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Old
11-14-2011, 11:02 PM
  #1
dkollidas
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Ryan Miller

What would Columbus fans be willing to give up for Miller? Mason is definitely not it right now, and maybe Miller could be a better influence than any of the goalie coaches Mason has had.

Anyone that would be totally untouchable? Nash, Carter, Johansen, Brassard, Vermette, picks, prospects?


Last edited by SuperGenius: 11-15-2011 at 08:54 AM.
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11-14-2011, 11:12 PM
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Fred Glover
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You can have Mason and Vermette

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11-14-2011, 11:14 PM
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Matt Foley
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I don't think the Jackets can afford to spend over $6 million per year for Miller to be Mason's goalie coach. Besides, the Jackets would be idiots to have over $9 million tied up in goaltending when they have lots of other issues to fix.

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11-14-2011, 11:17 PM
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dkollidas
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Well Mason could also be a throw-in as a part of the deal/dump. This is one of the top-5 goalies in the game we're talking about.

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11-14-2011, 11:18 PM
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You can have your choice of Vermette or Brassard in my opinion.

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11-14-2011, 11:21 PM
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Fred Glover
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Your question was what would Columbus FANS be willing to offer. Mason, Vermette, and Brassard. That is what I am willing to give up. If Buffalo ( or their fans) are willing to give up on Miller, sure, send him over. We will take him.

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11-14-2011, 11:27 PM
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dkollidas
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ok, so let me re-word it. What would "fair value be for Miller"? Would Johansen be totally untouchable? Nash, Carter?

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11-14-2011, 11:33 PM
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Matt Foley
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Originally Posted by dkollidas View Post
Well Mason could also be a throw-in as a part of the deal/dump. This is one of the top-5 goalies in the game we're talking about.
But that would be going against your original "speculation" that the Jackets would trade for Miller so that he could hold Mase's hand and tell him that everything's going to be OK.

1. Buffalo is not going to deal Miller when they are trying to win now. I doubt they have that much faith in Enroth to lead them to the Cup.

2. Again, Columbus would be idiots to tie up over $9 million in salary in goaltending when they have so many other issues to fix, mainly along the blueline.

While I don't believe that Mason is the answer, I'm rather sure that the Jackets will not go after the likes of Miller to fix their goaltending problems. IMO they will pursue a more affordable option in goal and use the dollar differential to invest in the blueline instead.

Sorry to be rude, but the idea expressed in your original post was beyond stupid IMO. But then again, this is HF, where stupid trade ideas rule...

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11-14-2011, 11:38 PM
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Fred Glover
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Originally Posted by Matt Foley View Post
But that would be going against your original "speculation" that the Jackets would trade for Miller so that he could hold Mase's hand and tell him that everything's going to be OK.

1. Buffalo is not going to deal Miller when they are trying to win now. I doubt they have that much faith in Enroth to lead them to the Cup.

2. Again, Columbus would be idiots to tie up over $9 million in salary in goaltending when they have so many other issues to fix, mainly along the blueline.

While I don't believe that Mason is the answer, I'm rather sure that the Jackets will not go after the likes of Miller to fix their goaltending problems. IMO they will pursue a more affordable option in goal and use the dollar differential to invest in the blueline instead.

Sorry to be rude, but the idea expressed in your original post was beyond stupid IMO. But then again, this is HF, where stupid trade ideas rule...
This

If Buffalo would be stupid enough to trade Miller to Columbus, I am certain that Columbus can find a "care package" to send Buffalo's way

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11-14-2011, 11:46 PM
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Crisp Breakout
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Yes Nash, carter, and johan are off limits.

Give me a break, if miller was available for second tier assets, howson would make financial room.

Mason costs 3 million? Awesome, ship him out for nothing, or waive him and get rid of his cap.

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11-14-2011, 11:56 PM
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Robert
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As Matt said, "Buffalo is not going to deal Miller ".... At least not this season.

There are complications with Ryan Miller having a slow start and getting concussed by Boston's Milan Lucic. There is no way the Sabres would trade him now or in the near future. I wouldn't trade my mother under the same circumstances...


Last edited by Robert: 11-15-2011 at 12:01 AM.
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11-15-2011, 02:26 AM
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plong123
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Crisp Breakout View Post
Yes Nash, carter, and johan are off limits.
Disagree. There's not a single person in that locker room, Nash included, who should be off limits. But the price for Nash would have to be just right, including multiple NHL players and a draft pick or two. A $9M G is far from the solution here.

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11-15-2011, 06:05 AM
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Untouchable or not. Miller is not worth what it would take.

Not to mention any goalie would fail with the current state of our defense. If I am moving assets I am spending them on defense.

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11-15-2011, 07:00 AM
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Originally Posted by dkollidas View Post
ok, so let me re-word it. What would "fair value be for Miller"? Would Johansen be totally untouchable? Nash, Carter?
Buwahaha.... /thud

Enjoy that 6+ million you invested. How is this a speculation thread? Isn't there a "value of" tag if I remember correctly?

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11-15-2011, 07:03 AM
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Originally Posted by plong123 View Post
Disagree. There's not a single person in that locker room, Nash included, who should be off limits. But the price for Nash would have to be just right, including multiple NHL players and a draft pick or two. A $9M G is far from the solution here.
Untouchable to you. Not sure if management and ownership agree with you. And certainly not sending one of them for a goalie.

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11-15-2011, 08:55 AM
  #16
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Isn't he concussed right now?

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11-15-2011, 09:06 AM
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blahblah
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Isn't he concussed right now?
Concussed like symptoms.

Good goalie, not worth the money however. Certainly not worth a top line player.

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11-15-2011, 10:09 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Crisp Breakout View Post
Yes Nash, carter, and johan are off limits.

Give me a break, if miller was available for second tier assets, howson would make financial room.

Mason costs 3 million? Awesome, ship him out for nothing, or waive him and get rid of his cap.
If this were any more than just conjecture, it would make my year. I say take Mason, Brassard, Vermette, Boomer, Arniel and Cody Bass and tell them we will take Miller and they can choose 3 from the list I provided, but Mason has to be one of the 3....even trade.

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11-15-2011, 10:20 AM
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Originally Posted by blahblah View Post
Concussed like symptoms.

Good goalie, not worth the money however. Certainly not worth a top line player.
A Miller with concussion-like symptoms is better than a Mason who plays healthy yet acts like he has a new full-blown concussion every game anyway.

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11-15-2011, 02:40 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by robo1 View Post
A Miller with concussion-like symptoms is better than a Mason who plays healthy yet acts like he has a new full-blown concussion every game anyway.
Truth.

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11-15-2011, 02:58 PM
  #21
blahblah
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A Miller with concussion-like symptoms is better than a Mason who plays healthy yet acts like he has a new full-blown concussion every game anyway.
So the question would be why if you wanted to rail on Mason why did you quote me? Your response has nothing to do with what I typed.

Miller is not work 6+ million and he's not worth one of our top three forwards.

I never said he wasn't better than Mason.

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11-15-2011, 05:21 PM
  #22
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I'd consider a deal around Miller and Nash depending on the severity of the symptoms. To say people are off limits for top five goaltender in the NHL, is a joke.

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11-15-2011, 06:54 PM
  #23
blahblah
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Originally Posted by TSA0402 View Post
I'd consider a deal around Miller and Nash depending on the severity of the symptoms. To say people are off limits for top five goaltender in the NHL, is a joke.
The joke is spending 6.5 million on a goal tender.

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11-15-2011, 11:21 PM
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dkollidas
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The joke is spending 6.5 million on a goal tender.
not when he single-handedly gets your team to the playoffs two years in a row. And when the only reason your team missed the playoffs the two seasons before that was because of injuries to him. Look, this is a hypothetical, but looking at the pay grade for the top tenders in the league (Lundqvist, Luongo, Bryzgalov, and now Rinne), it's easy to see that Miller is not over-paid.

And yea, it does eat a good chunk of change from your cap which you could spend on another forward or defenseman. But if the difference between Miller and Mason/Niemmi/Crawford and other goalies of that rank (at least when they signed their contracts) is $3M/yr, which is basically Jordan Leopold/Fedor Tyutin type player who is solid, but unspectacular, and who will be good for you, but won't win games for you. Goalies win games for you, Miller wins games. That's his value.

To Buffalo:
C-Ryan Johansen
G-Steve Mason
C-Antoine Vermette

To Columbus:
G-Ryan Miller
LW/C-Tyler Ennis
D-Marc Andre Gragniani


Sabres get a top-line center, a young goalie who can back up Enroth, and a defensive 3rd line center who can play second line if necessary. Columbus gets a franchise goaltender, who has about 5 good years left, a top-6 left winger, who could develop into a top-line Martin St.Louis type player, and a defenseman who at worst can QB your top power play unit and play as 4th-5th defenseman.

I as a Buffalo fan think it's pretty fair. I'm guessing Columbus fans won't, but hey, that's why it's subjective, we are all entitled to our own opinions.

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11-15-2011, 11:26 PM
  #25
Crisp Breakout
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Originally Posted by dkollidas View Post
not when he single-handedly gets your team to the playoffs two years in a row. And when the only reason your team missed the playoffs the two seasons before that was because of injuries to him. Look, this is a hypothetical, but looking at the pay grade for the top tenders in the league (Lundqvist, Luongo, Bryzgalov, and now Rinne), it's easy to see that Miller is not over-paid.

And yea, it does eat a good chunk of change from your cap which you could spend on another forward or defenseman. But if the difference between Miller and Mason/Niemmi/Crawford and other goalies of that rank (at least when they signed their contracts) is $3M/yr, which is basically Jordan Leopold/Fedor Tyutin type player who is solid, but unspectacular, and who will be good for you, but won't win games for you. Goalies win games for you, Miller wins games. That's his value.

To Buffalo:
C-Ryan Johansen
G-Steve Mason
C-Antoine Vermette

To Columbus:
G-Ryan Miller
LW/C-Tyler Ennis
D-Marc Andre Gragniani


Sabres get a top-line center, a young goalie who can back up Enroth, and a defensive 3rd line center who can play second line if necessary. Columbus gets a franchise goaltender, who has about 5 good years left, a top-6 left winger, who could develop into a top-line Martin St.Louis type player, and a defenseman who at worst can QB your top power play unit and play as 4th-5th defenseman.

I as a Buffalo fan think it's pretty fair. I'm guessing Columbus fans won't, but hey, that's why it's subjective, we are all entitled to our own opinions.
The mere mention of Johansen makes it a bad proposal. We won't be moving any of the three I previously mentioned for a goalie. Johansen won't be moving for pretty much anything.

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