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Theoretically Trading Lundqvist

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10-26-2011, 06:07 AM
  #26
That Stepan Guy
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ilovemarkmessier View Post
Wouldnt do this in a million years. I dont think you guys realize yet that Lunquist is one of the greatest goalies of all time. By far th eall time best Ranger goalie. To trade him would be pure stupitity
T-H-E-O-R-E-T-I-C-A-L-L-Y

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1. a : relating to or having the character of theory : abstract
b : confined to theory or speculation often in contrast to practical applications : speculative <theoretical physics>
2
: given to or skilled in theorizing <a brilliant theoretical physicist>
3
: existing only in theory : hypothetical <gave as an example a theoretical situation>
Back to the thread.

I'd assume we could get a pretty good package for Lundqvist if such a trade would occur.

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10-26-2011, 06:18 AM
  #27
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Originally Posted by ilovemarkmessier View Post
This is the stupidist post of all time. Hank loves New York and we love him. Pointless would never happen in a million years. Please delete post!
For gods sake please read the ****ing post before you make a comment. Selective reading is generally frowned upon, and when making a stupid reply such as yours, people get annoyed.

And to your trade proposal later in the thread, I don't think LA would do that, to be honest.

If I would do a HYPOTHETICAL trade, I'd go to Columbus and ask if they wanted to trade Lundqvist for Nash straight up.

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10-26-2011, 06:30 AM
  #28
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Didn't Colorado give Washington a potential lottery 2012 1'st for Varlamov, who was probably heading to the KHL?

With that said, I think Lundqvist could fetch a very good return.

Trade proposals aren't really my thing but could trade him to a team like the Kings for Quick or Bernier, throw in someone like Kopitar also.

I would only trade him if we brought back a young proven goalie and a superstar forward

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10-26-2011, 06:59 AM
  #29
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Unfortunately, goalies don't seem to carry the value of a elite offensive player/defensive player (though Hank is a top goalie).

In reality, its not going to happen in this current state but like others have state, you never know down the road.

I would think he is worth at least a late 1st rounder and player (NHL veteran or AHL prospect). Im sure there would have to be some kind of salery dump involved to for Hanks contract. Then again, this is why I don't make trade proposals because it will never be agreed upon in this place. I have a better chance of hitting the lottery lol.

And no, this is not the dumbest posts. There have been far worse. Hell the bipolar that goes around is laughable.

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10-26-2011, 07:15 AM
  #30
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ílovemarkmessier is on a role! Finds someone to insult in every thread and only makes a mockery out of himself. Do u even know what theoretically means? Please, make a new account and re-start here as "someone else"

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10-26-2011, 07:24 AM
  #31
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Originally Posted by HagelinForPresident View Post
ílovemarkmessier is on a role! Finds someone to insult in every thread and only makes a mockery out of himself. Do u even know what theoretically means? Please, make a new account and re-start here as "someone else"
And he just signed on too. Me thinks that at this rate he'll be lucky to make it to his 2nd month as a member heheh

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10-26-2011, 07:29 AM
  #32
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Doughty and Bernier?

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10-26-2011, 07:31 AM
  #33
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If Henrik was ever on the market I have a feeling that Detroit would be the first to bang on Slats door for a chat.

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10-26-2011, 07:33 AM
  #34
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Originally Posted by YMMV View Post
And no, this is not the dumbest posts. There have been far worse. Hell the bipolar that goes around is laughable.
Lol this. In the off-season Callahan was a superstar forward who we would never trade unless for Stamkos or Ovechkin, and now we start losing a few games, the other day I'm pretty sure I saw someone call him "just a 3rd liner"

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10-26-2011, 07:37 AM
  #35
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Originally Posted by YMMV View Post
Unfortunately, goalies don't seem to carry the value of a elite offensive player/defensive player (though Hank is a top goalie).

In reality, its not going to happen in this current state but like others have state, you never know down the road.

I would think he is worth at least a late 1st rounder and player (NHL veteran or AHL prospect). Im sure there would have to be some kind of salery dump involved to for Hanks contract. Then again, this is why I don't make trade proposals because it will never be agreed upon in this place. I have a better chance of hitting the lottery lol.

And no, this is not the dumbest posts. There have been far worse. Hell the bipolar that goes around is laughable.
Initially, I thought that it's a bit odd that goalies doesn't have comparable trade value, especially as they see 20 min + of icetime for 60 - 80 games + playoffs every season, and that the trade would be moronic, almost regardless.

Help me if I'm wrong, but going over the stats for last season, comparing e.g. Lundquist with, Thomas the best in the leage last season, Fleury, somewhat mediocre last year and Kiprusoff well below the best, based soly on sv%, the differnce in GA is only 10 goals a game between Lunquist and Fleury. Between Thomas and Kiprusiff a whole 36, while Lundquist vs Kiprusuff 24 goals.

Taking into consideration Biron had the same sv % as Lundquist, but only for 17 games: Given that he would as the 1. goalie for 70 +/- games play something like Fleury at 0.906, and we bring up Talbot from Whale as his backup, I would make good sence to do a trade with him attached to Wolski and Fedetenko, for a top 30 pruducing forward and a good D.

Might get some more entertaining hockey in MSG as well, with more goals. And if one would want to trade someone, it makes just as much sense doing it when they are at their peak.

A lot of ifs and buts, obviously very simplified, but yes..why not a trade? The difference between a good and a decent goalie is not that big? He's a great goalie, probably at his peak, but a slightly worse goalie might tempt Torts to create some offence now and then.


Last edited by Ilovemymum: 10-26-2011 at 07:43 AM.
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10-26-2011, 07:48 AM
  #36
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Any theoretical trading of lundqvist went out the door the minute Brad signed.

And even still, we would never get back equal value on him. A team that is trading for lundqvist isn't going to have the high picks and TOP prospects a rebuilding team would demand, which is what we'd be if we traded him.

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10-26-2011, 08:15 AM
  #37
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Welshy3413 View Post
Lol this. In the off-season Callahan was a superstar forward who we would never trade unless for Stamkos or Ovechkin, and now we start losing a few games, the other day I'm pretty sure I saw someone call him "just a 3rd liner"


If I'm not mistaken, someone even called him a 4th liner.

And to the guy above that this is the "stupidest" post--calm down. It's an interesting topic.

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10-26-2011, 08:54 AM
  #38
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Originally Posted by asphyXy View Post
Wayne Gretzky got traded. Anything's possible.
Gretzky got traded because they got a ton of cash in the deal and the team was hurting financially. If it was the CBA era where cash could not be included in deals, he would have never been traded (or the trade itself would have been a lot different--at least a half dozen draft picks).

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10-26-2011, 09:02 AM
  #39
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The one hiccup with trading Lundqvist is his cap hit. Yes, he's an elite goalie. Yes, he's world-class. The issue is that he carries a 6.875M cap hit. If he was making something closer to what Luongo is making (5.333M) he would fetch a hell of a lot more (then again, Luongo has one of those lifetime contracts).

Realistically, with the way the goalie market is, I would see us getting a 1st, 2nd, and a top-6 F or top-4 D, and I don't think that's worth it. Biron is almost 40, and none of our goalie prospects look ready for full-time NHL duty (CJ didn't look terrible, and Talbot didn't look bad in preseason). There's also the factor of the fans rioting (figuratively) when they hear, demanding Sather's head. Would be interesting...

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10-26-2011, 09:07 AM
  #40
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Quote:
Originally Posted by HAPPY HOUR View Post
If Henrik was ever on the market I have a feeling that Detroit would be the first to bang on Slats door for a chat.
Not sure they have what we would want.

They are not trading Pavel or Zetterberg and there's nothing else there I want.

Howard would be a nice start as he is a damn fine goalie in his own right, but they do not have anything I would want.

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10-26-2011, 09:08 AM
  #41
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I think hypothetically is the right word.

And that would give you a top line forward + 1st round pick or top 4 D-man. Goalies dont fetch as much value as skaters.

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10-26-2011, 09:32 AM
  #42
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kritikal View Post
The one hiccup with trading Lundqvist is his cap hit. Yes, he's an elite goalie. Yes, he's world-class. The issue is that he carries a 6.875M cap hit. If he was making something closer to what Luongo is making (5.333M) he would fetch a hell of a lot more (then again, Luongo has one of those lifetime contracts).

Realistically, with the way the goalie market is, I would see us getting a 1st, 2nd, and a top-6 F or top-4 D, and I don't think that's worth it. Biron is almost 40, and none of our goalie prospects look ready for full-time NHL duty (CJ didn't look terrible, and Talbot didn't look bad in preseason). There's also the factor of the fans rioting (figuratively) when they hear, demanding Sather's head. Would be interesting...
Isn't Biron like 34?

But yeah, I agree with you. Wouldn't fetch us much. There are a lot of really good goalies out there. The difference between the top5 goalies in NHL are literally nothing. The difference between top15 isn't that big either.

The need for a top6 forward or top4 defenseman is way greater than an established number 1 goalie, because _most_ teams have one already.

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10-26-2011, 09:43 AM
  #43
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In my opinion, there were 3 moments where this team could have gotten really serious about a rebuild.

1. When Sather first took over in 2000 - didnt do it, chugged along with aging names and continued failure.

2. 2004 - This is the closest we got, but outside of a couple of picks that have worked out, we really netted nothing of significance in the great purge of 2004. Plus we kept Jagr, which really defeats the agenda of a rebuild anyhow.

3. 2008 - After Jagr left. If there was a theoretical time to trade Lundqvist, this would've been it. But the fanbase would've revolted if Sather got rid of his most popular player with all the additional horrendous contracts the team was saddled with.

Point is, Sather has been unwilling to make the sacrifices necessary to truly rebuild a team, and hes not going to start now - and starting means trading Lundqvist...and probably Richards and Gaborik while you're at it.

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10-26-2011, 09:56 AM
  #44
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Originally Posted by Bleed Ranger Blue View Post
In my opinion, there were 3 moments where this team could have gotten really serious about a rebuild.

1. When Sather first took over in 2000 - didnt do it, chugged along with aging names and continued failure.

2. 2004 - This is the closest we got, but outside of a couple of picks that have worked out, we really netted nothing of significance in the great purge of 2004. Plus we kept Jagr, which really defeats the agenda of a rebuild anyhow.

3. 2008 - After Jagr left. If there was a theoretical time to trade Lundqvist, this would've been it. But the fanbase would've revolted if Sather got rid of his most popular player with all the additional horrendous contracts the team was saddled with.

Point is, Sather has been unwilling to make the sacrifices necessary to truly rebuild a team, and hes not going to start now - and starting means trading Lundqvist...and probably Richards and Gaborik while you're at it.
Regardless of Hank "never" leaving NY (even the great one was traded) it's a very interesting topic, because since the lockout, Lundquvist has essentially kept us from being a lottery wonder.

We would have had multiple 1-3 overalls by now actively playing all over the roster, with a goalie that was "good enough".

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10-26-2011, 10:01 AM
  #45
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Obviously nothing to take seriously, but say we put Hank on the market. What kind of realistic trade offers might we get? I've always wondered. In my opinion he is the best goalie on the planet right now. Would be interesting to try to see what teams might give up for a player of this caliber.
did you forget about tim thomas, who won the Vezina 2 out of the last 3 seasons....and a stanley cup...just saying

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10-26-2011, 10:02 AM
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Tune in 3 years from now.
I sure will. But as someone who feels that this team will begin contending starting next year, I'm confident that the outlook for this team is good 3 years from now.

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10-26-2011, 10:19 AM
  #47
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If he couldnt win a cup with the Rangers, would you cheer for him if he won with another team?

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10-26-2011, 10:23 AM
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If he couldnt win a cup with the Rangers, would you cheer for him if he won with another team?
not if it was against the Rangers.

If the Rangers are out, I root for my next favorite team, then former players in that order.

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10-26-2011, 10:32 AM
  #49
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dadude View Post
Obviously nothing to take seriously, but say we put Hank on the market. What kind of realistic trade offers might we get? I've always wondered. In my opinion he is the best goalie on the planet right now. Would be interesting to try to see what teams might give up for a player of this caliber.
He is one of those players who unfortunately despite being one of the top 3 in the league if not the top goaltender in the league, will never have his trade value equal that.

Hypothetically, Id say 1st, 2nd, and two blue chip prospects, or 2 1sts a 2nd and a blue chip prospect.

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10-26-2011, 10:36 AM
  #50
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did you forget about tim thomas, who won the Vezina 2 out of the last 3 seasons....and a stanley cup...just saying
Lundqvist has not had a team in front of him as good as Thomas has and I don't think many can argue that.

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