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What's Your Motivation?

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Old
10-28-2011, 01:44 PM
  #1
budster
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What's Your Motivation?

To the guy who plays a level down,

Why do you play in our league? You know you're better than everyone else. I know you know this because you like to flaunt your skill. You toe drag the defender that can't do backwards crossovers. You rip slappers a few feet in front of the red line. You're ALWAYS on the PK squad, and you always put yourself in for a 3 1/2 minute shift at the end of the game when it's close. You intercept passes from your weaker teammates because you know they aren't clutch like you. You get mad when we take shots at you, but you know the refs let it go because you don't belong and they can empathize with our frustrations. You justify your position by saying you are a mentor, or you are just there to setup passes, or keep things even. For the most part, you stick to this. However, when the game is on the line, or a weaker opponent shows you up, the competitive player inside of you simply cannot allow it. This is when you turn on the afterburners and take control of the game. You tease us by letting us think we have a chance, then you deny us victory. When you do this part of me wants to give up, and the other part of me wants to try my hardest so I can show you up. See the internal conflict? I can yell at you, I can chirp you, I can take cheap shots, but in the end all I want is for you to play in the league you belong. Please. Competition is what makes the game fun. Don't take this away from me and my linemates.

In the meantime I'll keep trying to improve until I can play in the highest league and not have this problem.

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10-28-2011, 02:52 PM
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My rule when I sub for a lower league is to never score a game winner. I'll do my best to tie up a game and then set up plays so that the other guys/gals can win it. Plus there is a 3 goal limit in our league so if you are an all star playing down (which I am not) then you won't be running up the score sheet too much. The team I sub for also doesn't put me out there during "crucial" situations, we just rotate through the lines.

One thing I've noticed is that I do notice that I skate at almost 100 percent when playing down a level, which I sometimes feel bad about. I really like playing down and getting a goal or two and some assists cause in the league I play in I'm only mediocre and rarely get an opportunity to put the puck on net as a defensemen.

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10-28-2011, 03:23 PM
  #3
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I have and most likely will never have the opportunity to play in a "lesser" league

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Old
10-28-2011, 10:41 PM
  #4
budster
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Gibson19 View Post
My rule when I sub for a lower league is to never score a game winner. I'll do my best to tie up a game and then set up plays so that the other guys/gals can win it. Plus there is a 3 goal limit in our league so if you are an all star playing down (which I am not) then you won't be running up the score sheet too much. The team I sub for also doesn't put me out there during "crucial" situations, we just rotate through the lines.

One thing I've noticed is that I do notice that I skate at almost 100 percent when playing down a level, which I sometimes feel bad about. I really like playing down and getting a goal or two and some assists cause in the league I play in I'm only mediocre and rarely get an opportunity to put the puck on net as a defensemen.
Yeah Gibs, this wasn't meant for guys like you because:
  1. You're a sub, not rostered in the lower level
  2. You actually feel bad when you go all out
  3. You don't try to personally influence the outcome of the game

I don't think there's anything wrong with playing down if you have friends/family on the team and you are just filling in.

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Old
10-29-2011, 11:45 AM
  #5
Frankie Spankie
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I can't stand those players either. There's a guy like that in one of my leagues that clearly doesn't belong. It was run by another hockey company until a couple years ago and he was clearly the best player in the league at the time. Now the league is a bit more balanced out and run by a different guy so he's not the clearcut best but he's still one of the best players in the league. He also does everything by himself and my only job when we play that team is to be all over him and don't give him an inch of open space. He hates me.

I did have the opportunity to play in a lesser league once, I have only been playing ice hockey for like 6 years so there aren't many lesser leagues available for me anyway. It was just a pick up game with a friend of mine who was only playing hockey for like 2-3 months just for fun. I took one shot, which I didn't even want to take. I only took it because it was such a nice pass by a player who clearly just started playing and I wanted him to feel good with an assist. We were on the ice for an hour and a half and that was my only shot the whole game. The whole time I was just trying to pass to people.

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Old
10-29-2011, 05:52 PM
  #6
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Wost I saw when starting out a couple years ago in my beginners league was when we were playing a team in the summer that started off winless in their first 6 games. Expecting a victory we ended up loosing like 9-3, and looking at the scoresheet they had only 2 players register points. One guy with like 6 goals and 3 assist the other guy with 3 goals and 3 assist, or something like that. I can understand wanting to get your first win, but the worst part was they had like 15 skaters on the bench and these two guys were always on the ice.

Other than that most people weren't too bad. Being a true beginners league it can be hard filling out a team with all beginners so when you lose players and have to find new ones you're bound to get a few ringers. For the 3/4's of a year I played in that league and through 10-12 teams that was the only really bad case I saw.

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Old
10-29-2011, 05:57 PM
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ponder
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For the most part ringers at a lower level are just out there to play hockey with some friends, and they generally don't try so hard. My league is mostly made of roughly HS/select/single A (like midget A) type players, but there are a decent number of ringers too, guys who played junior A/B or even university/college hockey. They're clearly better than most players, but they tend to tone it down a bit and don't just dominate games. Personally I don't mind the ringers at all, but I guess if it was a bigger talent gap it would suck.

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10-29-2011, 10:35 PM
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dabeechman
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I should be a league higher than I am, but I play where I do because the guys on my team are close friends of mine.

Every team has a ringer in our league. Is it right? No. But until the director steps up and does her job...I don't feel bad. Because like I said...every team has at least one guy that is on my level (or close to).

I am not the type to rub it in your face though unless you are "chirping" me.

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10-29-2011, 11:27 PM
  #9
budster
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ponder View Post
For the most part ringers at a lower level are just out there to play hockey with some friends, and they generally don't try so hard. My league is mostly made of roughly HS/select/single A (like midget A) type players, but there are a decent number of ringers too, guys who played junior A/B or even university/college hockey. They're clearly better than most players, but they tend to tone it down a bit and don't just dominate games. Personally I don't mind the ringers at all, but I guess if it was a bigger talent gap it would suck.
To me a "ringer" is someone who plays down for the purpose of dominating others and securing a victory. A person who values winning more than improving.

Not someone who is there because he wants to play on the same team as his less-talented buddies and wants to have a good time. It sounds like the guys you play with are cool, and if they played in my league I probably wouldn't classify them as ringers.

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11-01-2011, 03:45 PM
  #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by budster View Post
To me a "ringer" is someone who plays down for the purpose of dominating others and securing a victory. A person who values winning more than improving.

Not someone who is there because he wants to play on the same team as his less-talented buddies and wants to have a good time. It sounds like the guys you play with are cool, and if they played in my league I probably wouldn't classify them as ringers.
But the effect is the same. Regardless of the motivation you end up with a few players dominating league scoring. Does it matter if he's playing with his buddies and has good intentions if he's ruining a lower level league for the players it is intended for?

For the record I play in two leagues. In the lower league I'm somewhere between .8 and 1.2 ppg each year, and in the upper league I'm between .5 and .9 ppg each year. I think I'm probably right where I should be.

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Old
11-03-2011, 10:20 AM
  #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by budster View Post
To the guy who plays a level down,

Why do you play in our league? You know you're better than everyone else. I know you know this because you like to flaunt your skill. You toe drag the defender that can't do backwards crossovers. You rip slappers a few feet in front of the red line. You're ALWAYS on the PK squad, and you always put yourself in for a 3 1/2 minute shift at the end of the game when it's close. You intercept passes from your weaker teammates because you know they aren't clutch like you. You get mad when we take shots at you, but you know the refs let it go because you don't belong and they can empathize with our frustrations. You justify your position by saying you are a mentor, or you are just there to setup passes, or keep things even. For the most part, you stick to this. However, when the game is on the line, or a weaker opponent shows you up, the competitive player inside of you simply cannot allow it. This is when you turn on the afterburners and take control of the game. You tease us by letting us think we have a chance, then you deny us victory. When you do this part of me wants to give up, and the other part of me wants to try my hardest so I can show you up. See the internal conflict? I can yell at you, I can chirp you, I can take cheap shots, but in the end all I want is for you to play in the league you belong. Please. Competition is what makes the game fun. Don't take this away from me and my linemates.

In the meantime I'll keep trying to improve until I can play in the highest league and not have this problem.
I see where you're going with this, and I agree....somewhat. I like seeing the ringers out there, both on my team and against me, only because I can watch them up close and see what they are doing/not doing, how it compares to me, and how I can improve. Does it suck when you're trying to go end to end and the ringer sneaks you as you're clearing their blue line? Of course it does, but nobody ever got better being an average player in an average league playing against people of similar skill.

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Old
11-03-2011, 03:18 PM
  #12
budster
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Originally Posted by iamjs View Post
I like seeing the ringers out there, both on my team and against me, only because I can watch them up close and see what they are doing/not doing, how it compares to me, and how I can improve. Does it suck when you're trying to go end to end and the ringer sneaks you as you're clearing their blue line? Of course it does, but nobody ever got better being an average player in an average league playing against people of similar skill.
Don't get me wrong, I prefer to play with people who are better than me. That's how I improve. This isn't directed at the standout players who are a big asset to their team. This is for the sandbaggers who have the ability to control the outcome of the game, and feel the need to show everyone they can.

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11-03-2011, 09:49 PM
  #13
The Tikkanen
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After playing hockey for 18 years I've seen many of these guys come and go. I've come to 3 conclusions:1. They lack heart. They're playing below their skill level because they only play to score goals. They could care less about winning, their teammates and their worth in the sport is solely tied to scoring goals. After the game is over, if their team lost, they will look to the score sheet, see 2 or 3 goals and be happy as a clam. 2. These guys are usually horrible passers. Cover them before they get the puck and they'll be lost. When they do get the puck always look shot first, usually high and wide cause it's not cool to go 5 hole but picking a water bottle once every 5 games gets them pumped. 3. Shadow them and they'll leave the league. These guys have only 1 value to their team:scoring goals. If you remove that from their stat line they are worthless hockey players. They're fundamentally flawed in areas that are important, thus the reason why they failed at higher levels and "wanted to play with their friends". If you remind them that they weren't good enough in the higher levels they crumple mentally.

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11-04-2011, 05:54 PM
  #14
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It's almost always friends... and "said" ringer being too polite to decline helping a friend (or group of friends) out.

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11-05-2011, 01:46 PM
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The Tikkanen
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Quote:
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It's almost always friends... and "said" ringer being too polite to decline helping a friend (or group of friends) out.
It's funny how they failed to make new friends at higher levels, isn't it? It's always the same excuse, I wanted to play with my friends. It doesn't matter where we live, how old we are, roller or ice the excuse remains the same.

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11-05-2011, 04:52 PM
  #16
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Funny you bring this up, as captain of my team, I just emailed the league about this. Here's the situation, my team is a lower c team, with only 1 person with more than 1 1/2yrs exp, and he only has 3yrs exp. Suprisingly out of 10 teams in thethe league, we play close with all but 3, maybe not wining but def cthem all, but competitive. Now of those 3items teams, one has won the championship the past three years and then there is a new one that is more frustrating and made me write the email. They have a roster of 12 ppl, minus the goalie its 11 skaters, 3 of which play A and 4 play B at the same rink, the remaining 4 are also C+players. They beat us the first time only 6-0, 2nd time 10-0 but the thing is shots on goal was probably easliy 70 to our 7, not kidding. They also have beaten the other teams in the league by similar scores. While I love the competition and think it has made us better when we play teams our own level, its still very frustrating. Haven't heard back from the league but my stance is there is no reason someone from an A league should play, 1 level up or down is what I think is appropriate. If you're a b player,you have a chioce of either C or A but not both. I also suggested maybe a C- team C+ divisons split for the playoffs.

My team is at a loss of what else to do, our group actually has another team, which is a B level team and I was thinking about having them show up, just to prove a point but don't think I could actually do that. Based on league rules could probably get away with it, with jsut a forfeit but would be worth the laugh.

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03-02-2017, 07:44 AM
  #17
TheLokNesMonster
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In a good league, most teams should have a few guys that could probably play up a league and do well, a few guys that could probably play down and be better, and all the rest who comprise the average skill level of that league.

You definitely want to play at the appropriate level, but there is no shame in being one of the handful of guys in the league that are at the top of the skill level. And for the average players, playing against guys like that brings the whole league up a notch. Those guys might not be getting much better, but everybody else is.

The curious ones are the guys that play down a couple leagues. Like the D2 or D3 college guys playing with a C or D level rec team, especially if they don't gear down to the competition. It's like, "hey, good for you, you had a 10-point night".

Those are the guys you wonder about. What is their motivation? What are they trying to prove or accomplish? Do they have some kind of disorder?

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Old
03-02-2017, 08:21 AM
  #18
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Quote:
Originally Posted by The Tikkanen View Post
After playing hockey for 18 years I've seen many of these guys come and go. I've come to 3 conclusions:1. They lack heart. They're playing below their skill level because they only play to score goals. They could care less about winning, their teammates and their worth in the sport is solely tied to scoring goals. After the game is over, if their team lost, they will look to the score sheet, see 2 or 3 goals and be happy as a clam. 2. These guys are usually horrible passers. Cover them before they get the puck and they'll be lost. When they do get the puck always look shot first, usually high and wide cause it's not cool to go 5 hole but picking a water bottle once every 5 games gets them pumped. 3. Shadow them and they'll leave the league. These guys have only 1 value to their team:scoring goals. If you remove that from their stat line they are worthless hockey players. They're fundamentally flawed in areas that are important, thus the reason why they failed at higher levels and "wanted to play with their friends". If you remind them that they weren't good enough in the higher levels they crumple mentally.
I realize this is a 6 year old post, but since someone else already bumped it......

THIS. All. The. This.

I play in the lower level in my league, and about half the teams are really even. The other half have between 1 and 3 ringers, and it is ****ing frustrating. I bolded this part because it is so spot on. We played a team the other day where this one mother****er, who has like 30 goals (in 15 games), would just hover around and wait for a pass in the neutral zone. He has a good shot, but he is fat and slow, and I must have stolen the puck from him a dozen times... it's just if he got behind the D, it was almost an automatic goal.

I'm just sitting there going, what the hell are you even getting out of this? But the answer is, if he were playing a level up, he'd likely have like 3 goals instead of 30.

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Old
03-02-2017, 09:37 PM
  #19
MullerBrotenVerbeek
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I don't get it. I hate subbing in lower division games and will generally only do it if a buddy is hard up for guys and I am super hungover and borderline useless anyway. You don't get anything out of playing against players who are much worse than you.

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Old
03-02-2017, 09:43 PM
  #20
MullerBrotenVerbeek
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TheLokNesMonster View Post
In a good league, most teams should have a few guys that could probably play up a league and do well, a few guys that could probably play down and be better, and all the rest who comprise the average skill level of that league.

You definitely want to play at the appropriate level, but there is no shame in being one of the handful of guys in the league that are at the top of the skill level. And for the average players, playing against guys like that brings the whole league up a notch. Those guys might not be getting much better, but everybody else is.

The curious ones are the guys that play down a couple leagues. Like the D2 or D3 college guys playing with a C or D level rec team, especially if they don't gear down to the competition. It's like, "hey, good for you, you had a 10-point night".

Those are the guys you wonder about. What is their motivation? What are they trying to prove or accomplish? Do they have some kind of disorder?
I have a buddy that plays in a league way below where he should be, but it was for work reasons. He was trying to get a job from the team captain and finally did. Now he feels like he owes the guy and has to keep skating with his team.

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Old
03-04-2017, 02:51 PM
  #21
Auston Marlander
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ponder View Post
For the most part ringers at a lower level are just out there to play hockey with some friends, and they generally don't try so hard. My league is mostly made of roughly HS/select/single A (like midget A) type players, but there are a decent number of ringers too, guys who played junior A/B or even university/college hockey. They're clearly better than most players, but they tend to tone it down a bit and don't just dominate games. Personally I don't mind the ringers at all, but I guess if it was a bigger talent gap it would suck.
This. I started playing in a lower level due to concussions. Made some good friends and now play to be around them. The delta on this league is pretty big. There are 10-15 of us a clear cut above, but only put real effort in when you are directly against those players. The rest of the time we just take it easier and make some plays for the lower level players. Heat said, just floating around is taken as an insult by most of the less skilled players, we just don't run the score up.

I also am in a league that I am mod pack, so I get to go all out there.

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Old
03-15-2017, 12:37 PM
  #22
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I played down a couple levels one season dealing with injuries. I absolutely hated it. The other players in the league were down right vicious against me, despite me coasting all game and all season. When I'm injured I just stick to my organized drop in games. I'm still asked to play in lower divisions but refuse. I know plenty of guys who sandbag and pad stats, and they all have ridiculous egos. I think it's because their dad's never hugged them when they were growing up.

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Old
03-18-2017, 10:49 AM
  #23
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The problem I have with players too good playing a sub level is mostly the skating part. I can play hockey and shoot or dangle pretty good but my skating is "ok" . Those players are able to reach a speed I just don't have the practice/technic to tie. My team is a bunch of friends with good hockey iq and good feel for where we are going to be on the ice. We beat a lot of better team then us because we work hard and we are opportunistic.

We almost create everything off the rush, going to the net forechecking and trying to score. We rarely get to setup in the offensive zone , so there comes a point where we can't handle a team with too many "elite" players. We get exhausted quick and they skate by us easily.

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Old
03-20-2017, 10:03 AM
  #24
MattyMo35
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I am a terrible hockey player, so I will never be a "ringer". Ever. But I don't understand the motivation either. I mentioned in the beer league frustration thread that we had a ringer on our team for the first game or two of our session(we're a new team that was just put together by our goalie). The guy was very good, clearly didn't belong in our league, but he would take literally 10 minute shifts and try to score as many goals as he could in that time. There was no let up at all. Hell, he wouldn't even pass to the rest of us. He tried to do everything himself. Thankfully he's gone.

We now have another guy who is the complete opposite. He's our best player by far, and probably the best player in our division quite honestly, but he only has like 5 or 6 goals on the season(and we're 6 games in). He just sits back and plays defense even though he's normally a forward. When he turns it on, he's impossible for anyone in our division to stop, but he pretty much refuses to do that. The only exception was two games ago we were playing a team who was playing a bit dirty and talking all kinds of ****. We were down by a goal with like two minutes to go so he decided to go full Bobby Orr mode and went coast to coast for an amazing goal. Went through 4 defenders on the way. After that he went back to just sitting back and playing defense. He moves the puck to the forwards, but almost never takes a shot, but when he does you can tell he lets up a bit. He could probably score 10 goals a game if he really wanted to. I love having him on the team because he's someone I can study and help me improve, and he's just a great guy.

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Old
03-20-2017, 11:31 AM
  #25
Jim Bob
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I love it when the hot shot guy who is too good gets mad when another team adds a hot shot that is better than he is.

We kind of had that situation last week when one of my teammates brought his oldest son to play as a sub.

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