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The Legacy of Ken Holland

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Old
07-04-2010, 10:27 AM
  #201
RedWingsNow*
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When Holland took over as GM, he traded like a crack addict.
Now, he's the opposite.

Happy medium, Kenny. Get it done!

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07-04-2010, 10:28 AM
  #202
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Hockeytown93 View Post
if he was our gm starting in 97..who was it prior..sorry i was like 10 and too lazy to look it up..

Was it Brian Murrary or whatever that POS name is?
Calling Brian Murray a POS makes you look worse than what you think of him.

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07-04-2010, 11:46 AM
  #203
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Brian Murray is an excellent drafter. He can really build up an organization and stockpile them with talent in the system. His downfall is that he's a terrible evaluator of NHL players and how they will fit into his team. He may bad signings and his trades aren't all that special. That's why he usually gets replaced once he builds a good core and a GM better at cobbling things together at the NHL level takes over to put the team over the top (Like Burke in Anaheim). Of course, those guys tend to leave the system bare of talent and they draft like drunken sailors trying to hit a dartboard but at least you get a Cup out of it or t least a strong playoff team for a couple years.

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07-08-2010, 07:38 PM
  #204
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To me, Holland's biggest weakness is his refusal to trade roster players and his loyalty to players from the past at the expense of younger players development. Even his trading strategy revolved around waiting till the deadline to pillage the weak teams and give them draft picks for rentals. Now that the cap has caught up with him, he can no longer afford to trade picks for players which leaves him only available to trade roster players, which he refuses to do.

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Old
01-21-2011, 04:28 PM
  #205
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Gotta add Nabokov to the list, even if he's not Wings property tomorrow.

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Old
07-02-2011, 11:08 PM
  #206
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due for an update

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Old
07-03-2011, 10:30 AM
  #207
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well the summer is long so lets say what he can do. Right now its like mentioned on the mainboard a solid ok. White got traded from Toronto, Flames and Sharks so there has to be something wrong with him.

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Old
07-03-2011, 01:41 PM
  #208
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since actions speak louder then words, its safe to say holland publicly stated he had no intention of addressing any of our areas of concern nor replacing rafalski long term.

holland has done exactly what he said he would do and nohting more.

you cant be angry with him

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Old
07-03-2011, 01:48 PM
  #209
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Zetterberg4Captain View Post
since actions speak louder then words, its safe to say holland publicly stated he had no intention of addressing any of our areas of concern nor replacing rafalski long term.

holland has done exactly what he said he would do and nohting more.

you cant be angry with him
Care to elaborate on this, bra?

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Old
10-06-2011, 11:05 AM
  #210
FissionFire
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Updated. Let me know if I missed anything.

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Old
10-06-2011, 12:08 PM
  #211
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Quote:
Originally Posted by FissionFire View Post
Updated. Let me know if I missed anything.
Very minor, but shouldn't the hiring of Draper be on there...whatever it is that he does.

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10-06-2011, 12:37 PM
  #212
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Quote:
Originally Posted by The Wingman View Post
Very minor, but shouldn't the hiring of Draper be on there...whatever it is that he does.
And Maltby.

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10-06-2011, 01:10 PM
  #213
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jaster View Post
And Maltby.
Maltby's hiring is there under year 14.

Also, I noticed you have Rafalski's retirement on there. If you're including those then you're missing quite a few others...or are you only including the ones where the player retired while still under contract?

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Old
10-06-2011, 01:15 PM
  #214
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Originally Posted by The Wingman View Post
Maltby's hiring is there under year 14.
Well it should be in bold, damn it!

Yeah I just missed it.

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Old
10-06-2011, 02:22 PM
  #215
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Heaton View Post
The Lang trade is debatable but there's no way even in hindsight that it could be deemed "bad".

The Quincey and Matthias situations are too early to be labeled yet.
The Lang trade is not debatable. Fleischmann is pretty much established as a solid second-line scorer, and Green is a good offensive defenseman who is a huge liability in his own end. That's what Holland traded for the league's leading scorer; it was the first time the league's leading scorer had been traded so late in the year.
Sure, Fleischmann and Green would be nice to have now. But where would Fleischmann be playing? Third line? He'd have been competing with Hudler, Filppula, and Kopecky for ice time (they were the Nyquist, Jurco, Pulkinnen, and Tatar of their day) and as such he might have been traded in another deal or ended up sitting on the third line like Hudler has. Kopecky had to leave town to get top-six time, and Flip only started getting it regularly last year.

Quote:
Originally Posted by KevinP View Post
Done a super job(with some great help). However, no one is perfect:

1) Hate losing guys on waivers for nothing-to this day I still find it HARD to believe that Holland could not have dealt Ozzie for a least a couple of mid round picks. If I recall correctly, there were at least 5 00/01 non playoff teams that had a GAA of over three. Surely one of them could have used a Cup winning tender. If Holland (and Babcock) hadn't insisted on carrying an 8th dman(Chelios), Quincey would still be on the team.

2) Not a great fan of trade deadline deals either-see the four deals in '99. Lang did squat for the Wings and he cost us a first rounder(which could have been Green). Since I wanted the Wings to sign Stuart as a free agent, had no problem with that move and loved him staying with the team.
Quote:
Originally Posted by SirKillalot View Post
Well, you really can't include Mike Green in that, that's a fluke. But it was a bad deal even without Green.
Quote:
Originally Posted by cmccallum View Post
Yeah can you imagine the Wings with Mike Green! , I'm in agreement.
Osgood was offered around the league; teams that were interested (like the Isles) weren't going to give up assets when they knew the Wings had to waive one of Hasek, Ozzie, or Legace. The waiver order generally favored teams that had poor goaltenders (bad teams) so making a trade was difficult.

Lang provided the Wings the scoring presence they didn't have when they cut Fedorov loose. Green probably wouldn't have even been the pick.



Quote:
Originally Posted by HockeyinHD View Post
Ian White plays over 22 minutes a night in Toronto. Would he be playing that much for the Wings?
Hmm....

I think Ian White could play close to that much in Detroit. We should find out this year.

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Old
02-21-2012, 05:08 PM
  #216
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I guess this needs to updated.

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Old
02-28-2012, 12:20 PM
  #217
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Originally Posted by iRep TheWingedWheel View Post
I guess this needs to updated.
Yep, so it does. Updated for the post-trade deadline.

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Old
12-10-2012, 10:20 PM
  #218
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Updated. Started adding in some player retirements as well. If you can think of any guys who retired as Wings let me know and I'll see about adding them as well.

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Old
12-10-2012, 10:54 PM
  #219
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Quote:
Originally Posted by FissionFire View Post
Updated. Started adding in some player retirements as well. If you can think of any guys who retired as Wings let me know and I'll see about adding them as well.
Larry Murphy, Steve Yzerman, Brian Rafalski, Kirk Maltby, Kris Draper, Tomas Holmstrom, Nicklas Lidstrom, Jiri Fischer, Steve Duchesne, Dominik Hasek (2002, 2004, and 2008). Possibly Ty Conklin.

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Old
12-10-2012, 11:15 PM
  #220
FissionFire
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Originally Posted by eva unit zero View Post
Larry Murphy, Steve Yzerman, Brian Rafalski, Kirk Maltby, Kris Draper, Tomas Holmstrom, Nicklas Lidstrom, Jiri Fischer, Steve Duchesne, Dominik Hasek (2002, 2004, and 2008). Possibly Ty Conklin.
Several of those are already in there

I'll check on the rest though thanks.

And isn't Holmstrom not officially retired yet?

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Old
12-11-2012, 05:05 AM
  #221
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Quote:
Originally Posted by FissionFire View Post
Several of those are already in there

I'll check on the rest though thanks.

And isn't Holmstrom not officially retired yet?
he's still listed as a free agent on capgeek so probably not

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Old
12-11-2012, 05:05 AM
  #222
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Quote:
Originally Posted by FissionFire View Post
Several of those are already in there

I'll check on the rest though thanks.

And isn't Holmstrom not officially retired yet?
I don't think he is.

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Old
09-12-2013, 04:02 PM
  #223
FissionFire
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Figured it was time to update this to give all the pro- and anti- Holland camps some fodder to toss around in the wake of the Cleary signing lol

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Old
09-12-2013, 04:11 PM
  #224
kuick
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Quote:
Originally Posted by FissionFire View Post
Figured it was time to update this to give all the pro- and anti- Holland camps some fodder to toss around in the wake of the Cleary signing lol
Oh, you're terrible.

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Old
09-12-2013, 04:15 PM
  #225
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Holland is a bad GM because he decided to go with Cleary instead of Eaves/Tootoo.

I mean absolutely horrible GM. This kind of move loses Stanley Cups.

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