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Can we all just relax for a minute?

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Old
10-28-2011, 09:04 AM
  #26
Jester
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Originally Posted by Spongolium View Post
How can you declare this as fact? There is no reason to suggest that the flyers wont get their act together come march and play better hockey.
Other than they have a bunch of really young forwards that tend to hit the wall, along with some older players that have a propensity to carry nagging injuries with em as the season progresses? Not to mention the forwards are simply not built for the tighter checking game that is played in the spring?

You have to wrap your head around the fact that the problems aren't entirely about getting their act together. This team is going to suck on face-offs. This team is going to take penalties. Briere and Giroux are not going to magically become guys you can throw out there and expect to take care of bizness in their own end.

There's a reason certain types of teams get stronger as the year progresses, and others do not. In the coming years, Schenn and Couturier look like players that will be able to answer many of those question areas, but to expect them to this year is unfair.

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10-28-2011, 09:07 AM
  #27
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Originally Posted by Jester View Post
Other than they have a bunch of really young forwards that tend to hit the wall, along with some older players that have a propensity to carry nagging injuries with em as the season progresses? Not to mention the forwards are simply not built for the tighter checking game that is played in the spring?

You have to wrap your head around the fact that the problems aren't entirely about getting their act together. This team is going to suck on face-offs. This team is going to take penalties. Briere and Giroux are not going to magically become guys you can throw out there and expect to take dare of bizness in their own end.

There's a reason certain types of teams get stronger as the year progresses, and others do not. In the coming years, Schenn and Couturier look like players that will ve able to answer many of those question areas, but to expect them to this year is unfair.
I think the team will be better then than now. it's not like the defense can get much worse

But I would counter that argument with the likes of buffalo, who have small forwards but always turn up when it counts. They are not really built for tight checking games either.

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10-28-2011, 09:08 AM
  #28
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Originally Posted by DrinkFightFlyers View Post
Eh, we'll agree to disagree. Even with the rookies hitting the wall, this team has guys that can step up. None of Read, Schenn, or Couturier are being depended on in such a capacity that the outcome of the game may depend on them. Couturier is playing top line PK minutes now, but if he starts to slow, this team has other players who can step up and play those minutes, maybe not at the same level as Couturier at his highest, but not anything where the PK will suddenly become a guaranteed goal for the other team. Time will tell on this though, I suppose.
Um... Read is out there in all situations, and is playing the point on the pp. If that's not being counted on, I don't know what. Oh, and that Lavy quote about Couturier being our best defensive forward. The sad thing is he's actually been that. 18 year olds shouldn't be that. He's been good, it's not about that, but if Couturier begins to falter, or hit a wall too badly it will show.

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Originally Posted by Jester View Post
Holmgren needs to sit on his hands, and hopefully get one of Suter/Weber this coming offseason in order to bridge the gap. The forwards are not ready to compete, and that's just life.
I agree, it's not the time for any panic trade. As you say, go for Suter or Weber (depending on what Nashville does with the two of them), and make the best out of the situation we have. Playoff experience isn't a bad thing to get for Couturier, Schenn, Read, JvR, Voracek and Simmonds after all even if it won't get us all the way.

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10-28-2011, 09:16 AM
  #29
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Originally Posted by Spongolium View Post
I think the team will be better then than now. it's not like the defense can get much worse

But I would counter that argument with the likes of buffalo, who have small forwards but always turn up when it counts. They are not really built for tight checking games either.
Sabres haven't won a playoff series since they let Drury and Briere walk, and have missed the playoffs twice. They certainly came on strong at the end of last year, but they weren't relying on a slew of rookies and really young players the way we are. You can cite Myers, but he was also very up and down last year.

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10-28-2011, 09:20 AM
  #30
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10-28-2011, 09:23 AM
  #31
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Originally Posted by Jester View Post
Sabres haven't won a playoff series since they let Drury and Briere walk, and have missed the playoffs twice. They certainly came on strong at the end of last year, but they weren't relying on a slew of rookies and really young players the way we are. You can cite Myers, but he was also very up and down last year.
Myers, Ennis, grebe, and I think Gragnani were all rookies playing somewhat important roles

Still, I agree with your overall point. If the Sabres are what we aspire to be, then we have issues

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10-28-2011, 09:27 AM
  #32
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If the Sabres are what we aspire to be, then we have issues
That depends. What team did Don Luce come from?

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10-28-2011, 09:36 AM
  #33
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Originally Posted by Spongolium View Post
How can you declare this as fact? There is no reason to suggest that the flyers wont get their act together come march and play better hockey.
There's every reason to believe that by march, Read and the other rookies will be completely gassed. The entire season is likely to be uphill.

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10-28-2011, 09:37 AM
  #34
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The Flyers need time. A good start was maybe too good so the fans started to expect too much too early.

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Old
10-28-2011, 09:38 AM
  #35
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Originally Posted by BringBackStevens View Post
Myers, Ennis, grebe, and I think Gragnani were all rookies playing somewhat important roles

Still, I agree with your overall point. If the Sabres are what we aspire to be, then we have issues
It was Myers 2nd year. Ennis was coming off a full pro season, as was Gerbe. Gragnani had three full pro seasons before last year... And only played a handful of games for em. Miller also went completely ape **** in the 2nd half. Now, Bryz could certainly do that fir a stretch as well... But, similarly, you are looking at a young team with talent, not a contender... which we were last year before the injuries caught up with us.

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10-28-2011, 10:17 AM
  #36
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Gonna take time for some people to adjust to the fact that this won't be as good a team this season. This yr should be spent getting the youngs guys experience (which is why I get angry at lavy when jvr & Jake, even couturier have like 12 min a game) for about 3 yrs from now when guys start to hit their primes. I still expect them to make the playoffs but nothing more. Still way to early for all this. If the flyers go sub .500 in the next 10 games I'll start to get upset but before then is too soon IMO.

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Old
10-28-2011, 10:19 AM
  #37
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Can we still burn ****?
Vancouver flashback!




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10-28-2011, 10:23 AM
  #38
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I think I should bring up the "can we relax a second" thread that was posted in 2006 during the season from hell.

Or how about the "they will flip the switch" thread from last season. But honestly, it is hard as a big fan of your team to watch your team give up 4+ goals every single game. Not going to blame it on Breezy, but his last four games he has given up 19 goals...19...

Now I know 18 or whatever some people are saying goals arent his fault but we still have some major problems right now and if it doesnt get fixed, we could be in for a LONGGGG season.

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10-28-2011, 10:32 AM
  #39
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Originally Posted by sa cyred View Post
I think I should bring up the "can we relax a second" thread that was posted in 2006 during the season from hell.

Or how about the "they will flip the switch" thread from last season. But honestly, it is hard as a big fan of your team to watch your team give up 4+ goals every single game. Not going to blame it on Breezy, but his last four games he has given up 19 goals...19...

Now I know 18 or whatever some people are saying goals arent his fault but we still have some major problems right now and if it doesnt get fixed, we could be in for a LONGGGG season.
Fail for Nail?

I just can't get over the hilarity.



Either way, unlike 2006 we have talent that can compete at the NHL level. This isn't a problem of having too many people who can't play in a post-lockout NHL. This is a problem where the team isn't communicating properly. 99% of the problem is getting the puck out of the zone. That's a breakdown in communication between the defensemen, forwards, and sometimes the goaltender. Typical growing pains of a reinvented roster. There's no reason to panic just yet.

I recommend not getting overly worked up about it. I consider any playoff success this year a legitimate bonus. This team was built for 2012-13, 2013-14, 2014-15, etc. I want to win this year. I think we have an outside if not legitimate shot should our team gel. That said, it's best not to get worked up and upset. We all knew what this was long before we started the season 4-0-1. Let's relax.

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10-28-2011, 10:32 AM
  #40
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It's all planned by HBO...if they played solid for the first 3 months it wouldnt be interesting TV.

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10-28-2011, 10:48 AM
  #41
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Originally Posted by sa cyred View Post
I think I should bring up the "can we relax a second" thread that was posted in 2006 during the season from hell.

Or how about the "they will flip the switch" thread from last season. But honestly, it is hard as a big fan of your team to watch your team give up 4+ goals every single game. Not going to blame it on Breezy, but his last four games he has given up 19 goals...19...

Now I know 18 or whatever some people are saying goals arent his fault but we still have some major problems right now and if it doesnt get fixed, we could be in for a LONGGGG season.
The issue isn't really whether or not this team will win the Cup or even make the playoffs. It's the fact that this season is only 10 games old and people are going off the deep end talking about firing Lavy, tanking for last place, switching goalies, etc. The first five games of the season included a shutout and only one loss (in OT). The next five the team was 1-4. Not cause for alarm. If this was January and the team was in the toilet, then ok, lets start talking about some of this stuff. But ten games in to a season, whether they are 10-0 or 0-10, is not the time to start panicking or celebrating. They've already shown they can go five games without a regulation loss, why can't they do that again starting tomorrow?

The problem with this board is that losses appear to be weighed more than wins. This team can go on a five game unbeaten streak then go 1-4 and all of the sudden the sky is falling. If they win five more and then lose to more, the sky will once again be falling. And so forth and so on. Let's wait until A) the team falls out of contention or B) at least until a larger part of the season has been played before we start taking the suicide pillz.

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Old
10-28-2011, 10:54 AM
  #42
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yesterdays (and the night before) games reminded me of the playoffs

swiss cheese goaltending

not going to panic, but paying so much for goaltending and not getting it, is really annoying (its especially frightening considering how much the caps got vokoun for )

so much has changed yet so much is still the same


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10-28-2011, 11:00 AM
  #43
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When a team goes into a skid like the Flyers have, the one thing they need more than anything else is some unity and stability. Peter Laviolette tried pushing the "wakeup call" button with a bag skate and massive line changes after the loss against Washington, and that didn't work. Now, they need to rebuild some confidence, focusing on the things they can build from -- the first period against Montreal, the determination they showed last night -- and get back on the horse.
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The Flyers may not be as good as they looked the first week of the regular season. But they are also not as bad as they've looked the last couple weeks. Going through early season adversity is NOT always a bad thing, either. There are a lot of new -- and quite a few young -- forwards on the team. Part of learning how to win as a team is knowing that you can get through adversity together. You learn more at those times than when the sailing is smooth.
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Old
10-28-2011, 11:02 AM
  #44
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This team is exactly what everyone thought it was going into the season. A 6th to 8th team, possibly worse actually. The team is only going to get worse come the latter half of the season due to having so many rookies in our lineup.

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10-28-2011, 11:05 AM
  #45
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It was Myers 2nd year. Ennis was coming off a full pro season, as was Gerbe. Gragnani had three full pro seasons before last year... And only played a handful of games for em. Miller also went completely ape **** in the 2nd half. Now, Bryz could certainly do that fir a stretch as well... But, similarly, you are looking at a young team with talent, not a contender... which we were last year before the injuries caught up with us.
Well said. The way I like to describe it is that we're in a pseudo rebuild with a forward group that's young and more built towards a rebuild and a d-men group that's more built to win now.

I really hope they can make a strong play for a guy like Suter or Weber in the coming years because we're going to need it once Timonen and/or Pronger leave or decline in play. None of Meszaros, Coburn, or Carle are reliable 2nd pairing anchors and certainly not 1st pairing anchors.

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10-28-2011, 11:07 AM
  #46
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Well, imo they would be a 5th to 8th place team in the conference. The only good thing is that they really cant get any worse than right now so the only way to go for them is up. 25 goals over the last 5 games isnt going to cut it.

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10-28-2011, 11:37 AM
  #47
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Originally Posted by Beef Invictus View Post
There's every reason to believe that by march, Read and the other rookies will be completely gassed. The entire season is likely to be uphill.
In terms of rookies it's pretty much Read, Schenn and Couturier who are gonna be playinging the significant parts. Schenn wasn't exactly setting the place of fire when healthy, Read and Couturier would be more problematic though Couturier isn't playing massive mins.

The problem is that you have a lot of new young players together (the rookies, the trade acquisitions and our returning youngsters) but Simmonds, Voracek, van Riemsdyk (and Nodl if he sticks around) have all played NHL seasons and wont hit the wall.

The problem is gelling. That just takes time, trial and (unfortunately) error. In terms of the offense defending better Giroux (16!), van Riemsdyk (10), Voracek (8), Hartnell (8), Talbot (8) and Jagr (8) have all played 10 games and been on the ice for 8+ goals conceeded. While I realise that's no exactly an all telling stat that's where I think the work need to be done.

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10-28-2011, 11:40 AM
  #48
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In terms of rookies it's pretty much Read, Schenn and Couturier who are gonna be playinging the significant parts. Schenn wasn't exactly setting the place of fire when healthy, Read and Couturier would be more problematic though Couturier isn't playing massive mins.

The problem is that you have a lot of new young players together (the rookies, the trade acquisitions and our returning youngsters) but Simmonds, Voracek, van Riemsdyk (and Nodl if he sticks around) have all played NHL seasons and wont hit the wall.

The problem is gelling. That just takes time, trial and (unfortunately) error. In terms of the offense defending better Giroux (16!), van Riemsdyk (10), Voracek (8), Hartnell (8), Talbot (8) and Jagr (8) have all played 10 games and been on the ice for 8+ goals conceeded. While I realise that's no exactly an all telling stat that's where I think the work need to be done.
Yeah, I'm aware of the gelling. The problem is, once this team has found chemistry there's a solid chance that it gets blown up across at least two lines once those three rookies hit the wall.

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Old
10-28-2011, 11:56 AM
  #49
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Wait till pronger gets back. Things will get back on track.
That said - pronger is a bit of a cursed splodey bones in he is always getting injured.
Definitely talented but it is terrible to watch this team when he is injured.

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10-28-2011, 12:59 PM
  #50
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i propose we stop calling out shutouts and game scores and such before puck drops..

whateva it takes to rid us of this godam curse..

i'll just limit myself to "go flyers go" and other such banter, but no guessing of game outcomes..

i dont have a chicken or a goat to sacrifice, so this is what i can do to help i guess.

lets GO Flyers.

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