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Old
11-01-2011, 12:35 AM
  #176
Iron Duke
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Originally Posted by SLake View Post
Huge disadvantage? I'd suggest you check yourself...Chicago dressed John Scott tonight and played him a grand total of 2:45 (4 shifts). They had last line change tonight, which limits how often you use your fourth line anyhow, and McGrattan played two more shifts than Scott did, had a shot blocked and blocked one of his own in 4:09.

Ergo, the Predators and Hawks essentially played all night with 11 forwards apiece and if anything, got more use out of McGrattan than Chicago did with Scott.

I really don't understand where you think we're going to get some offensive hot shot from to dress as our 13th forward, nor do I understand why so many people have blinders on regarding McGrattan's skill level. Yes, he's a heavyweight enforcer. He's one of the meanest and toughest in the game. However, when the puck comes to him, he doesn't handle it like a hand grenade, and can actually read the play, and make the correct decisions when the puck comes his way.

The team is playing with a lot more confidence physically with McGrattan in the lineup. I'm sorry if some don't see it that way, but you ask anyone in the locker room and they point to McGrattan's presence as a key reason for that. Stortini didn't get it done the first two nights and teams took a lot of liberties with us and we simply backed down. We aren't backing down any longer and as we saw against Anaheim, when they screwed with us, we didn't hesitate to go right back at them.

Very few players contribute 82 games per year, especially guys on the fourth line...McGrattan might not have had an impact tonight, but it was far from his fault that we lost or that Chicago outskilled us by a country mile...
Doesn't help that we spent 16 minutes on the PK, which cut the amount of ToI that you would maybe see McGrattan, Bergfors and Thang getting a bigger cut of than they did tonight. I agree with you, I have no issues with McGrattan's play, and feel he's done a more than adequate job in his role. I would gladly take him out there, and his utter lack of offensive skill, over Bergfors, who may have it in spades, but has been effectively invisible with the time he has had.

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11-01-2011, 12:59 AM
  #177
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Originally Posted by Iron Duke View Post
Doesn't help that we spent 16 minutes on the PK, which cut the amount of ToI that you would maybe see McGrattan, Bergfors and Thang getting a bigger cut of than they did tonight. I agree with you, I have no issues with McGrattan's play, and feel he's done a more than adequate job in his role. I would gladly take him out there, and his utter lack of offensive skill, over Bergfors, who may have it in spades, but has been effectively invisible with the time he has had.
Bergfors is -1 with 2 assists in 5 games. I am not too worried about him at all and think that he should continue to play (especially on the power play with fisher and SK out). If nothing else, play him as a power play specialist that sees 8 minutes of ice time. I mean really Berfgors is such an easy scapegoat. I think he is taking a lot of unnecessary heat. It's not like SK just waltzed in and scored lots of points for us either.

Overall pretty hard to be upset about tonight's result. Chicago outguns us on a good day, much less a bad one like today.

For how many Spalings, Thangs, and what not we have in our system, I think I would be very tempted give all them away for just one Sharp, Hossa, or Kane. Those guys have offensive talent that far exceeds anything we have... except maybe Craig Smith but time will tell with Smith. Hopefully he continues this ridiculous year!

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11-01-2011, 04:57 AM
  #178
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Bergfors is -1 with 2 assists in 5 games. I am not too worried about him at all and think that he should continue to play (especially on the power play with fisher and SK out). If nothing else, play him as a power play specialist that sees 8 minutes of ice time. I mean really Berfgors is such an easy scapegoat. I think he is taking a lot of unnecessary heat. It's not like SK just waltzed in and scored lots of points for us either.

Overall pretty hard to be upset about tonight's result. Chicago outguns us on a good day, much less a bad one like today.

For how many Spalings, Thangs, and what not we have in our system, I think I would be very tempted give all them away for just one Sharp, Hossa, or Kane. Those guys have offensive talent that far exceeds anything we have... except maybe Craig Smith but time will tell with Smith. Hopefully he continues this ridiculous year!
You mean 1 goal and 1 assists so far.

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11-01-2011, 06:56 AM
  #179
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Originally Posted by NoNecksCurse View Post
look at our goals compared to there... the skill difference is obvious
Top three, yes ... overall, not so much. Total team v total team is a very competitive matchup and has been for the past several seasons.

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11-01-2011, 07:47 AM
  #180
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The Hawks have better forwards than us, yes. We have better goaltending by a mile. I would say our D is slightly better, though it's fairly even. We can't win them all. Just because they have better forwards doesn't mean we dont have talent....

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11-01-2011, 08:20 AM
  #181
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You mean 1 goal and 1 assists so far.
sorry I just looked at his point totals and thought both were assists yes one goal and one assist

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11-01-2011, 08:37 AM
  #182
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I'll take that point.
A lot of this.

First, I'll get the negative out of the way. Klein and Cube. They (Klein especially) looked overwhelmed and the -3 for the night (each) proved this. As I get to know this team, I can see why Klein is so frustrating. One game he's great, then the next 2, he's the worst on the ice.

Now to the positive. We went into the barn of a top-3 team in the league, without 2 of our top offensive talent, without one of our better bottom 6, and against a fully stocked team with Kane, Toews, Hossa, Sharp, Keith, and Seabrook, and managed to push them to overtime. I'll take that point any day of the week. I thought we looked great for most of that game.

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11-01-2011, 08:42 AM
  #183
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I will be very happy if hornqvist continues to get hot. Smith and Hornqvist on fire may lessen the blow of missing SK and Fishy.

Biggest positive I took from last night's game was ability to answer back. Before last tonight if a team scored, the guys look deflated and lacked concentration. last night marked steely resolve for the team, certainly a positive going forward.


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11-01-2011, 09:08 AM
  #184
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Originally Posted by Joetimo View Post
I will be very happy if hornqvist continues to get hot. Smith and Hornqvist on fire may lessen the blow of missing SK and Fishy.

Biggest positive I took form last nights game was ability to answer back. Before last tonight if a team scored, the guys look deflated and lacked concentration. Not last night marked steely resolve for the team, certainly a positive going forward.
this.

if we can actually get two lines scoring consistently AND get the forwards playing with confidence, we will be hard to beat assuming Rinne is in his baseline-awesome mode for most games.


now the question is, when do we let Lindback start a game?

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11-01-2011, 09:09 AM
  #185
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Originally Posted by 101st_fan View Post
Top three, yes ... overall, not so much. Total team v total team is a very competitive matchup and has been for the past several seasons.
I'm going to have to disagree. on pure skill, their forward group is quite a bit better than ours. our goaltending is better and I am not sure how i feel about our defense yet lol. I hope fisher and sk74 are ready soon. they are major contributors for us.

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11-01-2011, 09:19 AM
  #186
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now the question is, when do we let Lindback start a game?
Cooper questioned this as well. He thinks we see him in one of these west coasters.

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11-01-2011, 09:19 AM
  #187
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this.
now the question is, when do we let Lindback start a game?
my vote would be against LA then let rinne play against ANA in the back to back

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11-01-2011, 09:42 AM
  #188
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And didn't I go and drop Hornqvist from my fantasy team just before he scores twice...

Preds had that game last night, Smith's goal was a beauty. I couldn't stand to listen to Horachek though during the second intermission. He was irate about the Preds 3-on-2 that turned into a hawks 2-on-1. That's the mindset that kills us, heaven forbid the Preds try to create a rush and a scoring opportunity because it might result in a turnover and a rush the other way. Don't be aggressive on the rush, don't be aggressive going for a lose puck, just be ready for the transition to defense. I understand that the coaches aren't happy giving up an odd man rush, but to send them into a complete defensive shell as a result, it's so frustrating. The Preds were scoring before that, but since they entered the third with a lead, it was just sit back, chip pucks out and protect rather than just continue the game that you had been playing that got you there. Then you give up the lead and fall behind... lucky to get the point after that.

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11-01-2011, 10:38 AM
  #189
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Originally Posted by NoNecksCurse View Post
thats why we will NEVER win a cup with trotz and our style of play and players. the difference between the skill of CHI and us is huge. Rinne just makes us look decent.
I'm sorry, but that makes no sense. To "not win" with Trotz implies it's about coaching, but then you go on to say the "skill difference" between CHI and Preds is huge.

We're a small market team - we're gonna' have the talent we have. Until the building is sold out every night, we're not gonna' have resources to spend on more high-dollar contracts. To complain about this is lunacy.

Trotz does a very good job with the kinda' players we're going to have. Personally, I doubt any of the coaches we'd all find attractive would do as well; I mean, really, can you see Babcock winning with our guys? They get to keep more talent because they're willing to sign below-market contracts; our captain - who says he wants to stay - holds us up for ransom. It's not the coach; nor is it the GM. It's reality.

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11-01-2011, 11:05 AM
  #190
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our captain - who says he wants to stay - holds us up for ransom
I am definitely worried about Weber for next year.

If you REALLY believe in the Preds and want to stay as you say you do, why don't you agree to say a 5-year at 5 million a year (with bonuses for things like Norris)?

I suppose he's just trying to get the maximum he can get while he's hot since one's time on top can be short-lived, but if you won't agree to a long-term for a little less money, it's hard to believe that you won't take the highest bidder next time around.

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11-01-2011, 11:54 AM
  #191
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I'm sorry, but that makes no sense. To "not win" with Trotz implies it's about coaching, but then you go on to say the "skill difference" between CHI and Preds is huge.

We're a small market team - we're gonna' have the talent we have. Until the building is sold out every night, we're not gonna' have resources to spend on more high-dollar contracts. To complain about this is lunacy.

Trotz does a very good job with the kinda' players we're going to have. Personally, I doubt any of the coaches we'd all find attractive would do as well; I mean, really, can you see Babcock winning with our guys? They get to keep more talent because they're willing to sign below-market contracts; our captain - who says he wants to stay - holds us up for ransom. It's not the coach; nor is it the GM. It's reality.
I agree for the most part. It hasn't been determined what it will take (financially) whether it be selling out every night or player willingness to accept less or the owners ponying up or take a loss in order for us to add on. Trotz and Poile have proven they can assemble the core unit of a team. This is important because look at the Rangers they can't develop a core system whether they add this or that player doesn't make them better. Because of the absence of the core unit of the team. Far as selling out every night that is a relative term. Because crowds anywhere are fickle you have to show them before they commit. The second round was huge in the public's mind because this showed that we can or able to go further in the playoffs.

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11-01-2011, 03:10 PM
  #192
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I am definitely worried about Weber for next year.

If you REALLY believe in the Preds and want to stay as you say you do, why don't you agree to say a 5-year at 5 million a year (with bonuses for things like Norris)?

I suppose he's just trying to get the maximum he can get while he's hot since one's time on top can be short-lived, but if you won't agree to a long-term for a little less money, it's hard to believe that you won't take the highest bidder next time around.
I said the same thing but said he should sign a 4 year deal, but apparently he wanted to get into this year with Suter and Rinne and see what happens with them first.

basically gonna be a huge game of chicken.....

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11-01-2011, 03:45 PM
  #193
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Cooper questioned this as well. He thinks we see him in one of these west coasters.
As previously speculated, I would guess the Anaheim game we see Lindback. Pekka Tuesday at LA, Lindback Wednesday at ANA.

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11-01-2011, 04:23 PM
  #194
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And didn't I go and drop Hornqvist from my fantasy team just before he scores twice...

Preds had that game last night, Smith's goal was a beauty. I couldn't stand to listen to Horachek though during the second intermission. He was irate about the Preds 3-on-2 that turned into a hawks 2-on-1. That's the mindset that kills us, heaven forbid the Preds try to create a rush and a scoring opportunity because it might result in a turnover and a rush the other way. Don't be aggressive on the rush, don't be aggressive going for a lose puck, just be ready for the transition to defense. I understand that the coaches aren't happy giving up an odd man rush, but to send them into a complete defensive shell as a result, it's so frustrating. The Preds were scoring before that, but since they entered the third with a lead, it was just sit back, chip pucks out and protect rather than just continue the game that you had been playing that got you there. Then you give up the lead and fall behind... lucky to get the point after that.
I had the same reaction to horachek

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11-01-2011, 06:09 PM
  #195
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Originally Posted by deanwormer View Post
I'm sorry, but that makes no sense. To "not win" with Trotz implies it's about coaching, but then you go on to say the "skill difference" between CHI and Preds is huge.

We're a small market team - we're gonna' have the talent we have. Until the building is sold out every night, we're not gonna' have resources to spend on more high-dollar contracts. To complain about this is lunacy.

Trotz does a very good job with the kinda' players we're going to have. Personally, I doubt any of the coaches we'd all find attractive would do as well; I mean, really, can you see Babcock winning with our guys? They get to keep more talent because they're willing to sign below-market contracts; our captain - who says he wants to stay - holds us up for ransom. It's not the coach; nor is it the GM. It's reality.
they are both a problem. our budget and skill is a problem. trotz has been here since the start and he has never gotten us over the hump, with or without a budget I dont care.

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11-01-2011, 06:24 PM
  #196
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We have used the injury card, and rightfully so, for years. Sullivan missed huge chunks of time. Erat always misses 15. Same for Legwand. Radulov simply left. Hartnell would frequently hit the IR for a week or two at a time. Dumont suffered a pretty big concussion, and then lost all semblance of offensive ability. Heck, even when this team was icing Scott Walker and Andreas Johanson, they always seemed to be heading to the locker room early. Last year was simply a nightmare injury wise. The point is, we have suffered a TON of top 6 forward injuries ... more so than the average team does. But. We have poor depth at replacing those injuries. This is a Poile decision. It has been for years. He has failed to address it for years. Our team has plenty of forwards. We have plenty of forwards that are NHL ready and able to fill in on a 3rd line role, but we have precious few that can adequately play as a scoring forward. It hurts us every year. At some point, we need to enter a season with 6 top 6 forwards, rather than 4 or 5 with a couple of hopefuls and a bunch of developmental players that have no street cred with Trotz.

Just an observation/lament. Poile is a good GM, but this is his continual blind spot.

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