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2011-12 line up

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Old
09-23-2011, 02:50 PM
  #101
Spongolium*
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Are those numbers from their rookie years?

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09-23-2011, 02:51 PM
  #102
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sa cyred View Post
Eh really? I have thought Bartulis has had a subpar preseason so far while Gustafsson has had a pretty good one. I was talking with Bill Meltzer and he agrees also. To each their own though.
I thought Bartulis has looked better on defense, but Gustafsson has looked better on offense. In this case I picked the better defensive player because that is what I would rather have on the third line. If Kimmo were to get injured or any other top 4 D, which is possible playing in Lavy's system I would call up Gustafsson for those minutes.

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Old
09-23-2011, 03:09 PM
  #103
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Originally Posted by Spongolium View Post
Are those numbers from their rookie years?
Yeah. Should have clarified that perhaps.

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Old
09-23-2011, 03:25 PM
  #104
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Really?
Mike Richards 34
Jeff Carter 42
Claude Giroux 27 (only 42 games though)
JvR 35

That's how many points our previous highly touted rookies has mustered. If Schenn has a 15-15-30 season while holding his own defensively I'll be satisfied. More than that is a bonus for me.
I'm honestly expecting 40-45. The way Simmonds is playing, he'll drag plenty of points out of Brayden. Couturier, Read, Nodl, or Talbot on the other wing certainly won't hurt defensively, which will hopefully lead to more offense. Plus I expect him to grab a couple PP shifts per game, and as long as he's winning faceoffs, he'll accumulate assists like crazy.

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Old
09-23-2011, 03:50 PM
  #105
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Lines:
JVR-Giroux-Voracek
Read-Briere-Jagr
Hartnell-Schenn-Simmonds
Sestito-Talbot-Nodl
Betts

Pronger-Carle
Timo-Coburn
Mes-Bart
Lilja

Bryz (60 games)
Bob (22 games)

Point projections:
Giroux (82+) - with JVR/Jagr/Schenn on PP, I see him as PPG+
Briere (65) - He should be able to flirt with last years numbers
JVR (60) - Replaces Carter with 30-35 goals.
Jagr (60) - Replaces Richie points.
Vorachek (50) - Replaces Leino
Schenn (50+) - Calder finalist
Hartnell (50) - 25/25 (Typical)
Simmonds (40) - 20/20
Read (30)

I think Schenn jumps out of the gate and plays plenty of PP. I personally think he gets the Calder this year with 30 goals.

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Old
09-23-2011, 03:59 PM
  #106
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Originally Posted by flyersfan187 View Post
I thought Bartulis has looked better on defense, but Gustafsson has looked better on offense. In this case I picked the better defensive player because that is what I would rather have on the third line. If Kimmo were to get injured or any other top 4 D, which is possible playing in Lavy's system I would call up Gustafsson for those minutes.
Eh, like I said. I disagree. I think the Gus's offense has kinda been subpar lately. Maybe it is just because he hasnt put up points. That being said, Im actually pretty impressed by Gus's defensive play. Watching him at the beginning of last season, Gus's defensive play was horrible. He would pitch every time he had a chance leaving is partner alone. Now, he has settled down and focused on his defensive play which affected his points quite abit on defense. Bartulis, to me, has always been... average. He is quite hesistent moving the puck and can be prone to some terrible turnovers. On defense he definitely is alittle above average, but nothing outstanding. I would put Gus's and Bartulis's defensive play closer to one another. Bartulis has the edge on the physicalness, but Gus has the edge of positioning (which alot of smaller defenders need).

The Flyers have been playing a Timonen-Gustafsson pairing alot this camp, so it will be interesting if they see that as an option for opening night. Last season Gus had 0 chance of making the team with OD as the solid 6. Now Gus is pretty much fighting for a spot with Lilja and Bartulis.

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Old
09-23-2011, 07:31 PM
  #107
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Spongolium View Post
I don't know where to find the stats, But when Coburn is away from Timonen he is a train wreck.

Also, when Coburn was a young developing defenseman, who do you think he was partnered with lol.
Were the Flyers rebuilding their defense then, or did they have a solid group as they have now?

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Old
09-24-2011, 12:54 AM
  #108
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sa cyred View Post
Eh, like I said. I disagree. I think the Gus's offense has kinda been subpar lately. Maybe it is just because he hasnt put up points. That being said, Im actually pretty impressed by Gus's defensive play. Watching him at the beginning of last season, Gus's defensive play was horrible. He would pitch every time he had a chance leaving is partner alone. Now, he has settled down and focused on his defensive play which affected his points quite abit on defense. Bartulis, to me, has always been... average. He is quite hesistent moving the puck and can be prone to some terrible turnovers. On defense he definitely is alittle above average, but nothing outstanding. I would put Gus's and Bartulis's defensive play closer to one another. Bartulis has the edge on the physicalness, but Gus has the edge of positioning (which alot of smaller defenders need).

The Flyers have been playing a Timonen-Gustafsson pairing alot this camp, so it will be interesting if they see that as an option for opening night. Last season Gus had 0 chance of making the team with OD as the solid 6. Now Gus is pretty much fighting for a spot with Lilja and Bartulis.
Gustafsson starting the season with Kimmo would not make me unhappy. Just because I think Bartulis is the better defensive D doesn't mean I don't think Gustafsson has the potential to be a top 4 D.

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Old
10-02-2011, 06:07 PM
  #109
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bump.

So who does everyone think is making the team, and how will that make the lines turn out to be. Ill just take a stab at what I think.

JVR-Giroux-Jagr
Hartnell-Briere-Voracek
Read-Couturier-Simmonds
Talbot-Betts-Zolnierczyk
Rinaldo

Pronger-Carle
Timonen-Coburn
Meszaros-Lilja
Bartulis

Read and Couturier have played well enough to make the team, and could probably complement each other well. This is of course if Schenn's injury has him out for a week or two. If not Schenn is 3rd C. I like Zolniercyk's speed and defensive capibility on the 4th line, and Rinaldo is a cheaper 13th then Nodl

I think Bartulis makes it over Walker and Gustafsson because he is also another cheap option. Gus will probably benefit more from playing more and important minutes for Adirondak, and Walker is too expensive to be a 7th. Lilja is essential O'Donnel this season.

So post what you think!

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Old
10-02-2011, 06:14 PM
  #110
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CAPGEEK.COM CAP CALCULATOR

FORWARDS
James Van Riemsdyk ($1.654m) / Claude Giroux ($3.750m) / Jaromir Jagr ($3.300m)
Scott Hartnell ($4.200m) / Daniel Briere ($6.500m) / Jakub Voracek ($2.250m)
Matt Read ($0.900m) / Brayden Schenn ($3.110m) / Wayne Simmonds ($1.750m)
Andreas Nodl ($0.845m) / Blair Betts ($0.700m) / Maxime Talbot ($1.750m)
Zac Rinaldo ($0.544m)

DEFENSEMEN
Chris Pronger ($4.921m) / Matt Carle ($3.437m)
Kimmo Timonen ($6.333m) / Braydon Coburn ($3.200m)
Andrej Meszaros ($4.000m) / Andreas Lilja ($0.737m)
Oskars Bartulis ($0.600m)

GOALTENDERS
Ilya Bryzgalov ($5.666m) / Sergei Bobrovsky ($1.750m)

CARRY-OVER BONUS PENALTY: $1,402,500

CAPGEEK.COM TOTALS (follow @capgeek on Twitter)
(these totals are compiled without the bonus cushion)
SALARY CAP: $64,300,000; CAP PAYROLL: $63,302,539; BONUSES: $3,815,000
CAP SPACE (22-man roster): $997,461

If Schenn is injured for the start of the season. I can see them keeping Couturier up for 9 games until he returns.

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Old
10-02-2011, 06:28 PM
  #111
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Having your wish list does not mean Couturier won't make it.
To not include him in your cap calculations is obviously omitting part of the reality.

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Old
10-02-2011, 06:40 PM
  #112
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CerpinTaxt View Post
bump.

So who does everyone think is making the team, and how will that make the lines turn out to be. Ill just take a stab at what I think.

JVR-Giroux-Jagr
Hartnell-Briere-Voracek
Read-Couturier-Simmonds
Talbot-Betts-Zolnierczyk
Rinaldo

Pronger-Carle
Timonen-Coburn
Meszaros-Lilja
Bartulis

Read and Couturier have played well enough to make the team, and could probably complement each other well. This is of course if Schenn's injury has him out for a week or two. If not Schenn is 3rd C. I like Zolniercyk's speed and defensive capibility on the 4th line, and Rinaldo is a cheaper 13th then Nodl

I think Bartulis makes it over Walker and Gustafsson because he is also another cheap option. Gus will probably benefit more from playing more and important minutes for Adirondak, and Walker is too expensive to be a 7th. Lilja is essential O'Donnel this season.

So post what you think!
I agree with this. Exactly this

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Old
10-02-2011, 08:26 PM
  #113
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You guys think couturier will get a 9 game tryout? Awesome news. I thought he was a steal at 8th and I hope he turns out great for you folk.

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Old
10-02-2011, 11:03 PM
  #114
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The forwards are confusing as hell. Seems like there are too many guys that are almost good enough (Zolny, Nodl, Betts, Sestito, Rinaldo, Testwuide, etc.) How do they fit Schenn and Couturier on the team at the same time and still keep Betts at 4th line center - Couturier doesn't fit on the wing on the top 3 - he would have to bump out Read I guess. ****, I don't know...

I bolded everybody I think will play on Thursday. No Nodl, Zolnything, etc.

JVR-Giroux-Jagr
Hartnell-Briere-Voracek
Read-Schenn/Couturier-Simmonds
Talbot-Betts-Rinaldo

Pronger-Carle
Timonen-Coburn
Meszaros-Walker

Lilja (why the hell did they sign this guy...)
Bartulis

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Old
10-03-2011, 01:23 AM
  #115
sobrien
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CAPGEEK.COM CAP CALCULATOR

FORWARDS
Scott Hartnell ($4.200m) / Daniel Briere ($6.500m) / Jakub Voracek ($2.250m)
James Van Riemsdyk ($1.654m) / Claude Giroux ($3.750m) / Jaromir Jagr ($3.300m)
Sean Couturier ($1.375m) / Brayden Schenn ($3.110m) / Wayne Simmonds ($1.750m)
Maxime Talbot ($1.750m) / Blair Betts ($0.700m) / Matt Read ($0.900m)
Zac Rinaldo ($0.544m)

DEFENSEMEN
Kimmo Timonen ($6.333m) / Chris Pronger ($4.921m)
Andrej Meszaros ($4.000m) / Matt Carle ($3.437m)
Braydon Coburn ($3.200m) / Oskars Bartulis ($0.600m)
Andreas Lilja ($0.737m)

GOALTENDERS
Ilya Bryzgalov ($5.666m) / Sergei Bobrovsky ($1.750m)

CARRY-OVER BONUS PENALTY: $1,402,500

CAPGEEK.COM TOTALS (follow @capgeek on Twitter)
(these totals are compiled without the bonus cushion)
SALARY CAP: $64,300,000; CAP PAYROLL: $63,832,539; BONUSES: $4,265,000
CAP SPACE (22-man roster): $467,461

Someone tell me what I'm missing...it seemed too easy to build a solid lineup under the cap with Schenn, Couturier, AND Read...Shelley obviously but everyone is writing him off.

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Old
10-03-2011, 02:11 AM
  #116
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sobrien View Post
CAPGEEK.COM CAP CALCULATOR

FORWARDS
Scott Hartnell ($4.200m) / Daniel Briere ($6.500m) / Jakub Voracek ($2.250m)
James Van Riemsdyk ($1.654m) / Claude Giroux ($3.750m) / Jaromir Jagr ($3.300m)
Sean Couturier ($1.375m) / Brayden Schenn ($3.110m) / Wayne Simmonds ($1.750m)
Maxime Talbot ($1.750m) / Blair Betts ($0.700m) / Matt Read ($0.900m)
Zac Rinaldo ($0.544m)

DEFENSEMEN
Kimmo Timonen ($6.333m) / Chris Pronger ($4.921m)
Andrej Meszaros ($4.000m) / Matt Carle ($3.437m)
Braydon Coburn ($3.200m) / Oskars Bartulis ($0.600m)
Andreas Lilja ($0.737m)

GOALTENDERS
Ilya Bryzgalov ($5.666m) / Sergei Bobrovsky ($1.750m)

CARRY-OVER BONUS PENALTY: $1,402,500

CAPGEEK.COM TOTALS (follow @capgeek on Twitter)
(these totals are compiled without the bonus cushion)
SALARY CAP: $64,300,000; CAP PAYROLL: $63,832,539; BONUSES: $4,265,000
CAP SPACE (22-man roster): $467,461

Someone tell me what I'm missing...it seemed too easy to build a solid lineup under the cap with Schenn, Couturier, AND Read...Shelley obviously but everyone is writing him off.
There are ways to fit all three in. While I and most others want Shelley in the AHL or gone all together, I do not think the Flyers feel the same way. The following allows for all 3 and Shelley, but involves waving Betts.

CAPGEEK.COM CAP CALCULATOR

FORWARDS
Scott Hartnell ($4.200m) / Daniel Briere ($6.500m) / Wayne Simmonds ($1.750m)
Matt Read ($0.900m) / Claude Giroux ($3.750m) / Jaromir Jagr ($3.300m)
James Van Riemsdyk ($1.654m) / Brayden Schenn ($3.110m) / Jakub Voracek ($2.250m)
Maxime Talbot ($1.750m) / Sean Couturier ($1.375m) / Zac Rinaldo ($0.544m)
Jody Shelley ($1.100m)

DEFENSEMEN
Kimmo Timonen ($6.333m) / Chris Pronger ($4.921m)
Andrej Meszaros ($4.000m) / Matt Carle ($3.437m)
Braydon Coburn ($3.200m) / Andreas Lilja ($0.737m)
Oskars Bartulis ($0.600m)

GOALTENDERS
Ilya Bryzgalov ($5.666m) / Sergei Bobrovsky ($1.750m)

CARRY-OVER BONUS PENALTY: $1,402,500

CAPGEEK.COM TOTALS (follow @capgeek on Twitter)
(these totals are compiled without the bonus cushion)
SALARY CAP: $64,300,000; CAP PAYROLL: $64,232,539; BONUSES: $4,265,000
CAP SPACE (22-man roster): $67,461

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Old
10-03-2011, 02:21 AM
  #117
sobrien
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BillDineen View Post
There are ways to fit all three in. While I and most others want Shelley in the AHL or gone all together, I do not think the Flyers feel the same way. The following allows for all 3 and Shelley, but involves waving Betts.

CAPGEEK.COM CAP CALCULATOR

FORWARDS
Scott Hartnell ($4.200m) / Daniel Briere ($6.500m) / Wayne Simmonds ($1.750m)
Matt Read ($0.900m) / Claude Giroux ($3.750m) / Jaromir Jagr ($3.300m)
James Van Riemsdyk ($1.654m) / Brayden Schenn ($3.110m) / Jakub Voracek ($2.250m)
Maxime Talbot ($1.750m) / Sean Couturier ($1.375m) / Zac Rinaldo ($0.544m)
Jody Shelley ($1.100m)

DEFENSEMEN
Kimmo Timonen ($6.333m) / Chris Pronger ($4.921m)
Andrej Meszaros ($4.000m) / Matt Carle ($3.437m)
Braydon Coburn ($3.200m) / Andreas Lilja ($0.737m)
Oskars Bartulis ($0.600m)

GOALTENDERS
Ilya Bryzgalov ($5.666m) / Sergei Bobrovsky ($1.750m)

CARRY-OVER BONUS PENALTY: $1,402,500

CAPGEEK.COM TOTALS (follow @capgeek on Twitter)
(these totals are compiled without the bonus cushion)
SALARY CAP: $64,300,000; CAP PAYROLL: $64,232,539; BONUSES: $4,265,000
CAP SPACE (22-man roster): $67,461
Thats WAY too close to the cap for comfort, and I'm not sure Couturier would get regular season 4th line duties, even though he got them in the preseason. But at this point I don't know.

One of the beat writers had mentioned that Laperriere MUST be on the opening roster for him to be LTIR eligible (we can dump his contract to LTIR after the first game), does anyone know if this is true? If so, that throws another wrench in my ideas. I guess I'd send Read down (for 1 game) and play Rinaldo, and only dress 12 forwards.

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Old
10-03-2011, 02:33 AM
  #118
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sobrien View Post
Thats WAY too close to the cap for comfort, and I'm not sure Couturier would get regular season 4th line duties, even though he got them in the preseason. But at this point I don't know.

One of the beat writers had mentioned that Laperriere MUST be on the opening roster for him to be LTIR eligible (we can dump his contract to LTIR after the first game), does anyone know if this is true? If so, that throws another wrench in my ideas. I guess I'd send Read down (for 1 game) and play Rinaldo, and only dress 12 forwards.
As I understand it, Lappy has to be on the Wed 3pm roster, but then he is put of LTIR on Thursday and subsequent moves can be made such that he does not affect the opening night roster.

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10-03-2011, 03:05 AM
  #119
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As I understand it, Lappy has to be on the Wed 3pm roster, but then he is put of LTIR on Thursday and subsequent moves can be made such that he does not affect the opening night roster.
So long as Schenn's $3.1M cap hit is not on that initial roster, it should not really matter precisely when Lappy goes on LTIR, so long as it is before face-off Opening Night.

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10-03-2011, 04:10 AM
  #120
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Exactly what he said ^

They are going to place Schenn in the minors for the first game while he is "rehabbing" his injured shoulder, Drop Lappy on IR then bring Schenn back up. I would put my house on it.

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10-03-2011, 04:15 AM
  #121
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Then there's the Elephant in the Room Shelley! Why do all the beat writers I talk to on Twitter expect him to be part of the team?

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Old
10-03-2011, 07:52 AM
  #122
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Originally Posted by phillyfanatic View Post


I think Schenn jumps out of the gate and plays plenty of PP. I personally think he gets the Calder this year with 30 goals.
You don't understand, Flyers NEVER win Calder trophies.

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10-03-2011, 08:48 AM
  #123
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You don't understand, Flyers NEVER win Calder trophies.
C'mo, Couturier, Read and Schenn will finish 1,2,3 in the voting. The only question is the order!

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Old
10-03-2011, 12:05 PM
  #124
CerpinTaxt
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Originally Posted by sobrien View Post
Thats WAY too close to the cap for comfort, and I'm not sure Couturier would get regular season 4th line duties, even though he got them in the preseason. But at this point I don't know.

One of the beat writers had mentioned that Laperriere MUST be on the opening roster for him to be LTIR eligible (we can dump his contract to LTIR after the first game), does anyone know if this is true? If so, that throws another wrench in my ideas. I guess I'd send Read down (for 1 game) and play Rinaldo, and only dress 12 forwards.
Pretty sure Read is not waiver-free elgible, but I'm not entirely positive. Read throws an interesting wrench into the lineup. Would he benefit more, and as a result the team benefit more, if he played in the second line? He'd have more offensive responsibilities with less defensive ones. That means you either slot Hartnell, or Voracek on the 3rd line, but neither is outstanding and defense either.

Read on the lineup basically means that our 4th line will be getting top defenseive priorities, unless management believes that Schenn and Simmonds are adequate enough for that job. It will be interesting to say the least.

Maybe a line of Nodl-Schenn-Simmonds could be our 3rd line, and Read could be moved to the 4th line? I dont know.

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10-03-2011, 12:19 PM
  #125
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Originally Posted by Spongolium View Post
Exactly what he said ^

They are going to place Schenn in the minors for the first game while he is "rehabbing" his injured shoulder, Drop Lappy on IR then bring Schenn back up. I would put my house on it.
It really depends on the severity of the injury to Schenn. If he's still having trouble shooting, it means a partial separation. He's had minor shoulder trouble in the past, we don't want it to be chronic.

I could see him spending a few weeks in the A, to make sure his shoulder is strong. It would give Couturier a short intro to the NHL before going back to Jr.

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