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Eller or Desharnais

View Poll Results: Who would you take?
Lars Eller "The Great Dane" 128 92.09%
David Desharnais "deHARNAY" 11 7.91%
Voters: 139. You may not vote on this poll

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Old
11-14-2011, 10:23 AM
  #51
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Habaneros View Post
Why you laughing?


Just remember Martin St Louis was undrafted.
Ottawa let him go .
Calgary let him go .
Was a ppg player in AHL .
Didn't make NHL till 24 years old.


Again you guy can laugh all you want , but when you look at this post 2 years from now you will be eating crow .
Daniel Sedin was the only NHL player to break 100 pts last year, Crosby would have done it as well but his season was over in January. The year before there was 4 players that broke 100 pts. NHL superstars break NHL pts, not 3rd liners who at their best are 40 to 50 pts players that's where DD belongs and I do mean at best!

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11-14-2011, 10:23 AM
  #52
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Originally Posted by LyricalLyricist View Post
I said a jordan staal for us. I never said jordan staal. Eller will never be as good as Jordan.
He will be better than Staal.

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Old
11-14-2011, 10:24 AM
  #53
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Originally Posted by neofury View Post
Dude regardless of if you said/meant Jordan Staal or "Jordan Staal for us" whichever convoluted way you want to put it, it doesn't change the fact that this IS great upside, plain and simple.
Way to nitpick. I'm telling you straight up what I implied. I said he will be our 3rd line two-way center. No **** Jordan Staal is great upside. I really don't see why you're twisting what i'm implying when i'm making it clear for you by saying he'll never be as good as staal in anything. Man, way to take one comparison and ignore the rest. Eller won't be jordan staal, it's not a comparable, I retract my original statement because saying Jordan Staal>>>>>>>Eller is seen as putting Eller and Staal in same sentence.

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Old
11-14-2011, 10:25 AM
  #54
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Originally Posted by canadiensnation View Post
I really like both of these players especially Desharnais. DD reminds me of Koivu a bit (not comparing) using his strong center of gravity to shield the puck. He also DRIVES the net which i like. But then again hes 5'7" 170 ish pounds.
Would you rather have a 6'3" 215lb center with good speed and size and a big shot or a big playmaking center?

Eller is a good player with a potential to become a top six center. I think we have seen a lot of potential from him this year with his rather strong play. But i think there's so much more he can do but i just don't see him progressing offensively. 1. he has to get better on the face-offs. 2. He has to learn how to take a pass (not from Gomez) / how to shoot a one-timer. 3. Use his body and skating better.
Would you rather move him for a similar player that is younger and uses his 6'3" 215lb frame better the Eller does.

Who would you rather keep if one were to be traded?
ELLER or DESHARNAIS?
Were you hoping that fellow fans would vote for Desharnais? Not a chance.

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Old
11-14-2011, 10:25 AM
  #55
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Originally Posted by coolasprICE View Post
I never said otherwise
No I know, but he quoted the guy who said that. His prediction is far off, but the context was just to say he has upside, which I agree with, not MSL or 100+ point upside though, not even close.

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11-14-2011, 10:25 AM
  #56
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Reminds me of the Price vs. Halak debates of old

Eller, with the size and the tools much sought after in a top line centerman, has yet to put everything together. But you get the feeling that it's just a matter of time

Desharnais, with less than ideal physical attributes, more often than not finds a way to get things done

Thankfully, we don't have to choose between the two anytime soon. But Desharnais has been the most effective until now

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Old
11-14-2011, 10:27 AM
  #57
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Originally Posted by neofury View Post
Completely missing the point. The point is St. Louis had a reason to produce the way he did in the old NHL and then due to the new NHL produced much better.

Desharnais started off in the new NHL and thus it isn't like we should expect his production to increase in the way that it did for St. Louis.

He won't be a 100pt guy, that's just crazy. Leafs fans saying Kadri will be an 80-100pt guy is even more realistic than this is for crying out loud.
You got your opinion which i will respect, and you respect mine.

Time will prove us right or wrong .

Anyone trying to sell DD as inferior to Eller, i think you got a surprise coming .

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Old
11-14-2011, 10:31 AM
  #58
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Originally Posted by Habaneros View Post
You got your opinion which i will respect, and you respect mine.

Time will prove us right or wrong .

Anyone trying to sell DD as inferior to Eller, i think you got a surprise coming .
k good one chief. Always good for a laugh.

It is common knowledge that DD will become the next great 100point getter, a feat that has been exclusive to the elite players of the NHL.

Because DD is better than MSL, and MSL did it, so DD will do it. Great logic!

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11-14-2011, 10:33 AM
  #59
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Originally Posted by Pine View Post
k good one chief. Always good for a laugh.

It is common knowledge that DD will become the next great 100point getter, a feat that has been exclusive to the elite players of the NHL.

Because DD is better than MSL, and MSL did it, so DD will do it. Great logic!
I laugh when we're both in this thread because of our NHL 12 Pro names.

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Old
11-14-2011, 10:34 AM
  #60
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Originally Posted by Pine View Post
k good one chief. Always good for a laugh.

It is common knowledge that DD will become the next great 100point getter, a feat that has been exclusive to the elite players of the NHL.

Because DD is better than MSL, and MSL did it, so DD will do it. Great logic!
No i'm not saying because Martin did it DD will do it.

I just see alot of the same in the two guys (on the ice)in their early NHL careers.

DD got very high upside ,much higher than many here believe .

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11-14-2011, 10:34 AM
  #61
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Habaneros View Post
Can we give the guy a little time ? He only got 65 NHL games under his belt and yet has 33 points so far (some games winners!)What David needs to do is shoot more often.



Martin St Louis in his first 69 games in the NHL had only 20 points.
Then over the next two years 131 games, he had another 75 pts.Then he start popping off 90 pt seasons.


Talk to me about David D in 2 more years ,i bet many will be eating words.
Listen I know I've opened a Can of Worms in mentioning DD and him not being a top 6 forward. But lets agree on something here.

Martin St.Louis is a workhorse, with a ridiculous shot, incredible hockey sense, and one of if not the fastest player in the NHL.

DD has an OK shot, hockey sense is quite good, but his speed is quick, yet not jaw dropping. Smaller players if not ridiculously fast need an edge, or some sort of lower body strength to keep going in the NHL.

St.Louis was fortunate enough to be gifted with all of the above, so I don't think DD and Marty should be spoken about in the same context here.

I never said DD is not an NHL player, but the original Question was Eller or DD, and for obvious reasons I've chosen Eller, because DD is by no means a top 6 forward, nor an untouchable, and I think people have to realize that he is 25, climbed the ladder yes, but is still not a blazing fast high-octane skilled forward that people make him out to be. (I am not saying you are making him to be that, just a general statement of what I've seen on this board)

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Old
11-14-2011, 10:35 AM
  #62
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LyricalLyricist View Post
I laugh when we're both in this thread because of our NHL 12 Pro names.
And I'm here reppin' my homeboy. Not gonna change my name. Gonna stand by him and do what is right.



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Old
11-14-2011, 10:38 AM
  #63
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Originally Posted by Yarfangor View Post
Listen I know I've opened a Can of Worms in mentioning DD and him not being a top 6 forward. But lets agree on something here.

Martin St.Louis is a workhorse, with a ridiculous shot, incredible hockey sense, and one of if not the fastest player in the NHL.

DD has an OK shot, hockey sense is quite good, but his speed is quick, yet not jaw dropping. Smaller players if not ridiculously fast need an edge, or some sort of lower body strength to keep going in the NHL.

St.Louis was fortunate enough to be gifted with all of the above, so I don't think DD and Marty should be spoken about in the same context here.

I never said DD is not an NHL player, but the original Question was Eller or DD, and for obvious reasons I've chosen Eller, because DD is by no means a top 6 forward, nor an untouchable, and I think people have to realize that he is 25, climbed the ladder yes, but is still not a blazing fast high-octane skilled forward that people make him out to be. (I am not saying you are making him to be that, just a general statement of what I've seen on this board)
Was Martin St Louis this type of player at 24 years old when he broke into the NHL?
Was Martin at 24 the same player he is today?

Right , as i said give DD his fair share of time, and then will talk .


Thanks

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Old
11-14-2011, 10:51 AM
  #64
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Habaneros View Post
Was Martin St Louis this type of player at 24 years old when he broke into the NHL?
Was Martin at 24 the same player he is today?

Right , as i said give DD his fair share of time, and then will talk .


Thanks
Is David Desharnais Martin St. Louis?

When he becomes Martin St. Louis (legally changing names doesn't count), then we will talk. Thanks.

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Old
11-14-2011, 10:52 AM
  #65
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Habaneros View Post
Was Martin St Louis this type of player at 24 years old when he broke into the NHL?
Was Martin at 24 the same player he is today?

Right , as i said give DD his fair share of time, and then will talk .


Thanks
While I don't see DD being as strong as St Louis, but you are entitled to your opinion which I respect.

Plus you never know, there must have been someone saying watch Matrin St Louis turn into MVP when he was waived, and people must have thought he was nuts back then too.

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11-14-2011, 10:57 AM
  #66
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Originally Posted by LyricalLyricist View Post
Way to nitpick. I'm telling you straight up what I implied. I said he will be our 3rd line two-way center. No **** Jordan Staal is great upside. I really don't see why you're twisting what i'm implying when i'm making it clear for you by saying he'll never be as good as staal in anything. Man, way to take one comparison and ignore the rest. Eller won't be jordan staal, it's not a comparable, I retract my original statement because saying Jordan Staal>>>>>>>Eller is seen as putting Eller and Staal in same sentence.
Eller will be much more than just a 3rd liner. Thinking otherwise solely based on his conversion rate is kind of foolish. His improvement over his first game with us is big. A third line center is the worst case scenario.

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11-14-2011, 10:58 AM
  #67
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Habaneros View Post
Was Martin St Louis this type of player at 24 years old when he broke into the NHL?
Was Martin at 24 the same player he is today?

Right , as i said give DD his fair share of time, and then will talk .


Thanks
You can take extracts of whatever I say all you want to make your point, and thats fine by me, its everyones choice to see what they want to see.

By your Logic I should be comparing Lars Eller to Mikko Koivu or Ryan Kesler.

Anyway I wont continue this argument of Black vs White constantly. You want to see things your way fine, I'll be looking at reality.



Thanks

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Old
11-14-2011, 11:00 AM
  #68
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Originally Posted by habs03 View Post
While I don't see DD being as strong as St Louis, but you are entitled to your opinion which I respect.

Plus you never know, there must have been someone saying watch Matrin St Louis turn into MVP when he was waived, and people must have thought he was nuts back then too.
Thanks, that all i was really trying to say.
People trying to label DD right now are totally off course.
Same way people tried to label St Louis back in the day .


Max Pacioretty is developing into a point per game player as we speak.
Now eventually him and David Desharnais will be fulltime LINEMATES again ,when the Habs brass figure it out .

Max Pacioretty and David Desharnais got special chemistry together, and you will see how it will make both men atleast ppg players .

In the Ahl, Pacman was a ppg player with DD as his line mate feeding him.

DD had 76 point in 60 games WITH Pacioretty on his line.


So we know the chemistry is there, and when the Habs ever make the decision to put these two together and LEAVE them together ,you will see it pay in spades.

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11-14-2011, 11:01 AM
  #69
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Yarfangor View Post
You can take extracts of whatever I say all you want to make your point, and thats fine by me, its everyones choice to see what they want to see.

By your Logic I should be comparing Lars Eller to Mikko Koivu or Ryan Kesler.

Anyway I wont continue this argument of Black vs White constantly. You want to see things your way fine, I'll be looking at reality.



Thanks
No, I'd say Datsyuk but whatever.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Habaneros View Post
Thanks, that all i was really trying to say.
People trying to label DD right now are totally off course.
Same way People labeled St Louis back in the day .


Max Pacioretty is developing into a point per game player as we speak.

Now eventually him and David Desharnais will be fulltime LINEMATES again ,when the Habs brass figure it out .


Max Pacioretty and David Desharnais got special chemistry together, and you will see how it will make both men ppg players .

In the Ahl Pacman was a ppg player with DD as his line mate feeding him.

DD had 76 point in 60 games WITH Pacioretty on his line.


So we know the chemistry is there, and when the Habs ever make the decision to put these two together and LEAVE them together ,you will see it pay in spades.
Because obviously, the insane scoring rate in the AHL always translates to the NHL, 100% guaranteed....

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11-14-2011, 11:08 AM
  #70
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Yarfangor View Post
Eller by a landslide and its not even close.

Eller = The Future
DD = Great complimentary Winger, that is being played as a center. A 40 point guy at most imo, and definitely expendable, while Eller is the first big center we've had in years that has great upside.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Pine View Post
Eller and it's not even close
Quote:
Originally Posted by WhiskeySeven View Post
Eller is a studly kinda player. Him over DD any day.


Well to offer some contrast I will say that Desharnais's defense is superior to eller's, and that their passing skills are comparable, with DD having the edge ... as for the finishing and point production, still DD...

I have faith in eller and I think he can become a great player in this league, but in order to win games, today, I'd rely on DD a little more. Doesn't mean I don't appreciate when Eller makes me jump off my seat with a sick move ...

I like them both, but the lack of love for DD is disturbing. Don't agree that he is at best a 40 pts scorer ... he is much closer to be a 50-60 pts guy than Eller at the moment. If the argument is that Eller is the future, its fine ... but I have a hard time believing some here say on a serious tone that Eller is better today...and that its not even close ...

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11-14-2011, 11:09 AM
  #71
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Pine View Post
No, I'd say Datsyuk but whatever.



Because obviously, the insane scoring rate in the AHL always translates to the NHL, 100% guaranteed....
Lmfao Datsyuk it is then, Needs to work on his Dangles and speed tho

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11-14-2011, 11:12 AM
  #72
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Originally Posted by Pine View Post
No, I'd say Datsyuk but whatever.



Because obviously, the insane scoring rate in the AHL always translates to the NHL, 100% guaranteed....
I'm watching Pacman and it's translating quite well.
16 games 12pts ,the kids on his way .
16 Games 10 Pts for DD, he also is on his way (with less than half the NHL experience Pacman has so far)

Again , when ever the Habs feel both players are seasoned enough,Pacman and DD will be fulltime line mates, and will see it translate into PPG by both players.


Last edited by Habaneros: 11-14-2011 at 11:17 AM.
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11-14-2011, 11:13 AM
  #73
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Eller will be much more than just a 3rd liner. Thinking otherwise solely based on his conversion rate is kind of foolish. His improvement over his first game with us is big. A third line center is the worst case scenario.
I didn't mention his conversion rate in this thread and in any case, I just don't see this big first line center everyone hopes he is. He may become a 60 point 2nd line center, but that's as far as I go tbh. I did say i see him as a guy who can play top 6 but likely won't be strong enough offensively to stick there IMO.

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11-14-2011, 11:14 AM
  #74
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the whole comparison to MSL is silly other than everybody has to understand Martin's career. he's a star now but wasn't even an NHL level player for many years.

1998–99 St John Flames AHL 53 28 34 62
1998–99 Calgary Flames NHL 13 1 1 2
1999–00 St John Flames AHL 17 15 11 26
1999–00 Calgary Flames NHL 56 3 15 18
2000–01 TB Lightning NHL 78 18 22 40
2001–02 TB Lightning NHL 53 16 19 35
2002–03 TB Lightning NHL 82 33 37 70

see a resemblance?

Martin was 25 years old by the time he joined with the lightning and DD will probably beat st-louis' number at the same age.

my point is: st-louis was not always this good. this board constantly whines we let guys go, OB, D'ago et cetera - guys who couldn't even keep their spot on our roster. i see the upside in DD, so why not give him time? he doesn't even have 70 games in the NHL yet! he's all heart, bleeds the bleu-blanc-rouge, is talented, has the work ethics to get better and has the upside. i don't see the problem in giving him time.

remember how he used to get eaten for lunch by first, second and most third lines last year? well not so much this year. small step forward

the MSL st-louis is a good one to make but st-louis' career has to be put into perspective.

P.S., no im not saying he will be like st-louis. just that we need to give him time - just like st-louis needed to become the player that he is today

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11-14-2011, 11:15 AM
  #75
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There's a difference between being ppg and getting 100 points...

18 points as a matter of fact.

And it's always good to set out unrealistic expectations from the get go... Cause we know how those turn out.

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