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Old
09-29-2011, 04:08 PM
  #176
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Originally Posted by DaveT83 View Post
He sure looked good last night ... finally starting to use that big body.
as i said it's over and done and antro used to that, tease us non stop with big hopes and faith and then crush us at the same time lol...although poni did that the most haha

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09-29-2011, 04:10 PM
  #177
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Originally Posted by DaveT83 View Post
Komi has far more value to this team then Lupul - who's making 4.25
Hilarious. a guy who can't really even crack our roster on the basis of strength of play is more important than a top 6 forward who will be on a line with our best player.

yup, sounds logical.

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Unfortunately were just not as deep upfront as we are on D and Lupul's complete lack of production goes unnoticed.
....what?

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09-29-2011, 04:12 PM
  #178
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....what?

he hasnt produced in the pre-season. trade him for a 7th rounder.

and fire bourke.

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Old
09-29-2011, 04:22 PM
  #179
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Originally Posted by Volcanologist View Post
Hilarious. a guy who can't really even crack our roster on the basis of strength of play is more important than a top 6 forward who will be on a line with our best player.

yup, sounds logical.



....what?
Komi is a terrific 7th d-man on just about any team in the NHL
Lupul might not be able to crack the top 2 lines on any other team in NHL
They make basically the same amount of money...
Hence Lupul is in that position by default - not because of performance.

If he was playing 4th line minutes making the same $$$ everyone would be in an uproar similar to Komi. But unfortunately we do not have depth upfront to make this a reality.

A better comparision would be if Joey Crabb was making 4.25million and could barely crack the 4th line. Who's contract would you rather shed?

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Old
09-29-2011, 04:25 PM
  #180
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Originally Posted by PresidentCamacho View Post
2009/2010 - 11th in spending - 29th place finish.

It's very black and white.

We are in for the same story this year.

2011/2012 - 5th in spending - No playoffs.

Are you gonna blame it on Komisarek?
That's it, move on to 2009 when your 2010 argument and "facts" blow up.

This year has happened, we'll make the playoffs and Komi is an asset, I'm not on the bandwagon with you.

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09-29-2011, 04:51 PM
  #181
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Originally Posted by leafsin2011 View Post
That's it, move on to 2009 when your 2010 argument and "facts" blow up.

This year has happened, we'll make the playoffs and Komi is an asset, I'm not on the bandwagon with you.
If you can't acknowledge that the Leafs overspend for the 29th and 21st place finishes, I don't know what to tell you.

Something tells me investments aren't your strong suit.

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09-29-2011, 05:01 PM
  #182
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Originally Posted by PresidentCamacho View Post
If you can't acknowledge that the Leafs overspend for the 29th and 21st place finishes, I don't know what to tell you.

Something tells me investments aren't your strong suit.
How about underachieve? How about goaltending, that's one player on the roster. I haven't seen one person agree with your notion of the 7 or 8 overpaid players. I could tell you why that is but you already know.

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09-29-2011, 05:09 PM
  #183
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Originally Posted by PresidentCamacho View Post
If you can't acknowledge that the Leafs overspend for the 29th and 21st place finishes, I don't know what to tell you.

Something tells me investments aren't your strong suit.
Mess has beaten that horse to death already. Seasons are past, money has been paid out, on to this year.

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Old
09-29-2011, 07:22 PM
  #184
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Originally Posted by Tootoo Train View Post
You mean during pre-season? He was on fire to end the season, and showed great chemistry with Kessel. Lets see what happens when games matter before labeling him like that.
I wouldn't call 18 pts in 28 games, on fire.

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Old
09-29-2011, 07:35 PM
  #185
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Originally Posted by DaveT83 View Post
Komi is a terrific 7th d-man on just about any team in the NHL
Lupul might not be able to crack the top 2 lines on any other team in NHL
They make basically the same amount of money...
Hence Lupul is in that position by default - not because of performance.

If he was playing 4th line minutes making the same $$$ everyone would be in an uproar similar to Komi. But unfortunately we do not have depth upfront to make this a reality.

A better comparision would be if Joey Crabb was making 4.25million and could barely crack the 4th line. Who's contract would you rather shed?


I don't even know how to respond to this.

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Old
09-29-2011, 07:36 PM
  #186
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Originally Posted by DaveT83 View Post
Komi has far more value to this team then Lupul - who's making 4.25
Unfortunately were just not as deep upfront as we are on D and Lupul's complete lack of production goes unnoticed.


Komi is well on his way to many nights being a healthy scratch.

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09-29-2011, 08:20 PM
  #187
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Mess has beaten that horse to death already. Seasons are past, money has been paid out, on to this year.
You're right Moose as the saying does "The truth hurts".

However lets move on to the new season, lets just hope lessons were learned and mistakes not repeated.

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Old
09-29-2011, 08:31 PM
  #188
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Originally Posted by Volcanologist View Post


I don't even know how to respond to this.
He's right. If Lupul was still on Edmonton the discussion would be do we keep Lupul up because he makes 4.25 million or should we keep RNH up who has clearly outplayed him but is so easy to send down.

Lupul has been out right terrible this preseason but no one is noticing for some reason. All eyes are on defense it seems.

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09-29-2011, 08:34 PM
  #189
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Originally Posted by RogerRoeper View Post


Komi is well on his way to many nights being a healthy scratch.
Komi has had a decent preseason but regardless he's been surpassed by others.

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Old
09-29-2011, 08:34 PM
  #190
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Originally Posted by PresidentCamacho View Post
No. They are fat from head to toe.

Last year, the Leafs were entering the season with the 3rd highest payroll spending. The return on that investment was a 21st place finish.

Compare that to a team like Carolina, who were 24th in the league in payroll, yet found themselves higher in the standings than the Leafs.

Quite clearly, we aren't getting the same bang for buck that teams like Tampa, LA, and Carolina are currently experiencing. It's a systemic issue for the Leafs that goes beyond Mike Komisarek. Once again, we are going into the season as one of the top spending teams on players (5th). I wonder what kind of return we will get? Nothing short of playoffs is acceptable for that amount of money being spent.
no. they have one bad contract.

that one bad contract is the difference between us being 5th in payroll and 16th in payroll. Include Tucker's buyout which is obviously wasted money and we're down to 18th.

of course, you're still arguing based on the payrolls and results of last season, when we had a much bigger waste than even Komi's $4.5m contract, and that was Giguere's $6m contract. That was $6m that actually made us worse - it was worse than spending $6m on nothing, it was $6m spent on making us worse. Once we played Reimer ahead of Giggy we were a better team than Carolina, for example.

Of course, your numbers are wrong anyways - last year the Leafs spent the 18th most in the NHL in team payroll (http://www.capgeek.com/archive/index.php?year_id=2010), and that's including some massive wastages on our part.

Last year we had $10.5m completely wasted on 0 or negative value players. (actually $11.5 including Tucker's buyout). We could have chopped our payroll by that $11.5m last year and actually improved our team, and that would have brought out spending down to near the very bottom of the league.

This year we're down to $4.5m wasted. (actually $5.5m including Tucker's buyout)


Last edited by zeke: 09-29-2011 at 08:49 PM.
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Old
09-29-2011, 08:38 PM
  #191
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Originally Posted by Smif View Post
He's right. If Lupul was still on Edmonton the discussion would be do we keep Lupul up because he makes 4.25 million or should we keep RNH up who has clearly outplayed him but is so easy to send down.

Lupul has been out right terrible this preseason but no one is noticing for some reason. All eyes are on defense it seems.
People have noticed. He's just not under the microscope because:
A) expectations are low
B) no immediate competition for his spot
C) yes, competition surrounding the defense plays a part in it aswell.

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09-29-2011, 09:04 PM
  #192
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Originally Posted by Smif View Post
He's right. If Lupul was still on Edmonton the discussion would be do we keep Lupul up because he makes 4.25 million or should we keep RNH up who has clearly outplayed him but is so easy to send down.

Lupul has been out right terrible this preseason but no one is noticing for some reason. All eyes are on defense it seems.
No, he's not right. that post was gibberish.

Lupul is a legit top 6 nhl forward, much more useful than a 4.5 million skill-less slug who can barely crack our top 6 at best.

And seriously? we're making judgements on preseason performance by veteran players? really?

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09-29-2011, 09:32 PM
  #193
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Originally Posted by Volcanologist View Post
No, he's not right. that post was gibberish.

Lupul is a legit top 6 nhl forward, much more useful than a 4.5 million skill-less slug who can barely crack our top 6 at best.

And seriously? we're making judgements on preseason performance by veteran players? really?
I agree, I can't believe how quick some on here are to make comments about a player based on a few pre-season games, it's a joke really....

Pre-season is meant for guys to get their legs going and getting up to speed with decision making etc.

He's not some rook trying to impress for a spot.

Come on people.

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Old
09-29-2011, 09:36 PM
  #194
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Originally Posted by Mess View Post
You're right Moose as the saying does "The truth hurts".

However lets move on to the new season, lets just hope lessons were learned and mistakes not repeated.
It's nice to see you when you pretend to be a forward thinker.

I'm just kidding.

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09-29-2011, 10:12 PM
  #195
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Originally Posted by Mess View Post
You're right Moose as the saying does "The truth hurts".

However lets move on to the new season, lets just hope lessons were learned and mistakes not repeated.
Doesn't hurt me, I understand what was happening.

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Old
09-29-2011, 10:17 PM
  #196
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DaveT83 View Post
Komi has far more value to this team then Lupul - who's making 4.25
Unfortunately were just not as deep upfront as we are on D and Lupul's complete lack of production goes unnoticed.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Volcanologist View Post
Hilarious. a guy who can't really even crack our roster on the basis of strength of play is more important than a top 6 forward who will be on a line with our best player.

yup, sounds logical.

....what?
18 points in 28 games with us last season. That's **** production Volcanologist -- don't be so naive as to think that someone who only gets that many points is contributing in the slightest...

edit: I see my stats have been beaten. Oh well.

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09-29-2011, 10:35 PM
  #197
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Komi doesn't have to live up to his contract, he just has to stop sucking so badly and stop making costly mistakes.

I just think he needs to regain that confidence he once had...wherever it went.

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09-30-2011, 01:05 AM
  #198
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18 points in 28 games with us last season. That's **** production Volcanologist -- don't be so naive as to think that someone who only gets that many points is contributing in the slightest...

edit: I see my stats have been beaten. Oh well.
that extrapolates to over 50 points in a 82 game season. that is decent production for a forward who does all the small things right and makes his linemates better.

if lupul gets 50 points this season we should be ecstatic. he was a throw in with our best d prospect. and we dumped a player playing horribly for us.

but lupul blows, fire bourke.

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Old
09-30-2011, 01:18 AM
  #199
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lupul also had a 9 game bad streak since he was adjusting to the new team.

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Old
09-30-2011, 01:32 AM
  #200
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So now we know that "tried to do too much" is Burke code for "sucked"...
No, I think "tried to do too much" is Burke code for "tried to do too much".

Since when has Brian Burke talked in code?

I think your post about "Burke and codes" is code for "your a hater"

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