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Old
11-12-2011, 06:21 AM
  #51
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Originally Posted by static80 View Post
To be quite honest, I see a trade coming, either at the deadline or even sooner possibily.
Too many wingers.
The Roy/Stafford/Leino line may be doing decent these past 4 or 5 games, but it wasn't great to start the season. Obviously things can change if they slump again.

The Vanek, Pominville, Adam line I'm not as impressed with as others are here.
I'd like a speedier center with Vanek and Pommers and I'd like to see Adam with Gerbe and Boyes.

Shift Goose back to the 4th line with Kaleta and McCormick.
Send Ellis back down to Rochester.
Huh? No way Jose! Adam is plenty fast and he's the perfect compliment for those wingers. Strong, goes hard to the net, keeps it north and south. If you bring in some dangler he's just gonna screw up Vanek and Pomminville.

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11-12-2011, 06:46 AM
  #52
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Originally Posted by Play4Miracles View Post
Huh? No way Jose! Adam is plenty fast and he's the perfect compliment for those wingers. Strong, goes hard to the net, keeps it north and south. If you bring in some dangler he's just gonna screw up Vanek and Pomminville.
Could be correct, but I can't see Vanek and Pomers reaching their individual bests this season with Adam on the line.
Luke is a decent player, nothing fantastic however. He is young and I am sure will come along. Would just like to see that 1st scoring line get better than it already is.

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11-12-2011, 07:47 AM
  #53
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Originally Posted by static80 View Post
Could be correct, but I can't see Vanek and Pomers reaching their individual bests this season with Adam on the line.
Luke is a decent player, nothing fantastic however. He is young and I am sure will come along. Would just like to see that 1st scoring line get better than it already is.
That's ridiculous. They're having career statistical bests with Adam in the middle. That's the one line that should NOT be touched. LRS has come on as of late, but I'll break them up before VAP. VAP carried this offense through ten games.

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11-12-2011, 08:26 AM
  #54
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Originally Posted by static80 View Post
Could be correct, but I can't see Vanek and Pomers reaching their individual bests this season with Adam on the line.
Luke is a decent player, nothing fantastic however. He is young and I am sure will come along. Would just like to see that 1st scoring line get better than it already is.
If you need proof of the point I'm making, just remember when Roy centered Vanek and Pomminville. Trust me, Adam is the man for the job.

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11-12-2011, 08:30 AM
  #55
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That's ridiculous. They're having career statistical bests with Adam in the middle. That's the one line that should NOT be touched. LRS has come on as of late, but I'll break them up before VAP. VAP carried this offense through ten games.
Last night was one of his best games, but most nights I'd describe Adam less as contributing and more as not actively detracting from the V/P's magic. Still, thats not an insignificant accomplishment. Ruff will probably keep them together for the forseeable future.

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11-12-2011, 08:32 AM
  #56
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His name is Zenon Konopka. I don't think it's out of bounds to question parental love.
http://www.aolnews.com/2010/10/05/ho...fights-for-ev/

He's Zenon Konopka Jr.

And Sr. had quite the life story....

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11-12-2011, 09:03 AM
  #57
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Originally Posted by SoFFacet View Post
Last night was one of his best games, but most nights I'd describe Adam less as contributing and more as not actively detracting from the V/P's magic. Still, thats not an insignificant accomplishment. Ruff will probably keep them together for the forseeable future.
That's actually the point for this line. A center that's not detracting from Vanek and Pominville! Just as Play4Miracles said, a dangler would be catastrophic for them. We've seen it plenty of times, Vanek is not only a goal scorer, he's a fantastic playmaker too, but for that he needs the puck on his stick. His game is shifting with a dangler on his line, he's far less contributing to the play and is in a more supportive role then. Happens all the time when he's paired with Roy. The argument that he had his best season with him as his center doesn't count. Those were different times... Vanek can be dominating, as he is right now (last night was sub-par for him, but he still created a lot of chances. What a great sight, even on a bad day it clicks!), but he needs to be involved in the game as much as possible. It's the same thing that makes it so important, that he's involved in the PK. Two of his best career stretches he was PKing (recently and two years ago, first 20 games or so). I can understand that from own experience, even on a hobby sports level, it's the same with me: He needs a flow, needs to be involved in the game in every situation to get in a competitve rhythm, needs that bit of responsibility, a feel his actions count - and will affect the game's outcome heavily.

It's wonderful to behold right now - don't change it. And certainly not with a puck craving dangler.

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11-12-2011, 09:16 AM
  #58
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Originally Posted by LFDM View Post
That's actually the point for this line. A center that's not detracting from Vanek and Pominville! Just as Play4Miracles said, a dangler would be catastrophic for them. We've seen it plenty of times, Vanek is not only a goal scorer, he's a fantastic playmaker too, but for that he needs the puck on his stick. His game is shifting with a dangler on his line, he's far less contributing to the play and is in a more supportive role then. Happens all the time when he's paired with Roy. The argument that he had his best season with him as his center doesn't count. Those were different times... Vanek can be dominating, as he is right now (last night was sub-par for him, but he still created a lot of chances. What a great sight, even on a bad day it clicks!), but he needs to be involved in the game as much as possible. It's the same thing that makes it so important, that he's involved in the PK. Two of his best career stretches he was PKing (recently and two years ago, first 20 games or so). I can understand that from own experience, even on a hobby sports level, it's the same with me: He needs a flow, needs to be involved in the game in every situation to get in a competitve rhythm, needs that bit of responsibility, a feel his actions count - and will affect the game's outcome heavily.

It's wonderful to behold right now - don't change it. And certainly not with a puck craving dangler.
Well said. I would suggest also that some people look at other teams top scoring lines. Are all 3 puck hogging playmakers? Are all 3 snipers? Are all 3 the same kind of player? Usually the 3 are mostly different with little similarities that overlap. A Stable center like Adam is fine for that line. The proof is in the stats.

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11-12-2011, 10:04 AM
  #59
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Stafford has looked like the fastest player on the ice the past 3 games or so. Very impressed by his play

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11-12-2011, 10:06 AM
  #60
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Adam plays like a bull in a china shop. He isn't the most skilled, but the kid loves to plow to the net and in general just be in people's way while Vanek and Poms move the puck around. He's a perfect fit for them IMO and he'll only get better.

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Stafford has looked like the fastest player on the ice the past 3 games or so. Very impressed by his play
Agreed, though, I'd say 2nd fastest player. Roy is buzzing. His play has been incredible. It's the Roy from the beginning of last year.

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11-12-2011, 10:15 AM
  #61
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Originally Posted by gregor View Post
Adam plays like a bull in a china shop. He isn't the most skilled, but the kid loves to plow to the net and in general just be in people's way while Vanek and Poms move the puck around. He's a perfect fit for them IMO and he'll only get better.



Agreed, though, I'd say 2nd fastest player. Roy is buzzing. His play has been incredible. It's the Roy from the beginning of last year.
He has been directly responsible for many established forechecks by carrying the puck from our zone down the wing and either dumping it in and getting after it or carrying it over the line to establish possession. They have both been very effective at ES establishing sustained pressure, its been great to watch.

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11-12-2011, 10:16 AM
  #62
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Originally Posted by RiotAct View Post
I still can't believe Leino scored. Give the man a raise!!!!
I still can't figure out how the scoring officals gave Leino the goal - from all of the replays, it looked like Leino dropped a pass to Stafford, who took the shot that hit Auld and bounced up in the air. Yes, Stafford missed at swiping the puck in mid-air but Leino had already circled the net by the time the puck crossed the line....

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Originally Posted by jflory81 View Post
On a statistical basis - Ehrhoff did some digging out of his +/- hole (for whatever it's worth)....+3 tonight with an assist.
Chalk that up to one of those anomalies that happen every so often - I still think that the Ehrhoff-Gragnani pairing is the weakest defensively of the 3 defense tandems, regardless of the +/- stats.

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Sabres have now defeated Ottawa in 6 straight.

Seems so strange, since it still seems so recently that we never beat those guys.
MSG posted in their graphic during the pre-game that the Sabres were 7-1 against the Sens entering the game after the Sens had gone 9-0 the previous nine contests vs. Buffalo. I just hope that the reversal of fortunes the Sabres are benefiting from against Ottawa doesn't mean that their domination over Toronto will soon reverse itself in the Leafs' favor.

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Originally Posted by gregor View Post
Agreed, though, I'd say 2nd fastest player. Roy is buzzing. His play has been incredible. It's the Roy from the beginning of last year.
I'm with you on that perception - Roy looks like the buzzing waterbug he can be when he's at the top of his game. I doubt he'll ever give up his overdramatized acting when seeking a penalty call but I'll take the rest of his game at the moment.

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11-12-2011, 10:30 AM
  #63
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Originally Posted by Sabretip View Post
I still can't figure out how the scoring officals gave Leino the goal - from all of the replays, it looked like Leino dropped a pass to Stafford, who took the shot that hit Auld and bounced up in the air. Yes, Stafford missed at swiping the puck in mid-air but Leino had already circled the net by the time the puck crossed the line....
Stafford's shot was blocked and went to Leino along the goal-line for the followup.

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11-12-2011, 10:35 AM
  #64
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Originally Posted by Play4Miracles View Post
If you need proof of the point I'm making, just remember when Roy centered Vanek and Pomminville. Trust me, Adam is the man for the job.
He wont be able to since it never happen.

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11-12-2011, 10:50 AM
  #65
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Originally Posted by static80 View Post
To be quite honest, I see a trade coming, either at the deadline or even sooner possibily.
Too many wingers.
The Roy/Stafford/Leino line may be doing decent these past 4 or 5 games, but it wasn't great to start the season. Obviously things can change if they slump again.

The Vanek, Pominville, Adam line I'm not as impressed with as others are here.
I'd like a speedier center with Vanek and Pommers and I'd like to see Adam with Gerbe and Boyes.

Shift Goose back to the 4th line with Kaleta and McCormick.
Send Ellis back down to Rochester.
Couple of things.


1) Leino/Roy/Stafford were not together to start the season. They were put together after Ennis' injury and have been together for only 7-8gms. They've been very good with puck possession from the start and the production got going in the last 4 games. Basically the 4 or 5 games you feel they've played well are the bulk of the games they've been together.

2) Why in the world do you want to take apart the successful combos on this team? Gerbe/Goose/Kaleta or Boyes have been a rock as the 3rd line. Vanek/Adam/Pommer have been great together. Not sure why you're not impressed by them. Are you hung up on the fact that the center is not the force behind their succes? Even as a supporting player to Vanek/Pommer, Adam has 11 ES pts in 15gm. Thats pretty damn impressive.

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11-12-2011, 10:53 AM
  #66
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Just one thing: I really love Derek Roy on the point on the PP! He makes so many smart moves, it's a joy to watch.

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11-12-2011, 10:54 AM
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Originally Posted by joshjull View Post
He wont be able to since it never happen.
Ruff gave them a lot of time to gel in the preseason and it didn't happen. Then Vanek and Adam looked really good one game with Boyes on their wing, and Poms got slotted up the next game he was dressed for.

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11-12-2011, 10:57 AM
  #68
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Originally Posted by joshjull View Post
Couple of things.


1) Leino/Roy/Stafford were not together to start the season. They were put together after Ennis' injury and have been together for only 7-8gms. They've been very good with puck possession from the start and the production got going in the last 4 games. Basically the 4 or 5 games you feel they've played well are the bulk of the games they've been together.

2) Why in the world do you want to take apart the successful combos on this team? Gerbe/Goose/Kaleta or Boyes have been a rock as the 3rd line. Vanek/Adam/Pommer have been great together. Not sure why you're not impressed by them. Are you hung up on the fact that the center is not the force behind their succes? Even as a supporting player to Vanek/Pommer, Adam has 11 ES pts in 15gm. Thats pretty damn impressive.
For a veteran, let alone a rookie that's impressive! keep that line as is. Even if that line slumps for a couple games. They seem to compliment each other well.

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11-12-2011, 10:58 AM
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Good: That Enroth save on the 2 on 1 in the third. Just an amazing example of how well the kid reads the play. He was over and in position in the blink of an eye to make that stop.

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11-12-2011, 11:03 AM
  #70
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Good: That Enroth save on the 2 on 1 in the third. Just an amazing example of how well the kid reads the play. He was over and in position in the blink of an eye to make that stop.
I think it has slightly more to do with his reaction time. Reflexes like a cat.

Haven't really paid attention to how well he's been reading plays though, so I'm sure that's a large contributing factor.

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11-12-2011, 11:09 AM
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I think it has slightly more to do with his reaction time. Reflexes like a cat.

Haven't really paid attention to how well he's been reading plays though, so I'm sure that's a large contributing factor.
It was both, but he reads plays VERY well. (I am a goalie nerd, so i watch that sort of stuff all the time)

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11-12-2011, 11:33 AM
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Ruff gave them a lot of time to gel in the preseason and it didn't happen. Then Vanek and Adam looked really good one game with Boyes on their wing, and Poms got slotted up the next game he was dressed for.
1) How exactly could Ruff give them time to gel with Roy out injured most of preseason? He got hurt in the first period of the 3rd preason game. Roy didn't return until the game against Mannheim (preseason game 7). In fact none of Vanek, Roy or Pommer dressed for the first preseason game. They all dressed for the 2nd game and played together. Then Roy gets hurt in the 1st priod of the next game.

2) Roy's injury gave Adam his shot, not poor play by the Vanek/Roy/Pommer line or their inability to gel. Because in Roy's last full preseason game (game #2) Vanek and Pommer each scored goals. He assisted on Pommer's goal. That doesn't sound like a line not playing well and in need of breaking up.

3) I know posters have their agendas/issues with Vanek and Roy together. But Vanek/Roy/Stafford have not been a line on this team. I'm sorry but a preseason game does not constitute being a line for this team. Others team's don't always dress their best players in ther preseason. If they actual play together in the regular season. Then we can rate them and how they play together.

4) I'm pretty sure the poster I quoted was talking about previous seasons and thought Vanek/Roy/Pommer had been a line. I can't imagine he was pointing to the preseason game where they scored 2 goals as a line as proof they don't play well together.




In summary the bolded is just false. Vanek/Roy/Pommer played one game together in the preseason (game #2) and scored 2 goals. Then Roy got hurt in the 1st period of the next game and doesn't return until the last preseason game. Adam takes advantage of this opportunity.


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Old
11-12-2011, 11:49 AM
  #73
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Originally Posted by Buffalofan84 View Post
Just one thing: I really love Derek Roy on the point on the PP! He makes so many smart moves, it's a joy to watch.
This is noteworthy. I used to disdain him so much on the PP, one boneheaded play after another. All of a sudden he looks smart and very patient.

Patience on the PP, something I liked a lot yesterday. The play that led to the penalty to give them some 5-on-3 time. Of course, they failed to enter the zone for around 30 seconds, but kept puck possession without ever hurrying until they managed to get in fairly secure.

Even without scoring a PPG, they looked fantastic. 90 seconds of uninterrupted zone time was awesome.

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11-12-2011, 12:43 PM
  #74
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Good:

Stafford and Roy in full effect. LRS looks like a legit line.

5 goals. Not a ton of shots, but still -- 5 goals.

Enroth rock solid again.

Good movement on the PP. I agree that Roy looks good up top. On some of the PPs, they had really good rotation going. On the last one (I think), they were completely static.

Bad:

Not much. Too much time in the Buffalo zone, though, overall. A few dumb penalties.

Not exactly in the "bad" category, but Myers still looks slow this year, and kind of uncoordinated compared to last year. Not sure what's up with that.

Ellis had several surprisingly bad plays in the D-zone.

Ugly:

I got nothing.

Other:

I am constantly amazed at Leino's ability to keep the puck on his stick in traffic. I wouldn't exactly call it "dangling" because he doesn't have the speed and agility of someone like Datsyuk, and he's not really a power player. It's kind of weird - like magnets, or something. I don't always like it, but it's impressive to watch.

Gerbe has had several partial breakaways over the last few games, and he takes the same slapper from the mid- or top of the circle every time. As Harry Neale says, shooting the puck on net is not always the best play, but it's never a bad play. With no one else near the crease and no screen on the goalie, Gerbe needs to recognize that the slapper is not the best play. Take it to the hole, son.

I like Tropp's game. I thought he looked a little Mike-Ryan-style-out-of-control in pre-season, but he looks pretty good now. I'll look forward to his next call up.

Definite log-jam at wing, but that's a good problem to have in case of injury. I wouldn't be too anxious to trade anyone away. On the other hand, if Ennis and Hecht come back without any more injuries, it's going to be pretty tricky. I'm thinking:

Vanek-Adam-Poms
Leino-Roy-Stafford
Gerbe-Goose-Boyes
Ennis-Hecht-Kaleta

McC

send Ellis down

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11-12-2011, 01:22 PM
  #75
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Originally Posted by LFDM View Post
This is noteworthy. I used to disdain him so much on the PP, one boneheaded play after another. All of a sudden he looks smart and very patient.

Patience on the PP, something I liked a lot yesterday. The play that led to the penalty to give them some 5-on-3 time. Of course, they failed to enter the zone for around 30 seconds, but kept puck possession without ever hurrying until they managed to get in fairly secure.

Even without scoring a PPG, they looked fantastic. 90 seconds of uninterrupted zone time was awesome.
Roy looked good on the point last year too...unfortunately he was the only Sabres forward who looked good the first 30 games.

I like Roy a hell of a lot more on the point than on the half wall. He tries to force things a little less on the point because he has more options with the puck.

I don't like Roy carrying the puck in the neutral zone though. He's too afraid to dump it in and let the big bodies (Vanek, Boyes, Stafford, Adam, etc.) go and get it.

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