offer, gone. Health injuries and the price he's at, he can be replaced with what would be coming up

Lats = If he is lazy this year, Gone

Brodziak = I think he's staying to be honest...they'll just wait until Cullen's contract is up and that is whent he big Center shakeup will happen

Nystrom = gone

Wellman = most likely will be gone. I'm not impressed outside of speed and his backchecking.

Harding = Gone

And we still have Leighton (spelling?) in Sweden that wants to come over but will only play in the NHL because of his stints in the AHL already. From the Boston folks, he could be a 20-30 goal scorer as well
It's Lehtonen. Isn't he playing in the KHL or something now?

Bouchard is relatively untradeable. He's one bad hit away from an early career end. While he's certainly a valuable player to have, his contract and injury history mean he'll be with the Wild through his current contract, or at least until there's only a year left on it.

The reason Brodziak is unlikely to be kept around is Granlund. Since it seems we'll have Cullen through his contract (he's happy here and has an NTC) we need room in the top 6 for Granlund. Koivu, Heater, Gooch, and Bouchard are sticking around at least until next year, so unless Latendresse is moved or not retained, Brodziak is probably gone. He could garner fair value at the trade deadline, so unless management is convinced no one in Houston can fill an opening, I think he's gone at the trade deadline when we can still get something for him.

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08-13-2011, 02:22 AM
  #23
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Yes, Lehtonen is in the KHL.

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08-13-2011, 02:42 AM
  #24
BigT2002
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Quote:
Originally Posted by llamapalooza View Post
You say those things like they're not really important assets.
They are probably the most important thing for a dman to be graded on outside of clearing the puck. But the fact he has zero offensive ability makes him expendable for this team. As we all can agree

Quote:
Originally Posted by squidz View Post
It's Lehtonen. Isn't he playing in the KHL or something now?
Quote:
Originally Posted by Victorious Secret View Post
Yes, Lehtonen is in the KHL.

Didn't know that, shows how much I've been keeping up with it

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Originally Posted by squidz View Post
Bouchard is relatively untradeable. He's one bad hit away from an early career end. While he's certainly a valuable player to have, his contract and injury history mean he'll be with the Wild through his current contract, or at least until there's only a year left on it.
Doesn't Burke have a hardon for him??

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Originally Posted by squidz View Post
The reason Brodziak is unlikely to be kept around is Granlund. Since it seems we'll have Cullen through his contract (he's happy here and has an NTC) we need room in the top 6 for Granlund. Koivu, Heater, Gooch, and Bouchard are sticking around at least until next year, so unless Latendresse is moved or not retained, Brodziak is probably gone. He could garner fair value at the trade deadline, so unless management is convinced no one in Houston can fill an opening, I think he's gone at the trade deadline when we can still get something for him.
Can't we just move him down to 3rd/4th line like he wants with Granlund comes??

Koivu
Granlund
Cullen
Brodziak

He wants to be a grinder center anyways??

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08-13-2011, 03:09 AM
  #25
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It's nice to have a future to talk about, and being able to say, well he's gone cause he's going to be replaced by player X.

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