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11/5 Predators @ Sharks 7:30 pm

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Old
11-06-2011, 03:30 PM
  #776
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Originally Posted by InTentsProductions View Post
i may have overstated nabokov's struggles but this hyperbole is significantly worse. niemi was the sharks regular season mvp last year
Niemi had a month-long hot streak that Doug Wilson inexplicably concluded was worth over $15 million but he was under no circumstances the Sharks' MVP.

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11-06-2011, 04:09 PM
  #777
Ninja Hertl
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The Niemi hate is astounding considering he was one of the better sharks for the majority of the year last year. If anything Burns should be getting more flak because his play has been pretty awful. 0 points all week and looks confused in the zone.

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11-06-2011, 04:23 PM
  #778
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Originally Posted by sharkohol View Post
The Niemi hate is astounding considering he was one of the better sharks for the majority of the year last year. If anything Burns should be getting more flak because his play has been pretty awful. 0 points all week and looks confused in the zone.
I wouldn't go that far with Niemi. He had a couple of great months but most of his year was wildly inconsistent. And that continued into the post-season.

As for Burns, he definitely has room for improvement but I don't know why anyone would expect a player like him to transition to a more open system here seamlessly. It will take time for him.

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11-06-2011, 05:40 PM
  #779
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Originally Posted by sharkohol View Post
The Niemi hate is astounding considering he was one of the better sharks for the majority of the year last year. If anything Burns should be getting more flak because his play has been pretty awful. 0 points all week and looks confused in the zone.
He was hot for a few months, but Niitty was the starting goalie at this time last year because of Niemi's terrible play, and EVERYONE wanted Niemi gone.

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11-06-2011, 05:55 PM
  #780
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Yah but what choice do we really have as far as Goalies go.

Niemi has played pretty off.
Nitty is injured.
Griess is playing well but is pretty unproven.


All TMac can do is hope Neemo shows up soon.

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11-06-2011, 05:57 PM
  #781
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Yah but what choice do we really have as far as Goalies go.

Niemi has played pretty off.
Nitty is injured.
Griess is playing well but is pretty unproven.


All TMac can do is hope Neemo shows up soon.
How do you think players become proven? They play. Greiss earned a start for his performance and you can't bank on goalies being good from one season to the next unless you have an elite goalie. Remember, Niemi's year last year was his first season as a starter. He's not all that proven either.

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11-06-2011, 06:09 PM
  #782
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Originally Posted by Pinkfloyd View Post
How do you think players become proven? They play. Greiss earned a start for his performance and you can't bank on goalies being good from one season to the next unless you have an elite goalie. Remember, Niemi's year last year was his first season as a starter. He's not all that proven either.
Oh I completely hear you. I would like to see TMac play Niemi and Griess 50/50 right now till one of them shows that they deserve to be the #1 Goalie.

But I dont feel that TMac is going to do that. This is probably a few things that he may be looking at.

- Niemi has been signed for good $$$$.
- He has had shown that he can go on good hot streaks in the past.
- He has an SC ring.

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11-06-2011, 06:09 PM
  #783
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Originally Posted by Pinkfloyd View Post
How do you think players become proven? They play. Greiss earned a start for his performance and you can't bank on goalies being good from one season to the next unless you have an elite goalie. Remember, Niemi's year last year was his first season as a starter. He's not all that proven either.
Exactly, which is why you shouldn't sink $15.2 million and four years into a goalie unless you're absolutely certain of what you have. The Sharks would be in much better shape with a Greiss/Niittymaki tandem and $3.3mil to spend on improving the third line (more if you place Niitty on LTIR and sign a backup for league minimum or call up Sateri) than they are now. Wilson made a smart move in ditching Nabokov last summer when he wasn't worth the money. It makes no sense that he believed Niemi was.

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11-06-2011, 08:23 PM
  #784
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You must also consider the matchup on the ice, and when it comes down to it...Thornton WILL be on the ice in these type of situations... if he wasn't out there, and we still didn't score... i bet you would still complain...
I'm sorry, can you read minds?

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11-06-2011, 09:04 PM
  #785
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Originally Posted by Les Wynan View Post
Exactly, which is why you shouldn't sink $15.2 million and four years into a goalie unless you're absolutely certain of what you have. The Sharks would be in much better shape with a Greiss/Niittymaki tandem and $3.3mil to spend on improving the third line (more if you place Niitty on LTIR and sign a backup for league minimum or call up Sateri) than they are now. Wilson made a smart move in ditching Nabokov last summer when he wasn't worth the money. It makes no sense that he believed Niemi was.
Nitty can't play. You mean Greiss and Sateri... I don't think so.

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11-06-2011, 10:15 PM
  #786
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Brent Burns View Post
Whoever was hating on Nabby... I felt a lot more secure when Nabby was in net over Niemi. Nabby would let in a few soft goals but they were few and far between. With Niemi, any shot at all seems like it's gonna go in.
Nabby's primary soft spot was consistantly his 5-hole, but as you said hes hardly giving up as many of those as Neimi has. Plus, if the team would have gone down to block more shots when he was on the team that wouldn't have been a problem at all. Sharks were horrible in bothering to block a shot.

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11-06-2011, 10:21 PM
  #787
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Originally Posted by Spacemania View Post
Nabby's primary soft spot was consistantly his 5-hole, but as you said hes hardly giving up as many of those as Neimi has. Plus, if the team would have gone down to block more shots when he was on the team that wouldn't have been a problem at all. Sharks were horrible in bothering to block a shot.
The shot blocking problem was Nabby's fault for the most part though. He didn't want guys in shooting lanes blocking his vision.

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11-07-2011, 09:09 AM
  #788
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I have to agree with the general consensus here. Niemi inspires no confidence. Even his saves make me nervous. Greiss is unproven but deserves more of a chance, especially after his performance against Pittsburgh. Also, Demers definitely deserves more ice. I have to admit he's my favorite Sharks' D. He always plays hard, and while he makes mistakes at least he isn't like some others who frequently appear to just be watching the game while they're on the ice.

Positively, as a team the Sharks don't seem to be having as many of those sequences when they're running around with their heads cut off.

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11-07-2011, 10:40 AM
  #789
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Nabby's only problem was that he thought he was worth $5 million a year.

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11-07-2011, 10:55 AM
  #790
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Originally Posted by InTentsProductions View Post
did you watch the detroit series?
moreover, as inconsistent as nemo's playoffs were last year i hardly think nabokov's playoffs were ever any better.
You mean the series where we were up 3-0 and had to win game 7? (Marleau!)
Yes.

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11-07-2011, 11:04 AM
  #791
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Originally Posted by InTentsProductions View Post
i may have overstated nabokov's struggles but this hyperbole is significantly worse. niemi was the sharks regular season mvp last year
I disagree with that.
Couture was, without a doubt in my mind. The kid carried us to a bunch of wins when everybody else (except Clowe) struggled.
Nemo was average, at best.

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11-07-2011, 01:52 PM
  #792
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Nemo was average, at best.
That's just absurd.

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11-07-2011, 02:09 PM
  #793
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That's just absurd.
Not entirely. He was 12th among 30 NHL starting goaltenders last season in SV%. So slightly above-average.

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11-07-2011, 02:18 PM
  #794
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Originally Posted by Les Wynan View Post
Not entirely. He was 12th among 30 NHL starting goaltenders last season in SV%. So slightly above-average.
He had a rough start with a new and struggling team. To say that Niemi was average AT BEST for the Sharks last year is absurd.

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11-07-2011, 02:22 PM
  #795
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Originally Posted by Les Wynan View Post
Not entirely. He was 12th among 30 NHL starting goaltenders last season in SV%. So slightly above-average.
And during the first half of that season, he was getting used to a new system, his job security was still on the bubble, and he was playing behind the likes of Wallin and Huskins on a consistent basis.

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11-07-2011, 02:32 PM
  #796
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And during the first half of that season, he was getting used to a new system, his job security was still on the bubble, and he was playing behind the likes of Wallin and Huskins on a consistent basis.
I don't have anything against Niemi (just his contract) but those first two sound more like excuses than anything else. He certainly wasn't getting used to a new system or having his job security threatened when he posted an .896 SV% in the playoffs. All goalies experience highs and lows in their performance; Niemi just seems more prone to extremes in both directions than most. That's not necessarily a bad thing -- if the Sharks get lucky enough that one of his hot streaks coincides with the postseason, they're golden. As for Wallin and Huskins, the Sharks' SV% with Huskins on the ice last season was 0.946 and it was 0.926 with Wallin on the ice, both of which were higher than Niemi's SV% of 0.920. That isn't to say Wallin and Huskins are good defensemen (they're not), just that defensemen in general have minimal impact on SV%.

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11-07-2011, 02:51 PM
  #797
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The problem with basing an argument solely on save percentage is that it's a stat that doesn't take into account the quality of shots (ie, how the team is playing in front of the goalie), and it's an average of multiple games (data gets skewed with one or two bad games). Niemi was no doubt struggling in some nights of the playoffs, but that save percentage doesn't really do him justice. Game 4 of Vancouver for example, he only faced 13 shots, allowed 4 and 3 out of the 4 goals were on 5 on 3s. Game 5 vs LA, he allowed 3 out of 4 goals where again, the majority he had no chance on (A deflection, a 2 on 1, a turnover in the high slot). Game 2 against Vancouver, 7 out of 38 where the team pretty much stopped playing in front of him in the 3rd because of Eager. It skews the data and makes it seem like he was below average for the entire playoffs, which he wasn't. He was actually pretty dominant in the entire Detroit series.

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11-07-2011, 04:43 PM
  #798
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Originally Posted by Led Zappa View Post
He had a rough start with a new and struggling team. To say that Niemi was average AT BEST for the Sharks last year is absurd.
So, you think he was above average?

After Nabby all those years, Nemo felt, at best, average to me.
I'm not trying to bag on Nemo, we've seen him do some amazing things in teal.

He finished strong (The whole team finished strong) and helped us get to the WCF again. Hopefully, he helps us get the the finals and beyond this year.

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11-07-2011, 04:47 PM
  #799
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Originally Posted by WTFetus View Post
The problem with basing an argument solely on save percentage is that it's a stat that doesn't take into account the quality of shots (ie, how the team is playing in front of the goalie), and it's an average of multiple games (data gets skewed with one or two bad games). Niemi was no doubt struggling in some nights of the playoffs, but that save percentage doesn't really do him justice. Game 4 of Vancouver for example, he only faced 13 shots, allowed 4 and 3 out of the 4 goals were on 5 on 3s. Game 5 vs LA, he allowed 3 out of 4 goals where again, the majority he had no chance on (A deflection, a 2 on 1, a turnover in the high slot). Game 2 against Vancouver, 7 out of 38 where the team pretty much stopped playing in front of him in the 3rd because of Eager. It skews the data and makes it seem like he was below average for the entire playoffs, which he wasn't. He was actually pretty dominant in the entire Detroit series.
Good post.

Not talking stats, personally, I cringe every time the opposing team comes down the ice. Maybe that'll change over time. I'm old, it takes a while to get into my head.

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