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Old
08-25-2011, 02:32 PM
  #76
Sawdalite
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Originally Posted by Jester View Post
"Learn English" is not bigotry. Anyone can learn English.
You are assuming there.

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08-25-2011, 02:32 PM
  #77
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Originally Posted by Sawdalite View Post
They can have rules as long as they adhere to the law... and -- this is key -- they do not take away one's civil rights.

They can ban dogs from the esablishment... but cannot ban guide/help dogs for but one example.
It is utterly mind blowing how you ignore legal precedence established on levels all the way up to the Supreme Court in favor of what is, by opposition, only your opinion.

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08-25-2011, 02:34 PM
  #78
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Originally Posted by Rick Blaine View Post
If you've got a rich, elderly neighbor, it's probably safe to assume your problems are of the first world variety. I'm merely pointing out your love for American ideals, but only when convenient. Ignoring you understand why those people would want to move here, and why their first worry wouldn't be if they were in legal accordance, is ignoring large parts of those same American ideals.
This country should worry about citizens of this country. That's my stance. Yeah, it sucks for people of less fortunate areas around the world that have to deal with some awful ****, but there are plenty of people in our own country going through hell that are being neglected. The U.S. can't afford to be the good samaritan of the world anymore.

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08-25-2011, 02:36 PM
  #79
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Let's please keep this on the topic of Vento, there is a political forum for discussion of US foreign and domestic policy. Otherwise this could rapidly become a quagmire.

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08-25-2011, 02:39 PM
  #80
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Originally Posted by Sawdalite View Post
It is wrong to assume the Spanish customers were illegals... My point is he feels as he feels... and he ties the two together.

Away from that, as a businessman he should do his business fairly and not determine who should and should not be served.

The area he is located in has a large amount of Spanish speaking people... as an area business he has a responsibility to serve the community he is located in and in return he will be rewarded with their patronage.
He has absolutely no responsibility to serve the community. He sells steaks. The "migrant workers" who speak Spanish weren't there when Geno's opened up, so why is it his responsibility to cater to them? You learn the common language of the country you're moving to, not force everyone else to learn yours. It's not racism, it's not bigotry, it's common sense.

What he should've done was anytime someone comes up speaking something the order takers can't understand, just give them a plain roll and a spoon.

To take it further, why does automated phone lines only have English and Spanish as options? That alienates and offends everyone who doesn't speak those?

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08-25-2011, 02:39 PM
  #81
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Originally Posted by Beef Invictus View Post
So should a business owner be forced to learn every single language on earth so that no situation will arise where they can't provide service?
They should learn to be able to work with the people in the community the do business in... and when they are in an area with such a large population of Spanish speaking people they should establish a way to serve their customers.

Pat's and other businesses in the area are not having problems... I'm certain Claudio's is not turning away customers.

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08-25-2011, 02:41 PM
  #82
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Originally Posted by JVR21 View Post
This country should worry about citizens of this country. That's my stance. Yeah, it sucks for people of less fortunate areas around the world that have to deal with some awful ****, but there are plenty of people in our own country going through hell that are being neglected. The U.S. can't afford to be the good samaritan of the world anymore.
The same people who pay attention to the immigration problem as they have are the same ones not paying attention to the other problems you're talking about. Your issue shouldn't be with the foreigners.

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08-25-2011, 02:41 PM
  #83
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Originally Posted by JVR21 View Post
1. I'm assuming he was complaining about illegals, since if they were citizens they wouldn't be robbing anyone of tax dollars. Not to mention he would've been bombarded with lawsuits if he was simply being racist.
2. Wrong. As a businessman he can do whatever he has the right to do. Ever heard of a "No shirt, No shoes, no service" policy?
That does not deny civil rights.

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08-25-2011, 02:42 PM
  #84
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Originally Posted by Beef Invictus View Post
Let's please keep this on the topic of Vento, there is a political forum for discussion of US foreign and domestic policy. Otherwise this could rapidly become a quagmire.
Vento's actions have inherent political ties. Staying on topic is just going to get it moved, anyway.

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08-25-2011, 02:43 PM
  #85
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Originally Posted by Beef Invictus View Post
Actually, the guy behind the counter wasn't polite about it at all.

Edit: Ok, so I used to work at Blockbuster. Some Quebecois came in once, and either didn't speak English or insisted on speaking French. I couldn't help them with whatever their problem was because I couldn't communicate with them. Did I violate their civil rights?
Was this Blockbuster in Montreal?

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08-25-2011, 02:43 PM
  #86
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Originally Posted by Sawdalite View Post
They should learn to be able to work with the people in the community the do business in... and when they are in an area with such a large population of Spanish speaking people they should establish a way to serve their customers.

Pat's and other businesses in the area are not having problems... I'm certain Claudio's is not turning away customers.
The fact is, they can do whatever the hell they want as long as it's legal. Why are you so concerned about a simple rule of his establishment? He's the one who was losing some business because of it.

Why shouldn't the Spanish-speaking people learn the language of the business that has been so generous as to serve the community?

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08-25-2011, 02:44 PM
  #87
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Originally Posted by Sawdalite View Post
That does not deny civil rights.
Neither does not serving someone because you can't understand what they're saying.

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08-25-2011, 02:44 PM
  #88
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sawdalite View Post
They should learn to be able to work with the people in the community the do business in... and when they are in an area with such a large population of Spanish speaking people they should establish a way to serve their customers.

Pat's and other businesses in the area are not having problems... I'm certain Claudio's is not turning away customers.
I get to use my Blockbuster experience again...At once store I worked at, we were right next to a large Spanish-speaking community. Probably a third of our customers spoke zero English, and none of us at the store was good enough at Spanish to help them with anything besides basic stuff.

Does that make me a bigot? Did we deprive them of their civil rights? Did I fail to "serve the community?"

I get the feeling that you've never been in a position where you have to try to serve people who can't speak a lick of you language.

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08-25-2011, 02:45 PM
  #89
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Originally Posted by Sawdalite View Post
Was this Blockbuster in Montreal?
It was in Richmond, Virginia.

It should be pointed out that Philadelphia isn't exactly Montreal, either. It isn't a pocket of people who speak a different language from the rest of the country.

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08-25-2011, 02:45 PM
  #90
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Originally Posted by Sawdalite View Post
That does not deny civil rights.
Dude, it's not about civil rights. It's about the rights of a private business owner not being totally submarined by civil rights. If every business had to operate in accordance to civil rights from the scope you've perceived, everything would essentially be government run. That's kind of not America's thing.

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08-25-2011, 02:46 PM
  #91
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Originally Posted by JVR21 View Post
He didn't take away anybody's civil rights. End of story.
Make that as a sign with an Eagle on it and you are in business.

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08-25-2011, 02:46 PM
  #92
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Originally Posted by Sawdalite View Post
That does not deny civil rights.
But to the people who cannot afford such luxuries as shirts and shoes, it does.

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08-25-2011, 02:48 PM
  #93
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Originally Posted by Sawdalite View Post
Make that as a sign with an Eagle on it and you are in business.
Did you mean to post this?


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08-25-2011, 02:48 PM
  #94
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jester
"Learn English" is not bigotry. Anyone can learn
On it's own, no it's not, but I think most of the times that phrase is said there's quite a lot more there.

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Old
08-25-2011, 02:48 PM
  #95
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Originally Posted by RevUpThoseFlyers View Post
You are missing the point completely.

Asking someone to speak in a language you understand is NOT taking away any civil rights.
The asking is not... refusing to work with them and do business with them is.

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08-25-2011, 02:50 PM
  #96
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Originally Posted by Sawdalite View Post
The asking is not... refusing to work with them and do business with them is.
Dude, whod theu smodd dofofm fjfkffso sosdo?






Answer my question or you are a bigot!

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08-25-2011, 02:51 PM
  #97
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Originally Posted by Sawdalite View Post
The asking is not... refusing to work with them and do business with them is.
I said this before and I'll say it again, Geno's has never refused a customer service because of they didn't speak english.

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08-25-2011, 02:53 PM
  #98
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Vento was essentially an "agent of intolerance." He didn't do anything wrong from a "legal" perspective and he was within his rights to request that his patrons order in English however his underlying intolerance was a form of bigotry. The Jewish perspective under the Nazis while an extreme example offers some historical perspective in the dangers of intolerance. Oftentimes, it metastasizes into more which includes violence. Once you dehumanize people it makes it easier to kill them.

Also consider the nativist movement in the US and some of its current manefestations that will remain nameless. Furthermore, the innuendo that all those unable to order a cheesteak in English are illegals and most likely mexicans at that is also a slippery slope...

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08-25-2011, 02:54 PM
  #99
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Originally Posted by John Wayne View Post
He has absolutely no responsibility to serve the community. He sells steaks. The "migrant workers" who speak Spanish weren't there when Geno's opened up, so why is it his responsibility to cater to them? You learn the common language of the country you're moving to, not force everyone else to learn yours. It's not racism, it's not bigotry, it's common sense.

What he should've done was anytime someone comes up speaking something the order takers can't understand, just give them a plain roll and a spoon.

To take it further, why does automated phone lines only have English and Spanish as options? That alienates and offends everyone who doesn't speak those?
Yes, that is exactly what he should have done... ****ing embarrass them.

With that I'm done.

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Old
08-25-2011, 02:55 PM
  #100
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Originally Posted by JVR21 View Post
Dude, whod theu smodd dofofm fjfkffso sosdo?






Answer my question or you are a bigot!


Yes, I did steal the cabbage and turned it into a time machine. Google translate rules!!

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