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All Injury Talk: Markov to rejoin team at the end of Oct? Ryan White out indefinitely

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Old
10-03-2011, 03:37 PM
  #226
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hototogisu View Post
"On schedule" doesn't mean "ready to start the season".

The only people who had Markov's return date as Oct. 6th were Hab fans, not the organization or the doctors or Markov or anybody else.
Markov himself said he "expected to be ready for camp". That quote was right after he signed his contract.

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10-03-2011, 03:39 PM
  #227
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hototogisu View Post
"On schedule" doesn't mean "ready to start the season".

The only people who had Markov's return date as Oct. 6th were Hab fans, not the organization or the doctors or Markov or anybody else.
Read 417's post.

Guys, there's a thread to discuss the non-suspension. That thread is not this one.

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10-03-2011, 03:40 PM
  #228
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Quote:
Originally Posted by swimmer77 View Post
Markov himself said he "expected to be ready for camp". That quote was right after he signed his contract.
Markov's not a doctor...what he thinks means little in this situation.

Furthermore, he is/was ready for camp...it just looks like he pushed it too hard.

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10-03-2011, 03:45 PM
  #229
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Quote:
Originally Posted by overlords View Post
Read 417's post.

Guys, there's a thread to discuss the non-suspension. That thread is not this one.
Okay then I'm mistaken there, but it still doesn't change the principal of the thing - and we shouldn't counting on Markov to accurately diagnose himself either.

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10-03-2011, 03:51 PM
  #230
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Originally Posted by hototogisu View Post
Okay then I'm mistaken there, but it still doesn't change the principal of the thing - and we shouldn't counting on Markov to accurately diagnose himself either.
No, but we figure that what markov said is what the doctor told him. Bit weird that they'd differ by that much.

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10-03-2011, 03:51 PM
  #231
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 417 View Post
Markov's not a doctor...what he thinks means little in this situation.

Furthermore, he is/was ready for camp...it just looks like he pushed it too hard.
So there is no chance his doctor said that was possible either I suppose?

Markov said Friday that he was pleased with his rehabilitation program and he expects to be “100 per cent” when training camp opens on Sept. 15.

Why did he go out on a limb to say so? I quote a poster who said Markov had no target. It would appear to me he did from that statement.

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10-03-2011, 04:08 PM
  #232
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Originally Posted by overlords View Post
No, but we figure that what markov said is what the doctor told him. Bit weird that they'd differ by that much.
Has anyone thought to ask Dr. Recchi? He's 1/1 in his diagnoses so far...

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10-03-2011, 04:14 PM
  #233
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So is Campou 100%?

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10-03-2011, 04:14 PM
  #234
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Markov will be back when he will be back. You don't let that calibre of player walk away, you just don't, you probably will never replace him. The only guy who can reasonable replace Markov is Markov. He is the type of player you gamble on, period.

I never wanted him gone, even after his second injury and a lot of GMs would have thought the same.

I just think with him out people actually forgot how good he is.

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10-03-2011, 04:31 PM
  #235
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Originally Posted by Andy View Post
Markov will be back when he will be back. You don't let that calibre of player walk away, you just don't, you probably will never replace him. The only guy who can reasonable replace Markov is Markov. He is the type of player you gamble on, period.

I never wanted him gone, even after his second injury and a lot of GMs would have thought the same.

I just think with him out people actually forgot how good he is.
kind of like Malakhov....

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10-03-2011, 04:38 PM
  #236
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Quote:
Originally Posted by swimmer77 View Post
So there is no chance his doctor said that was possible either I suppose?

Markov said Friday that he was pleased with his rehabilitation program and he expects to be “100 per cent” when training camp opens on Sept. 15.

Why did he go out on a limb to say so? I quote a poster who said Markov had no target. It would appear to me he did from that statement.
Not sure where you read that Markov went out on a limb there...that's YOUR interpretation. Nowhere in that quote, if you can even call it that, does Markov say he's going to be back guaranteed.

And regardless, even IF he did...he's no medical doctor, that's not a confirmation from the team or anyone affiliated with the team because a doctor would never guarantee 5-6 months after ACL surgery that a player will be full recoved before the anticipated recovery time, which as i've stated about 100x's on this board...is 12 months.

Again, don't confuse your interpretation of things...with reality.

Edit - another thing...saying you 'expect' to be 100% by training camp, is NOT a guarantee. An expectation, is just that, an expectation. It is not a guarantee.

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10-03-2011, 04:39 PM
  #237
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He'll be back when he's back nobody knows when. relax pepole

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10-03-2011, 04:43 PM
  #238
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hototogisu View Post
"On schedule" doesn't mean "ready to start the season".

The only people who had Markov's return date as Oct. 6th were Hab fans, not the organization or the doctors or Markov or anybody else.
you don't think management expected him to start the season when they offered him the bank?

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10-03-2011, 04:47 PM
  #239
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 417 View Post
Not sure where you read that Markov went out on a limb there...that's YOUR interpretation. Nowhere in that quote, if you can even call it that, does Markov say he's going to be back guaranteed.

And regardless, even IF he did...he's no medical doctor, that's not a confirmation from the team or anyone affiliated with the team because a doctor would never guarantee 5-6 months after ACL surgery that a player will be full recoved before the anticipated recovery time, which as i've stated about 100x's on this board...is 12 months.

Again, don't confuse your interpretation of things...with reality.

Edit - another thing...saying you 'expect' to be 100% by training camp, is NOT a guarantee. An expectation, is just that, an expectation. It is not a guarantee.
I don't think there is any guarantee but don't make it sound like 6 months is not realistic. Granted this link is from the last surgery but it was still ACL surgery. And what about Josh Gorges? IMO you keep back pedaling.

Markov Expected to be Out Six Months

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10-03-2011, 04:53 PM
  #240
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I still believe we did the right thing. In our times, a A+ grade PMD defenseman like Markov for 5.75 is downright robbery, just look at Wiz or Enhroff's contracts.

Its a calculated risk. If he can't be back for sure, wash you hand and use the free cap space elsewhere. If he plays, you got yourself a big discount.

If Markov only comes back in December, we still have a huuge advantage over any other team when it comes to PMD. If he plays 75% of the two other contract years, including playoff performance...

Downright robbery, I tell ya

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10-03-2011, 05:11 PM
  #241
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Originally Posted by PricePkPatch View Post
I still believe we did the right thing. In our times, a A+ grade PMD defenseman like Markov for 5.75 is downright robbery, just look at Wiz or Enhroff's contracts.

Its a calculated risk. If he can't be back for sure, wash you hand and use the free cap space elsewhere. If he plays, you got yourself a big discount.

If Markov only comes back in December, we still have a huuge advantage over any other team when it comes to PMD. If he plays 75% of the two other contract years, including playoff performance...

Downright robbery, I tell ya
A healthy Markov is downright robbery, on the open market he would get more than that if he was 100% healthy. The problem is we don't know how healthy he'll be or if he'll stay healthy. I'm really happy with the contract and I'm hoping we make every other NHL fan eat their words when he kicks ass this season, but it's safe to be a bit apprehensive.

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10-03-2011, 05:18 PM
  #242
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Another thing that is forgotten, and I know it was only 7 games, but Markov didn't look that great prior to his last injury either. The production was okay in a small sample, 3 points, but I remember thinking that he looks to have lost a step. One knee injury later, and the fact he's turning 33, I really doubt we see dominant Markov ever again. So that's not what we are paying for. We're likely going to get, once he comes back, a lesser Markov than we are used to...

This contract was hardly a steal by any stretch of the imagination, and it was a very risky one...

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10-03-2011, 05:25 PM
  #243
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Originally Posted by Mike Lalor View Post
you don't think management expected him to start the season when they offered him the bank?
I wouldn't consider 5.75 mil offering him "the bank". They got him at a 25-30% discount because of his recent injuries. A healthy Markov type d-man gets 7-7.5 mil/year over 3 years.

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10-03-2011, 05:27 PM
  #244
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Originally Posted by hogtownhabsfan View Post
Another thing that is forgotten, and I know it was only 7 games, but Markov didn't look that great prior to his last injury either. The production was okay in a small sample, 3 points, but I remember thinking that he looks to have lost a step. One knee injury later, and the fact he's turning 33, I really doubt we see dominant Markov ever again. So that's not what we are paying for. We're likely going to get, once he comes back, a lesser Markov than we are used to...

This contract was hardly a steal by any stretch of the imagination, and it was a very risky one...
He definitely wasn't his old self but it probably had more to do with not yet being in midseason form having not played in preseason. There is being "in shape" then their is "game shape".

No reason to think he can't be back to 100% once he has 4-5 healthy weeks under his belt. His skating should come back, ACL surgery didn't sklow down Wisniewski.

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10-03-2011, 05:39 PM
  #245
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Originally Posted by hogtownhabsfan View Post
Another thing that is forgotten, and I know it was only 7 games, but Markov didn't look that great prior to his last injury either. The production was okay in a small sample, 3 points, but I remember thinking that he looks to have lost a step. One knee injury later, and the fact he's turning 33, I really doubt we see dominant Markov ever again. So that's not what we are paying for. We're likely going to get, once he comes back, a lesser Markov than we are used to...

This contract was hardly a steal by any stretch of the imagination, and it was a very risky one...
Markov never relied on his footspeed. His skill is all in his head. He was likely just out of practice, which is understandable.

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10-03-2011, 05:48 PM
  #246
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The only thing I care about is whether Markov's on track toward a complete recovery. As long as the team hasn't been sold faulty merchandise, I won't sweat the delivery date.

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10-03-2011, 07:10 PM
  #247
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Originally Posted by swimmer77 View Post
I don't think there is any guarantee but don't make it sound like 6 months is not realistic. Granted this link is from the last surgery but it was still ACL surgery. And what about Josh Gorges? IMO you keep back pedaling.

Markov Expected to be Out Six Months
I'm not sure how clearer I can be here...the recovery for a SECOND ACL SURGERY, is 12 months.

I'm not sure why you pasting a link of his FIRST acl injury...furthermore, Josh Gorges had his FIRST and so far, ONLY ACL surgery. The recovery period for that is shorter than it is when it's the SECOND surgery.

I'm not back tracking on anything...you're just failing to understand a very simple concept here.

6 months recovery after a 2nd ACL surgery, is NOT realistic

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10-03-2011, 07:13 PM
  #248
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Originally Posted by Mike Lalor View Post
you don't think management expected him to start the season when they offered him the bank?
Not necessarily...I don't think it was a pre-requisite. Furthermore, the Montreal Canadiens employ doctors, doctors who they pay very handsomely to look at situations like this to determine whether or not invest money and years into a player like Markov is worth the risk.

They determined it was, whether or not Markov starts the year game 1 or game 10, is really minute in the grand scheme of things.

If Markov's knee is holding up strong in February when the playoff drive starts, I don't think the Habs will care if he missed the first quarter of the season even. The goal is to have him play the majority of the 3 years he signed up for, not game 1 of this season.

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10-03-2011, 07:32 PM
  #249
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Originally Posted by hototogisu View Post
Let's stick to injury updates/discussion, please.
Seriously dude, the mods on HF Boards, well at least the ones in the Habs section (the only one I visit) need to lay off the power trips.

I visit HF boards Habs section quite a bit, I rarely post, but many times I see these comments from mods about staying on topic, etc... and it makes me laugh.

I remember one thread was created for **unconfirmed trade rumours** or something to that affect, and many people were talking about the trade rumours, and of course, how those trades would impact the team. Then a mod starts threatening to freeze the thread because people were discussing how a rumoured trade would affect a specific team, and not talking specifically about the trade itself. I believe it was even stated that the people in question should continue the discussion in another thread. Well, I'm pretty sure that those two topics lead in to one another, and it makes total sense that while discussing trade rumours, you'd eventually discuss how that trade would impact the so called teams involved.

I could give many other examples, but I just find it hilarious how strict the mods are about the topics of discussion. I could understand if HFBoards was some professional forum for scouts and agents only, but as far as I can tell, it's a place for hockey fans. Ease up on the power pills boys.

Stay on topic people, or I'll shut this thread down, don't make me pull the trigger! Really?

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10-03-2011, 07:32 PM
  #250
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Originally Posted by swimmer77 View Post
I don't think there is any guarantee but don't make it sound like 6 months is not realistic. Granted this link is from the last surgery but it was still ACL surgery. And what about Josh Gorges? IMO you keep back pedaling.

Markov Expected to be Out Six Months
Nearly gave me a god damn heart attack dude. Thought he was going to be out ANOTHER 6 months and that you were posting it as new info.

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