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Playing Carter with Richards

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Old
10-25-2005, 10:22 PM
  #1
Ri hards
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Playing Carter with Richards

I was just thinking during todays game how Richards seems to have instant chemistry with just about anyone Hitch puts with him (first with Sim and Knuble, now with Handzus). I also began thinking that the only way Carter is going to get decent minutes is playing on the wing.

That being said, would playing Carter with Richards work? They've played together before (at least on the PK together at the WJC), and maybe Richards is the boost Carter needs to finally break out of his slump.

Thoughts?

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10-25-2005, 10:26 PM
  #2
Dr Love
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Playing two rookies on the same line works if you figure you're gonna be in the running for the draft lottery when the season starts. But when you're legitamitely gunning for the Cup, it's way too risky. Carter needs either to be placed with real linemates or sent down to the AHL to find his groove and get confident. Carter never took the ice in the second half of the game tonight (neither did Patrick Sharp), and he only played 3 minutes. He's not going to develop riding the pine.

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10-25-2005, 10:44 PM
  #3
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All Carter needs is to regain his health.....once that happens, the kid will be great.......

And yes I agree , in the meantime , send him down where their is less pressure and give him time to recover health wise and confidence wise.

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10-26-2005, 12:16 AM
  #4
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dr Love
Playing two rookies on the same line works if you figure you're gonna be in the running for the draft lottery when the season starts. But when you're legitamitely gunning for the Cup, it's way too risky. Carter needs either to be placed with real linemates or sent down to the AHL to find his groove and get confident. Carter never took the ice in the second half of the game tonight (neither did Patrick Sharp), and he only played 3 minutes. He's not going to develop riding the pine.
Agreed. Carter hasn't been great, but it's hard to expect rookies to just step right in and be perfect. The Flyers have to be willing to give him a chance, at center, with some legitimate line mates with legitimate ice time. Playing the measly amount of time he does know with the scrubs he's with will not help him adapt to the NHL, nor will it help his confidence (which I can't imagine is too high right now).

At this point, be willing to give him the chance to show what he has, or send him down and bring Umberger up in his place. In the AHL, he could get 1st line minutes without all of the pressure of producing right away in the big leagues, and it might help his game. Then again, getting the ice time at the NHL level would probably help his game even more. Either way, playing him as a 4th liner and the 12th forward is doing absolutely nothing, IMO.

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10-26-2005, 12:19 AM
  #5
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did carter play tonight? i missed the first period and i didnt se him the rest of the game

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10-26-2005, 12:23 AM
  #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by phillyphan
did carter play tonight? i missed the first period and i didnt se him the rest of the game
He played 2:54 in the entire game.

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10-26-2005, 12:24 AM
  #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Brad
He played 2:54 in the entire game.
Thanks.

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Old
10-26-2005, 01:47 AM
  #8
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And it was the best 2:54 I've seen him play thus far. The line as a whole had *okay* forechecking pressure (despite sim losing the puck about 5 times in one shift). I thought for sure they'd get more time. Hitch must have decided it was too close a game to risk putting them out there.

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10-26-2005, 03:41 AM
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I wouldnt shuffle things about to much for the sake of it. Carter is a good player, he'll get it together soon enough and just needs a bit of time. Maybe when we're winning games well we could give him more powerplay time or throw him on one of the top lines just to try get him going, but preferably I'd rather keep a winning team as it is right now.

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10-26-2005, 05:08 AM
  #10
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I've seen yesterday's game, and was a little bit sad to see Carter lose his time on the fourth line. He's such a great player. He should be in the AHL instead of playing 3 minutes a game.

Richards? WOW!!! I was really impressed by his play. I never thought he was that good. I always saw him as a Mike Peca clone, but from what I saw, he looks a bit more like Steve Yzerman. I was really impressed.

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Old
10-26-2005, 10:37 AM
  #11
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one of the biggest problems with his TOI is that our fourth line is poo

Sim and Sharp just aren't that great

when these guys were not all together on the same line, we just noticed here and there that they werent that great. on different lines. sim and sharp had other linemates masking their poor play. so when hitch finally demoted them for their play, put them together with struggling carter, and man that is one of the worst lines i have seen.

that line cant match against anyone. yeah i want carter to get more TOI but on a line like that? i'd rather see that line sit. hitch cant play that line, too much of a liablity.

now i know carter is a center, but he is going to have to learn wing
no matter what, if carter is on the fourth line or not, he should be practicing on the wing
if he stays on the fourth, have sharp center. couldnt be any worse
what i would like to see is carter split some time on the third line
split him with brashear, it will get him some more ice and he will be with primeau and branko. Primes and branko would provide carter the safty buffer he needs. they can pick up some slack, and offer better scoring potential. right now, sim and sharp cant pick up the slack. they are struggling on their own.

on a line like that, there is no way out of the basement
i feel for the kid

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10-26-2005, 11:42 AM
  #12
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Koivu played during is rookie season with two other rookies: Valeri Bure and Oleg Petrov. They did pretty well. If Zednik was not injuried, I'm sure Julien would have tried an all rookie line too: Higgins-Plekanec and Perezhogin.

It is worth trying IMO.

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Old
10-26-2005, 02:46 PM
  #13
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I hate the defense that Sim is good because he draws penalties. That's fine and all but when you call your fourth line out the idea is to give the other lines a break. Drawing a penalty puts the fourth back on the bench and the first on the ice again. He needs to stay on his freaking skates every now and again so that line can generate a scoring chance. I'd like to see Sami play wing for Carter once he comes back from his surgery.

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10-26-2005, 02:51 PM
  #14
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I may take some verbal abuse for this suggestion, but I honestly believe right now that Carter should be tried with Gags and Forsberg again. Knuble has put up some points, but on a shift to shift basis, he doesn't have the skillset to play with the other two. Not to mention he's much slower than them. He's got brutal hands (he's fumbled so many passes on a nightly basis) and seems to fall down a lot. He's a good John LeClair type player to stand in front of the net, but honestly, he's not working out the way everyone thinks he is on the first line. Carter on the other hand has the skill and the speed to create on the rush. I know he hasn't "earned" the icetime, but he will if he's given the shot. Sending him down won't solve anything. Giving him another shot will.

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Old
10-26-2005, 02:56 PM
  #15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Panasonic Youth
I hate the defense that Sim is good because he draws penalties. That's fine and all but when you call your fourth line out the idea is to give the other lines a break. Drawing a penalty puts the fourth back on the bench and the first on the ice again. He needs to stay on his freaking skates every now and again so that line can generate a scoring chance. I'd like to see Sami play wing for Carter once he comes back from his surgery.
it wouldn't matter anyways since the flyers can't score on the PP.

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Old
10-26-2005, 06:20 PM
  #16
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BloodOnTheIce
one of the biggest problems with his TOI is that our fourth line is poo

Sim and Sharp just aren't that great
Id love to see the Three of them get somemore time on ice! Carters an awsome player , and so is Sharp! I really dont know about sim , But Last year on the Phantoms , It was Carter passes sharp shoots and scores or reversed! those two had allot of Chemisty last year or it looked like it, I dont know what happened. But i just wanted to tell you that because , i dont think Sharps that bad. I think their all great , they just dont look good on the same line

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10-26-2005, 07:33 PM
  #17
BloodOnTheIce
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Flyersfan17
Id love to see the Three of them get somemore time on ice! Carters an awsome player , and so is Sharp! I really dont know about sim , But Last year on the Phantoms , It was Carter passes sharp shoots and scores or reversed! those two had allot of Chemisty last year or it looked like it, I dont know what happened. But i just wanted to tell you that because , i dont think Sharps that bad. I think their all great , they just dont look good on the same line

sharp is not a goal scorer
he is a role player at best
he is a present day mike maneluk
he will bounce around the league as that guy each team trys once, tomorrows john sim
his career will be between the ahl and nhl

he plays his heart out, but he just doesnt hold the skill
maybe a niche player on a team
he should hope to get traded to a terrible team, so he can at least skate

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Old
10-26-2005, 07:37 PM
  #18
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BloodOnTheIce
man that is one of the worst lines i have seen.

that line cant match against anyone. yeah i want carter to get more TOI but on a line like that? i'd rather see that line sit. hitch cant play that line, too much of a liablity.
I thought that line played pretty well in the two minutes that they played (Carter looked much better than what I've seen so far), they kept the puck in the offensive zone for most of the time, had a couple small scoring chances and drew a penalty, that is pretty good for a fourth line if you ask me. maybe you're right because Hitchcock decided not to play them the rest of the game but then again, this is the same guy that had Brash and Branko playing when it was do or die. Seriously though he must have seen something he didn't like with them, I must have missed it, hopefully that get another chance.

lines worth trying:
Gagne Primeau Forsberg (he plays on the right side most of the time anyway)
Savage Richards Handzus
Sharpe Carter Knuble (if Sharpe or Knuble can play effectively at left wing)
Sim Umberger Radio (Sim and Umberger played good together)
I think this will give three solid lines and a good fourth to give the others a rest when needed.

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Old
10-26-2005, 08:03 PM
  #19
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hockeyphan25
I thought that line played pretty well in the two minutes that they played (Carter looked much better than what I've seen so far), they kept the puck in the offensive zone for most of the time, had a couple small scoring chances and drew a penalty, that is pretty good for a fourth line if you ask me. maybe you're right because Hitchcock decided not to play them the rest of the game but then again, this is the same guy that had Brash and Branko playing when it was do or die. Seriously though he must have seen something he didn't like with them, I must have missed it, hopefully that get another chance.

lines worth trying:
Gagne Primeau Forsberg (he plays on the right side most of the time anyway)
Savage Richards Handzus
Sharpe Carter Knuble (if Sharpe or Knuble can play effectively at left wing)
Sim Umberger Radio (Sim and Umberger played good together)
I think this will give three solid lines and a good fourth to give the others a rest when needed.
Sim and Sharp will not last at the NHL level
they will bounce between ahl and nhl and from team to team

Last night, branko was up on his skates. while i agree i wouldnt have had him out in OT, i think hitch was wise having him on ice in the third. he had energy and played a solid two-way game

as for brashear, you guys may fry me for this, he played a helluva game too
he actually made some great plays on defense
by no means am i a brash fan, but he is a better NHL player than sharp or sim
if brashear played the rest of his career at the level he is playing now, then he would always be able to find a team in the NHL
I just dont see sim or sharp always having work, they will struggle anywhere they go to get ice


as far as carter last night, i agree, i thought he looked decent
but he will never get ice with his current linemates
and i still think he needs to learn wing
our center ice is too stacked for carter to move onto a better line
if he is going to play on the fourth, have sharp center him

see, you get three guys, all trying to make it in the nhl. they are out there trying to save their spots. each one seems so concerned in protecting their spot on the team, that they are worry too much about screwing up. the weight of screwing up is hurting them because they are playing within themselves. it is not a line, it is three scared guys. you know they feel the pressure. that is why i wouldnt play them much in a game. scared of failure, not woking together as a line, it leads to goals against

that line will need to be broken up if any of them is to play better

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Old
10-26-2005, 08:44 PM
  #20
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It will take Carter another month at least to fully recover from mono. I think he needs to stay at center, he is not a winger at heart. As for Sharp, I would take him any day over Radio. He's just as fast, has better hands and can actually see the ice. He will be playing on the third line with Carter and Umberger when things shake out. As for Sim, trade him and Stevenson for a conditional pick in 2015. Sim does not belong in the NHL.

Gags-Forsberg-Zues
sami-Richards-Knuble
Umberger-Carter-Sharp
Brash-Prims-Radio

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Old
10-26-2005, 09:21 PM
  #21
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Quote:
Originally Posted by trippyime
I may take some verbal abuse for this suggestion, but I honestly believe right now that Carter should be tried with Gags and Forsberg again. Knuble has put up some points, but on a shift to shift basis, he doesn't have the skillset to play with the other two. Not to mention he's much slower than them. He's got brutal hands (he's fumbled so many passes on a nightly basis) and seems to fall down a lot. He's a good John LeClair type player to stand in front of the net, but honestly, he's not working out the way everyone thinks he is on the first line. Carter on the other hand has the skill and the speed to create on the rush. I know he hasn't "earned" the icetime, but he will if he's given the shot. Sending him down won't solve anything. Giving him another shot will.
Personally, i think taking Knuble off of the #1 line would be dangerous to rest of the lines as we are already a somewhat slow team. Placing Knuble with Gags and PF allows for Knuble's lack of speed to be hidden. (note: when i say "lack of speed" what i mean is that there are few "burners" on this team)

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