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Should Doug Wilson shop for a 3rd line winger (TDL p/u)

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Old
11-17-2011, 11:29 AM
  #226
hockeyball
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Originally Posted by stalockrox View Post
Where did you read that Comeau doesn't want to be there anymore? I know the Islanders aren't exactly sold on him, but are people assuming this because he's been a healthy scratch? Same with Okposo, who just signed a long term deal.

Anyhow, it would be a very bad move on their part to trade Okposo. Comeau may be available but like Pinkfloyd, I'm not so sure he's the answer for this Sharks team. He may turn his game around here, and he's young with upside - but the Sharks should be looking for a 3rd liner who's a good PKer (neither Comeau or Okposo kill penalties) who can put up some points. If they're going to make a trade with the NYI I still want Neilsen

Although, if they were dumb enough to send them both to SJ for Demers + a pick I'd probably be for it too...but they can't, there's that whole salary cap floor they have to stay above (among a whole lot of other reason why they wouldn't make that trade).
It doesn't really matter, we can't afford both, i just looked. But getting Okposo + pick for Demers would work well.

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11-17-2011, 11:42 AM
  #227
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Originally Posted by Pinkfloyd View Post
Why would we want to bring in people like Okposo and Comeau for our purposes? Okposo only has 3 assists this year and Comeau as one said hasn't scored this season. Both are -7.

I'd rather go after a guy like Samuel Pahlsson from Columbus or David Moss from Calgary. You bring either of those Islander boys in, you either have to drop someone from our formidable top six or put one of the acquisitions on the 3rd line. Neither of the potential Islander acquisitions are reliable enough to unseat anyone in the top six. And neither of those same guys are any good at being 3rd line players on our team since it is not offensively-inclined and they are not defensive-oriented players.
It's been 15 games. Judging anyone based on their boxcar stats so far is ridiculous. I suppose Eric Staal is worthless too? Okposo was phenomenal last season. He faced some of the toughest competition of anyone on the Islanders and began the majority of his shifts in the defensive zone yet still managed to post the highest on-ice shot differential on the team. Pretty much an identical story the season before. Comeau sucks, no argument there.

Not only is Okposo an awesome two-way player and completely capable of contributing at both ends of the rink but I have no idea where you're getting this idea that the Sharks' third line is "defensively-oriented." Handzus has a reputation as a defensive player but right now that line is being used as a third scoring line which they're obviously not nearly talented enough to effectively comprise as currently constructed. McLellan has exclusively used whatever line Marleau's been on against the opposing team's best forward line with the Sharks' second line drawing second-tier competition. The Sharks need to be looking for talented scorers on their third line unless McLellan drastically changes the way he's been using his forwards since arriving in San Jose three years ago.

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11-17-2011, 12:18 PM
  #228
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Originally Posted by hockeyball View Post
It doesn't really matter, we can't afford both, i just looked. But getting Okposo + pick for Demers would work well.
I was wrong - Comeau was killing penalties last year...

I'm really against trading Demers, the defensive depth the Sharks have now is going to be needed during the season and the playoffs. That being said, I'm a big Okposo fan and I'd think the Sharks would probably make that trade, but I really don't think the Isles will move him.

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11-17-2011, 12:26 PM
  #229
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McKenzie said the big reason why the Islanders are looking to move players who are underachieving is because they want to give those roster spots to Justin DiBenedetto and David Ullstrom. The Islanders are desperate for offense and Okposo in particular is providing nothing. He and Comeau seem to be playing themselves off the team, and Garth Snow isn't dumb enough not to try to get something for them.

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11-17-2011, 04:11 PM
  #230
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Originally Posted by Lebanezer View Post
McKenzie said the big reason why the Islanders are looking to move players who are underachieving is because they want to give those roster spots to Justin DiBenedetto and David Ullstrom. The Islanders are desperate for offense and Okposo in particular is providing nothing. He and Comeau seem to be playing themselves off the team, and Garth Snow isn't dumb enough not to try to get something for them.
Why don't the Isles just get rid of Comeau, Pandolfo and/or Rolston? Keep Okposo and bring up Ullstrom and DiBenedetto? Very large mistake trading Okposo.

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11-17-2011, 04:47 PM
  #231
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Originally Posted by Lebanezer View Post
McKenzie said the big reason why the Islanders are looking to move players who are underachieving is because they want to give those roster spots to Justin DiBenedetto and David Ullstrom. The Islanders are desperate for offense and Okposo in particular is providing nothing. He and Comeau seem to be playing themselves off the team, and Garth Snow isn't dumb enough not to try to get something for them.
Okposo currently has an on-ice shooting percentage of 2.27%. No one who played at least 40 games in the NHL last year had an on-ice SH% that low; the vast majority were not even remotely close and that includes all of the talentless goons from Shelley to Parros who managed to dress in that many games. He's just been incredibly unlucky so far but there's no chance that persists. Snow would be stupid to trade him at this point when his value around the league, where it's obvious a lot of GMs only care about goal and point production and are willing to judge a player on that criteria regardless of the sample size, is likely at an all-time low. Of course, Snow isn't the brightest GM and the Isles are pretty awful so if the Sharks can take advantage of that situation and pry away Okposo it would be terrific.

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11-17-2011, 06:24 PM
  #232
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Okposo is a terrific player and if we could get him for Demers we should be all over that. But like stalockrox said, Nielsen would be absolutely ideal (but the Isles would never trade him).

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11-17-2011, 06:31 PM
  #233
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11-17-2011, 06:31 PM
  #234
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Les Wynan View Post
It's been 15 games. Judging anyone based on their boxcar stats so far is ridiculous. I suppose Eric Staal is worthless too? Okposo was phenomenal last season. He faced some of the toughest competition of anyone on the Islanders and began the majority of his shifts in the defensive zone yet still managed to post the highest on-ice shot differential on the team. Pretty much an identical story the season before. Comeau sucks, no argument there.

Not only is Okposo an awesome two-way player and completely capable of contributing at both ends of the rink but I have no idea where you're getting this idea that the Sharks' third line is "defensively-oriented." Handzus has a reputation as a defensive player but right now that line is being used as a third scoring line which they're obviously not nearly talented enough to effectively comprise as currently constructed. McLellan has exclusively used whatever line Marleau's been on against the opposing team's best forward line with the Sharks' second line drawing second-tier competition. The Sharks need to be looking for talented scorers on their third line unless McLellan drastically changes the way he's been using his forwards since arriving in San Jose three years ago.
Okposo played 38 games last year. Even if he was phenomenal, which 5 goals and 15 assists isn't, it is far too few of games to make such a distinction. You highly overrate him. His defensive game is not that good and he hasn't even cracked 20 goals yet in a season.

As for the third line, Mitchell is a defensive player at this stage in his career. He's certainly not a scoring line player and the team has made it clear that while contributions on the score sheet would be nice, that is not their primary concern...in other words, they're a shutdown/energy line.

I would actually prefer if they were a scoring line but that wasn't their intent when they started this year. Handzus is a shutdown center. Mitchell is a defensive player but nowhere near a high level. McGinn has been a two-way player his entire career before hitting the NHL.

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Old
11-17-2011, 08:44 PM
  #235
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Originally Posted by Pinkfloyd View Post
Okposo played 38 games last year. Even if he was phenomenal, which 5 goals and 15 assists isn't, it is far too few of games to make such a distinction. You highly overrate him. His defensive game is not that good and he hasn't even cracked 20 goals yet in a season.

As for the third line, Mitchell is a defensive player at this stage in his career. He's certainly not a scoring line player and the team has made it clear that while contributions on the score sheet would be nice, that is not their primary concern...in other words, they're a shutdown/energy line.

I would actually prefer if they were a scoring line but that wasn't their intent when they started this year. Handzus is a shutdown center. Mitchell is a defensive player but nowhere near a high level. McGinn has been a two-way player his entire career before hitting the NHL.
Like I said, his performance was pretty much identical the season before when he played 80 games and 118 GP is plenty to conclude that a player's underlying numbers are indicative of his actual talent level. From 2009 through this season, Okposo has been playing some of the toughest minutes on the Islanders and starting more of his shifts in his own end than the opponent's yet has managed a positive on-ice shot differential on teams that sucked at puck possession. Sure his possession numbers haven't yet translated into gaudy offensive statistics but he provides a ton of value with his two-way game and as the numbers prove he absolutely is that good defensively.

I understand that the third line is made up of "defensive" players but they aren't being used in defensive situations. The Handzus line has pretty much exclusively faced opposing third and fourth lines. It's not like Vancouver where Malhotra is buried with defensive zone starts against top competition to supply the twins with butter-soft minutes because McLellan rightfully trusts Marleau, Thornton and Pavelski to go head-to-head against other teams' top lines and win the matchup. The way McLellan uses his forwards (essentially a carbon copy of the Detroit model that he's used ever since he arrived in San Jose) the third line is useless if constructed to purely be defensively proficient although I do agree that it's questionable at best as to whether Doug Wilson understands that. The Handzus signing indicated to me that he was trying to copy Vancouver but Todd apparently didn't get the memo.

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