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Old
11-12-2011, 10:59 PM
  #51
joshjull
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Originally Posted by jBuds View Post
I don't think so. I think they're just playing like **** as a collective unit. Regehr/Myers need to be reunited and leaned on as the top pair, and the rest needs to settle itself out behind them. I don't think we need another body just yet.



And to all the peacemakers, save it, please. All Sabres fans have every right to be pissed off about a game like this. You can argue what aspects of the game are valid or invalid to complain about, but telling people to "relax" after a game like this is bordering on trolling. And far past irritating and annoying at this moment in time.

This game blew. Blew ass.
Has it occured to you that not having enough good defensive dman is part of the reason why they are playing like **** defensively as a unit? And Myers is hardly a guy we should be leaning on right now. Leo has played solid defensively with Regehr and that pair is better and more reliable than Myers/Regehr.

Last time we had a reliable and consistant defense we had two defensive dmen in the top 4 (Lydman/Tallinder). Last year and this year we have had issues by not having 2 of those types in the top 4.

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11-12-2011, 11:00 PM
  #52
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glad i missed this one.

go irish!

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11-12-2011, 11:01 PM
  #53
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jBuds View Post
I don't think so. I think they're just playing like **** as a collective unit. Regehr/Myers need to be reunited and leaned on as the top pair, and the rest needs to settle itself out behind them. I don't think we need another body just yet.



And to all the peacemakers, save it, please. All Sabres fans have every right to be pissed off about a game like this. You can argue what aspects of the game are valid or invalid to complain about, but telling people to "relax" after a game like this is bordering on trolling. And far past irritating and annoying at this moment in time.

This game blew. Blew ass.
Lol it only started to blow when enroth came in.

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11-12-2011, 11:03 PM
  #54
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Originally Posted by joshjull View Post
Has it occured to you why they are playing like **** defensively as a unit? And Myers is hardly a guy we should be leaning on right now. Leo has played solid defensively with Regehr and that apir is better and more reliable than Myers/Regehr.
yeah i agree.

The sabres need myers to be active offensively and he did not seem to play that way with Regehr.

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11-12-2011, 11:06 PM
  #55
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Originally Posted by joshjull View Post
Has it occured to you that not having enough good defensive dman is part of the reason why they are playing like **** defensively as a unit? And Myers is hardly a guy we should be leaning on right now. Leo has played solid defensively with Regehr and that pair is better and more reliable than Myers/Regehr.

Last time we ahd a very good defense we ahd two defensive dmen in the top 4 (Lydman/Tallinder). Last eyar and this year we have had issues by not having 2 of those types in the top 4.
It has occurred to me that the unit looked better when Tallinder and Lydman were at their best instead of a poor-playing Leopold and Ehrhoff, yes.

But sorry, I won't claim that the unit is flawed because it is underperforming. Sekera and Myers are both beyond capable defensively, though Myers hasnt looked it of late and Sekera didn't tonight. But the unit should be good enough. Cut down on mistakes and get more disciplined mentally in terms of positioning and decision making.

But keep feinding for yet another body. That's healthy for you mentally....

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11-12-2011, 11:09 PM
  #56
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Myers = Barret Jackman 2 - Electric Boogaloo

Think about it.

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Old
11-12-2011, 11:09 PM
  #57
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jBuds View Post
It has occurred to me that the unit looked better when Tallinder and Lydman were at their best instead of a poor-playing Leopold and Ehrhoff, yes.

But sorry, I won't claim that the unit is flawed because it is underperforming. Sekera and Myers are both beyond capable defensively, though Myers hasnt looked it of late and Sekera didn't tonight. But the unit should be good enough. Cut down on mistakes and get more disciplined mentally in terms of positioning and decision making.

But keep feinding for yet another body. That's healthy for you mentally....
Excuse me?

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11-12-2011, 11:11 PM
  #58
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I agree with Jbuds: when we lose it's because we give up goals on stupid mistakes, not the Dman just not being good enough to stop the puck. We know Rej and Myers are capable defensively. But they have gone to **** this last month, to all of our frustration. Gragnani looks lost half the time and Erhroff is some weird hybrid of average and useless on defense.

The worst part is we know they can play better, but they just aren't. They better figure this **** out.

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11-12-2011, 11:31 PM
  #59
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MGIII View Post
I agree with Jbuds: when we lose it's because we give up goals on stupid mistakes, not the Dman just not being good enough to stop the puck. We know Rej and Myers are capable defensively. But they have gone to **** this last month, to all of our frustration. Gragnani looks lost half the time and Erhroff is some weird hybrid of average and useless on defense.

The worst part is we know they can play better, but they just aren't. They better figure this **** out.
The defense problem is bigger than the personnel. When the team plays the system (see Friday night against Ottawa) they are a different team. It's kind of a chicken or egg scenario for me. Are the defensive gaffs of late just their own craptastic play or does it start with the utter lack of support from the forwards causing their poor decisions because they have no outs (although I would think an NHL defensman would have a clue how to play a two on one)?

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11-12-2011, 11:31 PM
  #60
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MGIII View Post
I agree with Jbuds: when we lose it's because we give up goals on stupid mistakes, not the Dman just not being good enough to stop the puck. We know Rej and Myers are capable defensively. But they have gone to **** this last month, to all of our frustration. Gragnani looks lost half the time and Erhroff is some weird hybrid of average and useless on defense.

The worst part is we know they can play better, but they just aren't. They better figure this **** out.
There is a difference between being capable defensively and being strong defensively. Neither would be described as being strong defensively or be considered defensive dmen. In reality there is only one dman on the roster that fits that description (Regehr).

We've had only one pair this season thats been able to bring good defensive play while producing some offense. Leopold/Regehr. Thats what Ruff wants from the defense and no other pair has brought it. Myers/Sekera are feast or famine back there and Ehrhoff/Grags is weaksauce in our end but occassionally will add some offense (from Ehrhoff).

But only Leopold/Regehr has brought the hybrid solid defense and offense from the back end.

Ruff seems to have given up on the idea of a shutdown pair for now. He has a solid two way pair and two feast or famine pairs.


Last edited by joshjull: 11-12-2011 at 11:41 PM.
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11-12-2011, 11:35 PM
  #61
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Originally Posted by HockeyTerror View Post
The defense problem is bigger than the personnel. When the team plays the system (see Friday night against Ottawa) they are a different team. It's kind of a chicken or egg scenario for me. Are the defensive gaffs of late just their own craptastic play or does it start with the utter lack of support from the forwards causing their poor decisions because they have no outs (although I would think an NHL defensman would have a clue how to play a two on one)?
Tonight it was the dmen messing up all on their own. Myers on the first two goals and Ehrhoff/Sekera on the 3rd goal had little, if anything, to do with the forwards. But many times in the past its been the forwards. When they leave the gaps too big between them, particularly when they are cheating out of the zone.


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11-12-2011, 11:41 PM
  #62
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Originally Posted by BuffaloSabskis View Post
In 2007 were they a tough team? and did everyone know it?
2007 is history. No point going there. It's a different formula today. Big, tough, aggressive forwards and D-men that will knock you on your butt. Not so much small speedy forward stuff today. The Bruins lumberjacked their way to the last year's Cup by daring the Canucks to play physical (Horton or Thorton or Marchand or whoever it was facewashing Sedin and daring hi to reltailiate, Thomas cutting Sedin down in front of the crease.

The 2011 edition of the Sabres is the one on the ice and they labelled themselves tonight. That's what matters.

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11-12-2011, 11:45 PM
  #63
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Originally Posted by joshjull View Post
They need another defensive dman in the top 4. I'm not talking about Weber.
I agree. Regehr was a great add. Erhoff, not so sure but it strikes me that top teams have a couple of Regehr types on the team.

How many puck moving D are needed on one team? Seems like we have a bunch. Maybe a trade for a Bill Hajt type is needed.

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Old
11-12-2011, 11:46 PM
  #64
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Originally Posted by joshjull View Post
Tonight it was the dmen messing up all on their own. Myers on the first two goals and Ehrhoff/Sekera on the 3rd goal had little, if anything, to do with the forwards. But many times in the past its been the forwards. When they leave the gaps too big between them, particularly when they are cheating out of the zone.
while that is certainly the case, i thought that boston made our chemistry on offense appear limited. after vanek scored they basicly took that line out for most of the game. the 3rd line was totally a waste of time and we were left with trying to play a very ammature version of their formula.


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Old
11-12-2011, 11:52 PM
  #65
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Originally Posted by littletonhockeycoach View Post
2007 is history. No point going there. It's a different formula today. Big, tough, aggressive forwards and D-men that will knock you on your butt. Not so much small speedy forward stuff today. The Bruins lumberjacked their way to the last year's Cup by daring the Canucks to play physical (Horton or Thorton or Marchand or whoever it was facewashing Sedin and daring hi to reltailiate, Thomas cutting Sedin down in front of the crease.

The 2011 edition of the Sabres is the one on the ice and they labelled themselves tonight. That's what matters.

The Bruins had only 3 forwards over 200lbs on their Cup winning roster (Lucic, Hornton and Thornton) and one that weighed 200lbs (Paille). We have 7 forwards on our current roster over 200lbs. Size is not the issue. Mentality is the issue.

You referenced Marchand, who was awesome for them in the playoffs overall and the Finals in particular. He is 5'9" 183lbs.

Boston has only two key forwards that fit the description of tough, aggressive and big. Lucic/Hornton. Most of their key forwards are average sized or smaller.

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11-12-2011, 11:55 PM
  #66
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Boston has only two key forwards that fit the description of tough, aggressive and big. Lucic/Hornton. Most of their key forwards are average sized or smaller.
they do have 3 big and nasty defensemen.

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11-12-2011, 11:57 PM
  #67
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Originally Posted by ImpressedDAHagent View Post
they do have 3 big and nasty defensemen.
and that has nothing to do with what I bolded in his post and responded to.

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11-12-2011, 11:57 PM
  #68
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jBuds View Post
I don't think so. I think they're just playing like **** as a collective unit. Regehr/Myers need to be reunited and leaned on as the top pair, and the rest needs to settle itself out behind them. I don't think we need another body just yet.



And to all the peacemakers, save it, please. All Sabres fans have every right to be pissed off about a game like this. You can argue what aspects of the game are valid or invalid to complain about, but telling people to "relax" after a game like this is bordering on trolling. And far past irritating and annoying at this moment in time.

This game blew. Blew ass.
Thanks Jbuds. This is the most intelligent Sabre discussion board on teh web. And most folks are pretty level headed and don't over-react unnecessarily.

But when the Sabres are as bad as they were tonight, it should be pointed out (and justified) and not simply excused.

Do better next time. Show some heart and pride. Nobody's jumping ship. We're all committed to this franchise and this team. But geez, we have a right to expect a lot more from these guys.

And should be able to state that w/o being told that we are over-reacting.

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11-13-2011, 12:02 AM
  #69
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Originally Posted by joshjull View Post
The Bruins had only 3 forwards over 200lbs on their Cup winning roster (Lucic, Hornton and Thornton) and one that weighed 200lbs (Paille). We have 7 forwards on our current roster over 200lbs. Size is not the issue. Mentality is the issue.

You referenced Marchand, who was awesome for them in the playoffs overall and the Finals in particular. He is 5'9" 183lbs.

Boston has only two key forwards that fit the description of tough, aggressive and big. Lucic/Hornton. Most of their key forwards are average sized or smaller.
you're right..... I guess they just play bigger than their actual size. Pretty deceiving

Maybe we should clone Gerbe and downsize

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11-13-2011, 12:03 AM
  #70
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Excuse me?
Poor word choice. I mean that you can keep wanting an addition to the top 4 to come from outside the organization, but it's not happening - so wanting it is unhealthy mentally (stretch).

And I dont think it's necessary, either. I think that this unit, if everyone is playing solid hockey, is perfectly good enough to get the job done. Sadly, I think a lot of how the unit looks as a whole bases itself on Myers. Hopefully the stretch of poor games doesn't make people forget how tough he is to play against defensively, multiplied by 1000 if he is playing well and making good decisions while continuously rounding out his game.

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11-13-2011, 12:03 AM
  #71
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and that has nothing to do with what I bolded in his post and responded to.
i was just suggesting that the physical talent was there. Boston seems to get a lot from having a roster that can complement chara.

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11-13-2011, 12:08 AM
  #72
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Poor word choice. I mean that you can keep wanting an addition to the top 4 to come from outside the organization, but it's not happening - so wanting it is unhealthy mentally (stretch).

And I dont think it's necessary, either. I think that this unit, if everyone is playing solid hockey, is perfectly good enough to get the job done. Sadly, I think a lot of how the unit looks as a whole bases itself on Myers. Hopefully the stretch of poor games doesn't make people forget how tough he is to play against defensively, multiplied by 1000 if he is playing well and making good decisions while continuously rounding out his game.
A couple of days ago, someone asked whether Myers was hurt. Did anyone confirm that? He was knocked back on his butt a couple of games ago and I thought his head hit the ice. He was held out of the next day's practice.

Maybe there's no link but Tyler seems to be making more mental mistakes lately and there's a "consistant inconsistancy" to his play lately.

Any ideas or info on this?

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11-13-2011, 12:10 AM
  #73
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Originally Posted by littletonhockeycoach View Post
A couple of days ago, someone asked whether Myers was hurt. Did anyone confirm that? He was knocked back on his butt a couple of games ago and I thought his head hit the ice. He was held out of the next day's practice.

Maybe there's no link but Tyler seems to be making more mental mistakes lately and there's a "consistant inconsistancy" to his play lately.

Any ideas or info on this?
Myers had a maintenance day on Thursday, said he was feeling better and "it" had cleared up. But he didn't say what "it" was.


Last edited by joshjull: 11-13-2011 at 12:25 AM.
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11-13-2011, 12:25 AM
  #74
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Thanks. Everyone's noticed that Myers game is off. He started slow last year too but that was more like a growth spurt he hadn't adjusted too.

I can't put my finger on what's wrong this year but I was a lot more enthused when he was paired with Regehr.... which I interpreted as a mentorship.

Obviously, the coach has different ideas. It's just that the 2nd and 3rd pairs aren't working very well right now.

Good time for me to close out on this thread. My venting is exhausted. On to Montreal.

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11-13-2011, 12:31 AM
  #75
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Its not going to happen because Grags will never leave the lineup but........


Regehr/Leo --> playing well together
Sekera/Ehrhoff ---had some success together.
Weber/Myers ----> Give Myers some easy 3rd pairing ES minutes to settle his game down and put him with a stay at home dman.

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