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Old
08-18-2011, 09:02 AM
  #26
Liferleafer
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Quote:
Originally Posted by flash 12 View Post
you think so after what he gave up for kessel
HAHAHA...let me know when Kipper is 23yrs old again!!!

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Old
08-18-2011, 09:04 AM
  #27
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Quote:
Originally Posted by flash 12 View Post
you think so after what he gave up for kessel
Kessel was coming off of a 36g season at the age of 22. Kipper is going on 35 and declining.
Q:How does he fit the mold for the leafs going forward?

A: He doesn't.


Quote:
Originally Posted by SensGal View Post
I couldn`t see Toronto trading a goalie away that has yet to play badly. If Reimer flops this year, I think they`d be looking for a trade possibly, but I couldn`t see them trading a guy who`s given them that much hope.


Quote:
Originally Posted by flash 12 View Post
yes. but if he flops you will get nothing for him
SensGal nailed it on the head. Why would we trade a 22year old kid that just put up great numbers and seems to have the mentality needed to play in a head-case fan/media market?

No GM will trade a player in Reimer's situation "just to get something for him incase he flops". That's just stupid.

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Old
08-18-2011, 10:00 AM
  #28
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Quote:
Originally Posted by flash 12 View Post
yes. but if he flops you will get nothing for him
That's true. But would you trade a PPG prospect/rookie straight up for a PPG player who is 12 years older?

I don't disagree that Reimer could easily flop, but you don't trade someone who's actually got a great attitude, stats and has helped your team play better as a team for a player who is 12 years older (and not saying he's bad, but less likely to improve).

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Old
08-18-2011, 10:25 AM
  #29
Caitlyn Jenner
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At first I read this as Reimer for Kipper and a 1st, and i was still skeptical. Then I noticed the Leafs were the ones giving up the first, and I lol'ed

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Old
08-18-2011, 10:28 AM
  #30
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Burke laughs and hangs up the phone

Flames fans are still angry as how bad Burke fleeced Sutter in the Phaneuf deal.

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Old
08-18-2011, 10:35 AM
  #31
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Originally Posted by blader258 View Post
Burke laughs and hangs up the phone

Flames fans are still angry as how bad Burke fleeced Sutter in the Phaneuf deal.
What i find funny is that most flames fans would never want Phaneuf back and were just glad to get rid of him. The guy is a bum, good luck having him as your captain, he'll lead you right into the gutter.

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Old
08-18-2011, 10:44 AM
  #32
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Originally Posted by The Gnome View Post
What i find funny is that most flames fans would never want Phaneuf back and were just glad to get rid of him. The guy is a bum, good luck having him as your captain, he'll lead you right into the gutter.
Just like Gilmour.

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Old
08-18-2011, 10:49 AM
  #33
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Haha no. This I terrible for the leafs. Ill take Reimer over Kipper right now and you want us to add a first?

Just no.

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Old
08-18-2011, 10:52 AM
  #34
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Haatley View Post
flames say no. reimer is flash in pan
Lottery numbers for Friday please?

Leafs say no, by the time they're ready to compete Kipper will be on the decline.

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Old
08-18-2011, 10:58 AM
  #35
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Quote:
Originally Posted by flash 12 View Post
you think so after what he gave up for kessel


No goaltender has played as well as James Reimer in Toronto for as long, since the lockout.

We traded for can't miss goalies Raycroft/Toskala and we signed the most highly touted goalkeeping free agent in Gustavsson. No one else is able to handle the big smoke, they shrivel up and die once the media rips out there internals.

Also, have you happened to see any of the deals Burke has made since the Kessel deal. Even though in the Kessel deal, we picked up the team's best player, with the highest potential. But, since then he has been unloading our salary dumps and expendable players for diamonds and gold.

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08-18-2011, 11:01 AM
  #36
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Originally Posted by The Gnome View Post
What i find funny is that most flames fans would never want Phaneuf back and were just glad to get rid of him. The guy is a bum, good luck having him as your captain, he'll lead you right into the gutter.
Someone sounds bitter.

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Old
08-18-2011, 11:01 AM
  #37
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Quote:
Originally Posted by blader258 View Post
Burke laughs and hangs up the phone

Flames fans are still angry as how bad Burke fleeced Sutter in the Phaneuf deal.
It was the garbage that Sutter got back that bugged me. We would've been better off taking a 1st for him. I'm glad Phaneuf is gone and I was a huge fan. Still am, hope he becomes the player he should have become. No defenseman in the league has his physical tools. But ugh, my favorite player from that trade was Mayers... Enough said.

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Old
08-18-2011, 11:02 AM
  #38
Liferleafer
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Quote:
Originally Posted by The Gnome View Post
What i find funny is that most flames fans would never want Phaneuf back and were just glad to get rid of him. The guy is a bum, good luck having him as your captain, he'll lead you right into the gutter.
What i find funny is that we have yet to see the "BUM" side of Dion, but i'm sure you are right. Enjoy Stajan, Hagman and White. And also....thanks for Aulie!!

On a further note....if Phaneuf was the anchor holding your team back, how have you not achieved anything since the deal?

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08-18-2011, 11:13 AM
  #39
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Originally Posted by Liferleafer View Post
On a further note....if Phaneuf was the anchor holding your team back, how have you not achieved anything since the deal?
Phaneuf certainly didn't do anything on our team in his end days here that would indicate he'd be moving our team forward, that's for sure.

This is just one of those cases where it was addition by subtraction for Calgary. At this point, I'm happy to not have that player on our current squad. There's no room for him and his contract. While Bouwmeester is overpaid at this point, he plays a much better defensive / transitional game than Phaneuf, and that's what the Flames need at this point in time. He's a better fit for our club.

And personally, I couldn't care less about what happened to White / Mayers / Stajan / Hagman. That's not really of any interest whatsoever to me, and saying we lost a trade is just re-treaded material at this point with no insight whatsoever.

We eventually landed Babchuk, who brings the same booming shot from the point that Phaneuf did, but at a third of the price. I'd rather have that.

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08-18-2011, 11:14 AM
  #40
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So Calgary decides they are okay with losing a few more games when they are already going to be in tough to make the playoffs.

And Toronto not only runs out of patience with their young goalie duo of Reimer/Gust without anything warranting that... but they decide not having their first round pick was so great the last 2 years they may as well throw it away this time.

Probably a worse trade for TO than us at this point as we would have 4 young goalies with what looks like NHL upside to try and replace Kipper; but it's still bad for both sides imo.

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Old
08-18-2011, 11:16 AM
  #41
Saul Goodman
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hell no. leafs want nothing to do with a 34 year old kiprusoff even if it only cost us reimer, let alone our 1st. what a joke.

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Old
08-18-2011, 11:18 AM
  #42
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Liferleafer View Post
What i find funny is that we have yet to see the "BUM" side of Dion, but i'm sure you are right. Enjoy Stajan, Hagman and White. And also....thanks for Aulie!!

On a further note....if Phaneuf was the anchor holding your team back, how have you not achieved anything since the deal?
This coming from a leafs fan. After that trade you guys still suck. The trade itself was a decent trade it was the re signing of Stajan that made that trade bad. White got us Anton so I dont mind that trade at all.

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Old
08-18-2011, 11:23 AM
  #43
Saul Goodman
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Originally Posted by flamesfan5 View Post
This coming from a leafs fan. After that trade you guys still suck. The trade itself was a decent trade it was the re signing of Stajan that made that trade bad. White got us Anton so I dont mind that trade at all.
actually, since that trade the leafs have been a much better team. especially with phaneuf and aulie in the line up. glad you guys at least got a player you like but next time try getting your facts straight instead of resorting to the usual "you guys suck" BS.

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Old
08-18-2011, 11:31 AM
  #44
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Originally Posted by flamesfan5 View Post
This coming from a leafs fan. After that trade you guys still suck. The trade itself was a decent trade it was the re signing of Stajan that made that trade bad. White got us Anton so I dont mind that trade at all.
Actually, you've got it backwards. The leafs were a much better team after adding Dion. And are still a much better team than the pre-dion days.

Last season's lack of playoffs can be largely attributed to a horrible stretch pre-Reimer; while Phaneuf and Army were injured.

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Old
08-18-2011, 11:35 AM
  #45
Liferleafer
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Originally Posted by flamesfan5 View Post
This coming from a leafs fan. After that trade you guys still suck. The trade itself was a decent trade it was the re signing of Stajan that made that trade bad. White got us Anton so I dont mind that trade at all.
Yup we sucked before...but suck alot less after, and you?

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Old
08-18-2011, 11:39 AM
  #46
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Quote:
Originally Posted by flash 12 View Post
TOR
Kiprusoff

CGY
Reimer
1st rounder

TOR gets a goalie that will get them in the playoffs
CGY gets a much need first and will have two young goalies to work with
how do you figure that kipper will get them into the playoffs? Calgary was a better team then TO last year, and he couldnt get calgary into the playoffs...

pretty brutal trade proposal..

burke would be ran outta town for taking this trade, thats no knock on kipper, he just doesnt fit into the fold of what TO is doing right now.

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Old
08-18-2011, 11:52 AM
  #47
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This might fly if JFJ was still the Leafs gm.

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Old
08-18-2011, 12:05 PM
  #48
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Originally Posted by Liferleafer View Post
Yup we sucked before...but suck alot less after, and you?
Were doing great without the cancer in the lockerroom. At the end of the day we were happy to get rid of him, you were happy to take him. Neither team came out of it looking great. We are no different then we were before the trade. Dion was awful here other then his first year. As I before the only bad part of that trade was re-signing Stajan. Hagman is a great player for what hes being paid. White was turned over for Anton so thats a huge plus. The only real loss for us was Aulie. Since this has nothing to do with the OP.

The trade itself isn't that bad. It just doesn't make sense for the Leafs. They would risk to much trading Reimer. Thats not to say he could just be a complete bust, but you cant trade him until you know. As for the Flames there in a win one with the current core they have so unless they decide to head for a rebuild which they wont until the deadline imo they wouldnt make this trade either.


Last edited by flamesfan5: 08-18-2011 at 12:10 PM.
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Old
08-18-2011, 12:21 PM
  #49
Liferleafer
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Originally Posted by flamesfan5 View Post
Were doing great without the cancer in the lockerroom. At the end of the day we were happy to get rid of him, you were happy to take him. Neither team came out of it looking great. We are no different then we were before the trade. Dion was awful here other then his first year. As I before the only bad part of that trade was re-signing Stajan. Hagman is a great player for what hes being paid. White was turned over for Anton so thats a huge plus. The only real loss for us was Aulie. Since this has nothing to do with the OP.

The trade itself isn't that bad. It just doesn't make sense for the Leafs. They would risk to much trading Reimer. Thats not to say he could just be a complete bust, but you cant trade him until you know. As for the Flames there in a win one with the current core they have so unless they decide to head for a rebuild which they wont until the deadline imo they wouldnt make this trade either.
Can you by chance post a link about this cancer that was Phaneuf, cause i only heard this from fans POST trade.

Also, as far as the OP, i wouldn't make this deal as even i admit that IF we were to just make the playoffs this season that would be a huge step. Kipper's age and decline kind of hinder this deal, and having to give our 1st in what is to be a very good draft kills it.

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Old
08-18-2011, 12:32 PM
  #50
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Originally Posted by The Gnome View Post
What i find funny is that most flames fans would never want Phaneuf back and were just glad to get rid of him. The guy is a bum, good luck having him as your captain, he'll lead you right into the gutter.
Quote:
Originally Posted by flamesfan5 View Post
This coming from a leafs fan. After that trade you guys still suck. The trade itself was a decent trade it was the re signing of Stajan that made that trade bad. White got us Anton so I dont mind that trade at all.
Considering in games he has played we have a pretty overwhelming winning record in games he plays.

Take out the 5 wins and 11 losses he missed in November and games with him in it, the Leafs were 32 and 24. Thats not even taking into account that he didnt get back to full strength in his leg till late January, early March. Its pretty hard to argue we havent been better with him.

That trade was also never decent. Your team got taken. Ridiculously bad. Yes Im a Leafs fan, but Im also a Flames fan (spent 5 years there, during the cup run too).

The Flames gave up a potential number 1 dman and a top defensive dman prospect. For very little. Sure the Flames have Babchuk but Id caution before saying it worked out. Babchuk has never in his pro career scored more than 35 points. Not in the NHL, the KHL, the AHL or the RSL. In fact he only ever scored more than 27 points once in all those leagues. Id wait a little before proclaiming him an adequate replacement for Phaneuf. Plus the Stajan contract was brutal.

Not only that but at the very least Sutter should have been able to get a half decent prospect and a 1st for Phaneuf.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Ice Cream Man View Post
Phaneuf certainly didn't do anything on our team in his end days here that would indicate he'd be moving our team forward, that's for sure.

This is just one of those cases where it was addition by subtraction for Calgary. At this point, I'm happy to not have that player on our current squad. There's no room for him and his contract. While Bouwmeester is overpaid at this point, he plays a much better defensive / transitional game than Phaneuf, and that's what the Flames need at this point in time. He's a better fit for our club.

And personally, I couldn't care less about what happened to White / Mayers / Stajan / Hagman. That's not really of any interest whatsoever to me, and saying we lost a trade is just re-treaded material at this point with no insight whatsoever.

We eventually landed Babchuk, who brings the same booming shot from the point that Phaneuf did, but at a third of the price. I'd rather have that.
Saying that it was addition by subtraction is a little facetious. Yes Phaneuf had grown far to comfortable in Calgary. D Sutter babied him and contributed a little to much to his ego. I would actually agree that it was time for Phaneuf to move on. It was just done very badly. Sutter should have gotten a better return. He shouldnt have needed to give up a top prospect as well.

It wasnt a replacement of Babchuk for Phaneuf. It was Stajan + Babchuk for Phaneuf. The Flames barely saved any money. They saved like 600 000 grand a year. They essentially replaced Phaneuf with two pieces at a slightly lower price, and added Bouwmeester at an inflated price (albeit not that inflated). The Phaneuf trade will go down as one of the worst in history and the start of the fall of the Flames.

And Phaneuf has greatly increased his defensive game and penalty kill game while in Toronto. The difference in defensive play between Phaneuf and Bouwmeester is actually quite small compared to when the two were teammates

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