HFBoards

Go Back   HFBoards > NHL Eastern Conference > Atlantic Division > Montreal Canadiens
Notices

Predicting Production: Cole Hard Facts

Reply
 
Thread Tools
Old
08-21-2011, 03:09 PM
  #1
neofury*
 
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: Montreal, PQ
Country: Canada
Posts: 20,277
vCash: 500
Predicting Production: Cole Hard Facts

It isn't written by me just this writer on hockeybuzz. Some of them are half decent.

http://www.hockeybuzz.com/blog/Steve...acts/139/37491

Steven Hindle wrote it. Some interesting stuff, long summer so hopefully some people will enjoy the read.

neofury* is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
08-21-2011, 03:20 PM
  #2
onice
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jan 2004
Location: Montreal
Posts: 5,383
vCash: 500
I had reservations when this signing was made and that article hasn't dispelled any of them.

If Habs fans think that Cole is going to be an immense improvement over Andrei on that line, I think they'll be disappointed. Cole is a nice complementary player and so is Andrei.

But I hope I'm wrong and Cole lights it up.

onice is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
08-21-2011, 03:28 PM
  #3
neofury*
 
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: Montreal, PQ
Country: Canada
Posts: 20,277
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by onice View Post
I had reservations when this signing was made and that article hasn't dispelled any of them.

If Habs fans think that Cole is going to be an immense improvement over Andrei on that line, I think they'll be disappointed. Cole is a nice complementary player and so is Andrei.

But I hope I'm wrong and Cole lights it up.
I don't necessarily think they're expecting more production. More-so they're expecting the line to click better overall. The last two seasons Cammy being injured really made that line suffer. Now if he's injured we have relatively good people in the top 6 still. Andrei gets bumped up and voila Cammy-Plek-AK go back for example if Cole goes down. There are more options in general this year and I think that was the goal of the org. Plus I think Cole is a better fit on that line, you are right though production and injuries are a question mark. Hopefully the chemistry is there.

neofury* is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
08-21-2011, 03:58 PM
  #4
Estimated_Prophet
Registered User
 
Estimated_Prophet's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2003
Location: Ontario
Country: Canada
Posts: 3,157
vCash: 500
I like the signing as he is exactly the type of player that was needed.

The writer is probably mistaken by predicting PP production for Cole. Cole has below average hands and doesn't excel in "half-court" offensive situations. His production has always come from the transition/breakout game where he uses his phenomenal speed to overtake defenders and crash the net.

I would prefer to see Kostitsyn on the PP and Cole on the PK. With Cole and Plekanec on the PK would see a ton of shorthanded break aways.

Estimated_Prophet is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
08-21-2011, 04:05 PM
  #5
neofury*
 
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: Montreal, PQ
Country: Canada
Posts: 20,277
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Estimated_Prophet View Post
I like the signing as he is exactly the type of player that was needed.

The writer is probably mistaken by predicting PP production for Cole. Cole has below average hands and doesn't excel in "half-court" offensive situations. His production has always come from the transition/breakout game where he uses his phenomenal speed to overtake defenders and crash the net.

I would prefer to see Kostitsyn on the PP and Cole on the PK. With Cole and Plekanec on the PK would see a ton of shorthanded break aways.
Sounds like an interesting idea honestly. I like how this team is stacked this year. We have a ton of depth in case of injuries, even Aaron Palushaj could make the jump hence why I don't think Pouliot was ever considered.

neofury* is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
08-21-2011, 04:25 PM
  #6
Estimated_Prophet
Registered User
 
Estimated_Prophet's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2003
Location: Ontario
Country: Canada
Posts: 3,157
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by neofury View Post
Sounds like an interesting idea honestly. I like how this team is stacked this year. We have a ton of depth in case of injuries, even Aaron Palushaj could make the jump hence why I don't think Pouliot was ever considered.
Gauthier/Gainey are trying to create a culture of proessionalism and winning on this roster. Players who don't buy in (Latendresse, Sergei, Pouliot, Grabovski) are dispatched and players like Gill and Darche are kept.

When an organization successfully creates a winning culture (Red Wings, Patriots, Spurs) it is easier to bring in highly skilled but high maintenance players who then have little choice but to conform to the winning team-first atmosphere. We are not there yet but are well on our way.

I love the direction that the organization is headed......just have to tolerate the bean-counter posters who can't find a metric to quantify the value of intangibles such as these.

Estimated_Prophet is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
08-21-2011, 08:25 PM
  #7
Hackett
HF Needs Feeny
 
Hackett's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2002
Country: Canada
Posts: 15,271
vCash: 500
I dont expect the world out of cole. If he fits the habs mould and puts up 45 points, I think you got a decent year out of him.

The habs strength is in numbers, not star players. They will need to rely on a balanced attack.

Hackett is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
08-21-2011, 08:37 PM
  #8
overlords
Global Moderator
Jack Arse
 
overlords's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: Trolling Brian Wilde
Posts: 26,033
vCash: 500
I think Cole will bring more than goals and assists to the habs. I've used this analogy before, but I think of the Cole signing as finally getting that long skinny piece in tetris when you've been waiting for it. We've got every other dimension in our forward core. We've got speed, sniping ability, puck handling, playmaking etc.. but what Cole brings we sorely lack. I won't only be looking at how Cole plays, but how it changes the playstyle/productivity of whoever he's playing with.

__________________



"overlords is one of my favorite people on this entire site." - Hfboards
overlords is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
08-22-2011, 07:49 AM
  #9
neofury*
 
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: Montreal, PQ
Country: Canada
Posts: 20,277
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by overlords View Post
I think Cole will bring more than goals and assists to the habs. I've used this analogy before, but I think of the Cole signing as finally getting that long skinny piece in tetris when you've been waiting for it. We've got every other dimension in our forward core. We've got speed, sniping ability, puck handling, playmaking etc.. but what Cole brings we sorely lack. I won't only be looking at how Cole plays, but how it changes the playstyle/productivity of whoever he's playing with.
Great analogy

Yeah definitely the way I see it if you can have one power forward on each of the top 3 lines you're set.

neofury* is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
08-22-2011, 08:12 AM
  #10
Stjonnypopo
Rgesitreed Uesr
 
Stjonnypopo's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: Mount Doom
Posts: 10,261
vCash: 506
Quote:
Originally Posted by neofury View Post
Great analogy

Yeah definitely the way I see it if you can have one power forward on each of the top 3 lines you're set.
It's not about every team having the same formula of Sniper - Playmaker - Power Forward though, it's about our team needing to have some power guys.

Stjonnypopo is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
08-22-2011, 08:35 AM
  #11
neofury*
 
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: Montreal, PQ
Country: Canada
Posts: 20,277
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Stjonnypopo View Post
It's not about every team having the same formula of Sniper - Playmaker - Power Forward though, it's about our team needing to have some power guys.
Agreed, point I was making is that having Pacioretty and Cole on the top two lines is pretty awesome.

Andrei is like a poor mans power forward so for the third line it all works out.

neofury* is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
08-22-2011, 08:36 AM
  #12
hototogisu
Global Moderator
Poked the bear!!!!!
 
hototogisu's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: Montreal, QC
Country: Canada
Posts: 32,889
vCash: 500
Awards:
Quote:
Originally Posted by Stjonnypopo View Post
It's not about every team having the same formula of Sniper - Playmaker - Power Forward though, it's about our team needing to have some power guys.
A balanced attack has always been key:


hototogisu is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
08-22-2011, 08:48 AM
  #13
PricePkPatch
Registered User
 
PricePkPatch's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: Montreal
Country: Canada
Posts: 15,420
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by neofury View Post
Agreed, point I was making is that having Pacioretty and Cole on the top two lines is pretty awesome.

Andrei is like a poor mans power forward so for the third line it all works out.
He makes it up with alternate skills. I say it again: 3rd line is our key to success

PricePkPatch is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
08-22-2011, 09:00 AM
  #14
neofury*
 
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: Montreal, PQ
Country: Canada
Posts: 20,277
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by PricePkPatch View Post
He makes it up with alternate skills. I say it again: 3rd line is our key to success
Exactly. One thing that does frustrate me about Andrei is he's shown flashes of being able to be a good power forward but he really doesn't use those skills as often as he should. I don't personally think it's laziness so much as hockey sense.

He lacks that extra second of time a lot of power forwards have that give them that jump.


Last edited by neofury*: 08-22-2011 at 10:07 AM.
neofury* is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
08-22-2011, 09:02 AM
  #15
macavoy
Registered User
 
macavoy's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2009
Posts: 7,311
vCash: 243
Quote:
Originally Posted by onice View Post
I had reservations when this signing was made and that article hasn't dispelled any of them.

If Habs fans think that Cole is going to be an immense improvement over Andrei on that line, I think they'll be disappointed. Cole is a nice complementary player and so is Andrei.

But I hope I'm wrong and Cole lights it up.
You make a good point but Andre spent little time on that line and was productive when he was there. The problem as the article points out is more along the lines of "the Latendresse/Pouliot/Kostitsyn/Moen/Darche train that has run through that open wing on the Canadiens top line has been more of a hindrance than a help"

macavoy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
08-22-2011, 09:04 AM
  #16
PricePkPatch
Registered User
 
PricePkPatch's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: Montreal
Country: Canada
Posts: 15,420
vCash: 500
If we believe the Hurrican board, Cole has great top speed and can go on breakaways very efficiently.

I can't wait to see Markov feed him his Magical Passes to the neutral zone and then hope to see him rush the zone.

PricePkPatch is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
08-22-2011, 09:15 AM
  #17
MM425
Registered User
 
MM425's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2005
Posts: 4,586
vCash: 500
Honestly, I think Cole is a perfect fit for this team. He compliments our other players styles very well and could be a big boost to the PP.

I predict a 25/25ish season from him which would be solid.

MM425 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
08-22-2011, 10:27 AM
  #18
Jigger77
Registered User
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: Montreal
Country: Canada
Posts: 5,940
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by onice View Post
I had reservations when this signing was made and that article hasn't dispelled any of them.

If Habs fans think that Cole is going to be an immense improvement over Andrei on that line, I think they'll be disappointed. Cole is a nice complementary player and so is Andrei.

But I hope I'm wrong and Cole lights it up.
I like to think of him as an improvement over Pouliot rather than an improvement over Akost.

Jigger77 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
08-22-2011, 10:31 AM
  #19
PricePkPatch
Registered User
 
PricePkPatch's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: Montreal
Country: Canada
Posts: 15,420
vCash: 500
I just realized; (groan) the kinds of puns we'll see if Cole makes the NHL Headlines..

"Knocked out Cole"
"Cole chills Garden"
"Cole-blooded scorer"
"Switching line Cole-Turkey"


... I think I'll get an infraction

PricePkPatch is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
08-22-2011, 10:32 AM
  #20
habfaninvictoria
Registered User
 
habfaninvictoria's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: Victoria BC
Posts: 1,643
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by PricePkPatch View Post
He makes it up with alternate skills. I say it again: 3rd line is our key to success
We don't have an elite scorer so we need to have 3 effective lines. For the past 15 + years we haven't had either. The addition of Cole gives us at least 7 20 Goal players. Gionta and Cammy should pot 30+. Cole and Pleks with 25+. Patches, AK, and Desharnais with 20+. That whole paradigm disappears without AK or Cole.

habfaninvictoria is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
08-22-2011, 01:01 PM
  #21
Ozymandias
#firetherrien
 
Ozymandias's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: Hockey Mecca
Country: Canada
Posts: 13,441
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by onice View Post
I had reservations when this signing was made and that article hasn't dispelled any of them.

If Habs fans think that Cole is going to be an immense improvement over Andrei on that line, I think they'll be disappointed. Cole is a nice complementary player and so is Andrei.

But I hope I'm wrong and Cole lights it up.
Because you want to define him that way.

Cole is added depth to our top 9. And it's this addition coupled with a few young players rising that will make Cole a good signing.

We have 7 players in Plex, Cam, Gio, Gomez, AK, Markov and Subban who are all good for at least 40 points on a full season.

But now, you can add Cole, and three young players in Pac, Eller or DD, which at least one of them should reach 40 on a full season.

So our range is at least 7 players at 40 points and that's a very reserved scenario. Habs could very well finish with 9 of them.

Good offense doesn't just come from high-end talent, it can also come from deep talente depth offense.

Cole also adds a potential 20 goal scorer, which gives us 5 guys who are all good for at least 20 goals in a full season, and at least one of the four young players in Pac, Subban, Eller and DD, could reach 20 goals.

Since the lockout, teams that have over 4 x 20 goals scorers and/or over 6 x 40 points producers, are usually a lock for the playoffs and have an offense at least a little over 3 GPG.

If Habs finish with 5 x 20+ goal scorers and 8 x 40+ point producers, you can bet they'll be in the top 5 in the east. And it is a likely scenario, unless we get an overload of injuries, worst than last season.

Ozymandias is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
08-22-2011, 02:25 PM
  #22
matCH penalty
Registered User
 
Join Date: May 2011
Country: Canada
Posts: 1,077
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by PricePkPatch View Post
I just realized; (groan) the kinds of puns we'll see if Cole makes the NHL Headlines..
Kostitsyn-Plekanec-Cole... The Cole Slav line.

matCH penalty is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
08-22-2011, 04:08 PM
  #23
Jakomyte
Registered User
 
Jakomyte's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: Toronto
Country: Canada
Posts: 2,080
vCash: 500
Heading into next year after acquiring Cole gives me a bit more optimism that the Habs can take another step forward in terms of their offensive consistency.

I remember during the dark years of the late 90s/early 2000s when it seemed like the Habs only really had one scoring line, which was Koivu's line. The difference between those teams, and Habs teams that have been sneaking into the playoffs since the early-mid 2000s has been consistently having a second scoring line, which in my mind started in 2003-2004 when Ribeiro/Ryder broke out and provided a second line after Koivu-Zednik.

Going into next season, I feel the Habs are really starting to build towards that skilled forward depth that teams like Philly and Chicago have that have made them so successful recently. I see us as potentially having 9 forwards that could play in the top 6 (Cammalleri, Plekanec, Cole, Pacioretty, Gomez, Gionta, Kostitsyn, Eller, Desharnais). I'm excited to see whether this roster can provide the team with a bit more scoring to add on top of solid D and great goaltending.

Jakomyte is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
08-22-2011, 11:08 PM
  #24
Lafleurs Guy
Registered User
 
Lafleurs Guy's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2007
Posts: 20,196
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by overlords View Post
I think Cole will bring more than goals and assists to the habs. I've used this analogy before, but I think of the Cole signing as finally getting that long skinny piece in tetris when you've been waiting for it. We've got every other dimension in our forward core. We've got speed, sniping ability, puck handling, playmaking etc.. but what Cole brings we sorely lack. I won't only be looking at how Cole plays, but how it changes the playstyle/productivity of whoever he's playing with.
I didn't like the signing due to Cole's age but I agree with what you've said here. It's nice we finally got a guy with some physical edge to him and I hope he can set a nice example for some of the younger guys like MaxPac.

Lafleurs Guy is online now   Reply With Quote
Old
08-23-2011, 06:59 AM
  #25
TheBuriedHab
Registered User
 
TheBuriedHab's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2010
Posts: 5,181
vCash: 500
I think the best thing Cole brings is more depth up front. When Pacioretty went down last year we had such a gaping hole up front that nobody else could fill. Now we aren't spread out so thin that one injury can cripple our forward depth. We added a competent top 6 player, with size that fleshes out the top 9 very nicely.

TheBuriedHab is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Forum Jump


Bookmarks

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off



All times are GMT -5. The time now is 05:45 PM.

monitoring_string = "e4251c93e2ba248d29da988d93bf5144"
Contact Us - HFBoards - Archive - Privacy Statement - Terms of Use - Advertise - Top - AdChoices

vBulletin Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
HFBoards.com is a property of CraveOnline Media, LLC, an Evolve Media, LLC company. 2014 All Rights Reserved.