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Martin says " Cole is NOT our saviour "

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Old
10-15-2011, 08:07 AM
  #1
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Martin says " Cole is NOT our saviour "

They don't seem to be on the same page.

http://www.rds.ca/canadien/chroniques/328221.html

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10-15-2011, 08:14 AM
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if you actually READ the article and dont take bits and pieces that strike you, you realize that its all very normal.

new guy, new system= takes time to be comfortable.

anyone who actually though Cole was a Savior=

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10-15-2011, 08:18 AM
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Originally Posted by Canadian_Brewtality View Post
if you actually READ the article and dont take bits and pieces that strike you, you realize that its all very normal.

new guy, new system= takes time to be comfortable.

anyone who actually though Cole was a Savior=
Cole is also not Crosby. He wasn't brought in to be "the Guy" either. You are correct. He just adds an element to the team to make it better. No big surprise here.

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10-15-2011, 08:19 AM
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I don't know how did you came to an conclusion that they aren't on the same page, from what I managed to understand (my French isn't great) Martin says that fans in Montreal shouldn't treat Cole as the saviour of les Canadiens, which is a fair statement if you ask me. There's no reason to seek for problems when there isn't one to begin with.

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10-15-2011, 08:28 AM
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You make it sound so negative when it's not. He's simply taking pressure of Cole and allowing for a normal gestation period whiteout having so much pressure on him. For all those who bash JM, this is a great example. He's trying to ease a new player in and he's being chastised for it called him "not a savior." :

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10-15-2011, 08:39 AM
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I love how JM gets credit for doing absolutely nothing. I guess we will all see when this team goes 3-10-2 after the first 15 if he is still here.

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10-15-2011, 08:39 AM
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Originally Posted by Ivan13 View Post
I don't know how did you came to an conclusion that they aren't on the same page, from what I managed to understand (my French isn't great) Martin says that fans in Montreal shouldn't treat Cole as the saviour of les Canadiens, which is a fair statement if you ask me. There's no reason to seek for problems when there isn't one to begin with.
Erm, don't mean to be rude but... I take it you haven't heard of Montreal before

eg/. Lets say a situation arises where the Habs find themselves with two quality, young goalies on the roster. This, you might think, would be great news for fans of the team and could only be a positive that brings warmth, joy and happiness to all. And you would be wrong as the correct behaviour in such a situation (apparently) is to pick a side and then fight 'til the death.

eg/. Lets say some players talk on the phone and spend a little time in the company of someone who has committed a crime but these players have done no wrong themselves. They are perfectly innocent, as verified by the local police force. This, you might think, is an opportunity for people to get behind them, show them some support and encourage them to do great things for our team. Wrong. The best course of action here is to do your level best to run them out of town.

If the head coach says that a new player isn't the saviour of our team, then, with my experience of this fanbase, I expect this is cause to:

1. PANIC!
2. Criticise the player for not making himself the saviour of our team.
3. Criticise management for bringing in a player who isn't the saviour of our team.
4. Criticise the coaches for not treating him like the saviour of the team and then criticise them again for not coaching him into being the saviour of the team.
5. Blame Bettman (everyone needs a hobby).
6. PANIC AGAIN! (optional).

As I said, that's just my experience

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10-15-2011, 08:42 AM
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Originally Posted by Qui Gon Dave View Post
Erm, don't mean to be rude but... I take it you haven't heard of Montreal before

eg/. Lets say a situation arises where the Habs find themselves with two quality, young goalies on the roster. This, you might think, would be great news for fans of the team and could only be a positive that brings warmth, joy and happiness to all. And you would be wrong as the correct behaviour in such a situation (apparently) is to pick a side and then fight 'til the death.

eg/. Lets say some players talk on the phone and spend a little time in the company of someone who has committed a crime but these players have done no wrong themselves. They are perfectly innocent, as verified by the local police force. This, you might think, is an opportunity for people to get behind them, show them some support and encourage them to do great things for our team. Wrong. The best course of action here is to do your level best to run them out of town.

If the head coach says that a new player isn't the saviour of our team, then, with my experience of this fanbase, I expect this is cause to:

1. PANIC!
2. Criticise the player for not making himself the saviour of our team.
3. Criticise management for bringing in a player who isn't the saviour of our team.
4. Criticise the coaches for not treating him like the saviour of the team and then criticise them again for not coaching him into being the saviour of the team.
5. Blame Bettman (everyone needs a hobby).
6. PANIC AGAIN! (optional).

As I said, that's just my experience

QGD, you think i am just starting to critisize JM today because of this ?
Nope, i have not liked his coaching style ever since his implementation of the trap in Ottawa.

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10-15-2011, 08:50 AM
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Originally Posted by Qui Gon Dave View Post
Erm, don't mean to be rude but... I take it you haven't heard of Montreal before

eg/. Lets say a situation arises where the Habs find themselves with two quality, young goalies on the roster. This, you might think, would be great news for fans of the team and could only be a positive that brings warmth, joy and happiness to all. And you would be wrong as the correct behaviour in such a situation (apparently) is to pick a side and then fight 'til the death.

eg/. Lets say some players talk on the phone and spend a little time in the company of someone who has committed a crime but these players have done no wrong themselves. They are perfectly innocent, as verified by the local police force. This, you might think, is an opportunity for people to get behind them, show them some support and encourage them to do great things for our team. Wrong. The best course of action here is to do your level best to run them out of town.

If the head coach says that a new player isn't the saviour of our team, then, with my experience of this fanbase, I expect this is cause to:

1. PANIC!
2. Criticise the player for not making himself the saviour of our team.
3. Criticise management for bringing in a player who isn't the saviour of our team.
4. Criticise the coaches for not treating him like the saviour of the team and then criticise them again for not coaching him into being the saviour of the team.
5. Blame Bettman (everyone needs a hobby).
6. PANIC AGAIN! (optional).

As I said, that's just my experience
Oh, I've heard about Montreal, that's why I love the Canadiens. I've been to more Habs games than Avs games (3 to 1) in my life and I grew up listening to stories about Richard brothers, Jean Beliveau and Frank Mahovlich (as a Hab, not so much as a Leaf).

And don't worry you weren't rude at all.

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10-15-2011, 08:54 AM
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Originally Posted by AHMB Prez View Post
QGD, you think i am just starting to critisize JM today because of this ?
Nope, i have not liked his coaching style ever since his implementation of the trap in Ottawa.
Nope, I wasn't trying to highlight your post/POV specifically but give a view of how this fanbase tends to react to any news whatsoever.

Rookie camp in Montreal is a big deal.
Lines in pre-season practices are a big deal.
A player says something/anything and it can turn into a big deal.

When something legitimately big happens, the place goes into meltdown. I just find it kinda amusing and a little sad at times, depending on the situation. It reminds me a little of Monty Python - The Life of Brian at times. A guy can lose his shoe and it ends up interpreted as a great sign of... something! And it must mean something, because it happened! His shoe! His gloves have been seen! He said he is not our saviour! (obviously Cole is just a very naughty boy). Etc...

Just makes me chuckle

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10-15-2011, 08:54 AM
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QGD, you think i am just starting to critisize JM today because of this ?
Nope, i have not liked his coaching style ever since his implementation of the trap in Ottawa.
Me neither, but using this to further your negative opinion of him is ridiculous. Martin is a good coach, does some things we don't agree with, but he knows what he is doing.

I'd prefer a coach with a more uptempo style, but that would likely cost us games in the long run. Martin has exceeded expectations with this team, with an ECF appearance and leading a team decimated with injuries to a 6th place playoff birth. Does aesthetics trump performance? I think he's done this team wonders considering what he's had to work with, I am sometimes curious as to why he leans a certain way with roster decisions and sometimes question his ability to nurture our youth, but overall the results are positive. It's 3 games, 3 games where we have dressed a blue line of 50% inexperience dman, give the man time, this team will be on the right track soon enough. I have more confidence in JM than any of the previous coach's over the past decade.

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10-15-2011, 09:15 AM
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Me neither, but using this to further your negative opinion of him is ridiculous. Martin is a good coach, does some things we don't agree with, but he knows what he is doing.

I'd prefer a coach with a more uptempo style, but that would likely cost us games in the long run. Martin has exceeded expectations with this team, with an ECF appearance and leading a team decimated with injuries to a 6th place playoff birth. Does aesthetics trump performance? I think he's done this team wonders considering what he's had to work with, I am sometimes curious as to why he leans a certain way with roster decisions and sometimes question his ability to nurture our youth, but overall the results are positive. It's 3 games, 3 games where we have dressed a blue line of 50% inexperience dman, give the man time, this team will be on the right track soon enough. I have more confidence in JM than any of the previous coach's over the past decade.
This here is the proof that most Habs fans, are easily satisfied. Maybe it's just me, but just making the playoff's isn't my goal.
Let me just give you one tiny example of why i hate Martin's coaching. We get three or four straight penalties in the first period,some that were very iffy. What does Martin do to let the ref's know of his displeasure ? NOTHING. The man is zzzzzzz. Sorry to offend some of you Martin lovers.

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10-15-2011, 09:16 AM
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Me neither, but using this to further your negative opinion of him is ridiculous. Martin is a good coach, does some things we don't agree with, but he knows what he is doing.

I'd prefer a coach with a more uptempo style, but that would likely cost us games in the long run. Martin has exceeded expectations with this team, with an ECF appearance and leading a team decimated with injuries to a 6th place playoff birth. Does aesthetics trump performance? I think he's done this team wonders considering what he's had to work with, I am sometimes curious as to why he leans a certain way with roster decisions and sometimes question his ability to nurture our youth, but overall the results are positive. It's 3 games, 3 games where we have dressed a blue line of 50% inexperience dman, give the man time, this team will be on the right track soon enough. I have more confidence in JM than any of the previous coach's over the past decade.
Well said.

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10-15-2011, 09:18 AM
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So they just pay him like one?

Must be nice to be paid like a top performer, but not have the expectations to play like one.

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10-15-2011, 09:20 AM
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"Cole isn't the saviour and I'll make damned sure of that. Travis Moen, on the other hand..."

~ Jacques Martin

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10-15-2011, 09:20 AM
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Originally Posted by AHMB Prez View Post
This here is the proof that most Habs fans, are easily satisfied. Maybe it's just me, but just making the playoff's isn't my goal.
Let me just give you one tiny example of why i hate Martin's coaching. We get three or four straight penalties in the first period,some that were very iffy. What does Martin do to let the ref's know of his displeasure ? NOTHING. The man is zzzzzzz. Sorry to offend some of you Martin lovers.
You are right Martin should have shown his displeasure...toward his player...Darche Penalty was iffy, the rest unfortunately were actually good call...I hate this mentality that a hockey game should finish with the same number of penality on both sides or that after 2 penalties the coach should yell at the ref...if they are deserved...they are deserved....

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10-15-2011, 09:22 AM
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Well said.
Really ? You wouldn't prefer Vigneault to Martin ?

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So they just pay him like one?

Must be nice to be paid like a top performer, but not have the expectations to play like one.
Exactly.

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10-15-2011, 09:24 AM
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So they just pay him like one?

Must be nice to be paid like a top performer, but not have the expectations to play like one.
4.5 Millions is freaking far from top performer it's the salary of a 50 points guy, that's what he is...no points in 3 games wow, give him time to adjust, or does that means he is going to have 0 this year? Stamkos has 1 goal in 4 games does that mean he will end the season with 20 goals? they must panic alot more he is 8 millions under the cap....

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10-15-2011, 09:33 AM
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4.5 Millions is freaking far from top performer it's the salary of a 50 points guy, that's what he is...no points in 3 games wow, give him time to adjust, or does that means he is going to have 0 this year? Stamkos has 1 goal in 4 games does that mean he will end the season with 20 goals? they must panic alot more he is 8 millions under the cap....
Cute how you forgot about his 6 million dollar contract this season.

Comparing Stamkos to Cole? lol?

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10-15-2011, 09:39 AM
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But Desharnais and Moen are.

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10-15-2011, 09:40 AM
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Cute how you forgot about his 3 million dollar bonus he gets next year, and the 2 after that. I didn't realize that 4.5 million is a drop in the bucket in your neck of the woods.

Comparing Stamkos to Cole? lol?
What 3 million dollar bonuses and 2, Cole contracts cannot have bonuses...
and even at 6 millions this season, what his cap hit is still 4.5.


Yes, you know I really thin Cole is as good as Stamkos, if not better

come on I'm merely comparing the fact that if a player, has 0 points after three games it doesn't necessarily means that he is going to finish with 0 points. just like if stamkos has 1 goal in 4 games it doesn't mean that he is going to end the season with 20 goals.

and no 4.5 millions ain't a drop in my bucket here, but as far as I know, it'S not my bucket that is being used to pay Hockey player..and in their bucket 4.5 isn't supposed to turn out into a saviour and an 100 point player...come on, admit it!

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10-15-2011, 09:40 AM
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Me neither, but using this to further your negative opinion of him is ridiculous. Martin is a good coach, does some things we don't agree with, but he knows what he is doing.

I'd prefer a coach with a more uptempo style, but that would likely cost us games in the long run. Martin has exceeded expectations with this team, with an ECF appearance and leading a team decimated with injuries to a 6th place playoff birth. Does aesthetics trump performance? I think he's done this team wonders considering what he's had to work with, I am sometimes curious as to why he leans a certain way with roster decisions and sometimes question his ability to nurture our youth, but overall the results are positive. It's 3 games, 3 games where we have dressed a blue line of 50% inexperience dman, give the man time, this team will be on the right track soon enough. I have more confidence in JM than any of the previous coach's over the past decade.
I rarely get to say this so I won't pass up the opportunity, I agree with you.

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Originally Posted by AHMB Prez View Post
This here is the proof that most Habs fans, are easily satisfied. Maybe it's just me, but just making the playoff's isn't my goal.
Let me just give you one tiny example of why i hate Martin's coaching. We get three or four straight penalties in the first period,some that were very iffy. What does Martin do to let the ref's know of his displeasure ? NOTHING. The man is zzzzzzz. Sorry to offend some of you Martin lovers.
Habsjunkie2 is not easily satisfied. Might be the first time I see him write something positive about Martin. So you're completely wrong about that.
Some fans (like you) just don't get it. There is a difference between being satisfied because of simply making the POs, and being able to give credit when/where credit is due.
Most people say we are a playoff bubble team, and that's with everybody healthy. Martin has taken a team that not only has suffered key injuries, but also has 3 under performing players in their top 5, to a 6th place finish. I don't care how much you hate Martin and are displeased with a simple playoff birth, the man deserves some credit.

It's not because you don't like his style or some of his decisions that everything he does has to be bad. This team has exceeded expectations for the past two seasons considering all that happened (injuries, lack of production), Martin deserves a lot of credit for that.

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10-15-2011, 09:42 AM
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I love how JM gets credit for doing absolutely nothing. I guess we will all see when this team goes 3-10-2 after the first 15 if he is still here.
We are 1-2, there are a lot of so called better teams like the Bruins who are 1-3, Vancouver 1-2-1, LA 1-1-1, San Jose 1-1...is there a panic there?

No, it is the first 3 games. Are we to think that 2-0 Toronto are real, or that 3-1 Colorado are all top 3 finishers in the East and West this year too after only a couple of games???

No.

Way too much goes into calling the coach out, and the players.

Injuries have hurt this team, what has changed so much since last season that we would be basement dwellers and a potential lottery draft pick team now?

Hamrlik was a rock, but he was one player. Cole made us better and stronger. Markov and Cammalleri missing are key, Campoli injury has hurt, and Eller has just returned.

Expect a different team tonight, it is game 4. A win and we are .500, then go from there. It isn't a deep hole, it is a little bump in the road.

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10-15-2011, 09:42 AM
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Really ? You wouldn't prefer Vigneault to Martin ?
I'd prefer a bunch of coaches, doesn't mean they would have necessarily lead us any further. Martin has brought this team much further than it really should have.

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10-15-2011, 09:53 AM
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I'd prefer a bunch of coaches, doesn't mean they would have necessarily lead us any further. Martin has brought this team much further than it really should have.
True. Martin is a proven good regular season coach that with an incredible boring system will lead their team to a better regular season standings than they should have. He has not proven ANYTHING as far as playoffs are concerned. And he's clearly not having a system that makes the regular season interesting. Not sure how I should like him for doing what he does. Regular season should be a mix of entertainment and result, yet we're not talking at least to be top 8 in a conference which shouldn't be THAT difficult. And playoffs has to be plenty about results which still remains to be seen in his case. Yet, we've bought tons of offensive players over the past years and have to bury them in a system they are a tough time to play in. Habs are just like a Ferrari in a school zone...I just don't like Martin. Don't like the fact that he doesn't communicate well with his players (based on TONS of reports from past and present players), don't like how he conducts himself behind the bench etc. Reality is that I remember how much I laughed at the Sens and their management....and now I'm stuck with it.

Yes, he does well better than some thinks he should. But it's always easier to sell that type of system in the first years of your era....we will see how he does now.

Nope. Cole isn't a saviour....as if asking a guy you pay that much to play in your top 6 and some PP time is asking Cole to be a saviour.....Jacques at his best.

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