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2011 Capitals Roster Speculation, Thoughts, & Expectations (Acq./Rost. Bldg./Cap)

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Old
09-26-2011, 11:56 AM
  #76
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That is exactly it your 3rd line Center should not be play on the PP he should play PK good defense and win 60% of his face-offs. He is not suited to play center he like to bang crash the net etc. that’s his bread and butter. If he does that at center he will get caught out of position all the time which will lead to odd man rushes 2/1 and 3/2.
So you are saying there isn't a 3rd line center in the league? Because there isn't one player in the league that matched your criteria. In fact, the player in the league that comes closest is Dave Steckel.

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09-26-2011, 12:14 PM
  #77
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You know, with Vokoun and more of a veteran defense, I'd kind of like to see them go back to the run & gun. It probably won't happen but if the offense slumps in the 'hybrid' then it may be worth considering.
I'm with you. I'm hoping Vokoun is a guy we can hang out to dry from time to time and he'll make the bailout save more often than not.

This team's strength is a fluid uptempo offensive game. Let's get back to it.

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09-26-2011, 01:22 PM
  #78
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So you are saying there isn't a 3rd line center in the league? Because there isn't one player in the league that matched your criteria. In fact, the player in the league that comes closest is Dave Steckel.
Sorry I don't understand what you mean by (So you are saying there isn't a 3rd line center in the league)

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09-26-2011, 01:32 PM
  #79
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That is exactly it your 3rd line Center should not be play on the PP he should play PK good defense and win 60% of his face-offs. He is not suited to play center he like to bang crash the net etc. that’s his bread and butter. If he does that at center he will get caught out of position all the time which will lead to odd man rushes 2/1 and 3/2.
honestly, bud, you dont know what you are talking about.

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09-26-2011, 01:49 PM
  #80
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Sorry I don't understand what you mean by (So you are saying there isn't a 3rd line center in the league)
It's pretty simple. If the definition you provided is what constitutes a proper third-line center, no one in the league is such a player, and therefore there are no real third-line centers in the NHL.

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09-26-2011, 11:11 PM
  #81
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It's pretty simple. If the definition you provided is what constitutes a proper third-line center, no one in the league is such a player, and therefore there are no real third-line centers in the NHL.
Yes there is one not to far away and his name is Halpern. Will see with in 5 games of the season Laich will be playing on the top two lines and Halpern will be the 3rd line center.

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09-27-2011, 04:37 PM
  #82
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I'm not sure if this is the best place to ask this question, but I was curious about the Veteran Minor League Player designation. According to the CBA, a player (skater) can be designated a VMLP once they have played in 320 professional games in North America (NHL, AHL or ECHL). That number is 180 games for goaltenders. The exception to this is if the player/goaltender has been on an NHL roster for more than 80 games over the prior two seasons, or more than 40 in the season immediately prior. Since the language is "games on an NHL roster" and not "games played", it means that games in which the player was on the NHL roster but scratched still count toward the 80/40 number.

My question is whether this still holds true for playoff scratches. For example, when Hershey's season ended and Patrick McNeill was called up to Washington for the second round series against Tampa, do the 4 times that he was one of the Caps healthy scratches count toward the 80/40 number? Or is there an exception made for playoff call-ups? The CBA doesn't address this, so I assume that they do count, but I wanted to get some clarification.

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09-27-2011, 05:32 PM
  #83
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If Ovi came into last year in prime shape I think his numbers go down slightly as the league had better adjusted to him but nowhere near as drastically as they did with him not having that breathtaking jump in his step. Ovi looks to be in great shape and I look for him to adjust his game to counter the league's adjustment to his style. I'm expecting a decent year from him.

I'm still not sure what happened to Backstrom last year. I know it wasn't just because Ovi's numbers decreased. My best guess is that he has/had fat cat syndrome combined with a loss of confidence. I'm expecting a slightly better year from him, but still a down year. With MarJo looking bigger but still blazingly fast I bet Bruce will be quick on the trigger to switch the top-two pivots. This will be Bruce's new "throw Semin on the top line" equivalent.

I don't expect any of the kids to make the roster. While they can look good in preseason, we all know they're great at looking amazing for a few games before tailing off to being a liability on this team.

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09-27-2011, 06:40 PM
  #84
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mcphee described it as a hang over. i thought much the same during last season. ovechkin and backstrom both suffered badly from the combined disappointments of poor national team performance in the olympics combined with the first round embarrassment v montreal.

ovechkin suffered in the spotlight as he took much of the media blame for the russian flameout and the capitals collapse. backstrom's sweden and the caps playoff fall was not as public but very likely just as impactful.

both players didnt respond well to the challenge. either they made poor decisions as to what they needed to change about their approach or they walked away from the game and their off season prep too far and/or too long. its understandable, but it could be shown as a character flaw. they werent the only one's.

you could see it in laich's game. his performance was down. green came to camp convinced that he needed to be a different type of player and the mike green the caps needed to succede really didnt start playing til the playoffs.

i think this is where mcphee has made his biggest error in deciding to go long and keep his young base(carlson, alzner, neuvirth, johansson, holtby and others) in tact rather than go for broke and spend some of that.

his core is cracking under the losing. personally, i think the caps win the stanley cup if there are no olympics. that blew up in the capitals face and created significant doubt among the core players that they were capable of winning on a big stage. these core players are now carrying a heavy load of fail. to me this is bruce's main hurdle to get over. to convince these key guys that they are stanley cup caliber players.

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09-27-2011, 07:06 PM
  #85
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Originally Posted by txpd View Post
mcphee described it as a hang over. i thought much the same during last season. ovechkin and backstrom both suffered badly from the combined disappointments of poor national team performance in the olympics combined with the first round embarrassment v montreal.

ovechkin suffered in the spotlight as he took much of the media blame for the russian flameout and the capitals collapse. backstrom's sweden and the caps playoff fall was not as public but very likely just as impactful.

both players didnt respond well to the challenge. either they made poor decisions as to what they needed to change about their approach or they walked away from the game and their off season prep too far and/or too long. its understandable, but it could be shown as a character flaw. they werent the only one's.

you could see it in laich's game. his performance was down. green came to camp convinced that he needed to be a different type of player and the mike green the caps needed to succede really didnt start playing til the playoffs.

i think this is where mcphee has made his biggest error in deciding to go long and keep his young base(carlson, alzner, neuvirth, johansson, holtby and others) in tact rather than go for broke and spend some of that.

his core is cracking under the losing. personally, i think the caps win the stanley cup if there are no olympics. that blew up in the capitals face and created significant doubt among the core players that they were capable of winning on a big stage. these core players are now carrying a heavy load of fail. to me this is bruce's main hurdle to get over. to convince these key guys that they are stanley cup caliber players.
I think this is spot on. You can see how they just crumbled in the Tampa series when it seemed that the other team had more fight than them. We'll learn pretty quickly how properly focused this team is. I normally don't put too much stock in how well a team starts a season, but given the circumstances the start from this team will tell us quite a bit. Wins and losses will be important, sure, but I'm more interested in how much intensity this team puts forth.

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09-27-2011, 07:21 PM
  #86
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we won't learn quickly. everything i said about this team's lack of confidence in the playoffs is very much the opposite in the regular season. they know they can finish first and even last season as they were struggling and changing their identity, they held that knowledge.

the hurdle is carrying that swagger to the playoffs and finishing.

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Old
09-28-2011, 10:23 AM
  #87
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Originally Posted by OldSchoolCaps84 View Post
I'm not sure if this is the best place to ask this question, but I was curious about the Veteran Minor League Player designation. According to the CBA, a player (skater) can be designated a VMLP once they have played in 320 professional games in North America (NHL, AHL or ECHL). That number is 180 games for goaltenders. The exception to this is if the player/goaltender has been on an NHL roster for more than 80 games over the prior two seasons, or more than 40 in the season immediately prior. Since the language is "games on an NHL roster" and not "games played", it means that games in which the player was on the NHL roster but scratched still count toward the 80/40 number.

My question is whether this still holds true for playoff scratches. For example, when Hershey's season ended and Patrick McNeill was called up to Washington for the second round series against Tampa, do the 4 times that he was one of the Caps healthy scratches count toward the 80/40 number? Or is there an exception made for playoff call-ups? The CBA doesn't address this, so I assume that they do count, but I wanted to get some clarification.
As far as the NHL roster portion of the rule, the 40/80, games on the roster in the playoffs count.

Note, this minor league vet player rule is specific to re-entry waivers and a key component of the rule is it only becomes a factor for players making more than $105,000 at the AHL level. So for McNeill this is not an issue as he hasn't spent anywhere near that amount of time on the NHL roster, but also, McNeill's minor league salary is $105,000 (per capgeek), so re-entry waivers aren't an issue.

Sorry, I might have seen this faster if it was in the salary/cap/contract thread.

I try to run the calculations each year for the players where this might be a factor. Way OT, but a year ago I was wondering if Bourque had spent 40 days on an NHL roster between the Caps and Pens, but my count only hit the 30s so that wasn't a factor in his decision-making a year ago. As to this season, Bourque meets the rule requirements as he has played the 320 and doesn't meet the 40/80 by my count and makes more than $105,000 so he is exempt from re-entry waivers.

Some other players making over $105,000 in the AHL and under NHL contract who are minor league vets and are exempt from re-entry waivers: Aucoin and Richmond (plus Bourque). I never did the games on the roster math for Potulny because he makes $105,000 this season, but he spent a lot of time in '09-10 with Edmonton and has over 70 NHL games played over the 2 seasons. Given the 105,000, there's a chance he had hit the 80 games on an NHL roster and that could explain why his AHL salary is at the 'max' re. this rule compared to others of his type....note, he has a one way contract for the second season of his Caps contract.

Collins is an example of a player who hasn't played in 320 regular season games so he has an $105,000 AHL salary to avoid re-entry waivers (an issue for him last year when he was on a one way NHL contract and by definition made more than $105,000 at the AHL level.)

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09-28-2011, 01:26 PM
  #88
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Yes there is one not to far away and his name is Halpern. Will see with in 5 games of the season Laich will be playing on the top two lines and Halpern will be the 3rd line center.
Halpern is a 35 YO player who's topped at 30 points per season the past few years.

Looking at him in Montreal last season, he was way more often the 4th line centerman than the 3rd line C and with reason.
He can come in and relieve for a short stint on 3rd line, but he is not what this team needs when looking at the future.

This is a team which always looked in the last few years to roll 3 offensive lines.

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09-28-2011, 02:57 PM
  #89
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i think its pretty clear that mcphee has adjusted the roster make up with the idea of changing the use of their 3rd line away from a 3rd scoring line. look at the available wingers.

in past seasons the caps often has players like fleischmann and fehr to skate on the 3rd line. this season the caps have ovechkin and semin for the top two lines. after that they have a list of muscle players, knuble, laich, brouwer, ward, and chimera fighting over the two remaining wing spots on the top two lines and the 3rd line wing spots. there is not a catch and shoot player among those 5.

take any two of them and you cant really build a 3rd scoring line just by adding a perreault like center. i dont see a scenario where the current roster can provide a 3rd scoring line. its built for a more traditional physical/checking 3rd line.

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09-28-2011, 04:14 PM
  #90
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As far as the NHL roster portion of the rule, the 40/80, games on the roster in the playoffs count.

Note, this minor league vet player rule is specific to re-entry waivers and a key component of the rule is it only becomes a factor for players making more than $105,000 at the AHL level. So for McNeill this is not an issue as he hasn't spent anywhere near that amount of time on the NHL roster, but also, McNeill's minor league salary is $105,000 (per capgeek), so re-entry waivers aren't an issue.

Sorry, I might have seen this faster if it was in the salary/cap/contract thread.

I try to run the calculations each year for the players where this might be a factor. Way OT, but a year ago I was wondering if Bourque had spent 40 days on an NHL roster between the Caps and Pens, but my count only hit the 30s so that wasn't a factor in his decision-making a year ago. As to this season, Bourque meets the rule requirements as he has played the 320 and doesn't meet the 40/80 by my count and makes more than $105,000 so he is exempt from re-entry waivers.

Some other players making over $105,000 in the AHL and under NHL contract who are minor league vets and are exempt from re-entry waivers: Aucoin and Richmond (plus Bourque). I never did the games on the roster math for Potulny because he makes $105,000 this season, but he spent a lot of time in '09-10 with Edmonton and has over 70 NHL games played over the 2 seasons. Given the 105,000, there's a chance he had hit the 80 games on an NHL roster and that could explain why his AHL salary is at the 'max' re. this rule compared to others of his type....note, he has a one way contract for the second season of his Caps contract.

Collins is an example of a player who hasn't played in 320 regular season games so he has an $105,000 AHL salary to avoid re-entry waivers (an issue for him last year when he was on a one way NHL contract and by definition made more than $105,000 at the AHL level.)
Sk8- you read my mind as to why I was asking. I was doing some research about who in the system is eligible for re-entry waivers and the only one I could identify was Jay Beagle. Beagle is on a one-way contract and requires normal waivers to be sent down which makes him eligible for re-entry waivers. He would qualify as a VMLP since he has played 320 pro games except that he was on the roster for 52 games last season (by my count, including his 9 playoff scratches) thereby violating the 80/40 rule. Curious as to why the team didn't try to limit his NHL games a bit more last year, though IIRC he was left off of Hershey's clear day roster so he couldn't have been sent down to Hershey just prior to and/or during the playoffs.

In answer to your question on Potulny, I believe he would qualify as a VMLP even if he made more than $105,000 because (by my count) he has been on an NHL roster for only 76 games over the last two seasons, and fewer than 40 games last year (2009-10: 66 games on roster, 64 GP, 2 scratched; 2010-11: 10 games on roster, 10 GP, 0 scratched).

I believe Greentree and Sabourin are the two other players making over $105,000 in the AHL who qualify as VMLPs- correct? I'm unclear about whether Ford and Micflikier would qualify for re-entry waivers (if they made more than $105,000) because they are both on their first NHL contract which (I think) would mean they are exempt from normal waivers for this year [cf. NHL CBA 13.4]. Neither would qualify as a VMLP due to fewer than 320 pro games played.

Thanks for the info- if you don't mind my asking, where were you able to confirm that? Did I miss something in the CBA?

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09-28-2011, 04:29 PM
  #91
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Beagle definitely has to go through waivers and re-entry waivers this year.

Ford and MicFlikier are on first ever NHL contracts and are not subject to waivers, any kind of NHL waivers.

FWIW, for players who haven't spent any time or very small amounts of time on NHL rosters I don't worry about doing the calculations.

As I noted and as you calculated, for Potulny it would have been worth checking had the dollars meant it mattered as it was going to be close on the games on the roster count over the 2 seasons. As it relates to the second year of his Caps contract, it will only matter if he is on the NHL roster a lot since the majority of the games on the NHL roster were not last year, but the previous year.

As to the rule and the playoffs, it was my interpretation based on what is in the CBA, but I confirmed it with someone, as well.

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09-28-2011, 06:40 PM
  #92
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i think its pretty clear that mcphee has adjusted the roster make up with the idea of changing the use of their 3rd line away from a 3rd scoring line. look at the available wingers.

in past seasons the caps often has players like fleischmann and fehr to skate on the 3rd line. this season the caps have ovechkin and semin for the top two lines. after that they have a list of muscle players, knuble, laich, brouwer, ward, and chimera fighting over the two remaining wing spots on the top two lines and the 3rd line wing spots. there is not a catch and shoot player among those 5.

take any two of them and you cant really build a 3rd scoring line just by adding a perreault like center. i dont see a scenario where the current roster can provide a 3rd scoring line. its built for a more traditional physical/checking 3rd line.
If you include Ovechkin,Semin,Backstrom,Johanssen,Knuble on the first 2 lines, the Caps will surely pick one of Laich/Ward/Brouwer for that last spot on the top-6.
It leaves two of Laich/Brouwer/Ward as potential 3rd line wingers.
Both Brouwer and Ward proved in the past they could score 15 goals + on a 3rd line, plus you got Eakin who could play wing.

Yes there is enough scoring left for an offensive 3rd line when you include in a guy like Perreault and I don't think Boudreau will satisfy himself very long with a Halpern type 3rd line Centerman.

Chimera is more of a 4th liner.

The unknown factor is really Sjogren and I believe it weill play between him and Perreault.

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09-28-2011, 07:11 PM
  #93
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Halpern had more even-strength points last season than Brouwer, Ward, Chimera, Hendricks & Johansson. He's a capable 3C option and outside of Laich should be the leading candidate to center a shutdown/checking line.

The problem with the third line in the past is that it wasn't trusted much. It more or less split ES TOI with the more reliable fourth line and that needs to change. The pieces are in place for Boudreau to put together a more reliable two-way third line than in past seasons. Perreault can be a spark plug sort of center in his better games but that's a responsibility level none of the fringe roster candidates should be rushed into. Boudreau may revert to the 3a/3b configuration--strengthening the fourth while diluting the third--but I don't think that's getting the most out of what he has.

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09-28-2011, 09:14 PM
  #94
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Halpern had more even-strength points last season than Brouwer, Ward, Chimera, Hendricks & Johansson. He's a capable 3C option and outside of Laich should be the leading candidate to center a shutdown/checking line.

The problem with the third line in the past is that it wasn't trusted much. It more or less split ES TOI with the more reliable fourth line and that needs to change. The pieces are in place for Boudreau to put together a more reliable two-way third line than in past seasons. Perreault can be a spark plug sort of center in his better games but that's a responsibility level none of the fringe roster candidates should be rushed into. Boudreau may revert to the 3a/3b configuration--strengthening the fourth while diluting the third--but I don't think that's getting the most out of what he has.
So you would prefer a 35 YO career 3rd/4th liner to a 23 YO Perreault or Eakin?

The point is that Halpern is on the end of his NHL career and could help your team if you don't find in your system a player to fill te spot.
But that is not at all the case.

I just don't see Boudreau sticking to a plan where he gets a 3A and a 3B lines.

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09-28-2011, 09:46 PM
  #95
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old players are often better than more skilled young players when it counts the most. thats why aging veterans on their last legs are better nhl players that soon to be allstars in their first couple of seasons.

the capitals have A LOT of young players. til this season, too many, and not enough veteran experience. so, yea they would rather have a 35 year old hometown boy than a rookie.

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09-28-2011, 09:59 PM
  #96
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Eakin isn't ready yet. Perreault may be if he can bring it on a more consistent basis. In Perreault's favor is the lingering question of whether this team is going to score enough goals. That may well favor him as 3C...to begin with anyway.

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09-29-2011, 12:27 AM
  #97
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I thought the only thing we had figured out was our goalies, that was until tonight. Nuevirth injured, Holtby recalled and Vokoun pitching a .852.

I thought Vokoun 1, Nuevirth 2. In my fantasy its Holtby 1 (because he's that good) Vokoun 2. Really, its feeling like Nuevirth 1a, Vokoun 1b (who will be a godsend come playoff time)

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09-29-2011, 11:13 AM
  #98
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I thought the only thing we had figured out was our goalies, that was until tonight. Nuevirth injured, Holtby recalled and Vokoun pitching a .852.

I thought Vokoun 1, Nuevirth 2. In my fantasy its Holtby 1 (because he's that good) Vokoun 2. Really, its feeling like Nuevirth 1a, Vokoun 1b (who will be a godsend come playoff time)
Neuvy said himself the injury is nothing at all of concern its precautionary. Holtby getting more NHL time is never a bad thing. As far as Koun, is it really a big deal considering all the line shuffling and experimenting going on? Its still preseason. I admit Ive never followed hockey as closely as I have the past two seasons but is it really time to panic?

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09-29-2011, 11:18 AM
  #99
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As far as Koun...
Seriously. Don't use that nickname.

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09-29-2011, 11:22 AM
  #100
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Seriously. Don't use that nickname.

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