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Dreger: Sharks one of 8 teams in on Turris

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Old
11-02-2011, 07:16 AM
  #26
SpinTheBlackCircle
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Quote:
Originally Posted by UniversalRemonster View Post
Sharks should trade their late 2012 1st + prospect?
Sweet jesus, no.

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Old
11-02-2011, 09:42 AM
  #27
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he really isnt worth much but to be honest, I think, barring any mental issues, he would be a perfect fit to get that third line moving.

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11-02-2011, 10:10 AM
  #28
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Eh, I'm sure DW inquired about him but he will be going to the highest bidder and I don't think we are in the position to do that. He has talent but is still a project at this point.

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11-02-2011, 10:18 AM
  #29
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Originally Posted by UniversalRemonster View Post
Anyone know if our scouting staff interviewed him in the 2007 draft?
Regardless, the scouts will look into a prospect's character if he's a guy they like. (They often talk to coaches, billets, etc., to get a read on the kids.)

Notes are kept on file in database.

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Old
11-02-2011, 10:19 AM
  #30
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Originally Posted by Gene Parmesan View Post
Eh, I'm sure DW inquired about him but he will be going to the highest bidder and I don't think we are in the position to do that. He has talent but is still a project at this point.
The problem for the Coyotes is what can they realistically expect in return? A 1st, from a team like Calgary? Not a chance. Even Ottawa, on their current hot streak, isn't going to risk a 1st. A prospect? Why would any team trade a good to great prospect for a problem player who has thus far proved to be a bust? A veteran player on an expiring deal? Why would the Coyotes want that? They don't have a shot at the cup this year.

No, the Coyotes are going to want picks in return, and the teams i the best position to trade picks are teams like the Sharks with low 1st rounders and mid to high 2nd rounders (which we have this next year).

Unless someone wants to get stupid (which is possible) the Sharks have a realistic shot at it. I'd only offer a 2nd and prospect though, not a great prospect either.

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Old
11-02-2011, 10:25 AM
  #31
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Coyotes could want actual NHL players (forwards) for Turris, and not picks.

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Old
11-02-2011, 10:28 AM
  #32
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Franson for Turris

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Old
11-02-2011, 10:32 AM
  #33
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hockeyball View Post
The problem for the Coyotes is what can they realistically expect in return? A 1st, from a team like Calgary? Not a chance. Even Ottawa, on their current hot streak, isn't going to risk a 1st. A prospect? Why would any team trade a good to great prospect for a problem player who has thus far proved to be a bust? A veteran player on an expiring deal? Why would the Coyotes want that? They don't have a shot at the cup this year.

No, the Coyotes are going to want picks in return, and the teams i the best position to trade picks are teams like the Sharks with low 1st rounders and mid to high 2nd rounders (which we have this next year).

Unless someone wants to get stupid (which is possible) the Sharks have a realistic shot at it. I'd only offer a 2nd and prospect though, not a great prospect either.

Well like many have said I think the Coyotes want a player in return that can step in right away. So Benn Ferriero and a 2nd? I'm not a big Turris fan but I know he has talent and potential. I honestly feel he will be traded to Calgary within the next few weeks.

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Old
11-02-2011, 10:45 AM
  #34
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Gene Parmesan View Post
Well like many have said I think the Coyotes want a player in return that can step in right away. So Benn Ferriero and a 2nd? I'm not a big Turris fan but I know he has talent and potential. I honestly feel he will be traded to Calgary within the next few weeks.
Phoenix drafted Ferriero and didn't think he was worth signing, I doubt they'd be interested in him now.

And really, if all they wanted was a late 2nd and a not so good prospect, I'm pretty sure they would've made a deal by now.

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Old
11-02-2011, 11:32 AM
  #35
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Originally Posted by stalockrox View Post
Phoenix drafted Ferriero and didn't think he was worth signing, I doubt they'd be interested in him now.

And really, if all they wanted was a late 2nd and a not so good prospect, I'm pretty sure they would've made a deal by now.
I didn't say a late second, I specifically said a hi to mid 2nd, which we have.

The most they are going to get is a late first (which we have) to mid 2nd. Anything more would be totally illogical. A throw in player like maybe Heemskirk, Sexsmith, McCarthy etc is possible.

We tend to go nuts around here with trade predictions, and it usually turns out to be a lot less spectacular than we expect (I was soundly berated for my Michalek+Cheechoo prediction for instance in the Heatley trade). McCarthy and Minnesota's 2nd would be a realistic return at this point for a project player with attitude issues.

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Old
11-02-2011, 11:35 AM
  #36
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hockeyball View Post
If he gets an offer that helps the Coyotes, he'll take it. You can't take anything he's said publicly at face value. We have seen over, and over, and over again how meaningless that is. Remember the Heatley situation?

He is simply saying what he has to say to protect his interests. If he says "Ya, we are going to trade him" the value he gets will drop considerably. If he says "We are not trading him" it's basically a negotiating tactic (both with other GM's and Turris). Either he gets better offers, or Turris blinks and he gets him re-signed.

Do I want him? Sure, if DW can work some magic. We need more young forwards to improve our forward depth. He's just another poorly developed young player who needs a change of scenery. If he comes cheap, hell yah I'd take him.
Same here. For those saying he's not the answer for the third line, we know he's not the ideal answer, yes. The ideal answer is Clutterbuck and even if he's available, the price is too high (players + picks). Anybody in Clutterbuck's league is also out for the same reason.

That's why DW has to try to find some low cost, high upside guys. Sheppard is one of those, despite some complaints about giving up a third round pick. Turris at age 22 falls into that category too, especially if the trade cost is a 2nd and a mid level prospect that the Yotes would be high on?

ALSO: Can Turris still be signed to an offer sheet? I.e, can a team offer sheet him, Yotes don't match, and then he's a signed, under contract, member of the new team and can play immediately?

I ask because if there is a 12/1 deadline to sign or not be able to play this season, you'd think by mid november Turris' agent would be soliciting offer sheets because even if the Yotes match, boom, he's under contract, can play, and gets paid this season. So if this can be done, why not offer sheet Turris? Turris signs somewhere because he doesn't want to go the whole season without playing/being paid. AND if your offer has a cap hit of less than $1,034,249, there is no draft pick comp.
(If we still have our 2012 3rd, we could offer up to about $1.5m)

At some point, an offer sheet of any kind becomes a win/win for Turris, right?


Last edited by ChompChomp: 11-02-2011 at 11:43 AM.
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Old
11-02-2011, 11:45 AM
  #37
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There's a time period for extending offer sheets thats long since past.

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Old
11-02-2011, 11:50 AM
  #38
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Originally Posted by WineShark View Post
There's a time period for extending offer sheets thats long since past.
So he's an RFA that can only sign with the Coyotes at this point? I'm trying to find something that shows that there is a deadline for submission of an offer sheet to an RFA. Do you have something? Thanks.

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Old
11-02-2011, 12:41 PM
  #39
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All Maloney has to is wait another month and Turris is done for the year. He has all the power and will only trade him for something he feels helps the Coyotes. I just don't see him getting dealt.

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11-02-2011, 12:52 PM
  #40
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Originally Posted by WineShark View Post
There's a time period for extending offer sheets thats long since past.
That's not true. He is still free to sign offer sheets. The problem is teams know he's willing to sign a fair contract elsewhere and don't want to extend one to him. Besides, Phoenix is libel to match it anyway. For CC, there is an unwritten deadline for Turris' camp with regards to offer sheets. It's basically a week before the 12/1 playing deadline. Coyotes would have a week to match any offer sheet and if it's offered and signed at let's say 11/29, they can sit on the offer sheet and not match until after 12/1 and he'd still be ineligible to play whether they match or not.

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Old
11-02-2011, 01:04 PM
  #41
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Originally Posted by Lebanezer View Post
All Maloney has to is wait another month and Turris is done for the year. He has all the power and will only trade him for something he feels helps the Coyotes. I just don't see him getting dealt.
For a team on the verge of being sold and moved I don't think it benefits the Coyotes to sit on a prospect and not have him play. Especially considering there is at that point clearly no future for that player within the organization.

It makes more sense to trade him for a decent return. It benefits the Coyotes more this season, and in the future.

The only concern is in warding off future players from behaving this way, but for a team about to be sold I don't know why they would care about that. I'm not saying he'll go for trash, but I am saying he really isn't worth a whole lot even without this mess. He's struggled to produce and now add to that attitude issues. His value is better than Sheppards for instance, but not significantly.

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Old
11-02-2011, 01:15 PM
  #42
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Originally Posted by hockeyball View Post
I didn't say a late second, I specifically said a hi to mid 2nd, which we have.

The most they are going to get is a late first (which we have) to mid 2nd. Anything more would be totally illogical. A throw in player like maybe Heemskirk, Sexsmith, McCarthy etc is possible.

We tend to go nuts around here with trade predictions, and it usually turns out to be a lot less spectacular than we expect (I was soundly berated for my Michalek+Cheechoo prediction for instance in the Heatley trade). McCarthy and Minnesota's 2nd would be a realistic return at this point for a project player with attitude issues.
I'm not part of the "we" that goes nuts on trade predictions - we just disagree on what the Coyotes will get for Turris. Your opinion is based on what you think he's worth, I happen to think that Maloney holds ALL the cards here and will wait it out until someone offers him something he really can't refuse.

Also, I'd be pretty unhappy if the Sharks gave up their 1st round pick for Turris. I'd probably not be overly thrilled giving up the Minn. pick either.

The Sharks already used a 3rd for a "player that was poorly developed with attitude issues", I'd rather they didn't use a 1st round pick to get another...I'm sure he'll probably prove me wrong if he plays thi year, but I'm just not a big fan of Turris.

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Old
11-02-2011, 01:19 PM
  #43
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I hear he's a major d-bag off the ice. A real head case.

Source: a friend who intimately knows one of his teammates.

Just sayin'

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11-02-2011, 01:23 PM
  #44
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Kaspar Goc Turris line would be epic.

Make it happen DW.

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Old
11-02-2011, 02:02 PM
  #45
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Would Braun and a 3rd rounder be a fair trade for Turris? Or maybe Braun and a 2nd?

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Old
11-02-2011, 02:10 PM
  #46
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Would Braun and a 3rd rounder be a fair trade for Turris? Or maybe Braun and a 2nd?
I wouldn't trade Braun for Turris. He's already a better player than Turris is and is not a head case. Turris is a project.

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Old
11-02-2011, 02:23 PM
  #47
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Note - we don't have our 2012 3rd round pick.

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Old
11-02-2011, 02:27 PM
  #48
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Originally Posted by Pinkfloyd View Post
That's not true. He is still free to sign offer sheets. The problem is teams know he's willing to sign a fair contract elsewhere and don't want to extend one to him. Besides, Phoenix is libel to match it anyway. For CC, there is an unwritten deadline for Turris' camp with regards to offer sheets. It's basically a week before the 12/1 playing deadline. Coyotes would have a week to match any offer sheet and if it's offered and signed at let's say 11/29, they can sit on the offer sheet and not match until after 12/1 and he'd still be ineligible to play whether they match or not.
Thanks PF. So say we are a week or two before the 12/1 playing deadline. Sure Turris wants $3-4M per, but he isn't worth that. Say the Yotes are willing to let him sit out the season. They sure are getting there.

If you are Turris, you want to sign an offer sheet with someone at this point. Even if it's the Sharks for one year at $1.5M (or maybe the Flames on the long term deal, I hear they are wanting him bad, or another team). That way, once you sign that contract, you (Turris) know you will be on an NHL roster making NHL money (whether it be for the Yotes or someone else)

If Turris does NOT sign an offer sheet a week before 12/1 or with the Yotes before 12/1, he makes no money this season and loses this season completely. Thus, it would seem that Turris' agent should be soliciting for offer sheets, and specifically trying to get the best offer sheet possible.

And for the other teams, it seems to make sense to offer as low of an offer sheet as possible. After all, Turris has no leverage in this situation. No team is going throw him a 3 year, $3M/per offer sheet. If he gets a multi year offer sheet, it will probably have a cap hit of around $1M. Maybe a team would throw him a 1-2 year offer sheet at $1.5M. Whatever it is, those teams can make sure it's better than what the Yotes want to pay. Then with a signed offer sheet (contract), the Yotes can decide if they want Turris under the terms of the offer sheet or let him go (and possibly take nothing of the cap hit is at the level where there is no comp).

So from the Sharks POV, say the Monday before Thanksgiving rolls around and Turris is still not signed. That might be the time for DW to swoop in and offer a 1-2 year deal with a cap hit that either provides no compensation. If that's the only offer sheet out there, and the Yotes aren't going to sign him for more than the Sharks are offering, then if you are Turris on 11/21/11 you might very well sign that. If the Yotes match, no skin off DW's back.

Even to those saying that there is a code not to mess with other teams' RFA's, this is a different situation. This isn't Doughty or Stamkos. It's Kyle Turris, who hasn't done much in the NHL to date and the Yotes may deprive him of an NHL paycheck. No dishonor in DW coming in to help an NHL'er get some money.


Last edited by ChompChomp: 11-02-2011 at 02:33 PM.
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Old
11-02-2011, 02:28 PM
  #49
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Originally Posted by Gilligans Island View Post
Note - we don't have our 2012 3rd round pick.
Where did it go? I know Sheppard was acquired for our 2013 3rd.

Nevermind, from wikipedia:

"3.The San Jose Sharks' third-round pick will go to the Philadelphia Flyers as the result of a trade on July 1, 2011 that sent Kris Versteeg to the Florida Panthers in exchange for a second-round pick in either 2012 or 2013 and this pick.[14]
Florida previously acquired this pick as the result of a trade on June 25, 2011 that sent a second-round pick in 2011 to San Jose in exchange for a second-round pick in 2011 and this pick.[5]
"


Last edited by ChompChomp: 11-02-2011 at 02:33 PM.
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Old
11-02-2011, 02:32 PM
  #50
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Where did it go? I know Sheppard was acquired for our 2013 3rd.
Check this site (Might only work in IE) http://prosportstransactions.com/hoc...Years/2012.htm


Panthers: Traded 2011 second round pick (#47-Matt Nieto) to Sharks for 2011 second round pick (#59-Rasmus Bengtsson), 2012 third-round pick (?-?) on 2011-06-25

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