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How would you feel about Tanking?

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Old
10-19-2011, 05:52 AM
  #26
Phozzwald
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I wish that people would just stop bashing the Habs so early in the season. Theres still 77 games left to be played, the Habs could still finish first for all you know. They played all over Buffalo last night just could not manage to score. Cammalleri will help big time when he comes back. Boston is playing horrible to, do you think the defending champs fans are saying hey lets tank.

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10-19-2011, 06:10 AM
  #27
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Originally Posted by eliash View Post
I'm not exactly happy, but if we're not going to make the playoffs I hope we finish in the bottom for once.
I wanted the Habs to tank years ago.


The season Souray walked away. They could have traded him for picks and traded anyone else worth picks or prospects at the time. The team would have been so much better off.

Sometimes you need to take a few steps backwards before you can go forward..

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Old
10-19-2011, 06:12 AM
  #28
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Ahh got to love a slow start to the season.

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10-19-2011, 06:27 AM
  #29
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I wouldn't say I am ready to "Fail for Nail" but I am getting tired of hearing about how Gomez will elevate his game, like it's a guarantee. Has he been our worst player? Frankly, no, but I would prefer more than mediocrity out of him. What I find irksome more than anything is management's inability to realize we need a powerplay anchor. This is the fifth season our powerplay has been an utter disaster. Souray, Streit, Schneider, Wisniewski: can we pick someone and actually keep them for once? Yes, yes, Wisniewski is overpaid but I'd rather toss him is money and reap the benefits of a good powerplay then continue to watch the "Plekanec experiment."

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Old
10-19-2011, 06:29 AM
  #30
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I always say, the regular season is the regular season, as long as they make the playoffs I'd be happy, because for whatever reason this team elevates its play greatly in the playoffs. Much like they do against strong opposition during the regular season.

However, I wouldn't complain if we had a bad season and fell to last because that's the way the cards fell, would I like it? no, But if the teams design is so flawed that we finish dead last then so be it, frankly though something tells me yakupov is going to ott they need him lol

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Old
10-19-2011, 06:39 AM
  #31
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Originally Posted by Mr. Hab View Post
I'm with you.

I feel that this team can do great things in the playoffs IF all or most of our CORE palyers remain healthy.

TOR, COL, BUF...could have won all games.

Our Habs win 2-3 in a row and everyone will stop the panic!
(my only complaint is the annoying waiting, waiting, and waiting for Markov).
Yep, honestly.. Wiz should have been signed over Markov, for a variety of reasons.

I understand Markov bleeds Blue, Blanc et Rouge, but this is a business, after all.. the guy is one big hit or awkward fall away from retirement.


Last edited by BobbyFischer*: 10-19-2011 at 06:50 AM.
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Old
10-19-2011, 06:44 AM
  #32
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Yes lets ruin the development of our young guys like Price, Subban, Pacioretty and Eller and raise them up in a losing environment where the fans would likely boo them every home game so we can get a top prospect who there is no guarantee will even pan out in Montreal.

With veterans like Cammalleri, Gionta, Gorges, Gill, Plekanec etc this team has too much pride to go out and tank and on top of that we have too much talent to be a bottom 5 team.

This board honestly get more ******* retarded as each day passes.

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Old
10-19-2011, 06:48 AM
  #33
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even if we tank, Gomez, Gionta, Cammalleri, Cole will still be in the team for the next 3 years at least. So we better **** the wake up and play better.

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Old
10-19-2011, 06:51 AM
  #34
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This board is pathetically embarrassing, sometimes.

5 ****ing games, and a thread about tanking comes up.



Whoever feels good about tanking needs to reconsider what it means to be a fan.

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Old
10-19-2011, 06:54 AM
  #35
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jimmym007 View Post
Am I the only one who's happier and happier everytime I see habs lose? Don't get me wrong, I'm a die hard habs fan and would love more than seeing a cup in mtl in my lifetime, but when I see 2012 draft prospects and habs losing record, I can't help but to see a much brighter future.

We need change, defensive system is boring and clearly isn't working with the defense we have (most of them being offensive dmen except for Gill and Gorges). We need an offensive coach and size, but it doesn't cut it with the guys we have. We'll have to change the team all over and rebuild from the start. PG doesn't want that I'm sure, but I believe that we'll never win a cup with this team. Rebuilding starts with one franchise player and building around him. We thought about Price, hence why we built a defensive system around him. It worked not too bad, but still not good enough. We need a star that can score, because right now, when we're getting scored on, we have nobody that can tie the game up. When we happen to have the lead, we defend it. This whole mentality has to change, too. When we have to rely on guys like pacioretty when we're down by a goal, that's a good sign you need quality goal scorers.

Habs should stop drafting defensemen in the first round from now on. We've got enough now, it keeps us from drafting potential top 6 forwards.

The question I'd like to ask you guys is, how would you feel if habs plan was to tank this year? Not saying it was even mentionned by anybody in the habs organisation, but would you mind to "fail for nail" for the entire season knowing what the upcoming years would look like? Would you rather trade for a first overall pick (We have nothing close to being worth of a 1st overall in 2012 though).

I saw a lot of "habs and sens will fight for the 1st overall pick this year" or "Coyotes and Montreal won't have more than 25 wins this season" comments. It's the first time I see comments underrating the habs at that point, even if the authors of these quotes are nowhere near credible, people around the league seem to think we're going to finish in the bottom 5. I don't particularly share their opinions, but I'd like to hear what you guys have to say about that.



This is not a panic thread or a ranting on the habs current performance. It's an personnal review and personnal questions I've asked myself, please discuss without flaming and judging. Thank you.
1. Prospects are not better than proven NHL players (not even the great Yakupov, Daigle's numbers in junior anyone?)
2. There is no such thing as tanking.
3. Martin and this team will be fine.
4. 'Fail' does not rhyme with 'Nail'.

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Old
10-19-2011, 07:17 AM
  #36
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Does anybody know the last time we got a first overall pick?
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jimmy Ballzilly View Post
Lafleur... and Réjean Houle too !
Doug Wickenheiser - 1980

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Old
10-19-2011, 07:26 AM
  #37
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Originally Posted by BobbyFischer View Post
Yep, honestly.. Wiz should have been signed over Markov, for a variety of reasons.

I understand Markov bleeds Blue, Blanc et Rouge, but this is a business, after all.. the guy is one big hit or awkward fall away from retirement.
This is ridiculous. This could be said about 9/10ths of all NHL players.
Would you not take Crosby on your team ? He is one big hit from retirement, see how dumb that phrase is ?

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Old
10-19-2011, 07:38 AM
  #38
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Quote:
Originally Posted by eliash View Post
I'm not exactly happy, but if we're not going to make the playoffs I hope we finish in the bottom for once.
Even if we did tank we wouldn't suck enough to land Yakupov.

The only way we would achieve anything close enough to a draft pick that would allow us to get Grigorenko is playing Budaj on a split-start basis, without having to trade anyone away.

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Old
10-19-2011, 07:41 AM
  #39
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jimmym007 View Post
Am I the only one who's happier and happier everytime I see habs lose? Don't get me wrong, I'm a die hard habs fan and would love more than seeing a cup in mtl in my lifetime, but when I see 2012 draft prospects and habs losing record, I can't help but to see a much brighter future.

We need change, defensive system is boring and clearly isn't working with the defense we have (most of them being offensive dmen except for Gill and Gorges). We need an offensive coach and size, but it doesn't cut it with the guys we have. We'll have to change the team all over and rebuild from the start. PG doesn't want that I'm sure, but I believe that we'll never win a cup with this team. Rebuilding starts with one franchise player and building around him. We thought about Price, hence why we built a defensive system around him. It worked not too bad, but still not good enough. We need a star that can score, because right now, when we're getting scored on, we have nobody that can tie the game up. When we happen to have the lead, we defend it. This whole mentality has to change, too. When we have to rely on guys like pacioretty when we're down by a goal, that's a good sign you need quality goal scorers.

Habs should stop drafting defensemen in the first round from now on. We've got enough now, it keeps us from drafting potential top 6 forwards.

The question I'd like to ask you guys is, how would you feel if habs plan was to tank this year? Not saying it was even mentionned by anybody in the habs organisation, but would you mind to "fail for nail" for the entire season knowing what the upcoming years would look like? Would you rather trade for a first overall pick (We have nothing close to being worth of a 1st overall in 2012 though).

I saw a lot of "habs and sens will fight for the 1st overall pick this year" or "Coyotes and Montreal won't have more than 25 wins this season" comments. It's the first time I see comments underrating the habs at that point, even if the authors of these quotes are nowhere near credible, people around the league seem to think we're going to finish in the bottom 5. I don't particularly share their opinions, but I'd like to hear what you guys have to say about that.



This is not a panic thread or a ranting on the habs current performance. It's an personnal review and personnal questions I've asked myself, please discuss without flaming and judging. Thank you.
This stuff comes up every year and is utterly ridiculous. We lose a couple 1 goal games where we outplay the opposition and some radical posters want to dump all the vetaerans and tank

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Old
10-19-2011, 07:46 AM
  #40
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Either you didn't read at all or you can't read. I didn't suggest the habs to tank or want them to tank, I'm asking you how'd you feel about it? I just stated how I wouldn't mind considering all the draft depth of 2012, which is looking to be the deepest draft in the century.

Where did I say that we needed/HAD to tank to achieve the rebuild that I suggested? Where did I say that I was flipping **** over the habs for losing just 5 games into the season. You guys think everything is pathetic but the way you're seeing every thread as a panic thread is what makes it even worse for you.

You may now carry on.


And yes I'm aware that "Na-yeel" does not rhyme with "fail", but the motto is already established so deal with it.jpg


Last edited by Habs 4 Life: 10-19-2011 at 08:03 AM.
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Old
10-19-2011, 08:02 AM
  #41
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jimmym007 View Post
Either you didn't read at all or you can't read. I didn't suggest the habs to tank or want them to tank, I'm asking you how'd you feel about it? I just stated how I wouldn't mind considering all the draft depth of 2012, which is looking to be the deepest draft in the century.

Where did I say that we needed/HAD to tank to achieve the rebuild that I suggested? Where did I say that I was flipping **** over the habs for losing just 5 games into the season. You guys think everything is pathetic but the way you're seeing every thread as a panic thread is what makes it even worse for you.

You may now carry on.


And yes I'm aware that "Na-yeel" does not rhyme with "fail", but the motto is already established so deal with it.jpg
Oh please

the team loses 3 in a row, and suddenly a "tanking" thread is posted. How convenient. If the habs were 5-0 you wouldnt be posting this despite us having a coach you think is boring and the draft will still be as deep.

Its these reactionary posts that are getting increasingly "retarded" as you put it. The whole concept of tanking is first off, retarded in its own terms. No teams will purposely lose to obtain an unknown entity. Who knows how any prospect will translate there game in the NHL? Your happy when he lose, to throw away an entire season for 1 player while compromising the development of 5-6 other young kids we have in our lineup.

Point is, its 5 games in. The habs were the better team the last 2 games and have come up short minus their best scorer and missing Markov, Spacek & Campoli.
The wanting of a high draft pick is wanted & warranted 70 games in and they are 10 points back of 8th. Then im all for it. As long as they are not mathematically eliminated, anything is possible.

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Old
10-19-2011, 08:08 AM
  #42
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Originally Posted by Canadian_Brewtality View Post
Oh please

the team loses 3 in a row, and suddenly a "tanking" thread is posted. How convenient. If the habs were 5-0 you wouldnt be posting this despite us having a coach you think is boring and the draft will still be as deep.

Its these reactionary posts that are getting increasingly "retarded" as you put it. The whole concept of tanking is first off, retarded in its own terms. No teams will purposely lose to obtain an unknown entity. Who knows how any prospect will translate there game in the NHL? Your happy when he lose, to throw away an entire season for 1 player while compromising the development of 5-6 other young kids we have in our lineup.

Point is, its 5 games in. The habs were the better team the last 2 games and have come up short minus their best scorer and missing Markov, Spacek & Campoli.
The wanting of a high draft pick is wanted & warranted 70 games in and they are 10 points back of 8th. Then im all for it. As long as they are not mathematically eliminated, anything is possible.
Most tanking attempts begin before the tanking team is mathematically eliminated, sometimes as early as 5 games in (see the draft year that led to the Pens landing Mario Lemieux). But I'd rather hold judgment until Cammalleri and Markov both come back into play, Spacek and Campoli to a lesser extent.

If a team waits until they are about 1 or 2 losses away from mathematical elimination to tank, tanking will likely not work as they wanted it.

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Old
10-19-2011, 08:10 AM
  #43
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I think I should refrain from reading this board when the habs are on a losing streak... It's quite depressive.

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Old
10-19-2011, 08:19 AM
  #44
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It will not be easy to finish below the Ottawa Senators

If you're going to tank you gotta do it right!

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Old
10-19-2011, 08:25 AM
  #45
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I think I'm the most unbiased Habs fan of all, I want to see them finish last every season! That means I'm not biased!

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Old
10-19-2011, 08:30 AM
  #46
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I want a top three pick in 2012 but I see Montreal making the playoffs with the 7th or 8th seed in the east and either losing in the first or second round.

Players I would love to talk for are:

Mikhail Grigorenko
RW / 6'2" / 191 pounds

Alex Galchenyuk
C / 6'1" / 185 pounds

Ryan Murray
D / 6'0" / 190 pounds

As for Nail Yakupov, I have seen him play and the kid has talent but I don't want Russian players and I feel that at 5'10" he is too small and we need a BIG centre with skill like Galchenyuk or a shutdown defenseman with skill to play with our amazing core of future defenseman in Murray.

Imagine:

Subban - Murray
Tinordi - Beaulieu

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Old
10-19-2011, 09:45 AM
  #47
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Quote:
Originally Posted by WestIslander View Post
I want a top three pick in 2012 but I see Montreal making the playoffs with the 7th or 8th seed in the east and either losing in the first or second round.

Players I would love to talk for are:

Mikhail Grigorenko
RW / 6'2" / 191 pounds

Alex Galchenyuk
C / 6'1" / 185 pounds

Ryan Murray
D / 6'0" / 190 pounds

As for Nail Yakupov, I have seen him play and the kid has talent but I don't want Russian players and I feel that at 5'10" he is too small and we need a BIG centre with skill like Galchenyuk or a shutdown defenseman with skill to play with our amazing core of future defenseman in Murray.

Imagine:

Subban - Murray
Tinordi - Beaulieu
Sooo you don't want Russian players, yet you have Mikhail Grigorenko first on your list?

Not wanting Yakupov because he's Russian is just insanity, straight up.

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Old
10-19-2011, 09:46 AM
  #48
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Originally Posted by Bloumeister View Post
Doug Wickenheiser - 1980
I was waiting for it. 20 or so posts for the correct answer. Scary.

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Old
10-19-2011, 09:52 AM
  #49
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Originally Posted by Mathradio View Post
Most tanking attempts begin before the tanking team is mathematically eliminated, sometimes as early as 5 games in (see the draft year that led to the Pens landing Mario Lemieux). But I'd rather hold judgment until Cammalleri and Markov both come back into play, Spacek and Campoli to a lesser extent.

If a team waits until they are about 1 or 2 losses away from mathematical elimination to tank, tanking will likely not work as they wanted it.
Yeah, which is why the Pens suck balls and always will, in my eyes. Tampa is in that group too, and Edmonton is about to join them. Edmonton has been tanking for 2 years already. What a shame on that once great team. The NHL should NOT allow a team to pick top 3 two years in a row, let alone three. End of.

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Old
10-19-2011, 09:52 AM
  #50
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Quote:
Originally Posted by WestIslander View Post
I want a top three pick in 2012 but I see Montreal making the playoffs with the 7th or 8th seed in the east and either losing in the first or second round.

Players I would love to talk for are:

Mikhail Grigorenko
RW / 6'2" / 191 pounds

Alex Galchenyuk
C / 6'1" / 185 pounds

Ryan Murray
D / 6'0" / 190 pounds

As for Nail Yakupov, I have seen him play and the kid has talent but I don't want Russian players and I feel that at 5'10" he is too small and we need a BIG centre with skill like Galchenyuk or a shutdown defenseman with skill to play with our amazing core of future defenseman in Murray.

Imagine:

Subban - Murray
Tinordi - Beaulieu
I hope you're not talking about Murray. He's an exceptionnal OFFENSIVE d-man. Grigorenko and Galchenyuk are also Russians so what about your logic? I would take an offensive dynamite like Patrick Kane(Yakupov he's even more physical) in my team everyday of the week.

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