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2011 Capitals Roster Speculation, Thoughts, & Expectations (Acq./Rost. Bldg./Cap)

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Old
11-12-2011, 01:22 PM
  #751
ComplianceBuyout
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Any news on Green's injury from last night?

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11-12-2011, 01:44 PM
  #752
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Mike Green wonít play Saturday against Devils

By Katie Carrera

"Defenseman Mike Green will not play at Verizon Center in the second of back-to-back games against the New Jersey Devils, Coach Bruce Boudreau said Saturday morning.

Green made an abbreviated return to the Washington lineup Friday night, but played only 7 minutes and 10 seconds against the Devils before heading off to the dressing room with an apparent lower body injury.

The defenseman was hit late in the first period by New Jersey forward Ryan Carter. It was an awkward play with Green pinned to the corner boards and Carterís knee appeared to collide with the two-time Norris Trophy finalistís left leg."

I donít see this ever changing for Green. He is a smallish finesse defenseman. That gets pounded by the for check none stop. And he has made it clear that he does not play well banged up. And he cannot stay on the ice. He will forever be a target.
We will never be able to count on him to stay on the ice. If he canít stay on the ice now. He will never make it in the playoffs.

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11-12-2011, 02:09 PM
  #753
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Originally Posted by Mr Gone View Post
Mike Green wonít play Saturday against Devils

By Katie Carrera

"Defenseman Mike Green will not play at Verizon Center in the second of back-to-back games against the New Jersey Devils, Coach Bruce Boudreau said Saturday morning.

Green made an abbreviated return to the Washington lineup Friday night, but played only 7 minutes and 10 seconds against the Devils before heading off to the dressing room with an apparent lower body injury.

The defenseman was hit late in the first period by New Jersey forward Ryan Carter. It was an awkward play with Green pinned to the corner boards and Carterís knee appeared to collide with the two-time Norris Trophy finalistís left leg."

I donít see this ever changing for Green. He is a smallish finesse defenseman. That gets pounded by the for check none stop. And he has made it clear that he does not play well banged up. And he cannot stay on the ice. He will forever be a target.
We will never be able to count on him to stay on the ice. If he canít stay on the ice now. He will never make it in the playoffs.
He's just had a tough run of injuries. In the NFL the Raiders felt the same way about Charles Woodson and his injuries (and salary demands) and then they stopped and he was a dominant player again later in his career. Understand the frustration but the Caps need him and have to hope he stays healthy and he will turn it around.

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11-12-2011, 02:17 PM
  #754
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I can tell you from experience using the word never with such certainty will get you smoked. Green is a player with ability that is unmatched in this league. I would be very careful about wishing him gone.

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11-12-2011, 02:29 PM
  #755
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You cannot build a house on a bad foundation. And that is what the team has. No matter how you spin it. It will come back to the team not be prepared and not being able to adjust in the end. They play lazy poor fundamental hockey. And it’s been like this for years now.

"no legitimate points"

Accountability should start on day one. Not season four.

BB has some of the top talent in the league and the PP still sucks.

The team comes out flat for big games all the time.

It took three seasons for BB to make the forwards back check.

How many games seven have we lost at home now?

It’s not hard to keep going if you need me to.
The PP is top 5 in the league - not a legitimate point

You're admitting BB is holding players accountable - not a legitimate point

What big giames have they come out flat for this season? - not a legitimate point

You're admitting the forwards backcheck - not a legitimate point

2 game 7s lost at home, which has nothing to do with the current team or season - not a legitimate point

Again, I question as to whether you've actually watched the team this season.. You're going back to the same old criticisms from the doom crew, and still haven't brought forth a legitimate point for this season.

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11-12-2011, 02:39 PM
  #756
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Originally Posted by NobodyBeatsTheWiz View Post
You're admitting BB is holding players accountable - not a legitimate point

You're admitting the forwards backcheck - not a legitimate point
I mean, yeah, but the fact that certain adjustments have taken him years to make is a legitimate point, in that it speaks to a general tendency he's shown to make changes at a slower pace than he should. I really like what he's done so far this season, but I have my reservations about his ability to react to unexpected problems and situations in the playoffs. We'll see.

Quote:
What big giames have they come out flat for this season? - not a legitimate point

2 game 7s lost at home, which has nothing to do with the current team or season - not a legitimate point
Again, yeah, but that game 7 against Pittsburgh still means something. I don't know if it was a failure on his part; I don't know what the **** happened. It's still disturbing and you have to wonder. On the other hand, his teams have generally been very resilient in playoff games in which they could have been eliminated. The playoffs are going to be very interesting this year.

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11-12-2011, 02:40 PM
  #757
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Originally Posted by NobodyBeatsTheWiz View Post
The PP is top 5 in the league - not a legitimate point

You're admitting BB is holding players accountable - not a legitimate point

What big giames have they come out flat for this season? - not a legitimate point

You're admitting the forwards backcheck - not a legitimate point

2 game 7s lost at home, which has nothing to do with the current team or season - not a legitimate point

Again, I question as to whether you've actually watched the team this season.. You're going back to the same old criticisms from the doom crew, and still haven't brought forth a legitimate point for this season.
You twist things to how you need them. If itís BB, you talk only about what he is doing today and not his past down falls. If itís OV we are talking about. You look at as the player he was. And not the player he is today. You canít have it both ways.

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11-12-2011, 02:49 PM
  #758
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You twist things to how you need them. If itís BB, you talk only about what he is doing today and not his past down falls. If itís OV we are talking about. You look at as the player he was. And not the player he is today. You canít have it both ways.
I'm not twisting anything. You'll hate BB until he wins a Cup, and you'll bash him for past mishaps even if he corrects them. I'll support BB because he's done some damn good things with the organization. He's as much a reason as Ovy that they're as good as they are. I've said time and time again that Ovy isn't playing well. Does that mean I'll constantly bash him and want him traded? No. He's earned a huge leash.

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11-12-2011, 02:53 PM
  #759
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Originally Posted by sonsofcain View Post
I mean, yeah, but the fact that certain adjustments have taken him years to make is a legitimate point, in that it speaks to a general tendency he's shown to make changes at a slower pace than he should. I really like what he's done so far this season, but I have my reservations about his ability to react to unexpected problems and situations in the playoffs. We'll see.
How is that a legitimate point against Boudreau and the team this year? (It's not).


Quote:
Again, yeah, but that game 7 against Pittsburgh still means something. I don't know if it was a failure on his part; I don't know what the **** happened. It's still disturbing and you have to wonder. On the other hand, his teams have generally been very resilient in playoff games in which they could have been eliminated. The playoffs are going to be very interesting this year.
What do you have to wonder? Look at the personnel from those game sevens. Completely different from the cast we have now.

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11-12-2011, 03:17 PM
  #760
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How is that a legitimate point against Boudreau and the team this year? (It's not).
It's a legitimate cause to question certain aspects of his coaching ability. He is the coach of the team this year.

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What do you have to wonder? Look at the personnel from those game sevens. Completely different from the cast we have now.
It's pretty rare to see a team play like that in such an important game. I obviously don't know what caused it, but you have to wonder if something in Boudreau's approach, or the mentality he instilled in his team, or whatever, had a significant impact on it. I don't know whether it did, but that collapse happened with him as the coach.

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11-12-2011, 03:23 PM
  #761
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It's legitimate to be concerned that BB is reactive and doesn't have the ability to analyze and adjust and prepare with foresight.

It's legitimate to be concerned that its extremely difficult to change your leadership style without changing the people you're leading... Especially from relaxed to demanding.

Not that I've reached any sort of failure certainty of the previous poster.

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11-12-2011, 03:25 PM
  #762
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i am wondering if the team may be best served to shave Green's minutes some. Its not rocket science to expect your minute leader to be oft injured. In doing so limit his chances to be injured, and groom Wideman and Carlson for bigger roles to fill Green's shoes come the playoffs since his absence seems to tank our team more than any other player. Sure they were both injured too but something may need to be done. All George will do now is add depth RD, as we have our playoff team. So I want to see Orlov get some games in this winter. I dont care is he isnt fully ready, I think it serves a young player to get his feet wet. So he makes some widemans, who cares. Lets prepare in every way we can for puck mover injuries, as it is just like a whack in the sack for our entire team.

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11-12-2011, 03:33 PM
  #763
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Originally Posted by HSHS View Post
It's legitimate to be concerned that BB is reactive and doesn't have the ability to analyze and adjust and prepare with foresight.

It's legitimate to be concerned that its extremely difficult to change your leadership style without changing the people you're leading... Especially from relaxed to demanding.

Not that I've reached any sort of failure certainty of the previous poster.
Hope you don't mean me. I certainly don't think failure is certain. His decisions so far this season have given me reason to be optimistic, actually. Obviously that guy Mr. Gone shouldn't be taken seriously.

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11-12-2011, 03:34 PM
  #764
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It's pretty rare to see a team play like that in such an important game. I obviously don't know what caused it, but you have to wonder if something in Boudreau's approach, or the mentality he instilled in his team, or whatever, had a significant impact on it. I don't know whether it did, but that collapse happened with him as the coach.
Or it could be that Ovy missed an early breakaway that killed the momentum, that the starting goalie was a rookie with less than 20 games of NHL experience, or that half the defense was Jurcina, Morrisonn, and Pothier (plus Erskine). Who knows? They lost, and it's a completely different team makeup now.

The point is, people are using a game that happened 3 freaking seasons ago to bash Boudreau now, among other criticisms that don't even apply anymore. It's the epitome of ridiculous.

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11-12-2011, 03:39 PM
  #765
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i am wondering if the team may be best served to shave Green's minutes some. Its not rocket science to expect your minute leader to be oft injured. In doing so limit his chances to be injured, and groom Wideman and Carlson for bigger roles to fill Green's shoes come the playoffs since his absence seems to tank our team more than any other player. Sure they were both injured too but something may need to be done. All George will do now is add depth RD, as we have our playoff team. So I want to see Orlov get some games in this winter. I dont care is he isnt fully ready, I think it serves a young player to get his feet wet. So he makes some widemans, who cares. Lets prepare in every way we can for puck mover injuries, as it is just like a whack in the sack for our entire team.
green's minutes have been shaved. he is not playing 27 to 30 minutes a game and averaging 25+ minutes. he's playing more like 20-22 minutes in a 60 minute game. he's currently 4th on the TOI chart on defense. That he missed a chunk of two games that he played in averages in to that, but hamrlik, carlson and wideman are already playing at least as much as green.

they are all getting plenty of pp time.

how much less do you want green to play?

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11-12-2011, 03:43 PM
  #766
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Or it could be that Ovy missed an early breakaway that killed the momentum, that the starting goalie was a rookie with less than 20 games of NHL experience, or that half the defense was Jurcina, Morrisonn, and Pothier (plus Erskine). Who knows? They lost, and it's a completely different team makeup now.

The point is, people are using a game that happened 3 freaking seasons ago to bash Boudreau now, among other criticisms that don't even apply anymore. It's the epitome of ridiculous.
knowing what we know now, you would think there might be some revision upward to boudreau's playoff coaching. jurcina, morrisonn, pothier and erskine? two of them went out of the league almost immediately upon leaving the team. one is a 7 in washington and the other plays on a last place team. yet, its boudreau's fault that they lost. you could make a case that they made it to the 7th game of a series vs the eventual cup winners with that defense was a brilliant effort....instead its considered a choke job.

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11-12-2011, 04:02 PM
  #767
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It's a legitimate cause to question certain aspects of his coaching ability. He is the coach of the team this year.


It's pretty rare to see a team play like that in such an important game. I obviously don't know what caused it, but you have to wonder if something in Boudreau's approach, or the mentality he instilled in his team, or whatever, had a significant impact on it. I don't know whether it did, but that collapse happened with him as the coach.
You are making way too much out of that game. Teams come out flat, it happens. You seem to conveniently be forgetting that the team fought back from 3-2 in that series by winning in OT in Pitt. I think that emotional high took too much out of them, Ovy missed a breakaway in gm 7, Varlamov let in a few softies, and that was it.

Not sure how that is Boudreau's fault. In fact, there are other places that you can blame Boudreau for the Caps playoff failures (Montreal, Tampa series are for more glaring to me than the Pens one).

I remember the Redskins coming out as flat as can be in Super Bowl 18 against the Raiders. Skins were the best team all year, by far (and came within 2 "1pt losses" of a perfect regular season), and were coached by for my money the best coach of all time--- St Joe Gibbs-- and they got blown out. In a Super Bowl.

It happens. Let the game 7 Pens loss go.....if you want to be frustrated, look no farther than the Montreal series...that was a coaching nightmare, IMO.

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11-12-2011, 04:24 PM
  #768
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You are making way too much out of that game. Teams come out flat, it happens. You seem to conveniently be forgetting that the team fought back from 3-2 in that series by winning in OT in Pitt. I think that emotional high took too much out of them, Ovy missed a breakaway in gm 7, Varlamov let in a few softies, and that was it.

Not sure how that is Boudreau's fault. In fact, there are other places that you can blame Boudreau for the Caps playoff failures (Montreal, Tampa series are for more glaring to me than the Pens one).

I remember the Redskins coming out as flat as can be in Super Bowl 18 against the Raiders. Skins were the best team all year, by far (and came within 2 "1pt losses" of a perfect regular season), and were coached by for my money the best coach of all time--- St Joe Gibbs-- and they got blown out. In a Super Bowl.

It happens. Let the game 7 Pens loss go.....if you want to be frustrated, look no farther than the Montreal series...that was a coaching nightmare, IMO.
Agreed completely and with txpd's statement regarding the Caps actually getting to a Game 7 with that defense should be considered an acheivement in and of itself.

Nothing that happens the rest of the year will likely change anyone's opinion unless it's a complete implosion. Those on the fence might run out of patience. On the other side of the coin, I don't think there's anything can happen that will sway their opinion. Anything positive will be discarded until they do it in April and later (impossible) and anything negative will be latched onto as a sign of impending and inevitable doom.

Is it springtime yet?

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11-12-2011, 04:58 PM
  #769
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Hope you don't mean me. I certainly don't think failure is certain. His decisions so far this season have given me reason to be optimistic, actually. Obviously that guy Mr. Gone shouldn't be taken seriously.
No sorry. I don't have problems with people who've reached the end of their rope and need a full let's see. He has his opinion. Just have to understand than lens.

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11-12-2011, 05:02 PM
  #770
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Juice is a stud. His low hard shot set up the win vs the super caps led by BB.

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11-13-2011, 07:47 AM
  #771
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knowing what we know now, you would think there might be some revision upward to boudreau's playoff coaching. jurcina, morrisonn, pothier and erskine? two of them went out of the league almost immediately upon leaving the team. one is a 7 in washington and the other plays on a last place team. yet, its boudreau's fault that they lost. you could make a case that they made it to the 7th game of a series vs the eventual cup winners with that defense was a brilliant effort....instead its considered a choke job.
Revision upward

Almost all playoff teams have 567 types lurking around their rosters. I think some could argue Eminger and Erskine were our best pair versus Philly. Erskine and Juice were very good against the Rangers I. Pothier and Juice our best dmen vs Pitt, yes durability is a factor in grading players. Alzner Collins and Sloan pinch hit and didnt cost us games.

Bruce didnt trust anyone to cover for Green (spanning a few years), ignoring George's attempts to establish depth on that right side. Particularly against Pitt, the farthest we have gone, Bruce err'd in ignoring Green's injuries and a healthy Juice and Pots, who both even scored in the series.

We were a team built around Ovvense anyways. And I would dog Bruce for a lack of coaching before dogging the lowest paid dmen. No adjustments on the PP, no shadowing of forwards (boyd on Sid for instance), no shutdown pairs, forwards too high cherry picking, ignoring Dmen under pressure. Practices off instead or ironing out the PP; the handling of goalies is something I am not impressed with. Ignoring moving to Theo late in Montreal to haunt his former team and change the Mo, or late vs Pitt when everyone saw Varly falling apart. Not trying Holtby or Varly when Neuvy couldnt lead us to a win vs TB. I can probably keep going, no breakout plays to accommodate the non green defensemen. They would just slap the puck hard around to center.


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11-13-2011, 07:58 AM
  #772
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567 type defensemen on the first and second pair? lets be clear. morrisonn was his shutdown d. erskine is a 7 and was a 7. thats fine, but morrisonn was first pair pk and playing 20+. dont try and slide that like he was playing some third pair minutes. eminger stinks. if eminger was the best, that says even more.

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11-13-2011, 09:28 AM
  #773
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I think there is alot of talk about Green's injury. Review the tape, he got kneed in the nuts, period. Groin injury and not the pulled kind. As long as it did not smash anything he should be back very soon. Watch the tape and see watch is grabbed. I thought the dude would be smart enough to wear a cup, though. Maybe he was and got pinched, but he should be back ASAP. Though I would like to see Orlov or McNeil get some time

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11-13-2011, 10:21 AM
  #774
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knowing what we know now, you would think there might be some revision upward to boudreau's playoff coaching. jurcina, morrisonn, pothier and erskine? two of them went out of the league almost immediately upon leaving the team. one is a 7 in washington and the other plays on a last place team. yet, its boudreau's fault that they lost. you could make a case that they made it to the 7th game of a series vs the eventual cup winners with that defense was a brilliant effort....instead its considered a choke job.
A case could also be made that they were outplayed in just about every period of that series....and save for some ridiculous goaltending, it doesnt go 7.

Im not suggesting it hangs on BB alone.....they were beat by a better team IMO and it was a 7 gamer because of that longstanding hockey X factor....a hot goalie

I'll say this again.....im not sying BB stinks, is a moron, or whatever...but at what point do the full on BB supporters recognize that, to this point....he hasnt gotten it done when it counts.

His teams rack up wins like eating popcorn during the season, and thats important....but when it really matters he loses more than he wins. Lets hope that changes this spring

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11-13-2011, 11:03 AM
  #775
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A case could also be made that they were outplayed in just about every period of that series....and save for some ridiculous goaltending, it doesnt go 7.

Im not suggesting it hangs on BB alone.....they were beat by a better team IMO and it was a 7 gamer because of that longstanding hockey X factor....a hot goalie

I'll say this again.....im not sying BB stinks, is a moron, or whatever...but at what point do the full on BB supporters recognize that, to this point....he hasnt gotten it done when it counts.

His teams rack up wins like eating popcorn during the season, and thats important....but when it really matters he loses more than he wins. Lets hope that changes this spring
Hello Mothra, long time.

I think most people agree with the bolded part. Even Tex. Do you feel that many people think otherwise?

It would be pretty hard to disagree with you. Apples to apples comparisons show Bruce hasnt gotten beyond round 2 in the NHL playoffs, ever. There are what....at least a dozen coaches in the league now who have (I havent checked, but at quick glance it's maybe 15 or so)? Bruce hasnt accomplished -- in the playoffs-- what almost half the league's coaches have.

So for sure, thats a blight.

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