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Old
09-24-2011, 03:54 PM
  #901
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during the lockout there were two players who were a ppg in the RSL. two.
kovalchuk for all his "god awful struggles" was still 7th in the league in scoring.

you keep talking about how these super stars struggled mightily without recognizing that they most likely didn't exert their 100 percent effort because it was during a lockout season where they didn't want to hurt themselves playing in some overseas league that paled in comparison to the NHL. Additionally, you ignore the fact that a lot of these guys hadn't been playing for quite some time and were undoubtedly shaking off rust and playing in a different league with significantly less icetime than they are accustomed to. You ignore all these factors and cherry pick that their ppg was below one. Guess what everyones was below one.

You ignore that malkin was a ppg when he left the KHL at 19 and would have undoubtedly dominated that league in his prime. You just ignore stats, logic, and reason that disprove your points over and over again.

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09-24-2011, 04:10 PM
  #902
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Originally Posted by VanSciver View Post
I disagree. That has been completely overblown.
He spits his mouthguard into his gloves every 5 seconds to complain to a ref. Proof is in the pudding as homer would say

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09-24-2011, 04:28 PM
  #903
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Originally Posted by OrangeCrush28 View Post
He spits his mouthguard into his gloves every 5 seconds to complain to a ref. Proof is in the pudding as homer would say
Crosby is a Captain. It's part of his responsibilities to talk to the ref. That has been way, way overblown.

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09-24-2011, 04:44 PM
  #904
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Originally Posted by VanSciver View Post
Crosby is a Captain. It's part of his responsibilities to talk to the ref. That has been way, way overblown.
Whenever I see him "talking" to the ref it looks like he wants to cry and is complaining about every little detail... I understand as captain you have to argue calls, but there are ways to do it, and his way digusts me and it seems quite a few other hockey fans.


Other than that crosby is the best hockey player on the planet imo, so I am not just a huge hater.

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09-24-2011, 04:47 PM
  #905
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Quote:
Originally Posted by OrangeCrush28 View Post
Whenever I see him "talking" to the ref it looks like he wants to cry and is complaining about every little detail... I understand as captain you have to argue calls, but there are ways to do it, and his way digusts me and it seems quite a few other hockey fans.


Other than that crosby is the best hockey player on the planet imo, so I am not just a huge hater.
Like I said, it's a bunch of hogwash. Anytime Crosby does anything, quite a few Hockey fans, and a lot of Flyers fans, whine about it. Completely overblown.

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09-24-2011, 04:48 PM
  #906
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Originally Posted by OrangeCrush28 View Post
He spits his mouthguard into his gloves every 5 seconds to complain to a ref. Proof is in the pudding as homer would say
Other teams' fans would say the same thing about Richards. All they're doing is taking advantage of being able to talk to the ref. I'm sorry you don't like it, but it doesn't invalidate the player.

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09-24-2011, 04:51 PM
  #907
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Jagr's going to have a hell of a year. The fact that he scored a goal and an assist last night and said that he still felt rusty and needed to contribute more sounds incredibly good to my ears. I'm loving it. I've always been a big Jagr fan and I could care less about what teams he's played with in the past. Fact is, this is an excellent hockey player who is doing and saying the right things. And there's no reason to believe he can't be a point per game player either. I'll call it right now - Jagr leads the team in scoring this year and playing on a line with JVR and Giroux is just going to re-energize him.

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09-24-2011, 04:55 PM
  #908
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Originally Posted by VanSciver View Post
Like I said, it's a bunch of hogwash. Anytime Crosby does anything, quite a few Hockey fans, and a lot of Flyers fans, whine about it. Completely overblown.
Never "whined" about it, just said the way he does it disgusts me...just an opinion nothing more.

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09-24-2011, 07:58 PM
  #909
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Originally Posted by VanSciver View Post
Like I said, it's a bunch of hogwash. Anytime Crosby does anything, quite a few Hockey fans, and a lot of Flyers fans, whine about it. Completely overblown.
I don't know if anyone saw the interview on TSN with Crosby last night. I lost all the considerable respect I had for him.

He is still blaming Steckel for hitting him when he wasn't looking. The interviewer said that Steckel claimed it was an accident, that Sid ran into him - which is patently obvious if you've ever seen it. Crosby was turning around without looking where he was going.

Crosby said, well he claims that but really, would he have made the same hit if it was Mike Green? You'll have to ask him.

What an idiot. Steckel looked like he strided left to get out of the way and raised his shoulder to protect himself. He more likely thought he was getting a mouthful of helmet.

As far as I'm concerned, I don't care if the whiner ever comes back...

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09-25-2011, 12:14 AM
  #910
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BobbyClarkeFan16 View Post
Jagr's going to have a hell of a year. The fact that he scored a goal and an assist last night and said that he still felt rusty and needed to contribute more sounds incredibly good to my ears. I'm loving it. I've always been a big Jagr fan and I could care less about what teams he's played with in the past. Fact is, this is an excellent hockey player who is doing and saying the right things. And there's no reason to believe he can't be a point per game player either. I'll call it right now - Jagr leads the team in scoring this year and playing on a line with JVR and Giroux is just going to re-energize him.
Well, that should confirm the 60 pt. estimates.

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09-25-2011, 12:15 AM
  #911
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Originally Posted by Larry44 View Post
I don't know if anyone saw the interview on TSN with Crosby last night. I lost all the considerable respect I had for him.

He is still blaming Steckel for hitting him when he wasn't looking. The interviewer said that Steckel claimed it was an accident, that Sid ran into him - which is patently obvious if you've ever seen it. Crosby was turning around without looking where he was going.

Crosby said, well he claims that but really, would he have made the same hit if it was Mike Green? You'll have to ask him.

What an idiot. Steckel looked like he strided left to get out of the way and raised his shoulder to protect himself. He more likely thought he was getting a mouthful of helmet.

As far as I'm concerned, I don't care if the whiner ever comes back...
He's always been a *****.

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09-25-2011, 04:10 AM
  #912
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What a ****** bag.

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09-25-2011, 06:17 AM
  #913
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Can't stand Crosby. Sorry dude, you had a collision and that's the end of it. The bigger question is why did you and your team think it was ok for you to go back on the ice immediately after when it was clear to everyone that you were concussed?

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09-25-2011, 09:14 AM
  #914
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Quote:
Originally Posted by InTentsProductions View Post
during the lockout there were two players who were a ppg in the RSL. two.
kovalchuk for all his "god awful struggles" was still 7th in the league in scoring.

you keep talking about how these super stars struggled mightily without recognizing that they most likely didn't exert their 100 percent effort because it was during a lockout season where they didn't want to hurt themselves playing in some overseas league that paled in comparison to the NHL. Additionally, you ignore the fact that a lot of these guys hadn't been playing for quite some time and were undoubtedly shaking off rust and playing in a different league with significantly less icetime than they are accustomed to. You ignore all these factors and cherry pick that their ppg was below one. Guess what everyones was below one.

You ignore that malkin was a ppg when he left the KHL at 19 and would have undoubtedly dominated that league in his prime. You just ignore stats, logic, and reason that disprove your points over and over again.
First of all those stars played the 20 minutes they are accustomed to, there are game stats to show that. Second of all, if this league was so easy, it wouldn't matter if the players exerted full force, they should have still dominated it.

Jagr for one was PPG that season. He had 39 Pts in 32 games. Or wait, Jagr tried unlike these stars, so that is the only reason why he scored PPG right?

You say the players had to wait a long time to start playing so they were shaking off the rust right? The Russian league started earlier. They only just missed training camp.

Malkin is a curious case here because he did manage to get PPG at 19 but that doesn't guarantee that he would have dominated that league in his prime. Like Kovalchuk, Jagr and Ovechkin he's a big guy. The RSL/ KHL has not been that favorable to bigger players unless they were Marcel Hossa.

What I was trying to show, which I think you're missing the point, was that it doesn't mean if you're just a PPG player in the KHL that you will be below a PPG player in the NHL.

My point was is that they are two completely different games. Even Jagr himself said it. He says they are two games with the same rules but completely different styles.

Jagr said that the KHL employs the trap all the time and the larger ice surfaces means you have to skate more.

If there is one place where Jagr's lack of speed should have affected his game(which has been overblown on here and Jagr himself has said he's a better skater now than 3 years ago) would have been the KHL. Except in the KHL he wasn't "a step behind" every other young Russian there. He was keeping up with them very well.

If there is one thing the Russian players can claim to being the best at is speed. The KHL is all about skating speed. Jagr learned to skate fast again.

Most people that are predicting that Jagr will be under PPG are using the speed factor saying Jagr has lost a step. But has he lost a step? It seems that maybe Jagr has regained a step in speed over his last 3 years in the NHL. (as most have pointed out was that Jagr was slow not only in 2007-08 but in the other 2 post-lockout seasons as well).

What you are also not getting is that Jagr couldn't use his size and strength the way he can in the NHL. Jagr's game is all about puck possession and control around the boards. With his size and strength, in the NHL most couldn't take it off of him unless they used illegal tactics and got called for penalties.

The fact that the KHL had larger ice surfaces meant that Jagr's puck possession game became almost non-existent. So if Jagr still got PPG in the KHL, that means he must have been doing something good, maybe something different.

What you and everyone else will see is a more multifaceted Jagr. Not just a puck possession, cycling player but also someone that can beat you one-on-one.

That multifaceted Jagr resembles more the late 90's Jagr than the New-York Jagr. In Pittsburgh he could beat people with size and strength or with speed.

What never changed with Jagr though is that he has always had the hands, the passing, the vision and the shooting.


Last edited by livewell68: 09-25-2011 at 06:17 PM.
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09-25-2011, 01:48 PM
  #915
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Originally Posted by Jester View Post
Well, that should confirm the 60 pt. estimates.
Based on your expectations right?

It was only preseason, but Jagr got 2 Pts and was controlling the game. If Jagr wasn't happy with that performance, you think he'll be happy with 60 pts.?

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09-25-2011, 04:19 PM
  #916
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Originally Posted by jags6868 View Post
Based on your expectations right?

It was only preseason, but Jagr got 2 Pts and was controlling the game. If Jagr wasn't happy with that performance, you think he'll be happy with 60 pts.?
You should talk to Wolfy.

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09-25-2011, 05:45 PM
  #917
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Originally Posted by Rick Blaine View Post
You should talk to Wolfy.
I've heard a lot about this Wolfy guy. I have also heard that at least the player I like is a future Hall of Famer.

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09-25-2011, 05:50 PM
  #918
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You should talk to Wolfy.
Their ideals are eery similar.

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09-25-2011, 05:56 PM
  #919
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Originally Posted by jags6868 View Post
I've heard a lot about this Wolfy guy. I have also heard that at least the player I like is a future Hall of Famer.
Personally I have to agree with your stance on Jagr. I just think he has that "it" factor that will allow him to excel for years to come.

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09-25-2011, 06:50 PM
  #920
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Originally Posted by RockinRiles View Post
Personally I have to agree with your stance on Jagr. I just think he has that "it" factor that will allow him to excel for years to come.
Didn't you know? He's almost done and won't be able to keep with these superhuman faster, younger, stronger, more skilled NHL players in this new and improved NHL.

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09-25-2011, 07:41 PM
  #921
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This is from : http://espn.go.com/blog/nhl/post/_/i...asnt-a-mistake

Quote:
"I didn't know how hard he trained," GM Paul Holmgren said Sunday. "I don't know if that's a change from early in his career, but he's a fanatic about conditioning, about nutrition, about doing the right thing in preparing to play the game."

The other night in his first preseason action, Jagr scored on a wicked shot, but still wasn't pleased with his play.


"We all thought he had a pretty good game the other night in Detroit and he's hard on himself. He said, 'Ah, it wasn't enough, I've got to better, I got to get quicker,'" Holmgren said. "It's actually pretty refreshing and probably shows you why he's been an elite player for as long as he has been."

Hartnell recalled a backhanded saucer pass Jagr sent him in a recent practice.

"I ended up scoring on it and it was just like, 'Geez, not many people can make those passes.' You kind of think he's been out of the league a few years, maybe he's lost a step or his skill, but obviously he was playing in a good league over in Russia," Hartnell said. "He works so hard in practices, he's up in the gym working out. He wants to prove something to all the doubters out there, and obviously for himself, to have a great season and win a Stanley Cup here in Philly."

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09-25-2011, 08:14 PM
  #922
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Originally Posted by jags6868 View Post
Based on your expectations right?

It was only preseason, but Jagr got 2 Pts and was controlling the game. If Jagr wasn't happy with that performance, you think he'll be happy with 60 pts.?
Yeah, you didn't understand that comment. Seriously, you need to tone down the disturbing man crush.

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09-25-2011, 08:15 PM
  #923
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Here is to hoping he plays tommorow so we can see how he follows up his 2 point night.

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09-26-2011, 06:44 AM
  #924
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Originally Posted by jags6868 View Post
Didn't you know? He's almost done and won't be able to keep with these superhuman faster, younger, stronger, more skilled NHL players in this new and improved NHL.
There isn't a single person who has said that he won't be able to keep up. Pretty much everyone believes Jagr is going to be an effective player for this team. Why are you completely misrepresenting what's being said?

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09-26-2011, 08:25 AM
  #925
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Originally Posted by VanSciver View Post
There isn't a single person who has said that he won't be able to keep up. Pretty much everyone believes Jagr is going to be an effective player for this team. Why are you completely misrepresenting what's being said?
http://hfboards.com/showthread.php?t=944807

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