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Desperate Times Call For

View Poll Results: What do you do now? (check all that apply)
Stay the course. Howson and Arneil will right the ship. Give them time. 10 13.16%
Trade for a G, either demote or get rid of Mason. 31 40.79%
Upgrade the D. A significant upgrade will likely cost RyJo/high picks but gotta do it. 22 28.95%
Strip Nash's C, or trade him 23 30.26%
Make other moves to detonate the player leadership core (besides Nash) 11 14.47%
Fire Arneil. 24 31.58%
Fire Howson immediately. Start the search for a new GM. 24 31.58%
Fire Howson at the end of the year. 8 10.53%
Fire Priest. 29 38.16%
Multiple Choice Poll. Voters: 76. You may not vote on this poll

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Old
10-19-2011, 02:37 PM
  #51
blahblah
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Originally Posted by Skraut View Post
In the middle of that 30 games we brought in a new first line center, a new top power play quarterback, 2 new backup goaltender.
I get what your saying, but it wasn't in the middle it was more like 3/4. You've done an admirable job of hyperbole with the rest of it.

Point, the players that played during that streak last year aren't doing any better this. How long are you going to allow Arniel to try and work through it?

You aren't going to get anywhere with the "Don't change anything" route. I've head that for years around here by everyone under the sun for this or any number of topics. It has never ended well. If you think you are going to get me to rethink if we are still 4 or 5 games under .500 around game 20 that I'll think we should stay the course, you'll be very disappointed.

As it is, I realize it's very unlikely anything will happen until Wiz gets a few games back. You'll, most likely, get your wish in the short term. I don't like the structural problems I see on the ice, so I, personally, don't see a ton of reason to wait. Maybe he pulls out of, maybe he doesn't. What I do know is the team is not executing on his system. Or, lord help us, they are.

Bottom line, off season changes aren't really an excuse for a 0-5-1 start. They certainly aren't for a 0-3-1 start at home.


Last edited by blahblah: 10-19-2011 at 02:44 PM.
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10-19-2011, 02:41 PM
  #52
pete goegan
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Originally Posted by Palinka View Post
... Brassard still projects as a possible first-line center, although he's further behind the development curve than I would have expected by this point.
Yeah, I'd say he's barely chosen a line to take to apex that first curve.

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The biggest change I'd make is to do what Lou Lamoriello used to do when he had a young struggling team. The paychecks would be delivered to his office, and on payday, each player would have to come in and actually get it from him. Lamoriello would sometimes just give it to the player, but other times he'd look the player in the eye and ask, "Can you honestly say that you earned this paycheck?"
That is administrative genius!

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10-19-2011, 02:48 PM
  #53
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Originally Posted by pete goegan View Post
That is administrative genius!
I didn't read that from Palinka yet, might have glossed over it. However, that does fit in with what I said about maybe it's time to make the players less comfortable.

In the days of direct deposit it's probably not an option, but it would be fun.

I like when you can get someone to self reflect instead of just telling them what they did wrong.

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10-19-2011, 02:51 PM
  #54
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Originally Posted by blahblah View Post
You aren't going to get anywhere with the "Don't change anything" route. I've head that for years around here by everyone under the sun for this or any number of topics. It has never ended well.
Fortunately, the "make changes now" route has always been successful.

(Look. I'm totally clueless as to what the root issue is and what to do about it. Goofing off is all I have left...)

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10-19-2011, 03:16 PM
  #55
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Originally Posted by Double-Shift Lassť View Post
Fortunately, the "make changes now" route has always been successful.

(Look. I'm totally clueless as to what the root issue is and what to do about it. Goofing off is all I have left...)
And you are doing a great job of it!

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10-19-2011, 03:43 PM
  #56
pete goegan
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Interesting take from LtL:

http://www.lightthelamp.com/2011-art...s-against.html

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10-19-2011, 04:04 PM
  #57
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Originally Posted by pete goegan View Post
Yeah, decent points all through. I would contend that we're giving up prime chances that need to be cleaned up. Yes, I agree with him that the defense isn't that bad. A decrease in the shots allowed are a product of a few things, we've also had great offensive zone time.

That first goal was just poor. However, as far as replacing him, the team is handcuffed. In that now famous plan of mine (3 whole people!), one of things I was doing was freeing up the money to get Mason off the roster and bring in a replacement. Anyone saying Turco hasn't watched this guy much over the last couple of years. While he might give us performance greater than Mason, it wouldn't be by a great deal.

I don't want to flail around wildly in desperation. As I've always said, once you clean up the play in front of the goaltender then you can give a real evaluation of the goal tender. I've already said we shouldn't have signed Mason to that contract, but I also wanted to see what the new goal tending coach would do. If last nights game is any indication, not much. If that SO is further evidence, no improvement at all.

I agree that we are probably at the time to address the goal tending. But that's difficult to do with a 2.9 million goal tender on the roster and up against the cap.

We can clean up those chances against. We did some of that in the last game.

I really hope Mason get's his game together. Howson keeps trying to cover up his own mistakes on the roster. Based on the situation he was in I agreed with is calculated risk and then the injury (Dek).

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10-19-2011, 04:07 PM
  #58
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I'll tell you one that hasn't changed that I'd like to see changed with this organization..

LOSING!

Pro sports is built on change. The only teams that don't make significant changes are winning teams which we aren't. Even then you have your Flyers and Sharks that are constantly making significant moves to their lineups despite making the playoffs year in/year out.

Heck -- the model this entire league is built on gurantees change. The key is correctly identifying what area(s) needs changed and successfully executing it.

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10-19-2011, 04:08 PM
  #59
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Just an outsider's prospective here.

I went to the game last night-I'm from Cincinnati and go to about one game at Nationwide every year. I also don't watch the team on TV, so my exposure is very limited.

The team I saw last night didn't look to be an awful team. The dubious waved-off goal didn't help matters either. Nash has never had a bad game when I've seen him play and last night he was no exception. He was without a doubt by far the most effective offensive player for the Jackets. Overall, the Jackets created quite a few legitimate scoring opportunities for themselves; far more than the Stars did.

I certainly don't know what the answer is, but the one regulation win in the past 30 or so games for Arniel shouldn't be acceptable under any circumstances. The team I watched last night is certainly capable of better than that. The biggest worry I would have if I were a diehard fan is the lack of energy in the fanbase. There may have been 5,000 at the arena last night. The noise level was significantly less than a weeknight ECHL game in Cincinnati-now granted everyone is on one level at those games and the beer is $1-but, suffice to say, the atmosphere at the game was anything but energetic.

I hope the organization does turn it around. The arena is outstanding and a consistently winning team would likely draw very well in the area.

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10-19-2011, 04:42 PM
  #60
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I've been on the "Trade Nash" wagon for at least three years now, and I so far I haven't seen a reason why I should change it. There's no better way of "changing the culture" than to get rid of the only player left from said culture

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10-19-2011, 04:46 PM
  #61
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Brassard showed tonight what he can do when given a chance...not playing 4th line wing. Trade Vermette. I see absolutely nothing from the guy. We could get a solid defender for him and I really like Brass as our #2 guy that can fill in and play with Nash....he does have the best chemistry with him honestly..
Actually Brassard had a terrible game aside from the goal. So if thats showing "what he can do", which would be turning the puck over with either a bad pass/swagger move that draws everyone offside/or just plain losing the handle, then I've seen enough.

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10-19-2011, 04:51 PM
  #62
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I am surprised no one has mentioned Umberger's disasterous non-performance so far.


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10-19-2011, 05:22 PM
  #63
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Not sure if this is the best place to put this, but here's as good a place as any.

Anyone drinking the "Rick Nash is a Superstar" kool-aid needs to watch this video ten times in a row. Go ahead, I'll just wait here till you're done.






Nash, who is 6'4", could have BURIED Benn. Just destroyed him. But instead, he makes a half-a$$ed swipe at him, misses, and retreats while adjusting his visor while Benn scores the goal. I think the team is playing like the captain, and isn't fully committed to Sparkle Motion, err, I mean WINNING. A winner wouldn't have stopped at anything while a guy was in a scoring position and he had a chance to stop him. Truly, this video encapsulates what we as fans find so frustrating about Rick Nash, and, by extension, the entire team.

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10-19-2011, 05:24 PM
  #64
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that vid you posted plong is a microcosm of the Blue Jackets.

****ing lazy *****, every one of them, don't wanna put in the work, they just want the results. No heart, no desire, and a new coach or GM won't change that.

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10-19-2011, 05:30 PM
  #65
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I would agree that you gotta pin Benn to the boards, but you folks do notice that Nash was heading off the ice at the end of a shift, right? see him skating towards the open door, then changing his mind?

Not saying it's a particularly good excuse, but often considering where someone is during a shift can explain 'laziness'.

Nash was throwing his body around last night, checking hard, even in open ice. Hard to use this one example as an indication of how he played all game, IMO.

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10-19-2011, 06:04 PM
  #66
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Nash was throwing his body around last night, checking hard, even in open ice. Hard to use this one example as an indication of how he played all game, IMO.
I agree with you, he did play a decent game last night. That's just it, though; it's not the whole game. It's sporadic lapses like this that are the reason he's not actually a superstar, or even a consistent 70-point scorer. Even if he was skating towards the bench and changed his mind (good!), he then doesn't commit fully to stopping the play (bad!). He was right there, and he decided to do a little stick poke instead of using his massive god-given body and stopping the guy. And then, his body language after that is more "I don't care" than "Is there something else I can do to stop this guy?".

Maybe Rick Nash is the Jay Cutler of the NHL? Both men are supremely gifted athletically. Much like Nash, everyone who knows Cutler personally say he's the best dude, the hardest worker, totally committed, etc. But sometimes his playing field demeanor is confusing. I don't profess to know these guys personally, or have any insight into the locker room or psyche. But little things like this add up, and make you wonder.

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10-19-2011, 07:20 PM
  #67
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I think this situation absolutely requires a really futile and stupid gesture be done on somebody's part. And we're just the guys to do it.
Time for a slump buster?

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10-19-2011, 07:31 PM
  #68
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Time for a slump buster?
It would be cool if we could come up with something innovative that would not only band fans together but not come across as kicking dirt in the face of the players (as much as we'd like to for some of them). Like the money on the board last year. That was good, but I'm thinking something more long-term that could pick up steam if the Jackets started to mount a rally.

Civil war-era rally caps?

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10-19-2011, 07:43 PM
  #69
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Originally Posted by Nanabijou View Post
It would be cool if we could come up with something innovative that would not only band fans together but not come across as kicking dirt in the face of the players (as much as we'd like to for some of them). Like the money on the board last year. That was good, but I'm thinking something more long-term that could pick up steam if the Jackets started to mount a rally.

Civil war-era rally caps?
Dark Blue Jacket is going Neon until the slump is busted
http://darkbluejacket.blogspot.com/2...e-to-this.html
http://darkbluejacket.blogspot.com/2...-6-dallas.html

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10-19-2011, 07:52 PM
  #70
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I like it, but it may need to be something more visible to gain traction in the fanbase. Maybe we should join Matthew's Neon Navy and actually do the neon-out. Organize us, Grand Admiral!

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10-19-2011, 07:59 PM
  #71
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Desperate times call for a Stinger Third Jersey.

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10-19-2011, 08:05 PM
  #72
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Blast Nash all you want, but as someone who has played hockey their entire life, when backchecking on a one on three, the last thing you do is take a penalty. If I'm the forward there and I see two defensemen back, my only objective is to apply pressure to remove time and space. Nash did that ... at the point where he failed at the stick lift, it was then the defenseman's turn to step up and apply pressure, and the other defenseman should have dropped behind for insurance. Had Nash hooked, held, elbowed, dragged down, or any other way tried to stop Jamie Benn there, that's likely a penalty. By the time he reached Benn, there was little other option.

The bigger issue here is Aaron Johnson stepping up and whiffing on both the puck and the player. He has to get one or the other - no exception.

Had Nash taken a hooking penalty here, everyone would have been ticked about that as well - because there was no reason, in a one on three, for him to do so. It was a half-hearted effort by all four guys on the play - from Russell not finishing his check, to Brassard's lazy attempt at a pass across, to Nash not skating back hard enough, to Johnson completely failing in every aspect.

Blaming only Nash is completely unfair, he had less of an opportunity than every other player on this play to stop this play from happening. Why not blame Johnson? Because he makes less money and doesn't wear a letter?

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10-19-2011, 08:57 PM
  #73
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Many problems exist with this team- I'm not sure Scotty Bowman could mold them into a winner.

I believe it is mainly due to the type of people we draft or obtain in trade. With the exception of Wis they are soft. There are no Benn's, Iginla's, Getzlaff's, etc. We appear to have tried to emulate the Red Wings but have been completely inept at drafting/signing free agents/and trading. For years we picked the next guy from the Hockey News rankings of prospects, bypassing people like Anze Kopitar among many others.(and don''t even tallk about 2003) One of my to do's is to go back through the drafts and see how many other teams have drafted as poorly as we have. I know we made some changes in scouting but as I recall we just promoted people from within. So my first step in fixing the team is get a completely new scouting team. Second step is go find a goalie who can steal a game now and then. Has Mase stolen one since his rookie year? Third pray we can trade the long list of players Howson has signed to too long contracts. 4th, chose an alternative team to root for in addition to the BJ's.

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10-19-2011, 10:40 PM
  #74
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Ladies and gentlemen, when desperate times call for desperate measures, there is, truly, but one thing to do. If Paul Newman taught us anything (besides how to make great salad dressing), it's how to win a hockey game when you're short on talent, desire, looks, and everything else important in hockey. Everything, except for one thing ... the yearning to absolutely bash the opponent into submission!



Yes, it is time for a "Call to Violence" ... if you can't beat 'em ... beat 'em into submission!

Desperation? I say nay!

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10-19-2011, 10:59 PM
  #75
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Bumpy Bus Ride

I think the team is at the crossroads where - you have to blow it up. At least detonate the core.

I can't get too excited about a good effort and a near-OT game with Dallas on our home ice. Not at 0-5-1. If this represents a good post-bag-skate effort and we lose by 1 to the team stripped of its top skill players with the second-lowest payroll in the league (on our home ice) - then we are definitely not going to be anywhere near a playoff contender.

The CBJ were looking to be in the 5-6-7-8 hunt. I just don't see how we can leapfrog our way back up there even IF we start playing well on Friday. If we were the wings, a possible division champ - and we were playing poorly because of multiple significant injuries - then when the team got healthy we could thing about getting in the 5-8 mix. But that's not the CBJ.

I think it goes without saying that Howson and Arneil won't survive this year. Without some miracle like Clitsome suddenly contending for the Norris. Forgone conclusion IMO. Howson got rid of all the toughness this team had on D and didn't replace it. The D men can't clear the crase to save their lives. And Arneil and all his "D in the offense" BS - two things: We give up so many odd man rushes I can't even count, and.....where are all the goals our "offensive D" should be getting us? I think a good coach molds his system to fit the players he has available. Arneil is trying to shove square pegs into round holes, and Howson isn't getting him the round pegs. Apparently $65 million can't buy many round pegs. Under the bus they go!

I think Nash has got to go. He will be the trade bait that will start the rebuilding process. I think Portzline nailed it in the chat today - this team was convinced it had so much scoring prowess that they wouldn't have to play defense, wouldn't have to play tough....Poorly communicated to the team by Arneil, no doubt......

.....But after how many years of this, after how many Clarks, Moreaus, and other "leaders" brought in to fill the "player leader" void.......After how many coaches, systems, strategies, etc. - How can we not question the player-level leadership?

As for the "de facto" leader RJ - It seems he has got a bit of the "I got my big contract and now I'm gonna kick back and coast" mentality. Given the absence of the "leader players" like Moreau, with Nash being his ususal non-leader self and with RJ mentally checking out..........Arneil's poor coaching and Howson stripping out all the toughness....

perfect recipe for a team coming out of the gate DOA.

Oh yeah...almost forgot....Steve Mason.....he goes under the bus too


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