I could see you thinking it was a favor and a strategy to drive-up the price for Martin...but the statement was never made publicly until after he had already signed elsewhere, so that kinda shoots a hole in that theory
I said, "Agents do this all the time to drive up their free agents price and by showing interest."
This was a case of showing of showing interest and doing a favor, not using us to drive Martin's price up.
You can believe Snow all you want. He's a great soldier.
You are so F***ing cynical its quite infuriating. No matter what anyone says there is something negitive to be pulled out right? I have yet to see any post that isnt S***ing on this team. If you have nothing to serious to add to the conversation go someplace else. I for one am tired of hearing it. Not everything is a conspiracy or ineptitude so take off the tin foil hat. Just because you dont have all the facts dont assume you know what is going on behind closed doors.
Yes Snow suggested the seeding idea. Yes it works in the DEL. Do you really have a problem with someone suggesting in a brainstorming meeting, how the NHL can increase its marketabilty and Revenue. You are overreating and reaching for ways to drag everyone through the mud.
Where is Isles guy(or whatever hes calling himself nowadays) when you need him. Snow/Wang have shown a willingness to spend on players they deam worthy. Offers to Martin, Hamhius, Michaleck(sp?), Volchenckov, Kovolchuk, Erlhoff, etc. Snow is trageting those guys that will help the rebuld while not at the expence of the youth. Like it or not, it is clear that snow is sticking to his plan.
Yes the rebuld has been long, but im open to seeing it through before I condem it.
Toughen up, it is just hockey and you do not dictate anything here. I have praised Snow for Montoya, Grabs, MM, Striet. I really do not care what happens in the DEL and fans ACROSS the boards bashed Snow for this stupid idea. Wang and Snow have not accomplished a thing, and in case you did not notice he wants to stay at cap floor. For the most part Snow's plan is to lay it all on the kids. It will not work.
I know you guys are trying to say "The proof is in the pudding" when it comes to the payroll floor, but that still does not mean that Snow doesn't have a green light to spend. It still does not mean we're being lied to.
You are free to not believe what you want. I See quite a bit of evidence to suggest he's throwing a thin veil of smoke over Wang's holding the team back. DP's situation being coddled, lots of talk about free agents but never enough to go even 5 mill over the cap, letting folks like Jankowski go from an important post THEN not hiring someone else but giving the added responsibility to the GM... Steve has outlined more than a few. How many pieces of evidence do you (and others) need Chapin?
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The team HAS spent to keep personnel here - some for a long team. The team HAS attempted to spend to land several very high profile RFA or UFAs.
They have spent enough to stay at the floor, and not much more. I want to be able to believe it is all out of shrewdness. I really do, but some of the cheapness, like even the radio station baloney... it's being cheap on a minor league level.
Quote:
And if I'm running a business that has serious profability problems, I do not spend more than I have to. Until I have the necessary building to profit from, I wouldn't spend more than I had to either.
YES. That is my exact point. If they actually told the flippin' truth about it many people you see being unhappy here stop being unhappy. It is called respecting your fan base enough to be honest with them. Seriously, who wouldn't understand where they are coming from?
Quote:
This said, saying we're being lied to with respect hereto is nothing more than conjecture. And I find it to be a lousy cop out to critical of a management.
And I would counter that it is more than just conjecture for you to keep looking at the positive possible reasons as to why they do most everything on the cheap now.
BTW, nothing lousy about adding up the evidence and asking, "Why?" There is an old saying, "follow the money." It is rarely wrong. When I follow the money on this all roads lead to Charles going the cheap route until he either gets a deal by the end of the lease, or, he sells the club to another group outside the area which having a really cheap young team full of first round picks who are good is a fantastic incentive for a prospective buyer of an NHL club. If you think that's lousy, so be it. I think it is pretty much right on the money, literally.
His name is ben hankinson, here is his email. Ben.Hankinson@octagon.com
email him, then pm me when you get a response and I can email you what he sent to me.
Chris Botta himself doubted Snow on this one as well.
Meaning Botta or Hankinson was a liar.
I believe Botta afetr I read the carefully worded response from Hankinson.
Agents do this all the time to drive up their free agents price and by showing interest. This was a favor.
Call me a liar any which friggen way you want to, I could care less.
I am of the same mindset. I don't think most of them got real offers. Doesn't matter. The salary is at the floor which pretty much tells the story.
I am of the same mindset. I don't think most of them got real offers. Doesn't matter. The salary is at the floor which pretty much tells the story.
Ill ask again... why spend more money on a team you know is going to be bad regardless? I wouldnt... Like I said before, if the team becomes good and they still refuse to spend money then thats a problem
Ill ask again... why spend more money on a team you know is going to be bad regardless? I wouldnt... Like I said before, if the team becomes good and they still refuse to spend money then thats a problem
Two things:
Because the defense has a big enough hole that it is causing issues for the offense which is home to quite a few good young prospects. Do I really need to flesh this one out? PAP f'ing up all sorts of plays on the first line underscores this well. There is no way that this kid is the best option out of all avenues for a wing for John. I've played enough and watched enough to know a flawed placeholder being pawned off to save a buck when I see one.
Also, why lie to a fan base that understands you have financial problems?
They lie to us like we are 4 year olds who can't handle the truth. So while we support them against the idiot politicians they repay our thanks by not being up front and honest. Honesty is free N.E., it doesn't cost you anything, though lies can cost you all sorts of things, starting with your class & character...
You are free to not believe what you want. I See quite a bit of evidence to suggest he's throwing a thin veil of smoke over Wang's holding the team back. DP's situation being coddled, lots of talk about free agents but never enough to go even 5 mill over the cap, letting folks like Jankowski go from an important post THEN not hiring someone else but giving the added responsibility to the GM... Steve has outlined more than a few. How many pieces of evidence do you (and others) need Chapin?
They have spent enough to stay at the floor, and not much more. I want to be able to believe it is all out of shrewdness. I really do, but some of the cheapness, like even the radio station baloney... it's being cheap on a minor league level.
YES. That is my exact point. If they actually told the flippin' truth about it many people you see being unhappy here stop being unhappy. It is called respecting your fan base enough to be honest with them. Seriously, who wouldn't understand where they are coming from?
And I would counter that it is more than just conjecture for you to keep looking at the positive possible reasons as to why they do most everything on the cheap now.
BTW, nothing lousy about adding up the evidence and asking, "Why?" There is an old saying, "follow the money." It is rarely wrong. When I follow the money on this all roads lead to Charles going the cheap route until he either gets a deal by the end of the lease, or, he sells the club to another group outside the area which having a really cheap young team full of first round picks who are good is a fantastic incentive for a prospective buyer of an NHL club. If you think that's lousy, so be it. I think it is pretty much right on the money, literally.
Wang spends. Promos, event giveaways, an IKEA lockerroom, the Dad games (which I APPLAUD him for) and all extraneous stuff, but it's a pittance compared to what he should have been spending to fill the barn with fans.
A good GM in 2001 or 2002, HELP for Yashin, better talent throughout the years, GOOD coaches, non family staff leadership (a respected team President).
Whatever.....he runs it minor league and says he wishes he never bought it. Kinda like the guy I know who decided to restore his classic car himself on the cheap and cries about the results.
Ill ask again... why spend more money on a team you know is going to be bad regardless? I wouldnt... Like I said before, if the team becomes good and they still refuse to spend money then thats a problem
Why is the team bad with money for better players, a top level coach and GM, a superb scouting staff and a product fans know will be competitive?
Oh yeah, it's the building's fault no one ran to Milbury or the shambled mess since.
Why is the team bad with money for better players, a top level coach and GM, a superb scouting staff and a product fans know will be competitive?
Oh yeah, it's the building's fault no one ran to Milbury or the shambled mess since.
please, the team needed to be gutted, they gutted it. The scouting staff has done pretty well Id say, Snow hasnt done a bad job IMO, coaching they could do better and as for players theyre signing the good players they do have to long term deals and I have no reason to believe they arent at least trying to sign players at this point in time.
I do believe that the arena at least has SOME role to play in our inability to bring in marquee players. and Milbury sucked...big time
Whatever.....he runs it minor league and says he wishes he never bought it. Kinda like the guy I know who decided to restore his classic car himself on the cheap and cries about the results.
At least the guy who bought the classic car wanted the classic car. Wang bought the club for the land deal. That in and of itself doesn't kill me, but what does is that once he realizes his dream is dead he shows his real colors by letting a good young team perish from lack of funding. But when he needs something it is "Islander fans come help me! I saved your team, I saved your team!!!!" Then when the team needs him it is "I'm sorry but I'm so poor I can't even pay attention.. Tavares who? What? Do I even know you?"
Ill ask again... why spend more money on a team you know is going to be bad regardless? I wouldnt... Like I said before, if the team becomes good and they still refuse to spend money then thats a problem
Wow.... How about for the reason of trying to improve it, by bringing in proven players? If you really think the kids are going to become a contender on their own you are dreaming.
Because the defense has a big enough hole that it is causing issues for the offense which is home to quite a few good young prospects. Do I really need to flesh this one out? PAP f'ing up all sorts of plays on the first line underscores this well. There is no way that this kid is the best option out of all avenues for a wing for John. I've played enough and watched enough to know a flawed placeholder being pawned off to save a buck when I see one.
Also, why lie to a fan base that understands you have financial problems?
They lie to us like we are 4 year olds who can't handle the truth. So while we support them against the idiot politicians they repay our thanks by not being up front and honest. Honesty is free N.E., it doesn't cost you anything, though lies can cost you all sorts of things, starting with your class & character...
Character? A lot of this fan base has none. It is just excuse after excuse trying to justify failure. Some even thinking Snow begging for that extra opportunity to get into the playoffs is OK. There is no pride at all. Losers look for that extra help.
please, the team needed to be gutted, they gutted it. The scouting staff has done pretty well Id say, Snow hasnt done a bad job IMO, coaching they could do better and as for players theyre signing the good players they do have to long term deals and I have no reason to believe they arent at least trying to sign players at this point in time.
I do believe that the arena at least has SOME role to play in our inability to bring in marquee players. and Milbury sucked...big time
Milbury - Wang
Arena - BS
Snow - he's tried
Wang - epic failure owner
So what do you say the prospect of winning plays as a role to players staying or signing here the past decade? What confidence in the team becoming successful do you think someone had in, say, 2003? 2007? 2009? 2012?
The team drew BEST when NOLAN was coach and SMITH was GM. Not great but better than any year over nearly two decades. They were both winners. Jack Adams and Stanley Cup.
Lavy was an upstart. Stirling an upstart. Gordon an upstart. Cappy an upstart. Some win, some lose but none sell winning unless they win. We had some hope with Lavy until the suicidal move BY THE TEAM (I firmly believe Wang thus Milbury had a say in using an exciting new system based on aggressive offense). We had some hope with a successful AHL coach in Stirling until he proved fruitless and Milbury further degraded the 2001 squad. Gordon was doomed to start (implement a system with bad D before you have the speed and offense to carry it out - pretend you're the 1985 Oilers!). Cappy is.....what Goring was and Bowness and to a lesser degree Henning were.
Nolan was a statement that the Isles would play the NHL game as best they could. Though I could have seen a better handling, Smith and Nolan were the right hires. Players noticed. What Wang did in 40 days would kill the image they regained in no time.
But that's not important.
Snow now is doing right in many aspects of the job, and the team will win more and look better.
Now what's important is.....will Wang let Snow's work get and/or remain successful?
If it does and the image rises again, and players are drawn to success, can we still blame the building?
Now as for the team needing to be gutted? In 2001, no. 2003? No. Nolan's team? Certainly not. We needed some talent to reach the playoffs. We needed a hands off owner but could not get that until the backlash from Nolangate made Wang look like an uncontrollable ****head to most of the fans.
But Snow could not resign Smith and gambled with the Yashin buyout to land Smith. His inability to sell the team to Smith and others led to the destruction of any playoff aspirations and the beginning of the rebuild.
Would a better GM have gotten Smith and others to get us back into the postseason? Who knows.....
Thankfully Snow's improved a ton since those days, but regardless, we did not need to gut that team. We were cornered into it.
Wow.... How about for the reason of trying to improve it, by bringing in proven players? If you really think the kids are going to become a contender on their own you are dreaming.
They can....it just takes a LOT longer and with that, the increased chance of a Bailey or Okposo not hitting their potential is there with no supporting veterans ON THEIR LINE.
Weight sure did help the fourth liners for a bit. And the lockerroom is better for it, yes, but there is Philly and their insistance on kids having the best chance, Chicago and their first chance failure (though the kids got help) and second chance success in rebuilding with vets and Atlanta and Florida who rebuilt with low rent vets and got nowhere. (Florida pulled it together, though)
The Isles will get there even without help or minimal help. Rolston might be a vital, long overdue cog this year......if he doesn't turn into the next step in the Guerin-Weight-Matlock chain. I think he'll contribute quite a bit to helping some kids develop their offensive games better.
Milbury - Wang
Arena - BS
Snow - he's tried
Wang - epic failure owner
So what do you say the prospect of winning plays as a role to players staying or signing here the past decade? What confidence in the team becoming successful do you think someone had in, say, 2003? 2007? 2009? 2012?
The team drew BEST when NOLAN was coach and SMITH was GM. Not great but better than any year over nearly two decades. They were both winners. Jack Adams and Stanley Cup.
Lavy was an upstart. Stirling an upstart. Gordon an upstart. Cappy an upstart. Some win, some lose but none sell winning unless they win. We had some hope with Lavy until the suicidal move BY THE TEAM (I firmly believe Wang thus Milbury had a say in using an exciting new system based on aggressive offense). We had some hope with a successful AHL coach in Stirling until he proved fruitless and Milbury further degraded the 2001 squad. Gordon was doomed to start (implement a system with bad D before you have the speed and offense to carry it out - pretend you're the 1985 Oilers!). Cappy is.....what Goring was and Bowness and to a lesser degree Henning were.
Nolan was a statement that the Isles would play the NHL game as best they could. Though I could have seen a better handling, Smith and Nolan were the right hires. Players noticed. What Wang did in 40 days would kill the image they regained in no time.
But that's not important.
Snow now is doing right in many aspects of the job, and the team will win more and look better.
Now what's important is.....will Wang let Snow's work get and/or remain successful?
If it does and the image rises again, and players are drawn to success, can we still blame the building?
Now as for the team needing to be gutted? In 2001, no. 2003? No. Nolan's team? Certainly not. We needed some talent to reach the playoffs. We needed a hands off owner but could not get that until the backlash from Nolangate made Wang look like an uncontrollable ****head to most of the fans.
But Snow could not resign Smith and gambled with the Yashin buyout to land Smith. His inability to sell the team to Smith and others led to the destruction of any playoff aspirations and the beginning of the rebuild.
Would a better GM have gotten Smith and others to get us back into the postseason? Who knows.....
Thankfully Snow's improved a ton since those days, but regardless, we did not need to gut that team. We were cornered into it.
When Nolan and Smith came in, there was a MAJOR buzz. When Snow came in there was head shaking and laughter. Huge difference.
Toughen up, it is just hockey and you do not dictate anything here. I have praised Snow for Montoya, Grabs, MM, Striet. I really do not care what happens in the DEL and fans ACROSS the boards bashed Snow for this stupid idea. Wang and Snow have not accomplished a thing, and in case you did not notice he wants to stay at cap floor. 
For the most part Snow's plan is to lay it all on the kids. It will not work.
