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Rinaldo injures BOTH Doughty and Penner

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Old
10-20-2011, 07:44 AM
  #76
Banger
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Protest View Post
I know, the opposition trembles for those whole 5 minutes he's out on the ice. Any moron can fly around the ice like a maniac and hit people, that's not talent and it is not hockey.

Do you really think the opposition cares about zac rinaldo? Do you care about playing against Orr? I sure as hell don't. He's out there for 5 minutes and takes a stupid penalty.

And no my evidence isn't an opinion, my evidence is that he plays less than 6 minutes a night, and those players don't play in the playoffs unless they absolutely have too. I'd much rather have Blair Betts play 13 minutes a night, than Rinaldo play 5.

Also, I understand his role. There are however, players that exist that do those things and still can play hockey at the NHL level.
Betts is done...he's been done. I'm not sure why people can't see that.

Ya, the opposition does care about him. Despite playing just a few minutes he had an impact on the game with his hit/fight. He gets under teams skin which is his role and he does it well. You are living in the past with respect to your opinions on Betts and Zac.

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10-20-2011, 07:59 AM
  #77
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Would be awesome if Patterson gave Rinaldo tons and tons of PK time down in the AHL in progress to become to a really great 4th liner. I'm sure we haven't seen his last NHL game, folks.

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10-20-2011, 08:07 AM
  #78
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Coutsiephan View Post
Why you all HEFF to hate the crazy Italian? I mean I think all the detractors are anti-italian..yeah that's it! I blame The Jersey Shore for this ethnic attack....

But seriously, I have my concerns with him but I also see some decent intangibles and potential..
This made me think of Goodfellas when they're outside the restaurant waiting for it to catch fire haha.

"Prejudice against Italians. In this day and age? Do you believe that?

Quote:
Originally Posted by sm0ka47 View Post
If any moron can hit people then why are there so many few good open ice hitters?

Why haven't we seen a hitter like Scott Stevens since he retired?

It actually does take skill to hit people. Anticipation and positioning.
Is Zac Rinaldo as good a hitter as Stevens? Even if he was, Stevens still did other things that helped his team win, like being awesome at defense, and putting up points.

Any moron can hit people because the vast majority of hits are not open ice.

Quote:
Originally Posted by FreshPrinceOfBriere View Post
Yes, yes I do think the opposition cares about Zac Rinaldo. There's a difference between a big slow goon and someone who has the skating ability/technique to deliver devastating hits anywhere on the ice. Sure, anyone can attempt to play the body, but how many can hit like Rinaldo?

The refs have been in their early season whistle everything mode, which is turning games into a special team-off. Not going to get a ton of minutes in these type of contests. I think he's capable of taking regular 4th line shifts.

We'll see what happens. Obviously, he's back down for now. Pumped to see Schenn.
If you're saying you think he can be a capable hockey player, and provide more than just hitting and goonery then that's fine. I don't see it, and I don't think there is a place for someone who only hits and fights. If he proves in the AHL he is capable of more than that's great. I'd love to have a player that can hit and skate like him, provided they can do other things to help the team and aren't bat **** crazy.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Banger View Post
Betts is done...he's been done. I'm not sure why people can't see that.

Ya, the opposition does care about him. Despite playing just a few minutes he had an impact on the game with his hit/fight. He gets under teams skin which is his role and he does it well. You are living in the past with respect to your opinions on Betts and Zac.

I know Betts is done. I'm not talking about Betts the person, but Betts the player type. A good defensive player.

Rinaldo serves his role, but his role is useless. There are other players that exist that do the things he does in a more controlled manner, and can still play.

Upshall hit, skated fast and got under peoples' skin. He could also play hockey.

Lappy could hit, and fight (and far more important than just fighting, he knew when to fight). He could also play hockey

The list can go on, and on. You do not need these Rinaldo type players. Having them as the 13th forward and dressing them when the other team dresses their moron is fine, but even still the whole concept is stupid. They both play 4:30 and as soon as they're on the ice at the same time they fight. Its pointless. That type of fighting is not needed, and you're living in the past if you think it is needed.

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Old
10-20-2011, 08:17 AM
  #79
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Protest View Post
I know Betts is done. I'm not talking about Betts the person, but Betts the player type. A good defensive player.

Rinaldo serves his role, but his role is useless. There are other players that exist that do the things he does in a more controlled manner, and can still play.

Upshall hit, skated fast and got under peoples' skin. He could also play hockey.

Lappy could hit, and fight (and far more important than just fighting, he knew when to fight). He could also play hockey

The list can go on, and on. You do not need these Rinaldo type players. Having them as the 13th forward and dressing them when the other team dresses their moron is fine, but the whole concept is stupid. They both play 4:30 and as soon as theu're on the ice at the same time they fight. Its pointless. That type of fighting is not needed, and you're living in the past if you think it is needed.
Rinaldo makes $500K and that matters...comparing him to Upshall? cmon. What kind of comparison is that? Why not compare him to Lucic?

You say controlled manner...has he been out of control? If he has I haven't seen it...has he hurt the team with dumb penalties?

You say they don't need a Rinaldo type of player but you're wrong and the Flyers obviously disagree with you. You have formed your opinion based on the past and it'll take time to open your eyes to reality.

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Old
10-20-2011, 08:27 AM
  #80
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Protest View Post
Is Zac Rinaldo as good a hitter as Stevens? Even if he was, Stevens still did other things that helped his team win, like being awesome at defense, and putting up points.

Any moron can hit people because the vast majority of hits are not open ice.
I never said he was. It was an example. The best hitters who played in the NHL could skate. Jody Shelley should be a big hitter because of his size. But hes not. Why? Because he can't skate. Any moron can't hit. Delivering good body checks actually takes skill. The only useless hitter i can think of was Steve Webb. Now he sucked in every facet of the game.

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Old
10-20-2011, 11:51 AM
  #81
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PSPhantoms Tim McManus
Talked to Zac Rinaldo who seems in great spirits. Terrific, quotable material as always from him in tomorrow's paper.

PSPhantoms Tim McManus
Interesting thing is it looks like Phantoms are really going to try to develop Rinaldo as a penalty killer. Seems a priority.

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10-20-2011, 11:59 AM
  #82
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I'm fine/pleased with that. If the guy can get good on defense, he can turn into something pretty worthwhile.

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Old
10-20-2011, 12:36 PM
  #83
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Banger View Post
Rinaldo makes $500K and that matters...comparing him to Upshall? cmon. What kind of comparison is that? Why not compare him to Lucic?

You say controlled manner...has he been out of control? If he has I haven't seen it...has he hurt the team with dumb penalties?

You say they don't need a Rinaldo type of player but you're wrong and the Flyers obviously disagree with you. You have formed your opinion based on the past and it'll take time to open your eyes to reality.
I'm not comparing him to those players, I'm showing that people exist that can do some or all of the things he can, and also provide something more important. Hitting and fighting are secondary skills, and even players who are not offensive machines, like Lappy and OD, had much more to provide to the team than a guy like Rinaldo.

Rinaldo plays 5 minutes a night for a reason. He is not a good player, and his role is not important. If he can work on his defense, pk'ing, and keep himself under control then he could definitely be an effective 4th liner. He just isn't there yet.

Quote:
Originally Posted by sm0ka47 View Post
I never said he was. It was an example. The best hitters who played in the NHL could skate. Jody Shelley should be a big hitter because of his size. But hes not. Why? Because he can't skate. Any moron can't hit. Delivering good body checks actually takes skill. The only useless hitter i can think of was Steve Webb. Now he sucked in every facet of the game.
I know you were just giving an example, and that's true, you do have to be an adequate skater. However, it doesn't change the fact that solely being able to hit and fight is not enough to warrant a roster spot. You have to bring something else to the table, and plenty of players do combine offensive, or defensive skill with the ability to hit, agitate, or fight.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Banger View Post
PSPhantoms Tim McManus
Talked to Zac Rinaldo who seems in great spirits. Terrific, quotable material as always from him in tomorrow's paper.

PSPhantoms Tim McManus
Interesting thing is it looks like Phantoms are really going to try to develop Rinaldo as a penalty killer. Seems a priority.
"You say they don't need a Rinaldo type of player but you're wrong and the Flyers obviously disagree with you."

They disagreed with me so much that they sent him to the AHL to learn how to kill penalties, which is something that actually contributes to the overall success of the team.

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Old
10-20-2011, 12:46 PM
  #84
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Protest View Post
I'm not comparing him to those players, I'm showing that people exist that can do some or all of the things he can, and also provide something more important. Hitting and fighting are secondary skills, and even players who are not offensive machines, like Lappy and OD, had much more to provide to the team than a guy like Rinaldo.

Rinaldo plays 5 minutes a night for a reason. He is not a good player, and his role is not important. If he can work on his defense, pk'ing, and keep himself under control then he could definitely be an effective 4th liner. He just isn't there yet.



I know you were just giving an example, and that's true, you do have to be an adequate skater. However, it doesn't change the fact that solely being able to hit and fight is not enough to warrant a roster spot. You have to bring something else to the table, and plenty of players do combine offensive, or defensive skill with the ability to hit, agitate, or fight.



"You say they don't need a Rinaldo type of player but you're wrong and the Flyers obviously disagree with you."

They disagreed with me so much that they sent him to the AHL to learn how to kill penalties, which is something that actually contributes to the overall success of the team.
the point is that you and many others have had your mind made up on the player he will be/can be...based on previous incidents, minor league stats, etc.. To me I've seen a kid that is absolutely driven to succeed and make the most of his abilities and do whatever it takes to play and make it in the NHL despite the odds. "You" have seen him as what he was and I tend to look at him in what he's done to turn the page....he was fat and out of shape...he dedicated himself all offseason, moved to Philly to train with the club, dropped the weight and got kudos from the organization. He was told that his antics aren't going to work in the NHL and he's been great..no bad penalties/suspensions and has made some nice hits and played solid games.

If you would have told me at this point last year that he would make the team this year out of training camp I would have thought you were nuts. It's obvious that the organization sees something in the kid and he's not just a dime a dozen goon that so many have classified him as.

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Old
10-20-2011, 12:56 PM
  #85
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Banger View Post
the point is that you and many others have had your mind made up on the player he will be/can be...based on previous incidents, minor league stats, etc.. To me I've seen a kid that is absolutely driven to succeed and make the most of his abilities and do whatever it takes to play and make it in the NHL despite the odds. "You" have seen him as what he was and I tend to look at him in what he's done to turn the page....he was fat and out of shape...he dedicated himself all offseason, moved to Philly to train with the club, dropped the weight and got kudos from the organization. He was told that his antics aren't going to work in the NHL and he's been great..no bad penalties/suspensions and has made some nice hits and played solid games.

If you would have told me at this point last year that he would make the team this year out of training camp I would have thought you were nuts. It's obvious that the organization sees something in the kid and he's not just a dime a dozen goon that so many have classified him as.
I have not made up my mind on what he can be; I just know what he is, and what he is is someone who needs to learn more ways to contribute. I said this in the post you quoted:

"If he can work on his defense, pk'ing, and keep himself under control then he could definitely be an effective 4th liner. He just isn't there yet."

That's not me making my mind up on someone.

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Old
10-20-2011, 06:19 PM
  #86
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I canīt understand this discussion.

We speak about Shelley or Rinaldo...
We speak about Lilja or Walker....

Did really anyone of you want Shelley more than Rinaldo? Cmon guys that canīt be true.

Rinaldo fights everyone and donīt look bad, Shelley look terrible in almost every fight. Shelley looks so ****ing terrible on the ice it could be my grandma. Rinaldo is fast and checks really good. Shelley is lucky if he hits one player per game! Shelley isnīt playing special teams so why should Rinaldo must play pk?

Sure everyone want 4th liner that can score, pass, hit, fight and play pk, but players like that donīt grow on trees. And i take Rinaldo with his cap hit over Shelley anytime of the day!


Walker: IMO he gets his roster spot because of his fighting. Itīs seems that the organisation think, they need fighting too sell out the arena. Said that Walker is on the team although he plays like ****. I canīt remember one good game from him. Also his fighting ability isnt really entertaining. I take Lilja over him although he donīt fight.

Quote:
Originally Posted by BleedOrange View Post
http://www.hockeybuzz.com/blog/Bill-...01911/45/38994
"I personally think either Rinaldo or Zolnierczyk should have stayed with the big club and Shelley have been the one to be waived. I realize that Shelley is a veteran, a heavyweight and a good locker room and practice presence. However, as stated many times before, I think he makes too much on the cap for a player of his role, especially considering the team's cap problems. Same thing goes for Matt Walker, who did not play well in his first game of the season last night while the much more affordable Andreas Lilja was generally effective as the sixth defenseman in his first four games. "



In summary:

If the organisation want a fighter on the team, i really take Rinaldo over Walker and Shelley. Think about we get rid of the two salaries from Walker and Shelley. Than we will have a good chance at the trade deadline if a veteran presence is needed for the playoffs! I would like to get a dman to play with Coburn on the 3rd line!


In a perfect world i really can imagine of another 4th line:

Powe - Bergeron - Clutterbuck


Speed, Checking, Dzone play, PK, Scoring abilities....


But we arent in the perfect world we are in a cap world!


Last edited by Ironmanrulez: 10-20-2011 at 07:06 PM. Reason: Insert the quote by bleed Orange from another Thread!
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