HFBoards

Go Back   HFBoards > NHL Eastern Conference > Atlantic Division > Montreal Canadiens
Notices

Yannick Weber

Reply
 
Thread Tools
Old
10-27-2011, 07:46 AM
  #26
Joe Cole
Registered User
 
Joe Cole's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2003
Location: Montreal
Posts: 3,174
vCash: 500
I am not in the Weber fan club. He scored a great goal last night, but he still is consistently over matched in his own end. Consistently.

He may learn how to preperly position himself and get past his lack of NHL strength, but until then... deensively he just is not a top 6 D on a good team

Joe Cole is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
10-27-2011, 07:48 AM
  #27
The Kremelin Wall*
the krEMELIN wall
 
Join Date: Oct 2010
Location: Canada
Country: Canada
Posts: 5,769
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Joe Cole View Post
I am not in the Weber fan club. He scored a great goal last night, but he still is consistently over matched in his own end. Consistently.

He may learn how to preperly position himself and get past his lack of NHL strength, but until then... deensively he just is not a top 6 D on a good team
Explains his team tops +5 rating.

The Kremelin Wall* is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
10-27-2011, 07:57 AM
  #28
Kriss E
Registered User
 
Join Date: May 2007
Posts: 21,021
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Joe Cole View Post
I am not in the Weber fan club. He scored a great goal last night, but he still is consistently over matched in his own end. Consistently.

He may learn how to preperly position himself and get past his lack of NHL strength, but until then... deensively he just is not a top 6 D on a good team
Not sure how you come to this conclusion.
He's not perfect, he's still very green with only 58 reg season games played, but he has improved by leaps and bounds since his first call up two years ago. He is doing a commendable job playing 20+ minutes.
I really don't see this consistent over match in his own end. He does lose some battle, but I don't think he's been losing them more than any of our other Dmen.

Kriss E is online now   Reply With Quote
Old
10-27-2011, 08:11 AM
  #29
Monctonscout
Monctonscout
 
Monctonscout's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Posts: 28,993
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Joe Cole View Post
I am not in the Weber fan club. He scored a great goal last night, but he still is consistently over matched in his own end. Consistently.

He may learn how to preperly position himself and get past his lack of NHL strength, but until then... deensively he just is not a top 6 D on a good team
Can you site some examples. As much as the team has struggled, I don't recall any occasions where Weber was badly out of position or overmatched this year...and he's played big minutes.

Monctonscout is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
10-27-2011, 09:57 AM
  #30
Joe Cole
Registered User
 
Joe Cole's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2003
Location: Montreal
Posts: 3,174
vCash: 500
Kremelim, Carey Price and Kriss E !!

My my, the Weberites were fast to defend him!

I do not have the games digitized and at my finger tips so that I can post the instances where he is over matched in his end. Seriously.... do you have all the games ready for that kind of documented proof? I have a career I am trying to maintain between posts on HF!

That said, yes, I believe he is over matched VERY often. More so than any other D on the current roster. Not that Martin's opinion is well thought of here but, the fact that Weber is scratched or used as a forward says it all.

Often, he either loses the battle straight out or is rushed into making a bad play and gets a team mate in a bad position where the team mate loses a battle. It has to do with game speed, balance and strength.


Obviously he is going to be compared to other Habs D. Diaz is the exception I suppose, he has transitionned to the North American game quickly. He makes a fast first pass and uses his speed to stay n position, even if he does not have the strength to compete at a purely physical level.

The next comparison is Emelin. Weber has played hundreds of games in North America, all his junior and AHL games. There is no mystery in the game here for Weber. We have to giv Emelin a longer leas to see if he ever will become a NHL D. He has the body tye, and possibly the offensive potential, we'll see if he ever starts to understand the NHL defensive zone game.

He had a great goal last night. No debate. But I do not see him being a top 6 D on the Habs, nor on any other team I believe is a contender. Not yet. Will he develop, maybe, but there is no way he is that guy now. If you think so, let's say we have different standards.

As for why he is a + player right now.... look at the games he has played, the opposition. Look at the forwards he was lined up against. The Habs want him to develop. They are picking their spots with him. He played a ton of minutes....against a Florida. Not exactly the offensive powerhouse are they?

Joe Cole is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
10-27-2011, 10:09 AM
  #31
Cupmonger
Registered User
 
Cupmonger's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: Montreal
Country: Armenia
Posts: 3,241
vCash: 500
I've been saying this kid has talent ever since we called him up on our centennial. He was one of the few who actually played well in the playoffs that year too. Sure he's done some rookie mistakes, mainly because he is a rookie and was only called up during injuries, and played on the offensive line sometimes. But this kid has got the talent to make the team with an important role. I don't think I see him as top2 material (mainly because I see that for Subban and Markov), but he could be a point player for a second duo. Kid's got talent for sure, he just needs to be kept on the D and well looked after by our coaching staff. I'm glad he's finally get recognition for his talent. I'd say though, tbh, that at some point his performances could diminish like any rookie. Seeing how rookies always start strong and then slow down because they can't keep up. He's got a bit of experience under his belt though, so he might tire out much later.

Cupmonger is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
10-27-2011, 10:18 AM
  #32
Perrah
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jul 2009
Posts: 1,728
vCash: 500
He's been great this year so far, it seems he is starting to figure how a guy his size has to defend to be successful. They had better not trade him that would be retarded. He was also one of the few guys showing some spine around the habs net.

Perrah is online now   Reply With Quote
Old
10-27-2011, 10:24 AM
  #33
habitue*
 
habitue*'s Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2002
Country: Canada
Posts: 9,236
vCash: 500
Weber was the best d-man yesterday, even better than PK.

habitue* is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
10-27-2011, 10:28 AM
  #34
Talks to Goalposts
Registered User
 
Join Date: Apr 2011
Location: Edmonton
Country: Canada
Posts: 3,478
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by natey2k4 View Post
Weber had the 3rd most minutes on ES for our club last night..
Last night he played great, but we're talking broad generalities here rather than a singular performance.

Talks to Goalposts is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
10-27-2011, 10:56 AM
  #35
Lucius
Registered User
 
Lucius's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: Halifax, NS
Country: Canada
Posts: 4,705
vCash: 500
Weber has easily been the best D all year. That's more an indictment of Subban, Gill and Gorges than a compliment, but it's still true. He's been a pleasant surprise and even more surprising is that Martin has clearly noticed. He'd moved from 9th on the depth chart on Day #1 to one of the most utilized guys back there.

I'd imagine - barring other injuries - when Markov comes back it'll be Diaz into the AHL. No fault of his, but Diaz playing 22 minutes a night in all situations wouldn't be a bad thing. He brings a lot, but Weber, Markov and Subban all have similar skillsets. Emelin, I imagine they'll keep because if Markov gets hurt again they can just recall Diaz, they cannot bring Emelin back from Russia.

My hope is this:

Markov - Subban
Gill - Weber
Spacek - Gorges
X: Emelin
Inj: Campoli

Lucius is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
10-27-2011, 11:03 AM
  #36
EveryDay
Habs Prospect
 
EveryDay's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: Gatineau
Country: Canada
Posts: 4,568
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Lucius;38547773[B
]Weber has easily been the best D all year[/B]. That's more an indictment of Subban, Gill and Gorges than a compliment, but it's still true. He's been a pleasant surprise and even more surprising is that Martin has clearly noticed. He'd moved from 9th on the depth chart on Day #1 to one of the most utilized guys back there.

I'd imagine - barring other injuries - when Markov comes back it'll be Diaz into the AHL. No fault of his, but Diaz playing 22 minutes a night in all situations wouldn't be a bad thing. He brings a lot, but Weber, Markov and Subban all have similar skillsets. Emelin, I imagine they'll keep because if Markov gets hurt again they can just recall Diaz, they cannot bring Emelin back from Russia.

My hope is this:

Markov - Subban
Gill - Weber
Spacek - Gorges
X: Emelin
Inj: Campoli
Weber have been great so far but Gorges was even better(exception of 1 game)

EveryDay is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
10-27-2011, 11:06 AM
  #37
pine
irregistered user
 
pine's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: Singapore
Country: Canada
Posts: 7,459
vCash: 50
If only we had a young stud left handed all-around defenseman...

e.g. Ryan McDonagh.

Gorges - Subban
McDonagh - Weber
Gill/Emelin - Diaz

Instead we're stuck with Scott 7.3M Gomez.

pine is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
10-27-2011, 11:14 AM
  #38
TinordiandSubban
Registered User
 
TinordiandSubban's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: Toronto
Posts: 1,361
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Lucius View Post
Weber has easily been the best D all year. That's more an indictment of Subban, Gill and Gorges than a compliment, but it's still true. He's been a pleasant surprise and even more surprising is that Martin has clearly noticed. He'd moved from 9th on the depth chart on Day #1 to one of the most utilized guys back there.

I'd imagine - barring other injuries - when Markov comes back it'll be Diaz into the AHL. No fault of his, but Diaz playing 22 minutes a night in all situations wouldn't be a bad thing. He brings a lot, but Weber, Markov and Subban all have similar skillsets. Emelin, I imagine they'll keep because if Markov gets hurt again they can just recall Diaz, they cannot bring Emelin back from Russia.

My hope is this:

Markov - Subban
Gill - Weber
Spacek - Gorges
X: Emelin
Inj: Campoli
Markov-Subban could be good but what happens when they both want to carry the puck and make stretch passes and jump into the rush at the same time?

Markov-Gorges
Spacek-Subban
Emelin-Weber
Hal Gill dressed but used just on the penalty kill

TinordiandSubban is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
10-27-2011, 11:21 AM
  #39
habitue*
 
habitue*'s Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2002
Country: Canada
Posts: 9,236
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kyle West View Post
Markov-Subban could be good but what happens when they both want to carry the puck and make stretch passes and jump into the rush at the same time?

Markov-Gorges
Spacek-Subban
Emelin-Weber
Hal Gill dressed but used just on the penalty kill
What about Campoli and Diaz ?


don't worry, I am sure we gonna loose one or two other d-men with long-term injuries down the road.

habitue* is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
10-27-2011, 11:35 AM
  #40
MasterDecoy
Carlos Danger
 
MasterDecoy's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2010
Location: Beijing
Posts: 9,230
vCash: 1707
Quote:
Originally Posted by habitue View Post
Weber was the best d-man yesterday, even better than PK.
not hard to do lately

MasterDecoy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
10-27-2011, 11:55 AM
  #41
Kriss E
Registered User
 
Join Date: May 2007
Posts: 21,021
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Joe Cole View Post
Kremelim, Carey Price and Kriss E !!

My my, the Weberites were fast to defend him!

I do not have the games digitized and at my finger tips so that I can post the instances where he is over matched in his end. Seriously.... do you have all the games ready for that kind of documented proof? I have a career I am trying to maintain between posts on HF!

That said, yes, I believe he is over matched VERY often. More so than any other D on the current roster. Not that Martin's opinion is well thought of here but, the fact that Weber is scratched or used as a forward says it all.

Often, he either loses the battle straight out or is rushed into making a bad play and gets a team mate in a bad position where the team mate loses a battle. It has to do with game speed, balance and strength.


Obviously he is going to be compared to other Habs D. Diaz is the exception I suppose, he has transitionned to the North American game quickly. He makes a fast first pass and uses his speed to stay n position, even if he does not have the strength to compete at a purely physical level.

The next comparison is Emelin. Weber has played hundreds of games in North America, all his junior and AHL games. There is no mystery in the game here for Weber. We have to giv Emelin a longer leas to see if he ever will become a NHL D. He has the body tye, and possibly the offensive potential, we'll see if he ever starts to understand the NHL defensive zone game.

He had a great goal last night. No debate. But I do not see him being a top 6 D on the Habs, nor on any other team I believe is a contender. Not yet. Will he develop, maybe, but there is no way he is that guy now. If you think so, let's say we have different standards.

As for why he is a + player right now.... look at the games he has played, the opposition. Look at the forwards he was lined up against. The Habs want him to develop. They are picking their spots with him. He played a ton of minutes....against a Florida. Not exactly the offensive powerhouse are they?
I'm not defending him, I was curious to know what your arguments were for thinking that way. Very much like Breezer always was one of Natey's best Dmen (I'll never let that one go Natey! ).
I just completely disagree with your assessment. All three youngsters have done a commendable/good job. I don't think he's losing battles more often than others. He is holding his ground, is tenacious, has a good first pass, nice speed, is smart about his pinches, and despite his small size I've seen him respond to anybody trying to rush Price after the whistle.
His bread and butter is the PP, I've been wondering all season why Weber is not the go-to guy on the first PP unit since the start of the season. I never understood why he wasn't there. It's obvious to me that PK should be the QB on the right and Weber the shot on the left. Eventually I hope management goes with that.

Kriss E is online now   Reply With Quote
Old
10-27-2011, 12:06 PM
  #42
ECWHSWI
P.K. is perfect.
 
ECWHSWI's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2006
Posts: 14,108
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kriss E View Post
I'm not defending him, I was curious to know what your arguments were for thinking that way. Very much like Breezer always was one of Natey's best Dmen (I'll never let that one go Natey! ).
I just completely disagree with your assessment. All three youngsters have done a commendable/good job. I don't think he's losing battles more often than others. He is holding his ground, is tenacious, has a good first pass, nice speed, is smart about his pinches, and despite his small size I've seen him respond to anybody trying to rush Price after the whistle.
His bread and butter is the PP, I've been wondering all season why Weber is not the go-to guy on the first PP unit since the start of the season. I never understood why he wasn't there. It's obvious to me that PK should be the QB on the right and Weber the shot on the left. Eventually I hope management goes with that.
agree on both count.

sure he has it hard sometimes, but considering he's playing 20+ a game (over 15 minutes at ES vs Flyers) he'll have to face the 1st and 2nd liners from time to time and given his inexperience it's only normal he has more problems against those.

as for defending Price, it's kinda the same, given his size he wont knock anyone down, but he's always there trying the best he can to protect his goalie, and in the end if he cant do it properly cause he doesnt have the strengh to do it well - he's not to blame for it, it's the Org that has to provide some muscle to play next to him.

Quote:
Originally Posted by MasterDecoy View Post
not hard to do lately
still, the kid deserves props, he went from playing on the 4th line due to a poor camp to our steadiest D.


Last edited by Habsfan18: 10-27-2011 at 12:13 PM. Reason: merge
ECWHSWI is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
10-27-2011, 12:35 PM
  #43
Toro
Registered User
 
Toro's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: Windsor
Country: Canada
Posts: 3,740
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Lucius View Post
Weber has easily been the best D all year. That's more an indictment of Subban, Gill and Gorges than a compliment, but it's still true. He's been a pleasant surprise and even more surprising is that Martin has clearly noticed. He'd moved from 9th on the depth chart on Day #1 to one of the most utilized guys back there.

I'd imagine - barring other injuries - when Markov comes back it'll be Diaz into the AHL. No fault of his, but Diaz playing 22 minutes a night in all situations wouldn't be a bad thing. He brings a lot, but Weber, Markov and Subban all have similar skillsets. Emelin, I imagine they'll keep because if Markov gets hurt again they can just recall Diaz, they cannot bring Emelin back from Russia.
This post sets a lot of things straight in this thread.

Weber is improving on a very good curve and is now for the last 4 or so games has been in the top 3 in minutes and has been very solid for a youngster like himself. He will have some growing pains and some but like any NHL defenceman he will have a brain fart from time to time. Like it or not haters, he has developed into an NHL defenceman not a 4th line winger for good now.

I expect Weber to continue to improve.

Toro is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
10-27-2011, 12:42 PM
  #44
SuperUnknown
Registered User
 
SuperUnknown's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2002
Posts: 4,492
vCash: 500
If Weber can keep the level of play he has shown the past 3-4 games, then he is a top 4 about anywhere in the NHL. He seems to thrive on ice time and pressure.

He probably has the best positioning amongst the Montreal blueline. The number of plays he keeps in the offensive zone or cuts in the neutral zone with his anticipation and positioning is astounding. He has improved on D to the point where the past few games he was probably the most steady player in his zone. He uses his body to check and angle the opponents.

Contrary to what some posters have said in this thread, from my observation, he wins more battles on the boards and involves himself physically more than Gorges, Diaz or Gill. He doesn't fall down easily either. He also has improved his decision making lately as he'll use his skating to join the rush and still be able to fall back and defend. Sometimes in his zone he picks the wrong man but he's been cutting on that as well (and frankly, he hasn't been worse than the other dmen).

I think he's underrated on here, while Diaz is vastly overrated (no physical game, takes bad decisions with the puck and gets himself out of position). Of the other newcomers, I'd also take Emelin over Gill.

SuperUnknown is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
10-27-2011, 12:45 PM
  #45
MasterDecoy
Carlos Danger
 
MasterDecoy's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2010
Location: Beijing
Posts: 9,230
vCash: 1707
Quote:
Originally Posted by ECWHSWI View Post
still, the kid deserves props, he went from playing on the 4th line due to a poor camp to our steadiest D.
absolutely! my remark merely highlighted how bad subban has been. better last game, but still...

weird that he is now where everyone thought he'd be given a normal progression. but his awful camp had me worried and im pretty sure gauthier went and finally signed campoli specifically because weber had a bad camp

MasterDecoy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
10-27-2011, 12:47 PM
  #46
Mike8
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jun 2002
Posts: 10,818
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Joe Cole View Post
That said, yes, I believe he is over matched VERY often. More so than any other D on the current roster. Not that Martin's opinion is well thought of here but, the fact that Weber is scratched or used as a forward says it all.

...

As for why he is a + player right now.... look at the games he has played, the opposition. Look at the forwards he was lined up against. The Habs want him to develop. They are picking their spots with him. He played a ton of minutes....against a Florida. Not exactly the offensive powerhouse are they?
I respect your opinion, Joe. I do take issue with the above two points, however. Weber has played over 20 mins every game except the first two (where he was playing as a forward for some of the games). Despite those first two games skewing the statistics a fair bit, Weber has averaged to be third amongst Montreal defensemen in ice time per game. Exclude those first two games where he played as a forward for some of the time, and Weber's averaging more ice time than Gorges. All this while posting the best +/-.

If you say to look at how Martin is treating him as a reflection of how good he is, then I would argue that Martin's come around to respecting Weber's game. If you say he's only playing a ton of minutes against Florida, I say that while he played his season-high of just shy of 25mins against Florida, he's played 20+ against every other team as well.

Please note: I don't disagree that he is, at times, overmatched. I disagree that it is consistent, and disagree that it is more frequent than, say, Diaz. I also think the point that Weber gets some sheltered minutes is worth noting.

Mike8 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
10-27-2011, 12:50 PM
  #47
SuperUnknown
Registered User
 
SuperUnknown's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2002
Posts: 4,492
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by ECWHSWI View Post
as for defending Price, it's kinda the same, given his size he wont knock anyone down, but he's always there trying the best he can to protect his goalie, and in the end if he cant do it properly cause he doesnt have the strengh to do it well - he's not to blame for it, it's the Org that has to provide some muscle to play next to him.
While Weber isn't tall, I don't think he's weak.

SuperUnknown is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
10-27-2011, 12:53 PM
  #48
Chfan
HFBoards Sponsor
 
Chfan's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2004
Location: Montreal
Country: Hong Kong
Posts: 3,523
vCash: 50
Quote:
Originally Posted by SuperUnknown View Post
While Weber isn't tall, I don't think he's weak.
He looked skinny and weak when he first arrived and even last year, he was getting physically overmatched pretty bad. But this year, he looks way bigger, which is a good thing.

Chfan is online now   Reply With Quote
Old
10-27-2011, 01:01 PM
  #49
ECWHSWI
P.K. is perfect.
 
ECWHSWI's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2006
Posts: 14,108
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by SuperUnknown View Post
While Weber isn't tall, I don't think he's weak.
not weak maybe, but when you concede a 10, 15 or 20 pounds to the opponent in every "battle", it's tough on the smaller player, especially for a D.

ECWHSWI is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
10-27-2011, 01:02 PM
  #50
MasterDecoy
Carlos Danger
 
MasterDecoy's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2010
Location: Beijing
Posts: 9,230
vCash: 1707
Quote:
Originally Posted by Chfan View Post
He looked skinny and weak when he first arrived and even last year, he was getting physically overmatched pretty bad. But this year, he looks way bigger, which is a good thing.
i've also seen him throw some good hits and shove people like it's nothing.

that's great news since i never thought that aspect of the game would be part of his repertoire

MasterDecoy is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Forum Jump


Bookmarks

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off



All times are GMT -5. The time now is 02:27 PM.

monitoring_string = "e4251c93e2ba248d29da988d93bf5144"
Contact Us - HFBoards - Archive - Privacy Statement - Terms of Use - Advertise - Top - AdChoices

vBulletin Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
HFBoards.com is a property of CraveOnline Media, LLC, an Evolve Media, LLC company. 2014 All Rights Reserved.