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The Development of Colin Wilson: An Apology to Barry Trotz

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11-16-2011, 03:53 PM
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Top 6 Spaling
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The Development of Colin Wilson: An Apology to Barry Trotz

When Colin Wilson was scratched in the playoffs, I was incredibly upset, along with others. There was speculation the Trotz and Wilson just didn't get along, and we were furious that Trotz was, once again, ruining an offensive threat.

Everyone has 20/20 hindsight, but Barry Trotz must have 20/20 foresight. Wilson's ego was taken down a notch, and his play ramped up. This year, he is working hard, hustling and going to the dirty areas. Trotz's tough love got his attention and he is showing signs of the star we always thought he could be.

I'm sorry Barry. Once again, you have proven way smarter than me and gotten the most out of a player.

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11-16-2011, 04:06 PM
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Soundgarden
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gopreds9 View Post
When Colin Wilson was scratched in the playoffs, I was incredibly upset, along with others. There was speculation the Trotz and Wilson just didn't get along, and we were furious that Trotz was, once again, ruining an offensive threat.

Everyone has 20/20 hindsight, but Barry Trotz must have 20/20 foresight. Wilson's ego was taken down a notch, and his play ramped up. This year, he is working hard, hustling and going to the dirty areas. Trotz's tough love got his attention and he is showing signs of the star we always thought he could be.

I'm sorry Barry. Once again, you have proven way smarter than me and gotten the most out of a player.
Same thing happened with Ryan Suter during his first playoffs. Glad it's paying off.

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11-16-2011, 04:55 PM
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token grinder
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everyone complained about hartnell's develpment too.

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11-16-2011, 05:35 PM
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everyone complained about hartnell's develpment too.
And everyone, or at least Flyers fans, still does.

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11-16-2011, 05:54 PM
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I was hoping a similar thing would happen with Wilson that happened with Suter. So far it looks like that is the course Wilson's development is taking. It's still early, but there is definite reason to be optimistic. If Wilson can become the forward equivalent of Ryan Suter we are in for a treat

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11-16-2011, 05:57 PM
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And everyone, or at least Flyers fans, still does.
scott hatnell turned into an NHL power forward. a dumb one at times, but one that is productive nonetheless

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11-16-2011, 06:51 PM
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Hmmmmmmmmmmmm... a coach (and according to another thread, it would seem, a GM) knowing more than fans. No way!!!!!

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11-16-2011, 06:53 PM
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I think many of us realized that Colin Wilson had a big part in our plans. Say what you want about the treatment he received, but it was quite telling how highly this organization felt about him. He is one of the few non-first year draftees to ever sniff making the big club. I do think Trotz's decision to bench him in the playoffs was a difficult one. We needed the offense. We also didn't need bone-headed turnovers. A 20 year old that was playing undisciplined and nervous hockey was not going to be helpful. I think 1-2 games on the bench would have sufficed, but meh, whatever. He is getting back to the basics. Strong on the boards. Go to the net. Chip it in deep.

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11-16-2011, 07:28 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by token grinder View Post
scott hatnell turned into an NHL power forward. a dumb one at times, but one that is productive nonetheless
He has turned into an NHL powerforward, one who scored 14 goals and 41 points as a 19 year old then proceeded to struggle to consistently build upon those numbers. There's no doubt that he's capable of scoring 20 goals and 20 points, and he's clearly more productive than your average NHLer. But considering both his draft position and his output as a younger NHLer, I don't think it would be unreasonable to be disappointed with his ultimate development. And I think you can take either side on whether his development is actually a feather in Trotz' hat.


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11-16-2011, 07:54 PM
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Originally Posted by SmokeyClause View Post
He has turned into an NHL powerforward, one who scored 14 goals and 41 points as a 19 year old then proceeded to struggle to consistently build upon those numbers. There's no doubt that he's capable of scoring 20 goals and 20 points, and he's clearly more productive than your average NHLer. But considering both his draft position and his output as a younger NHLer, I don't think it would be unreasonable to be disappointed with his ultimate development. And I think you can take either side on whether his development is actually a feather in Trotz' hat.
Harnell's goal totals since 2005-06:
25,22,24,30,14, 24 and 6 so far this season .... an average of over 23 goals per season between 2005-2011. Rather productive by any standard.

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11-16-2011, 07:58 PM
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I think the only draft pick Trotz has ever had that was real top line talent was Radulov. And he did pretty well in a secondary role as a 20 year old. I think Wilson is the 2nd most talent offensive player to come through our system. A guy like Erat can produce like a frist liner from time-to-time, but he's more suited for the 2nd line.

Hartnell scored 25g in a 2nd/3rd line capacity on the Preds. He's good, but doesn't have top-end talent. He was able to score 30 in Philly with highly skilled linemates, but his type of play leads to sporadic goal output (similar to Hornqvist). He scored 14g the next year.

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11-16-2011, 08:10 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dulzhok View Post
I think the only draft pick Trotz has ever had that was real top line talent was Radulov. And he did pretty well in a secondary role as a 20 year old. I think Wilson is the 2nd most talent offensive player to come through our system. A guy like Erat can produce like a frist liner from time-to-time, but he's more suited for the 2nd line.

Hartnell scored 25g in a 2nd/3rd line capacity on the Preds. He's good, but doesn't have top-end talent. He was able to score 30 in Philly with highly skilled linemates, but his type of play leads to sporadic goal output (similar to Hornqvist). He scored 14g the next year.
This will sound a little funny but Legwand was on an 80 point pace or thereabouts before he got injured. Funny how he puts up good numbers when paired with talented players. When he isn't, he doesn't put up the same type of numbers. Go figure.

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11-16-2011, 09:03 PM
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This will sound a little funny but Legwand was on an 80 point pace or thereabouts before he got injured. Funny how he puts up good numbers when paired with talented players. When he isn't, he doesn't put up the same type of numbers. Go figure.
It's funny because we know that's not a accurate gauge of Legwand's offensive abilities. You are using a tiny sample size. He was playing pretty well, but you will have spurts when you lead the team in every ice-time category, and guys like Smith/Wilson are really clicking. Legwand has played on a scoringline for most of his career with a variety of linemates. He had one decent season offensively. Scored over 20 once. He has shown very little ability to create offense on his own. He plays generic in the offensive zone.. poor shot, average vision, gives up the puck up easy, rarely wins battles, only goes hard to the net when he feels like it (early in the season & playoffs). He was never, nor will ever been a true first line player. True first liners don't have 40 game goal drougts. That was the only extended time he spent on the 3rd line, which just drove home the idea that he can't create offense on his own. It aint Trotz's fault. It's not Legwand's fault. It just amazing me that 12 years into someone's career, people keep waiting / hoping / making excuses for him to turn into a PPG player.

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11-16-2011, 09:22 PM
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Guys, if you want to argue back and forth about Legwand do so in a thread that isn't about Colin Wilson/the way Barry Trotz develops players. Please.

In fact, I'd rather keep this to "The Development of Colin Wilson" to be honest. If you want to compare his development to other players who have come up under Trotz that's fine, but when your conversation is solely about a player not named Wilson it is off topic.

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11-16-2011, 10:01 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 101st_fan View Post
Harnell's goal totals since 2005-06:
25,22,24,30,14, 24 and 6 so far this season .... an average of over 23 goals per season between 2005-2011. Rather productive by any standard.
Productive is nice. And he's just that, productive. Not especially productive or unproductive, just productive. Like a Jeep. He's not the best top 10 pick. Nor is he the worst. And that 23 gpy is solid in isolation (his 23g/47a pace over that period would place him right around the 75th percentile of forwards who played more than half a season), but that's significantly muted by the fact that at age 22, he was on pace for 25 goals. At 23, he scored 25. And short of an anomolous first year with the Flyers, that year represents his peak.

Which brings me back to my point - he showed strong initial production. But his offensive game failed to take the next step. We can argue back and forth as to whether he was ever capable of taking the next step. But, as I've said before, it's not a stretch to say that his development isn't something Trotz should be lauded for. Taking a top 6 pick and turning him into someone that barely cracks the top 100 most productive forwards in a given year isn't noteworthy.

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11-16-2011, 10:24 PM
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With the aforementioned qualifiers, that benching (and the thought process that followed it) does seem to have caused Colin to re-evaluate his approach and elevate his play. He is WAY more consistent in terms of effort and focus to this point in the season, even if it is not always reflected by the stats-- I hope he can maintain that focus and intensity thru the entire NHL season and beyond. If so, he will be realizing the great potential scouts saw for him, and this fanbase desperately wants to see.

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11-16-2011, 11:09 PM
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I think Wilson has the ability to dictate offensive play, as evidenced by the GWG last night (among other times). Radulov, IMO, was the only other Preds draft pick capable of that. Smith might have that ability, but we need to see more...

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11-17-2011, 02:23 AM
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This is a big year for Colin and so far he has come out the gates looking great. If he would have struggled all year I would have been genuinely concerned. But we have already seen what he can do for a stretch of games. Now he just has to put together night in and night out.

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11-17-2011, 03:21 AM
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IMHO Wilson has not had a bad game yet

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Old
11-17-2011, 06:11 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ThirdManIn View Post
Guys, if you want to argue back and forth about Legwand do so in a thread that isn't about Colin Wilson/the way Barry Trotz develops players. Please.

In fact, I'd rather keep this to "The Development of Colin Wilson" to be honest. If you want to compare his development to other players who have come up under Trotz that's fine, but when your conversation is solely about a player not named Wilson it is off topic.
And yet you don't mention a thing about Hartnell or Radulov in this thread?

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