HFBoards

Go Back   HFBoards > NHL Western Conference > Pacific Division > Edmonton Oilers
Mobile Hockey's Future Become a Sponsor Site Rules Support Forum vBookie Page 2
Notices

Team Canada Red vs. White

Reply
 
Thread Tools
Old
08-11-2011, 07:51 PM
  #376
cheesed-off*
 
Join Date: Aug 2003
Location: Under your skin...
Posts: 3,123
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by jadeddog View Post
i simply couldn't agree more with this post

I could.

You are simply not trying hard enough.

cheesed-off* is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
08-13-2011, 10:19 PM
  #377
Oi'll say!
Registered User
 
Oi'll say!'s Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2002
Location: Oil in 9
Country: Canada
Posts: 12,065
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by s7ark View Post
It isn't really fair to compare draft year points between Kane and RNH because Kane played for the Knights in their system. Kane saw 2 minutes of PP time each PP. Kane got insane minutes and offensive opportunities. To put it in perspective, Gagner outpointed Stamkos, Hall and RNH when comparing draft years because he played in that system.
If it was 1.6ppg vs 1.3ppg I'd call it a wash but it's a full extra ppg, it's scoring >1gpg vs <.5gpg.

And as far as RNH's ability to chip in offensively is concerned I have no doubt that he could be useful, I just think he's a kid who's not ready for the nhl. If he had Kane's speed and agility that would be one thing but he doesn't. I think he'll get wrecked here playing against Tootoo, Burrows, etc.

Oi'll say! is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
08-13-2011, 10:25 PM
  #378
Toydarian
Registered User
 
Toydarian's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2009
Posts: 2,518
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Oi'll say! View Post
If it was 1.6ppg vs 1.3ppg I'd call it a wash but it's a full extra ppg, it's scoring >1gpg vs <.5gpg.

And as far as RNH's ability to chip in offensively is concerned I have no doubt that he could be useful, I just think he's a kid who's not ready for the nhl. If he had Kane's speed and agility that would be one thing but he doesn't. I think he'll get wrecked here playing against Tootoo, Burrows, etc.
RNH aside, all you have to do is see how Kane has done in the NHL versus Stamkos. If Kane's ppg truly reflected his superior skill, you would expect that Kane would be considerably "out-pointing" Stamkos in the NHL which simply isn't the case.

Toydarian is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
08-13-2011, 10:34 PM
  #379
Oi'll say!
Registered User
 
Oi'll say!'s Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2002
Location: Oil in 9
Country: Canada
Posts: 12,065
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bryanbryoil View Post
Agreed, and this is why stats can be very misleading or very convenient to suit your side of the debate. In theory Kane should be by far the 2nd highest scoring NA player behind Crosby in the NHL because his junior numbers say so.
He finished 18th in scoring in last year and the year before that he was 9th, plus he scored 28 points in 22 playoff games and got a sc winning goal. Are you really trying to say that his offense didn't translate to the nhl? 145 in jumior, 88 in the nhl at 20....

Do you think we could trade rnh for him right now, based on how misleading their junior stats were?

Oi'll say! is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
08-13-2011, 10:42 PM
  #380
Oi'll say!
Registered User
 
Oi'll say!'s Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2002
Location: Oil in 9
Country: Canada
Posts: 12,065
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Toydarian View Post
RNH aside, all you have to do is see how Kane has done in the NHL versus Stamkos. If Kane's ppg truly reflected his superior skill, you would expect that Kane would be considerably "out-pointing" Stamkos in the NHL which simply isn't the case.
I put more stock in junior goal totals than I do in assist totals and their junior goal scoring was actually pretty similar. In their draft seasons (reg + playoffs) Kane had 72 goals in 74 games and Stamkos had 69 goals in 70 games.

Oi'll say! is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
08-13-2011, 10:50 PM
  #381
I am the Liquor
Registered User
 
I am the Liquor's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: Sunnyvale
Country: Canada
Posts: 34,428
vCash: 50
Quote:
Originally Posted by Oi'll say! View Post
If it was 1.6ppg vs 1.3ppg I'd call it a wash but it's a full extra ppg, it's scoring >1gpg vs <.5gpg.

And as far as RNH's ability to chip in offensively is concerned I have no doubt that he could be useful, I just think he's a kid who's not ready for the nhl. If he had Kane's speed and agility that would be one thing but he doesn't. I think he'll get wrecked here playing against Tootoo, Burrows, etc.
People were saying the same thing about Hall last year, albeit for different reasons. Hopkins wont get "wrecked" if he were to play in the nhl next year, but it may not be what is best for his development.

I think he could use another year in Junior regardless.

We have nothing to lose by sending him there either.

I am the Liquor is online now   Reply With Quote
Old
08-13-2011, 10:51 PM
  #382
Watch for the Yeti
Time to retool
 
Watch for the Yeti's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2011
Location: Swansea, MA
Country: United States
Posts: 7,821
vCash: 500
I have a question for u. In Canada which USA jersey do u like better .. The new ones or the old ones?

Watch for the Yeti is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
08-13-2011, 10:59 PM
  #383
Toydarian
Registered User
 
Toydarian's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2009
Posts: 2,518
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Oi'll say! View Post
I put more stock in junior goal totals than I do in assist totals and their junior goal scoring was actually pretty similar. In their draft seasons (reg + playoffs) Kane had 72 goals in 74 games and Stamkos had 69 goals in 70 games.
Yet Kane has scored a career high of 30 goals in 4 NHL seasons (Career: 317GP, 103G, 0.325GPG) and Stamkos has scored a career high of 51 goals in 3 NHL seasons (Career: 243GP, 119G, 0.490GPG). I don't mean to take anything away from Kane, he is a sublime talent, but obviously the Knights system (along with teammates) played a considerable role in his goal totals.


Last edited by Toydarian: 08-13-2011 at 11:54 PM.
Toydarian is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
08-13-2011, 11:47 PM
  #384
the word*
 
Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: rearranging atoms
Country: Canada
Posts: 4,960
vCash: 500
My number one concern about Ryan Nugent-Hopkins was his face-off efficiency and technique on the dot. From all reports during the scrimmages Hopkins pretty much dominated in this area. This doesn't elevate my concerns about his prowess on the dot but it eases them a great deal.

Face-offs were a weakness for Hopkins last year in my opinion. I wonder if he has being working on them or if hes just getting stronger?

the word* is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
08-14-2011, 03:06 AM
  #385
Bryanbryoil
Moderator
Paying Off A Bet
 
Bryanbryoil's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2004
Posts: 51,037
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Oi'll say! View Post
He finished 18th in scoring in last year and the year before that he was 9th, plus he scored 28 points in 22 playoff games and got a sc winning goal. Are you really trying to say that his offense didn't translate to the nhl? 145 in jumior, 88 in the nhl at 20....

Do you think we could trade rnh for him right now, based on how misleading their junior stats were?
He's doing well, however not to the point that he should be IF his draft year stats were the end-all. Where was Gagner amongst scorers? Did he outscore guys like Stamkos? Duchene? He outscored them in their draft years.....

Kane is a special talent, that said anyone that doesn't recognize his linemates and understand how the Hunter's play their top players then they are giving his junior stats more credit than they likely should.

__________________
Treat Others As You Would Like To Be Treated
Bryanbryoil is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
08-14-2011, 03:15 AM
  #386
Wheatking
Registered User
 
Wheatking's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2006
Country: Canada
Posts: 15,236
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bryanbryoil View Post
He's doing well, however not to the point that he should be IF his draft year stats were the end-all. Where was Gagner amongst scorers? Did he outscore guys like Stamkos? Duchene? He outscored them in their draft years.....

Kane is a special talent, that said anyone that doesn't recognize his linemates and understand how the Hunter's play their top players then they are giving his junior stats more credit than they likely should.
Exactly. Gagner had a 0.660 gpg average in his draft year. Hall had 0.702. A difference of 2 goals over the 57 games Hall played.

I'd say Kane and Gagner's point totals were inflated by about 40 points in their draft year. I'm pretty sure Kane and Gagner are the last players to put up 110+ points in their draft years. Stamkos, Tavares, Hall, Seguin and RNH all had 104-106 points. Kane had 145 and Gagner had 118....something obviously doesn't add up.

Wheatking is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Forum Jump


Bookmarks

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off



All times are GMT -5. The time now is 03:17 PM.

monitoring_string = "e4251c93e2ba248d29da988d93bf5144"
Contact Us - HFBoards - Archive - Privacy Statement - Terms of Use - Advertise - Top - AdChoices

vBulletin Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
HFBoards.com is a property of CraveOnline Media, LLC, an Evolve Media, LLC company. ©2014 All Rights Reserved.