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The Ryan McDonagh Mancrush thread

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Old
11-06-2011, 11:19 PM
  #176
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getting rid of gomez, imho, was addition by subtraction. i woulda traded him away for a 7th round draft pick.

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11-06-2011, 11:27 PM
  #177
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Okay...so having Subban means that you don't "need" McDonagh? He's be #2 on your depth chart right now; hell, this season, he's been better than Subban has.

Your top 6 currently sports players such as Rafael Diaz and Jaro Spacek. Hal Gill will soon be gone to retirement. Markov is injured more often than not. Weber/Emelin are promising, as are Bealieu and Tinordi, but not at level of McDonagh.

I just don't buy the "we don't need him" argument. Every team could use a player like McD.
Well idk like i said im not here to troll..Markov has played 623 games over 9 seasons for us. He got seriously injured only 2 years ago and again last year on the same spot.

What i'm saying basicly we already have P.K Subban whos a really good 2-way player and he can play 25 mins easy. Last year he did 30-32 mins in a couple of games in a row and he was only 21...Hopefully if Markov comes back 100% healthy we will have another #1 def in our team. We have Gorges whos a really solid D, Gill, Spacek and then Weber/Diaz/Emelin...I just dont see Mcdnagh as a big necessity I would see him more like a luxury. Mcdonagh could have played in our #2 line but at this moment what is more precious to us is experience.

But I agree wth you with Markov out, Macdonagh would have been a great asset.

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11-06-2011, 11:36 PM
  #178
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Well idk like i said im not here to troll..Markov has played 623 games over 9 seasons for us. He got seriously injured only 2 years ago and again last year on the same spot.

What i'm saying basicly we already have P.K Subban whos a really good 2-way player and he can play 25 mins easy. Last year he did 30-32 mins in a couple of games in a row and he was only 21...Hopefully if Markov comes back 100% healthy we will have another #1 def in our team. We have Gorges whos a really solid D, Gill, Spacek and then Weber/Diaz/Emelin...I just dont see Mcdnagh as a big necessity I would see him more like a luxury. Mcdonagh could have played in our #2 line but at this moment what is more precious to us is experience.

But I agree wth you with Markov out, Macdonagh would have been a great asset.
wow..who knew...a 22 year old who is a top pair defenseman right now is a luxury. man, must be nice to have that kinda depth.

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11-06-2011, 11:37 PM
  #179
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And honestly we dont really care about Gomez its all the other players we got that counts. If it happens that Gomez wakes up it will be a plus for us none the less. Again space cap wise yes it does hurt but in general it was hard to attract free agents in Montreal back then to play for us.. so getting a Big name first was mandatory and dosent matter how bad he is now Gomez meant something back then.

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11-06-2011, 11:42 PM
  #180
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And honestly we dont really care about Gomez its all the other players we got that counts. If it happens that Gomez wakes up it will be a plus for us none the less. Again space cap wise yes it does hurt but in general it was hard to attract free agents in Montreal back then to play for us.. so getting a Big name first was mandatory and dosent matter how bad he is now Gomez meant something back then.
you think Scott Gomez is the reason you guys got Gionta and Cammalleri? Not the fact that you gave the guys 55 million dollars between the 2?

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11-06-2011, 11:47 PM
  #181
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wow..who knew...a 22 year old who is a top pair defenseman right now is a luxury. man, must be nice to have that kinda depth.
Its because you dont understand how to play in Montreal feels for a player with all the pressure, the media and the fans. Hockey is our #1 sport here...imagine CFL comes second.

Maybe his a top D in New york but its not guaranteed to be the same for him here.

I can name you at least 10 young players who were struggling in Montreal the past few years and then left the city and were playing in the top lines with their new teams.

I guess I was taking that in consideration when I was saying having him would have been a luxury cuz it wasn't guaranteed he was gonna perform that great with us.

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11-06-2011, 11:50 PM
  #182
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Well idk like i said im not here to troll..Markov has played 623 games over 9 seasons for us. He got seriously injured only 2 years ago and again last year on the same spot.

What i'm saying basicly we already have P.K Subban whos a really good 2-way player and he can play 25 mins easy. Last year he did 30-32 mins in a couple of games in a row and he was only 21...Hopefully if Markov comes back 100% healthy we will have another #1 def in our team. We have Gorges whos a really solid D, Gill, Spacek and then Weber/Diaz/Emelin...I just dont see Mcdnagh as a big necessity I would see him more like a luxury. Mcdonagh could have played in our #2 line but at this moment what is more precious to us is experience.

But I agree wth you with Markov out, Macdonagh would have been a great asset.
Gill and Spacek are ancient. Not to mention Gill just isn't very good. In regards to Emelin and Diaz, neither of them are even remotely in the same league as McDonagh in terms of potential. They could be serviceable 3/4 d-men, but McDonagh has all-star potential

Neither Gorges nor Weber are better than McDonagh right now, and Gorges has 5 years on McDonagh.

I'll give you Subban even though he's been struggling this season. He's a beast. That's about it

As for the trade, we would have won it if nothing came back our way. I remember people talking about giving up a pick just so someone would take the guy. The fact that we got McDonagh absolutely makes this trade one of the most lopsided in history. I just can't see how anyone can argue otherwise

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11-06-2011, 11:50 PM
  #183
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you think Scott Gomez is the reason you guys got Gionta and Cammalleri? Not the fact that you gave the guys 55 million dollars between the 2?
Trust me...even Briere after we offered him the better deal dint wanted to come here. So many top players we tried to sign that never came here. I think Gomez played a big part in it definitely.

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11-06-2011, 11:55 PM
  #184
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Gill and Spacek are ancient. Not to mention Gill just isn't very good. In regards to Emelin and Diaz, neither of them are even remotely in the same league as McDonagh in terms of potential. They could be serviceable 3/4 d-men, but McDonagh has all-star potential

Neither Gorges nor Weber are better than McDonagh right now, and Gorges has 5 years on McDonagh.

I'll give you Subban even though he's been struggling this season. He's a beast. That's about it

As for the trade, we would have won it if nothing came back our way. I remember people talking about giving up a pick just so someone would take the guy. The fact that we got McDonagh absolutely makes this trade one of the most lopsided in history. I just can't see how anyone can argue otherwise
I agree.

But the fact that we went to the ECF (after almost 20 years )the same year we got him, totally makes up for the young prospect we gave away the previous summer.

And btw he was not our top prospect.. Subban was so really the risks were calculated i'm pretty sure.

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11-07-2011, 12:04 AM
  #185
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I agree.

But the fact that we went to the ECF (after almost 20 years )the same year we got him, totally makes up for the young prospect we gave away the previous summer.

And btw he was not our top prospect.. Subban was so really the risks were calculated i'm pretty sure.
He scored 2 goals for you guys in 19 playoff games. Was it really worth giving up a potential #1 d-man for 2 goals in the playoffs? I know he had a bunch of assists, but at the end of the day the reason you guys got that far was because of two players : Halak and Cammalleri. I'm sorry, that's a pretty lame way to justify the trade.

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11-07-2011, 12:07 AM
  #186
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Originally Posted by XperHFB View Post
I agree.

But the fact that we went to the ECF (after almost 20 years )the same year we got him, totally makes up for the young prospect we gave away the previous summer.

And btw he was not our top prospect.. Subban was so really the risks were calculated i'm pretty sure.
ECF doesn't mean **** unless you build off it and go even further the next year which the Habs didn't.

You can't justify trading away one of your top prospects and claim it's a good deal because you reached the ECF one year. ECF =/= Stanley Cup.

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11-07-2011, 12:19 AM
  #187
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Its because you dont understand how to play in Montreal feels for a player with all the pressure, the media and the fans. Hockey is our #1 sport here...imagine CFL comes second.

Maybe his a top D in New york but its not guaranteed to be the same for him here.

I can name you at least 10 young players who were struggling in Montreal the past few years and then left the city and were playing in the top lines with their new teams.

I guess I was taking that in consideration when I was saying having him would have been a luxury cuz it wasn't guaranteed he was gonna perform that great with us.
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Trust me...even Briere after we offered him the better deal dint wanted to come here. So many top players we tried to sign that never came here. I think Gomez played a big part in it definitely.
im very aware of the lunacy in Montreal and in Toronto when it comes to hockey, trust me. Its kinda like NY is for baseball.except worse...like WAY worse.

With that said, i'm going to call shenanigans that Scott Gomez is the reason those 2 guys signed there, and not the 50 million bucks thrown their way. could it have made some sorta impact? I guess. maybe a small one. but marginal at best imho. did they turn down more money elsewhere to join your team and specifically say he was a reason for doing so? if so, then ill take it back...but until then, i call shenanigans.

if anything youd think it would have the opposite impact.

Why?

put yourself in a perspective free agents mindset.

ok, this team just traded some big time assets to acquire a guy who had 58 pts the year before, has a MASSIVE contract with 5 more years to go...this hampers their ability to sign other impact players, and by dealing away their, at the time, #1 or #2 prospect delivers a blow to their depth going forward.


Even besides all that, look at your D going forward next year, outside of Markov, everybody is either and UFA or an RFA say hello to raises galore, and this is with the team likely having to give Carey Price a contract in the 6-7 million dollar neighborhood as im sure everyone expects. Scott Gomez just kills your team right now. the question is, is your team willing to bury him in the minors where he should be.

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11-07-2011, 12:47 AM
  #188
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McD was a steal. Sather commited Grand Larceny with that trade. The guy is already a stud and he is only getting better. To say that MTL wouldn't want him or that he would be a luxury there is ridiculous.

How can you justify trading one of your top prospects who had potential to be a #1 guy for a guy who is an abomination on skates? It is obvious to anyone that is not a homer that the Rangers won this trade hands down. Also Gomez was not the reason for Cammy and Gionta going to MTL, it was the fact that you threw 55 million bucks at them. On top of that, the arguement that they made the ECF that year means they won the trade is also stupid. No offense and I really mean it, but it is idiotic to think that MTL won the trade. Having Subban or not does not make it okay to throw away a guy who could very well be a top player in the NHL

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11-07-2011, 12:48 AM
  #189
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im very aware of the lunacy in Montreal and in Toronto when it comes to hockey, trust me. Its kinda like NY is for baseball.except worse...like WAY worse.

With that said, i'm going to call shenanigans that Scott Gomez is the reason those 2 guys signed there, and not the 50 million bucks thrown their way. could it have made some sorta impact? I guess. maybe a small one. but marginal at best imho. did they turn down more money elsewhere to join your team and specifically say he was a reason for doing so? if so, then ill take it back...but until then, i call shenanigans.

if anything youd think it would have the opposite impact.

Why?

put yourself in a perspective free agents mindset.

ok, this team just traded some big time assets to acquire a guy who had 58 pts the year before, has a MASSIVE contract with 5 more years to go...this hampers their ability to sign other impact players, and by dealing away their, at the time, #1 or #2 prospect delivers a blow to their depth going forward.


Even besides all that, look at your D going forward next year, outside of Markov, everybody is either and UFA or an RFA say hello to raises galore, and this is with the team likely having to give Carey Price a contract in the 6-7 million dollar neighborhood as im sure everyone expects. Scott Gomez just kills your team right now. the question is, is your team willing to bury him in the minors where he should be.

I don't understand the wanting to sign because of Gomez thing either. There were probably 20+ centers in the league better than him at the time. Why in gods name would he be the reason anyone signs with a team? And that was after he had the disappointing season in NY and everyone was screaming albatross

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11-07-2011, 12:50 AM
  #190
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It was stated after the trade that the acquisition of Gomez positively influenced guys to sign there. Definitely Gionta and maybe Cammelleri too. I don't have a link or anything and I don't know if they turned down more money from another team, but it was said many times that summer. Hopefully someone else will remember the details.

Still, I have to agree that you'd be silly not to be upset about losing McDonagh. I don't want to get ahead of myself, but I think there is a strong possibility that he will be our #1 Dman in a few years.

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11-07-2011, 12:52 AM
  #191
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Originally Posted by Inferno272 View Post
im very aware of the lunacy in Montreal and in Toronto when it comes to hockey, trust me. Its kinda like NY is for baseball.except worse...like WAY worse.

With that said, i'm going to call shenanigans that Scott Gomez is the reason those 2 guys signed there, and not the 50 million bucks thrown their way. could it have made some sorta impact? I guess. maybe a small one. but marginal at best imho. did they turn down more money elsewhere to join your team and specifically say he was a reason for doing so? if so, then ill take it back...but until then, i call shenanigans.

if anything youd think it would have the opposite impact.

Why?

put yourself in a perspective free agents mindset.

ok, this team just traded some big time assets to acquire a guy who had 58 pts the year before, has a MASSIVE contract with 5 more years to go...this hampers their ability to sign other impact players, and by dealing away their, at the time, #1 or #2 prospect delivers a blow to their depth going forward.


Even besides all that, look at your D going forward next year, outside of Markov, everybody is either and UFA or an RFA say hello to raises galore, and this is with the team likely having to give Carey Price a contract in the 6-7 million dollar neighborhood as im sure everyone expects. Scott Gomez just kills your team right now. the question is, is your team willing to bury him in the minors where he should be.
This is were the notion "deal with it" comes in to play. He is injured right now, I think he will stay like this for a while. This summer Gill and Spacek will be gone thats a combined 6 millions. At worst case scenario we will bury him in the AHL like you said and we will have space again to sign who ever we want at what ever price they ask lol

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11-07-2011, 12:55 AM
  #192
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MTL went to the ECF because Halak put on the goaltending clinic of the decade. Even better than Tim Thomas, IMO.

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11-07-2011, 12:56 AM
  #193
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McD was a steal. Sather commited Grand Larceny with that trade. The guy is already a stud and he is only getting better. To say that MTL wouldn't want him or that he would be a luxury there is ridiculous.

How can you justify trading one of your top prospects who had potential to be a #1 guy for a guy who is an abomination on skates? It is obvious to anyone that is not a homer that the Rangers won this trade hands down. Also Gomez was not the reason for Cammy and Gionta going to MTL, it was the fact that you threw 55 million bucks at them. On top of that, the arguement that they made the ECF that year means they won the trade is also stupid. No offense and I really mean it, but it is idiotic to think that MTL won the trade. Having Subban or not does not make it okay to throw away a guy who could very well be a top player in the NHL
I never said we won the trade...the only thing i said was that it helped us get other quality players..but if Gomez was a regular 60 pointer then we would have won the trade (not by too much though) at this moment right now considering our needs. Thats it

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11-07-2011, 01:03 AM
  #194
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I never said we won the trade...the only thing i said was that it helped us get other quality players..but if Gomez was a regular 60 pointer then we would have won the trade (not by too much though) at this moment right now considering our needs. Thats it
For you to have won the trade, you would have needed to done better than us. We created the cap space to sign Gaborik by dumping an overpaid center signed for quite a few more years who was on the decline and got a 22 year old top pairing defenseman on an ELC for dirt cheap.

You didn't.

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11-07-2011, 01:06 AM
  #195
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I don't understand the wanting to sign because of Gomez thing either. There were probably 20+ centers in the league better than him at the time. Why in gods name would he be the reason anyone signs with a team? And that was after he had the disappointing season in NY and everyone was screaming albatross
Well i'm pretty sure Gainey is not a dumb guy and i'm pretty sure the reason he traded for Gomez was because the opportunity to acquire a good player for "cheap" came to him, so he took it. Considering it was hard to get players to come in Montreal he had no choice but to sacrifice one good prospect instead of giving Price,Marko or Subban.

I'm pretty sure Gainey knew what he was doing at that time.

Honestly Gainey made one really bad trade in his life with us and that was giving Ribeiro away for free to Dallas. Besides that i really dont have a problem with Gomez trade.

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11-07-2011, 01:08 AM
  #196
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For you to have won the trade, you would have needed to done better than us. We created the cap space to sign Gaborik by dumping an overpaid center signed for quite a few more years who was on the decline and got a 22 year old top pairing defenseman on an ELC for dirt cheap.

You didn't.
Well, we went to the ECF.

You didn't.

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11-07-2011, 01:10 AM
  #197
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Well, we went to the ECF.

You didn't.
And you conclusively say you wouldn't have made the ECF without Gomez? Forget all the other pieces that had no direct effect from the trade. It's funny you give credit to Gomez for making the ECF, but you don't blame him for getting knocked out of the first round the next season.

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11-07-2011, 01:10 AM
  #198
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I will stop arguing right here cuz I feel this will turn in a troll war.

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11-07-2011, 01:13 AM
  #199
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Well, we went to the ECF.

You didn't.
Everyone got cookies and pats on the back for it, I'm sure.

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11-07-2011, 01:26 AM
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I will stop arguing right here cuz I feel this will turn in a troll war.
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Everyone got cookies and pats on the back for it, I'm sure.
Ehhhh

Yeah, if you need anything just let me know.

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