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Steve Downie / Ryan Shannon

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Old
11-07-2011, 03:38 AM
  #26
Rschmitz
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Shannon looked great pre-season, but as soon as the season started his creativity and skill set completely evaporated. Looks more like matt elich than st.louis light now, and 2010-2011 tyrell would be a hands down improvement

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11-07-2011, 09:14 AM
  #27
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Tyrell is on a two-way, isn't he? Him not being in Tampa is not an impossible problem to fix.

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11-07-2011, 09:26 AM
  #28
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Originally Posted by MAB4Norris View Post
Tyrell is on a two-way, isn't he? Him not being in Tampa is not an impossible problem to fix.
Calling up Tyrell, without sending someone down reintroduces the problem I think the team was having with too many players in the pressbox.

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Originally Posted by Rschmitz View Post
Shannon looked great pre-season, but as soon as the season started his creativity and skill set completely evaporated. Looks more like matt elich than st.louis light now, and 2010-2011 tyrell would be a hands down improvement
Shannon now > most of Tyrell's time in TB.

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Old
11-07-2011, 02:30 PM
  #29
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Originally Posted by Felonious Python View Post
Shannon now > most of Tyrell's time in TB.
I'm wondering if we are watching the same players, you can't believe that. Tyrell's overall game is far superior to shannons. And offensively shannon hasn't done anything, and that's the one area that tyrell lacks

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11-07-2011, 02:53 PM
  #30
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Originally Posted by Rschmitz View Post
I'm wondering if we are watching the same players, you can't believe that. Tyrell's overall game is far superior to shannons. And offensively shannon hasn't done anything, and that's the one area that tyrell lacks
Tyrell just sort of farted around until he eventually faded into the woodwork.

And Shannon's lack of production is more from connections being missed, then opportunities not being created. Tyrell rarely had anything to do with those.

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Old
11-07-2011, 05:04 PM
  #31
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Maybe... honestly, it may be a bit reactionary to throw Shannon/plug under the bus. I'm willing to give, barring a ton of horrible gaffs, him until game 25 before I make a verdict.

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11-07-2011, 05:31 PM
  #32
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Originally Posted by Felonious Python View Post
Shannon now > most of Tyrell's time in TB.
I completely disagree with this. Obviously Shannon is the more skilled player, but I'll take Tyrell's hustle and defense over the current Shannon any day of the week.

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Old
11-07-2011, 05:56 PM
  #33
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I don't know. I just think a lot of us has got a touch of buyer's remorse, and they're taking their first dump of the season on Shannon.

Shannon is more skilled than Tyrell. There is some consensus on that. The question should be, is Tyrell more skilled than Jones? As that's realistically the flip-flop that'd be happening.

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11-07-2011, 06:24 PM
  #34
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I'd much rather see Tyrell up than Jones. I'm not sure Jones has what it takes to make an impact here. I also think Tyrell would bring much more than Shannon could the way he's playing right now, but I feel Shannon (if he can figure it out) provides much more offensive power than Tyrell.

It would be great if we could combine the 3 into one guy and go with that.

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Old
11-07-2011, 07:03 PM
  #35
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Originally Posted by Felonious Python View Post
I don't know. I just think a lot of us has got a touch of buyer's remorse, and they're taking their first dump of the season on Shannon.

Shannon is more skilled than Tyrell. There is some consensus on that. The question should be, is Tyrell more skilled than Jones? As that's realistically the flip-flop that'd be happening.
I'm not sure about the buyer's remorse comment. Shannon was cheap and on paper seemed like a good fit for this team. However, it's hard to deny that he's been quite poor for us so far this season. Despite the fact he has more natural talent than a player like Tyrell, he hasn't been as effective as the latter was for us last year.

Who makes the lineup shouldn't necessarily depend on pure skill. Take Adam Hall for example. His skills are very limited, but he makes the most of what he has and is a reliable and consistent player on our 4th line. Tyrell's hands never caught up to his feet, but I like his tenacity on the forecheck and defensive play over what Shannon has brought thus far, which is very little. I haven't given up at all on Shannon, but if we're talking about what he's done to this point, I think it's fair to want to give Tyrell a shot. Of course, the play of Blair Jones has a lot to do with this as well. He'll be the one headed to Norfolk if Tyrell gets called up.

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Old
11-07-2011, 07:36 PM
  #36
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My top 6 based on performance this season:

Stamkos - St. Louis - Lecavalier
Gilroy - Connolly- MAB

Honorable mention: Malone, Shannon, Downie.

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11-07-2011, 07:42 PM
  #37
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Originally Posted by dbieon12 View Post
My top 6 based on performance this season:

Stamkos - St. Louis - Lecavalier
Gilroy - Connolly- MAB

Honorable mention: Malone, Shannon, Downie.
Gilroy started out horribly before the last few games. Hedman has been infinitely better IMO

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Old
11-07-2011, 08:45 PM
  #38
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Downie and Shannon together is a disaster. So many bad passes and it is quite evident they have 0 chemistry. Moore and Downie need someone else to gel with for them to start producing.
Shannon's too fast for Downie...

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11-07-2011, 08:57 PM
  #39
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Downie played with St. Louis and Stamkos for a long time, I doubt Shannon is so fast that he can't keep up.

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Old
11-07-2011, 09:18 PM
  #40
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Originally Posted by MAB4Norris View Post
Downie played with St. Louis and Stamkos for a long time, I doubt Shannon is so fast that he can't keep up.
That's true...

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Old
11-08-2011, 08:25 AM
  #41
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I think we're freaking out a bit too much about Shannon. This is the normal, average learning curve for Guys system. Some guys get it quick, some guys still resist a bit and have troubles.

Shannon will be a significant upgrade over Tyrell, in time.

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Old
11-08-2011, 08:29 AM
  #42
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Originally Posted by Genius Brian Lawton View Post
I think we're freaking out a bit too much about Shannon. This is the normal, average learning curve for Guys system. Some guys get it quick, some guys still resist a bit and have troubles.

Shannon will be a significant upgrade over Tyrell, in time.
This. Exactly.

It's not like Shannon is really 'going' anywhere. We're not going to send him to Norfolk over this, and unless a deal comes along, he's not going to be traded just yet. He'll sit in the pressbox, or he'll play. (I'd prefer him playing, since we know he has the skill, if not the know-how and maybe more importantly, the chemistry to use it for us. The chemistry hasn't had time to develop, since he's been sitting so much.)

I'm putting chemistry above the system here because if Shannon can gel with certain guys, he'd be gelling with system play.

Tyrell vs. Shannon is silly because Shannon is going to play top 9, while Tyrell isn't going past the DNA line, unless he's made some miraculous development since being sent down.

The more direct comparison would be Ritola vs. Shannon, as Ritola could have at least conceivably taken Shannon's spot while he was up. Now that he's in the bucket, Ritola's got to compete against Ashton, Conacher, and Tyrell, among others, for the call-up.


Last edited by Felonious Python: 11-08-2011 at 08:52 AM.
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11-08-2011, 09:31 AM
  #43
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Shannon's problem is Shannon. Until he controls his thoughts and projects some confidence, he will stumble.

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Old
11-08-2011, 10:29 AM
  #44
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Genius Brian Lawton View Post
I think we're freaking out a bit too much about Shannon. This is the normal, average learning curve for Guys system. Some guys get it quick, some guys still resist a bit and have troubles.

Shannon will be a significant upgrade over Tyrell, in time.
I think Shannon will eventually get the system down and contribute. But to think that he has been productive to this point, and I don't just mean on the score sheet, is wrong. I hope nobody is freaking out over it.

The Shannon love kinds of reminds me of the Randy Jones from last season. Just don't see it.

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Old
11-08-2011, 11:13 AM
  #45
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Originally Posted by Rschmitz View Post
I think Shannon will eventually get the system down and contribute. But to think that he has been productive to this point, and I don't just mean on the score sheet, is wrong. I hope nobody is freaking out over it.

The Shannon love kinds of reminds me of the Randy Jones from last season. Just don't see it.
The Randy Jones thing came out of a different context though. Everyone was telling us that we were getting this horrible defenseman, and he turned out sorta okay. The love for him was not about how he was such a good defenseman, but that he wasn't as bad as they said.

Shannon's come to TB with some positive comments out of Ottawa, and we want him to succeed.

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Old
11-08-2011, 12:28 PM
  #46
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Felonious Python View Post

Shannon now > most of Tyrell's time in TB.
Usually don't disagree with you but this is not true AINEC.

Tyrell played really good IMO last year, Shannon has not done anything in the whole regular season so far.

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Old
11-08-2011, 01:47 PM
  #47
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Originally Posted by Felonious Python View Post
The Randy Jones thing came out of a different context though. Everyone was telling us that we were getting this horrible defenseman, and he turned out sorta okay. The love for him was not about how he was such a good defenseman, but that he wasn't as bad as they said.

Shannon's come to TB with some positive comments out of Ottawa, and we want him to succeed.
Woops, didn't finish typing my thought. I don't mean the Jones love, I means the Jones hate. I thought he was solid and there were people who were hating on him when he was deserving of praise.

I'll throw one more out there that will probably get more nay's than yay's. MAB has played surprisingly good defense, and is a very good player without the puck. But as soon as he gains possession of the puck, and isn't shooting it, back to being a train wreck. He's a turnover machine.

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11-08-2011, 01:57 PM
  #48
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Usually don't disagree with you but this is not true AINEC.

Tyrell played really good IMO last year, Shannon has not done anything in the whole regular season so far.
Pretty harsh for a guy who only played in 8 games. And yeah he did help the rookie get his first point by making a good play in the corner and turning a firing a tape to tape pass to Moore who scored a goal. 3 points in 5 games isn't that shabby either. As others have said, he needs to find chemistry and start gelling with the right mix. He has not had the benefit (I know, not yet earned, but you can't earn it if not given the opportunity either) of playing in the top 6 with more skilled players.

The last third of last season he showed what he could do given the ice time on the top 2 lines. I remember 2x last year when he came into Tampa and helped beat the Bolts.

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11-08-2011, 02:04 PM
  #49
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http://downloads.lightning.nhl.com/a...ucherNov08.mp3

Downie will play tomorrow in Malone's spot with Stamkos and Purcell

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11-08-2011, 02:04 PM
  #50
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Are you guys seriously comparing Tyrell's 78 + 7 NHL games in a Bolts jersey to Shannon's 8? Tyrell also had the benefit of joining / making the team when over half of the roster, ownership, management and coaching staff was new. Shannon is the only truly new forward this year - except for Pyatt who played under Boucher before and plays a totally different role as he isn't expected to be overly creative and productive offensively (just like Tyrell, BTW). Everybody else played for us during our playoff run last season. Give this kid some time.

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