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Old
11-07-2011, 09:14 AM
  #176
Ilovemymum
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Originally Posted by anofsti View Post
I think alot of it stems from american sports being more about earning money, and not being best. Becuase of that, the club owners bargain collectivly to keep salaries down, while in europe, they try to outbid each other. That way, they don't only have a complicated rights system, but also finacial head room to "re-buy" the rights; not to forget that they don't have to pay the salaries if the player in question goes to europe. In european sports, if you keep a player you don't intend to use, you're just wasting money, because of big saleries and most clubs are always looking to shed expenses to buy new players.
But what does the QOs look like? I know Tollefsen got one but turned it down and went to Modo. Are they typically one way deals, where they make a fraction in the AHL compared to the NHL entry level contract they had the year before?

And what's the deal with Current Swift and Søberg? Very annoying that the highest draftet goalie ever now is out of hockey indefinately. Did he sign a contract with CSB and then he moved back? I guess it's not a very smart move, but the kid just turned 18 years old and didn't want to leave, so they should get over it and sign the card or whatever they have to do.


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11-07-2011, 09:57 AM
  #177
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Originally Posted by Tunnelundefaret View Post
But what does the QOs look like? I know Tollefsen got one but turned it down and went to Modo. Are they typically one way deals, where they make a fraction in the AHL compared to the NHL entry level contract they had the year before?

And what's the deal with Current Swift and Søberg? Very annoying that the highest draftet goalie ever now is out of hockey indefinately. Did he sign a contract with CSB and then he moved back? I guess it's not a very smart move, but the kid just turned 18 years old and didn't want to leave, so they should get over it and sign the card or whatever they have to do.
That has nothing to do with The Rangers ,what so ever. They are annoyed already,and we should not adress other players contract to them

Søberg should go back in my opinion.

And by the way,it`s Swift Current,not the opposite

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11-07-2011, 10:25 AM
  #178
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There have been some ideas thrown out about changing the entry level system in the next CBA. Make it 4 or 5 years for players 18-21 and adjust it for the other eligible players. The 2nd contract is taking money away from the veteran players. JVR and Myers are making crazy $ in their 2nd contracts. Both players are struggling this season and those contracts don't begin into next season.

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11-07-2011, 02:28 PM
  #179
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Well, it doesn't look good for MZA now when the Rangers are doing well. I'd say he has two options, 1. Stay in the minors for the rest of the season, 2. Break the contract and play in Europe. I think he'll go for the last one and return to Swedish hockey. He'll be close to home and have a decent salary that makes sense compared to his skills.

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11-07-2011, 03:01 PM
  #180
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Well, it doesn't look good for MZA now when the Rangers are doing well. I'd say he has two options, 1. Stay in the minors for the rest of the season, 2. Break the contract and play in Europe. I think he'll go for the last one and return to Swedish hockey. He'll be close to home and have a decent salary that makes sense compared to his skills.
And burn all bridges to NHL the 3 comming years? There will be injuries. I think he will get a call up.
And I think he is plain stupid if he leaves for europe now.

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11-07-2011, 03:41 PM
  #181
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Originally Posted by fredrikstad View Post
And burn all bridges to NHL the 3 comming years? There will be injuries. I think he will get a call up.
And I think he is plain stupid if he leaves for europe now.
Unless he gets sick of the NHL and the way they treat him. Same thing happened to Jonas Holos, Mattis Olimb and O.K Tollefsen. OKT had an offer from Nashville this summer, but he was stupid enough to forget the famous clause in his Modo contract.

I'm a Norwegian myself living in NY. Maybe you can tell me why all my fellow countrymen struggle in the NHL, I have no idea

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11-07-2011, 03:58 PM
  #182
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Originally Posted by Wolfy View Post
Unless he gets sick of the NHL and the way they treat him. Same thing happened to Jonas Holos, Mattis Olimb and O.K Tollefsen. OKT had an offer from Nashville this summer, but he was stupid enough to forget the famous clause in his Modo contract.

I'm a Norwegian myself living in NY. Maybe you can tell me why all my fellow countrymen struggle in the NHL, I have no idea
Dont forget Patrick Thoresen, a guy that has dominated KHL with Salavat, now a 1 line center for SKA, not good enough for any team in NHL? BS..............from one end to another..

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11-07-2011, 04:09 PM
  #183
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Originally Posted by fredrikstad View Post
That has nothing to do with The Rangers ,what so ever. They are annoyed already,and we should not adress other players contract to them

Søberg should go back in my opinion.

And by the way,it`s Swift Current,not the opposite
Don't know the whole story, but if he's back in Oslo playing NHL 12 dreaming of making the BHs roster sometimes in the future, he's not playing his cards very well.
I'd say this is his chance over there. If he wants to follow an other profession or aim at SEL he might wait it out for a bit. The incident in WJs when he took himself off the ice against Canada adds to the impression that he's not too easy to handle, and I guess scouts care quite a bit about that.
Go Rangers

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11-07-2011, 04:18 PM
  #184
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Wolski now being out for a month (at least( should open up some possibilities for mini Mats.

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11-07-2011, 04:19 PM
  #185
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Originally Posted by Interesting Cat View Post
Dont forget Patrick Thoresen, a guy that has dominated KHL with Salavat, now a 1 line center for SKA, not good enough for any team in NHL? BS..............from one end to another..
Yes, it's very hard to understand why he could find a club in the NHL. He wasn't too happy about his agent. He's an unrestricted free agent now?

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11-07-2011, 04:22 PM
  #186
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Thoresen demanded a one way deal. He didn't get one, so he bolted.

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11-07-2011, 04:26 PM
  #187
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Wolski now being out for a month (at least( should open up some possibilities for mini Mats.
I sort of doubt that, unless someones play drops significantly for multiple games (then again.. with Torts behind the wheel, its difficult to say).

I'd think that they'll just move existing players around as needed, and "fill up" the 4th line if there are any holes in the roster.

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11-07-2011, 04:38 PM
  #188
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Originally Posted by Interesting Cat View Post
Dont forget Patrick Thoresen, a guy that has dominated KHL with Salavat, now a 1 line center for SKA, not good enough for any team in NHL? BS..............from one end to another..
How could I forget him

Regarding Wolski. There are only 12 forwards and 6 Ds on the roster now. Somebody should be called up before the next road trip. Poor Zucc if they bypass him once again

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11-07-2011, 04:49 PM
  #189
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Originally Posted by Tunnelundefaret View Post
Yes, it's very hard to understand why he could find a club in the NHL. He wasn't too happy about his agent. He's an unrestricted free agent now?
He should be an UFA now, but I dont think he will ever play in NHL, unless a team comes up with a one way contract which is unlikely. He is happy with his situation now, a respected player in KHL, good salary and not to far away from Norway.

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11-07-2011, 04:58 PM
  #190
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I sort of doubt that, unless someones play drops significantly for multiple games (then again.. with Torts behind the wheel, its difficult to say).

I'd think that they'll just move existing players around as needed, and "fill up" the 4th line if there are any holes in the roster.
I fear you`re right in this. Torts must have caught him making a joke about him or something, this degrading is a mystery
The camp was great, the preseason was great, suddenly everything went wrong and he barely got minutes. Torts even praised him as one of his best players at one point.

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11-07-2011, 05:05 PM
  #191
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MZA deserves a callup and Deveaux should be returned to hartford. It's pretty simple. We would be a better team if that happens.

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11-07-2011, 05:09 PM
  #192
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Originally Posted by RikElite View Post
Thoresen demanded a one way deal. He didn't get one, so he bolted.
Though he would get a one way deal, being one of the point leaders in KHL and the +/- leader of the whole league. He wanted to stay with his family, understandable after two years in Sibiria (literally). The two way contract doesn't seem very family friendly.

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11-07-2011, 11:51 PM
  #193
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I´m starting go get some of the NHL-rules, which are quite complicated compared to what we are used to in Europe in other sports, mainly football (soccer).

If we compare Zuccas situation to what would happen in a football club in Europe, 99,9% of the clubs will let a player go if he is not in their future plans. This of course because the contracts are different from the NHL. If a player does not intend to resign his contract, then the club wants to get money for him, and usually sells him before the contract expires. At the end of their contracts they become a so called "Bosman player", which is nothing else than you would call a unrestricted free agent in the NHL-system. And the player can sign for whom i wishes.

What I find problematic with the RFA-system and QO, is that the club has too much ownership in the player, even if he is not in the clubs future.

The question I, and many other norwegians, ask them selves would be:

Why would the Rangers extend a qualifying offer to Zuke after he finishes his entry level contract, if he is not in their plans? For me that is strange. If a firm has an employee that is not wanted, why would they pay him to stay, and do nothing, just to prevent other firms from picking him up?

I know this is a lot about business, but why on earth would Rangers reclaim Zuke´s rights and bury him in the AHL, thus stopping other NHL teams from picking him up without a offering sheet, when he obviously is not in their future plans?

I just don´t get it. I get that they can do this by the rules, but I don´t see any logic to this.

One more question:

Given that The rangers give Zuccarello a qualifying offer at the end of the season, and no other teams extends an offer sheet, and Zuccarello accepts and signs the qualifying offer.

I have read that the new contract is 1 or 2 years. Can Zuccarello decide whether he wants 1 or 2 years?
At the end of this new contract, will he THEN becoma a UFA, even though he is not 27 years old, or can the Rangers keep on giving qualifying offers every time the contract expires until he is 27?
To answer your first question: Chances are, if Zuccarello isn't in the Rangers plans, they will trade him before the end of the season. If the Rangers do keep him, the QO will be for one year.

You should also be aware that once Zuccarello plays in 60 NHL games (he's already played in 45 up to this point), he will be subject to waivers and that means the Rangers risk losing him to another team if they were to try and send him back to the AHL. If he doesn't play in the NHL again this year, signs the qualifying offer and is buried in the AHL for all of next year, he will become a UFA because he'll have finished his 2nd contract and hasn't played enough NHL games.

At this moment all Zuccarello can do is play as hard as possible--if he plays well both the Rangers and other teams will notice. I think he will either be part of the every day lineup or traded by the deadline.

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11-07-2011, 11:54 PM
  #194
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Originally Posted by Bardof425 View Post
MZA deserves a callup and Deveaux should be returned to hartford. It's pretty simple. We would be a better team if that happens.
But, only if the coaching staff was willing to play Zuccarello at least 12-13 minutes a night. If they are only going to play him 5-6 shifts on the 4th line, then he's not going to be able to score enough to stay in the lineup.

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11-08-2011, 01:02 AM
  #195
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Dont forget Patrick Thoresen, a guy that has dominated KHL with Salavat, now a 1 line center for SKA, not good enough for any team in NHL? BS..............from one end to another..
Funny how Norway, who has ZERO NHL players, is ranked 9th worldwide. 10th ranked Slovakia, has how many? 15-20?

Maybe SEL is a better league than most think, since the national team is like 80% SEL players.

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11-08-2011, 02:17 AM
  #196
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Funny how Norway, who has ZERO NHL players, is ranked 9th worldwide. 10th ranked Slovakia, has how many? 15-20?

Maybe SEL is a better league than most think, since the national team is like 80% SEL players.
Isnt SEL ranked as third, after NHL and KHL ? But how does AHL fit into this ?

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11-08-2011, 02:24 AM
  #197
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I think they'll send down deveaux and call up Hagelin and Mitchell for a closer look - They know what zuke can do but the other two are unproven in the eyes of Ranger coaches..

As for zuke, like I've said ALOT these past weeks, patience and point production in ahl WILL get him BOTH Rangers attention but also attention from other clubs...

If he bolts to Europe now, he's likely done in nhl...Same as with Holos, who broke his contract with Colorado - no one wants a quiter so he's done in nhl...

Right now there's no place for zuke on anything other than the 4th line with 5-7 minutes of ice time but things happens fast in this game..

He had an eye opening training camp and pre season games that were very good but he blew it BIG time in his first shift on the ice in the first game. First thing he does is getting a stupid penalty and a fine from the nhl, that buried him..If he'd only score on his penalty shot in the first game he could've been here more than 3 games....

Right now all he has to do is keep his head up, produce great plays and stay out of trouble, then when the call comes he has to play some monster games and then maybe he'll be up more than a few weeks..

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11-08-2011, 02:28 AM
  #198
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But, only if the coaching staff was willing to play Zuccarello at least 12-13 minutes a night. If they are only going to play him 5-6 shifts on the 4th line, then he's not going to be able to score enough to stay in the lineup.
If Zuccarello is the guy I hope and think he is, he has really one option, forget about feeling mistreated in any way and play his a... off where he is now to capture a top six spot in NYR sooner or later. If he gives up and leave for Europe I will be hugely disappointed, its a completely different thing to play in europe than in the NHL in my eyes. If he stays in AHL and plays like a NHL player it proves hes got stamina and they have to bring him up at some point or trade him, I hope he stays in NYR because its a great club but one never knows.
Just look at Avery; not one bad word about the situation, just hard work and now he is up with the big guys.

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11-08-2011, 03:47 AM
  #199
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I think they'll send down deveaux and call up Hagelin and Mitchell for a closer look - They know what zuke can do but the other two are unproven in the eyes of Ranger coaches..

As for zuke, like I've said ALOT these past weeks, patience and point production in ahl WILL get him BOTH Rangers attention but also attention from other clubs...

If he bolts to Europe now, he's likely done in nhl...Same as with Holos, who broke his contract with Colorado - no one wants a quiter so he's done in nhl...

Right now there's no place for zuke on anything other than the 4th line with 5-7 minutes of ice time but things happens fast in this game..

He had an eye opening training camp and pre season games that were very good but he blew it BIG time in his first shift on the ice in the first game. First thing he does is getting a stupid penalty and a fine from the nhl, that buried him..If he'd only score on his penalty shot in the first game he could've been here more than 3 games....

Right now all he has to do is keep his head up, produce great plays and stay out of trouble, then when the call comes he has to play some monster games and then maybe he'll be up more than a few weeks..
It's just crazy if that one shift blanked out the whole camp. Think he was very very unlucky in that situation, the other player a bit out of balance and he a bit too punch. It's redicilous if that's what sent him to the minors, but I think you might be right. He might have gotten himself a bit too confident with Torts maybe. The power distance vs management is not very long i Norway, compared to other places, and the consept of a playing coach is not rare.
Seasoning opener pep in Stockholm:
Torts: - What are we gonna do?
Team: - Grindgrindgrind
Torst: - What's the gameplan?
Team: - Grindgrindgrind
Torst: - How are we gonna grind them?
Team: - TRAPTRAPTRAP
Zucc: - no idea
Torts: - Who are we?
Team: - RANGERSRANGERSRANGERS
Zucc: - no idea

Torts to Zucc: Do you know what a Redden is?
Zucc: - no idea.

Now he knows.

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11-08-2011, 04:34 AM
  #200
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Originally Posted by Tunnelundefaret View Post
Don't know the whole story, but if he's back in Oslo playing NHL 12 dreaming of making the BHs roster sometimes in the future, he's not playing his cards very well.
I'd say this is his chance over there. If he wants to follow an other profession or aim at SEL he might wait it out for a bit. The incident in WJs when he took himself off the ice against Canada adds to the impression that he's not too easy to handle, and I guess scouts care quite a bit about that.
Go Rangers
Soberg is a spoiled kid, he's been drafted way higher than he really is, he had a chance to play for the Broncos (who's goalies duo is terrible) and had a chance to be sucessful, but he wasn't "feeling alright in NA", apparently missing his girl and family, if you can't make sacrifice to play at the best level, don't try, he is not even playing right now.

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