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MLD Retrospectives - "Knowing What We Know Now"

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Old
08-11-2011, 05:49 PM
  #1
seventieslord
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MLD Retrospectives - "Knowing What We Know Now"

Some of the "old boy's club" may call it heresy. But this is something that interests me far too much to avoid. I'm going to take a look at all MLDs, going back to the first one, MLD4, and take a look at who were the best uncovered players there, as well as which team or teams found the most of these players. This is mainly for fun, but also to honour the players, pay homage to their humble beginnings and the humble beginnings of the MLD, and to tip my hat to the great MLD GMs before us who found these players first.

I definitely encourage comments and discussion. I think that in the beginning there will be a near consensus on the best early MLD players, but that will get tougher as we go on.

Expect the first installment in this 10-part series soon.

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08-11-2011, 05:52 PM
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TheDevilMadeMe
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I strongly approve of this thread if the effort is to show players (and teams) that were underappreciated in the past.

But I strongly disapprove of re-fighting old playoffs and rankings.

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08-11-2011, 06:04 PM
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seventieslord
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TheDevilMadeMe View Post
I strongly approve of this thread if the effort is to show players (and teams) that were underappreciated in the past.

But I strongly disapprove of re-fighting old playoffs and rankings.
the first few MLDs weren't even competitive, so that shouldn't be an issue for those ones. It's really just a novelty to see the types of players that were left out of these early MLDs and credit those who finally selected them.

As for the competitive years, I definitely don't want to "redo" any playoffs or crown a new champion. And certainly wouldn't bother with "rankings", that is just time-consuming and too subjective.

However, if a one or two teams are the ones who made all the good picks and they didn't end up winning at the time, they certainly deserve at least a handclap emoticon from us now.

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08-11-2011, 06:09 PM
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TheDevilMadeMe
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Quote:
Originally Posted by seventieslord View Post
the first few MLDs weren't even competitive, so that shouldn't be an issue for those ones. It's really just a novelty to see the types of players that were left out of these early MLDs and credit those who finally selected them.

As for the competitive years, I definitely don't want to "redo" any playoffs or crown a new champion. And certainly wouldn't bother with "rankings", that is just time-consuming and too subjective.

However, if a one or two teams are the ones who made all the good picks and they didn't end up winning at the time, they certainly deserve at least a handclap emoticon from us now.
I will happily handclap underappreciated teams from the past (like arrbez's team that had Ziggy Palffy and multiple HHOFs on it, lol).


Last edited by TheDevilMadeMe: 08-11-2011 at 08:42 PM.
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Old
08-11-2011, 07:39 PM
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Leduc at 141 in MLD 7 is kinda crazy. Went below Aaron Ward.

Tom Dunderdale was at 178 to EB and MXD. Below Tim Young, Shjon Podein, Ethan Moreau.

Those are the two that stand out from MLD 7 for me.

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08-11-2011, 09:23 PM
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TheDevilMadeMe
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MLD 4:

Roy Conacher fell to the MLD? The hilarious part to me is that Leaf Lander picked Roy Conacher and Sean Burke with back to back picks.

Hooley Smith fell to the MLD? He's a borderline top 100 pick now!

There are a lot of regular ATD players who fell, but those two are first liners in the main draft now!

MLD 5:

BM67's back to back picks of Hod Stuart and Duke Keats look spectacular when sandwiched between Felix Potvin/John MacLean and Neil Broten/Marty Barry... oh I guess Barry is a great pick here too.

BM67 got Hap Holmes as his goalie... after Felix Potvin and Olaf Kolzig were drafted.

Didier Pitre one spot after Tony Amonte?

Jim Neilson (BM67 again) and Ted Green going after Eric Brewer?

This is hilarious:

181 BM67 - Albany River Rats - Jacques Lemaire, coach
184 reckoning - Rochester Americans - Tommy Gorman, coach
187 raleh - Nova Scotia Voyageurs - Anatoli Tarasov, coach
189 jtuzzi - North Dakota Fighting Sioux - Brent Sutter, coach
191 Hedberg - Victoria Salmon Kings - Ken Hitchcock, coach
211 God Bless Canada - Notre Dame Hounds - Punch Imlach, coach
212 Murphy2 - Edmonton Oil Kings - Lindy Ruff, coach

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08-11-2011, 11:27 PM
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seventieslord
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TheDevilMadeMe View Post
MLD 4:

Roy Conacher fell to the MLD? The hilarious part to me is that Leaf Lander picked Roy Conacher and Sean Burke with back to back picks.

Hooley Smith fell to the MLD? He's a borderline top 100 pick now!

There are a lot of regular ATD players who fell, but those two are first liners in the main draft now!

MLD 5:

BM67's back to back picks of Hod Stuart and Duke Keats look spectacular when sandwiched between Felix Potvin/John MacLean and Neil Broten/Marty Barry... oh I guess Barry is a great pick here too.

BM67 got Hap Holmes as his goalie... after Felix Potvin and Olaf Kolzig were drafted.

Didier Pitre one spot after Tony Amonte?

Jim Neilson (BM67 again) and Ted Green going after Eric Brewer?

This is hilarious:

181 BM67 - Albany River Rats - Jacques Lemaire, coach
184 reckoning - Rochester Americans - Tommy Gorman, coach
187 raleh - Nova Scotia Voyageurs - Anatoli Tarasov, coach
189 jtuzzi - North Dakota Fighting Sioux - Brent Sutter, coach
191 Hedberg - Victoria Salmon Kings - Ken Hitchcock, coach
211 God Bless Canada - Notre Dame Hounds - Punch Imlach, coach
212 Murphy2 - Edmonton Oil Kings - Lindy Ruff, coach
hey - don't spoil the results!

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Old
08-12-2011, 11:29 AM
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seventieslord
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MLD 4

When:

January 2006

Who:

Hedberg
Kruezer
BM67
Spitfire11
Maxwell Edison (now Frightened Inmate #2)
Leaf Lander

Winner/Finalist:

none. this was not a competitive draft.

Following how many picks:

385 picks were made in ATD4.

"oops" picks:

1. Hedberg - Marek Svatos (517th)
2. Leaf Lander - Donald Brashear (522nd)
3. kruezer - Marc Bergevin (518th)
4. Hedberg - Gary "Suitcase" Smith (421st)
5. Spitfire11 - Joni Pitkanen (484th)

Who did they miss?

1. Moose Johnson, D
2. Georges Boucher, D/F
3. Eddie Gerard, D/LW
4. Mickey MacKay, F
5. Didier Pitre, RW
6. Tommy Phillips, W
7. Frank Foyston, C
8. Art Ross, D
9. Neil Colville, C/D
10. Harvey Pulford, D

AWARDS

Top scorer: Leaf Lander - Roy Conacher (390th)
HM: BM67 - Hooley Smith (399th), Leaf Lander - Marty Barry (486th)

MVP: BM67 - Hooley Smith (399th)
HM: Spitfire - Pat Stapleton (453rd), Leaf Lander - Roy Conacher (390th)

Top defenseman: Spitfire - Pat Stapleton (453rd)
HM: kruezer - Herb Gardiner (395th), Leaf Lander - Jim Thomson (403rd)

Top Goalie: This was an extremely poor class of MLD goalies compared to the forwards and defensemen getting selected. In today's terms, Luongo's stock would be the highest. Circa 2006, the honour has to go to:

BM67 - Dave Kerr (394th)
HM: kruezer - Percy Lesueur (387th), Spitfire11 - Roberto Luongo (465th)

Top defensive forward: BM67 - Ed Westfall (454th)
HM: Spitfire11 - Don Marshall (489th), Hedberg - Dave Poulin (420th)

Great Discoveries:

(some of these guys were taken before this, in ATDs 1-3, but credit is still due to the GMs who finally picked them up in MLD4)

1. BM67 - Hooley Smith (399th)
2. Spitfire11 - Pat Stapleton (453rd)
3. Leaf Lander - Roy Conacher (390th)
4. Leaf Lander - Marty Barry (486th)
5. Leaf Lander - Reg Noble (462nd)
6. kruezer - Herb Gardiner (395th)
7. Leaf Lander - Jim Thomson (403rd)
8. Spitfire11 - Moose Vasko (448th)
9. BM67 - Ed Westfall (454th)
10. Leaf Lander - Sid Smith (533rd)

Comments:

- A remarkably strong showing by Leaf Lander, who made, in my estimation, five of the draft's ten best picks.

- seven players who now go in the top-200 regularly were selected.

- Maxwell Edison did not make a top-10 pick, but he didn't make an "oops" pick, either.

- Hedberg still refers to his Svatos pick as a massive MLD gaffe

- it's difficult to see this draft playing out competitively and Leaf Lander not winning.

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Old
08-12-2011, 12:43 PM
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TheDevilMadeMe
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Wow, it's really amazing that none of the Moose Johnson / Eddie Gerard / Georges Boucher trio was selected at any level 5 years ago.

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08-12-2011, 09:47 PM
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BM67
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I once made a list of players I was the first to select in any draft.

Frank Boucher, Lester Patrick, and Doug Mohns didn't get selected until the second draft. It wasn't until ATD8 until someone other than me drafted Lester.

Frank Nighbor didn't get selected until the third draft. Nighbor didn't break the top 200 until ATD7.

Chuck Rayner and Duke Keats waited until the 4th draft.

Joe Klukay waited until the 5th.

Ott Heller and Mickey MacKay waited until the 6th. MacKay was on my team of unselected players with names starting with M at the end of MLD5. Of course I grabbed Mickey in every draft I participated in after that, slowly moving him up to 212 in ATD10.

Of course there were many more greats that slipped through to be selected by other GMs.

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08-12-2011, 11:43 PM
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Iain Fyffe
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Wow. I should have been involved in this years ago. Would've schooled all of ya.

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08-13-2011, 12:31 AM
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I'm looking forward to reading this.

Quote:
Originally Posted by seventieslord View Post
"oops" picks:

1. Hedberg - Marek Svatos (517th)
2. Leaf Lander - Donald Brashear (522nd)
3. kruezer - Marc Bergevin (518th)
4. Hedberg - Gary "Suitcase" Smith (421st)
5. Spitfire11 - Joni Pitkanen (484th)
I picked Marc-Andre Fleury that draft as well when he was a veteran of 72 uninspiring NHL games. That's worse than Smith.

I'm the Joe Thornton of MLDs

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08-13-2011, 12:52 AM
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seventieslord
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Hedberg View Post
I'm looking forward to reading this.



I picked Marc-Andre Fleury that draft as well when he was a veteran of 72 uninspiring NHL games. That's worse than Smith.

I'm the Joe Thornton of MLDs
Hey, his first ten games were fairly inspiring!

yeah, I probably should have chosen Fleury. I strongly considered LL's Crosby pick too, since he was halfway through his first season. But he is also one of very few players where maybe his junior career should count for at least something.

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08-13-2011, 08:04 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Iain Fyffe View Post
Wow. I should have been involved in this years ago. Would've schooled all of ya.
The first draft started in 2003.

I think I counted only 3 players that where drafted in ATD1 that played before 1911 or in the PCHA when someone brought up the rover position.

My defense of Red Kelly, Earl Seibert, Bill Gadsby, Lionel Conacher, Alexei Kasatonov and Sprague Cleghorn was not well respected back then. It was rated 11th of 12 teams by John Flyers Fan. Someone stated that Kelly wasn't a superstar because Harvey was the superstar defender of the 50s.

I still remember my discussion with monkey_00 at the end of All-X2 where he rates Marty McSorley a better player than Doug Mohns because McSorley played both forward and defense.

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08-14-2011, 10:50 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BM67 View Post
The first draft started in 2003.

I think I counted only 3 players that where drafted in ATD1 that played before 1911 or in the PCHA when someone brought up the rover position.

My defense of Red Kelly, Earl Seibert, Bill Gadsby, Lionel Conacher, Alexei Kasatonov and Sprague Cleghorn was not well respected back then. It was rated 11th of 12 teams by John Flyers Fan. Someone stated that Kelly wasn't a superstar because Harvey was the superstar defender of the 50s.

I still remember my discussion with monkey_00 at the end of All-X2 where he rates Marty McSorley a better player than Doug Mohns because McSorley played both forward and defense.
Lol yes, Red Kelly was so not a superstar that the 3 year HHOF waiting period was waived for him when he was inducted in 1969.

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01-16-2013, 08:20 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BM67 View Post
I once made a list of players I was the first to select in any draft.
I should do that too. *mental note: to do in 2013* It'll be a long list.

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01-31-2013, 12:48 AM
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I love my MLD 6 team. But some of the modern defencemen picks are laughable, not sure how Adrian Aucoin, Harold Snepsts and Dana Murzyn would compete. Especially compared to the excellent picks I made with older players.

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