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Tripe! (Bucky Gleason Article)

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Old
11-17-2011, 06:27 PM
  #101
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Originally Posted by skibum View Post
Bucky is such a tool. It's painfully obvious from his spiteful little jabs that the players don't much care for him and thus never give him any decent information. For years, he has been the biggest hater and I honestly don't know why he doesn't move on to report for a new locale at this point.
I have to be honest, I don't see how "his spiteful little jabs," whatever they may be, indicate that "the players don't much care for him and thus never give him any decent information." To the contrary, it looks like somebody inside the locker room, or at least someone who has regular access to the locker room, gave Bucky some very interesting information about how the "boys" really feel about Miller.

On the other hand, we could believe that someone who went to j-school and wrote for the AP doesn't have any source on this issue and decided to make the whole thing up. That seems far more reasonable to me.

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11-17-2011, 06:52 PM
  #102
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Boy, I really miss the days when the Sabres had that loveable, happy-go-lucky Dominik Hasek. Everyone always talked about how he was their best friend on the team.
Good teams aren't always made up of people who are great friends.

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11-17-2011, 07:50 PM
  #103
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I read the first 2 pages, then moved to end to post.

I'll further Dugman's comment.

I've been following hockey longer than some of you have been alive. Not that it makes me an expert, by any means, in fact, I'm still a novice on many parts of the game. But two things I have come to realize in sports:

1) A lot of professional athletes in all sports have "issues" just like the rest of humanity.

You could just as easily fill all-star rosters in all major sports with misanthropes, alcoholics, adulterers, bad parents, bigots/racists, etc., as you could fill a roster from model citizens. (The after-game-party scene from "North Dallas Forty" with "Preacher" and his trophy wife pitching the upcoming church revival is a fitting visual.)

2) Those shortcomings don't objectively diminish that individual / his sports accomplishments. It is left to the fan / writer / his family members to determine if it subjectively diminishes that individual or his accomplishments.

Pretty sure the following goaltenders weren't viewed as cuddly bundles of joy:

Hasek (cited above)
Ed Belfour
Tom Barrasso
Billy Smith
Jacques Plante
Terry Sawchuk
Glen Hall

And that's just off the top of my head.

(From the OP "article" quoted,) the logical inference is the 4 teams each year who make the Conf finals are the ones who all love each other the most, and file the callouses from each others feet singing Kum By Ya around campfires while making s'mores for each other. I don't think so.

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11-17-2011, 08:30 PM
  #104
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Originally Posted by brian_griffin View Post
I read the first 2 pages, then moved to end to post.

I'll further Dugman's comment.

I've been following hockey longer than some of you have been alive. Not that it makes me an expert, by any means, in fact, I'm still a novice on many parts of the game. But two things I have come to realize in sports:

1) A lot of professional athletes in all sports have "issues" just like the rest of humanity.

You could just as easily fill all-star rosters in all major sports with misanthropes, alcoholics, adulterers, bad parents, bigots/racists, etc., as you could fill a roster from model citizens. (The after-game-party scene from "North Dallas Forty" with "Preacher" and his trophy wife pitching the upcoming church revival is a fitting visual.)

2) Those shortcomings don't objectively diminish that individual / his sports accomplishments. It is left to the fan / writer / his family members to determine if it subjectively diminishes that individual or his accomplishments.

Pretty sure the following goaltenders weren't viewed as cuddly bundles of joy:

Hasek (cited above)
Ed Belfour
Tom Barrasso
Billy Smith
Jacques Plante
Terry Sawchuk
Glen Hall

And that's just off the top of my head.

(From the OP "article" quoted,) the logical inference is the 4 teams each year who make the Conf finals are the ones who all love each other the most, and file the callouses from each others feet singing Kum By Ya around campfires while making s'mores for each other. I don't think so.
This post is akin to a good shift from Kaleta. What effort!

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11-17-2011, 08:53 PM
  #105
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Quote:
Originally Posted by brian_griffin View Post
I read the first 2 pages, then moved to end to post.

I'll further Dugman's comment.

I've been following hockey longer than some of you have been alive. Not that it makes me an expert, by any means, in fact, I'm still a novice on many parts of the game. But two things I have come to realize in sports:

1) A lot of professional athletes in all sports have "issues" just like the rest of humanity.

You could just as easily fill all-star rosters in all major sports with misanthropes, alcoholics, adulterers, bad parents, bigots/racists, etc., as you could fill a roster from model citizens. (The after-game-party scene from "North Dallas Forty" with "Preacher" and his trophy wife pitching the upcoming church revival is a fitting visual.)

2) Those shortcomings don't objectively diminish that individual / his sports accomplishments. It is left to the fan / writer / his family members to determine if it subjectively diminishes that individual or his accomplishments.

Pretty sure the following goaltenders weren't viewed as cuddly bundles of joy:

Hasek (cited above)
Ed Belfour
Tom Barrasso
Billy Smith
Jacques Plante
Terry Sawchuk
Glen Hall

And that's just off the top of my head.

(From the OP "article" quoted,) the logical inference is the 4 teams each year who make the Conf finals are the ones who all love each other the most, and file the callouses from each others feet singing Kum By Ya around campfires while making s'mores for each other. I don't think so.
Whoa whoa whoa. Your assertion here is that hockey and professional sports is played by humans. That simply cannot be true.

Firstly, we know they make a lot of money, even on two way contracts, compared to the rest of us workaday losers. Immediately, that makes them superhuman. Because with money, comes invulnerability to the foils and foibles that makes us people.

Secondly, that also draws the DANGEROUS conclusion that we all perform perfectly every day. I mean, I DO, but most don't. Ask my boss. I'm positive he'll back me up.

Lastly, Barrasso was an a-hole. He flipped me off once. So did Kevin Lowe, but that's immaterial (True Story).

Seriously though. As I said in an earlier post, the opinions of Bucky, Harrington, Sullivan, and for that matter Esmonde are irrelevant to your daily lives. If you choose to drop your quarter, and read their crap, then its YOUR problem. Just like I said earlier when I indicated I had made it mine.

Don't like em? Eff em. The internet is HUGE. You can get your misinformation, correct information, and disinformation elsewhere I guess.

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Old
11-17-2011, 10:07 PM
  #106
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Originally Posted by brian_griffin View Post

2) Those shortcomings don't objectively diminish that individual / his sports accomplishments. It is left to the fan / writer / his family members to determine if it subjectively diminishes that individual or his accomplishments.
well said

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11-18-2011, 02:34 AM
  #107
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If I'm a teammate of his, the shrug would be the thing that did it for me. I can't not look at The Shrug and think that behind closed doors, that might be a little more vocal.

I like Miller a lot, but when I see The Shrug, and the "WE DIDNT DO XXXX" after losses where he's been subpar, or the almost aloof attitude he has developed recently...I can't help but think there's a little bit of fire with this smoke, even though the arsonist is poor at what he does.

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11-18-2011, 06:06 AM
  #108
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If I'm a teammate of his, the shrug would be the thing that did it for me. I can't not look at The Shrug and think that behind closed doors, that might be a little more vocal.

I like Miller a lot, but when I see The Shrug, and the "WE DIDNT DO XXXX" after losses where he's been subpar, or the almost aloof attitude he has developed recently...I can't help but think there's a little bit of fire with this smoke, even though the arsonist is poor at what he does.
And yet other NHL goalies do an equivalent shrug. Whomever played goalie for Winnipeg in our last game against them comes to mind. It was the same shrug. No one has any idea what "The Shrug" actually means, so putting anything negative into it, is pure speculation.

Maybe Miller can do something unique after he's scored on next time. I say he stands up, takes his mask off, and drinks from his water bottle. After that, he can put his mask back on, and hunch over with his arms on his pads. Never mind, that sounds an awful lot like he's tossing his teammates under the bus there. It's bound to cause locker room problems.

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11-18-2011, 07:50 AM
  #109
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http://thegoalieguild.com/2010/01/me...body-language/

Someone needs to print this out and stick it in Miller's locker if this really is an issue within the team.

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11-18-2011, 08:10 AM
  #110
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Originally Posted by Jim Bob View Post
http://thegoalieguild.com/2010/01/me...body-language/

Someone needs to print this out and stick it in Miller's locker if this really is an issue within the team.
And there's the rub. Nobody KNOWS that there's an issue at all. People are assuming that based on baseless innuendo by Gleason, and 400 amateur psychologists that someone think they can figure that out by watching 3 hockey games a week,

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11-18-2011, 08:11 AM
  #111
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Originally Posted by Jim Bob View Post
http://thegoalieguild.com/2010/01/me...body-language/

Someone needs to print this out and stick it in Miller's locker if this really is an issue within the team.
True. It's always bugged me that he throws his arms up or stares at the teammate that accidentally deflected the puck so he couldn't save it. I understand his frustrations, but it happens in every game. It was an accident. It wasn't on purpose to score on his own goalie, but Miller looks like and comes off as this holier than thou goalie that would've stopped it had it not been deflected.

When I played goal in pick up games and let in a bad goal one guy from NYC would always come up to me and say, "Hey, at least nobody died!" and would just laugh. It would make me laugh. **** happens. Deal with it.

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11-18-2011, 08:18 AM
  #112
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True. It's always bugged me that he throws his arms up or stares at the teammate that accidentally deflected the puck so he couldn't save it. I understand his frustrations, but it happens in every game. It was an accident. It wasn't on purpose to score on his own goalie, but Miller looks like and comes off as this holier than thou goalie that would've stopped it had it not been deflected.

When I played goal in pick up games and let in a bad goal one guy from NYC would always come up to me and say, "Hey, at least nobody died!" and would just laugh. It would make me laugh. **** happens. Deal with it.
But then again, you're assuming what his actions may mean. He could just be frustrated that the goal was scored. I've seen him do that when the only one at fault was him. He's been doing this for how long? Why is it only such an issue now? Why wasn't it an issue before?

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11-18-2011, 08:30 AM
  #113
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Originally Posted by BowieSabresFan View Post
But then again, you're assuming what his actions may mean. He could just be frustrated that the goal was scored. I've seen him do that when the only one at fault was him. He's been doing this for how long? Why is it only such an issue now? Why wasn't it an issue before?
Because people didn't have an agenda before.

My favorite 'shrug' comment came after a double deflection goal against last year. Shot -> skate -> stick -> corner. Seeing eye shot, not a goalie alive that could have done anything to stop it.

Miller shrugged, and my first thought was "well, can't say I blame him". You get frustrated as a player when you're doing the right thing and in the right position, and fluky things happen. Looked in the GDT here, and some knob was moaning about how Miller was showing up his defenseman , yadda yadda.

Complete nonsense. Everyone on the ice saw that it was a fluke, and it was clearly a WTF moment. It's stuff like this that makes me discount a lot of the anti-Miller comments, because so many are just damn unreasonable and don't make a lick of sense.

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11-18-2011, 08:34 AM
  #114
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Nobody "knows" anything one way or the other. If you want to talk "know," go discuss the stats page.

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11-18-2011, 08:37 AM
  #115
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But then again, you're assuming what his actions may mean. He could just be frustrated that the goal was scored. I've seen him do that when the only one at fault was him. He's been doing this for how long? Why is it only such an issue now? Why wasn't it an issue before?
Yes that is my assumption because to my recollection I don't ever recall Miller throwing up his arms when he was at fault and let in a softee. But I'm not trying to bash on him as I think that we cannot win the Cup without him. I'm more in support of what the article is stating. Some players may take it one way and some the others. Everyone has their own perceptions and personalities.

Either way, if someone else deflected it, screened him, or he let in a bad goal deal with it. Don't show emotion. Just get up, take a drink, go for a skate. Whatever. But emotions has always been Miller's Achilles heel, so much so he went to a sports psychologist early in his career and may still be going to one.

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11-18-2011, 08:39 AM
  #116
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Wow...Bucky is a master troll.

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11-18-2011, 09:13 AM
  #117
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Yes that is my assumption because to my recollection I don't ever recall Miller throwing up his arms when he was at fault and let in a softee.
Oh, come on. He's demonstrative when he knows it's on him. Go watch his reaction to Florida's first goal in the home loss--he's clearly pissed at himself (he also ripped himself for that goal after the game...accountability and whatnot). He also broke his stick over a crossbar after surrendering a goal he thought he should've saved a few years back.

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11-18-2011, 09:44 AM
  #118
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Oh, come on. He's demonstrative when he knows it's on him. Go watch his reaction to Florida's first goal in the home loss--he's clearly pissed at himself (he also ripped himself for that goal after the game...accountability and whatnot). He also broke his stick over a crossbar after surrendering a goal he thought he should've saved a few years back.
OK, so twice.

Like I said I'd rather see him do nothing than be demonstrative about it, like the article was referring to. But just like how other players may perceive it because that is there personality, maybe that is the way he has to deal with it.

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11-18-2011, 10:51 AM
  #119
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I keep thinking about a teary eyed, emotional Ryan Miller in the locker room... and Robyn Regehr thinking "what the **** is this ****..."

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11-18-2011, 11:01 AM
  #120
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I keep thinking about a teary eyed, emotional Ryan Miller in the locker room... and Robyn Regehr thinking "what the **** is this ****..."
And giving him a B slap

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11-18-2011, 11:17 AM
  #121
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But then again, you're assuming what his actions may mean. He could just be frustrated that the goal was scored. I've seen him do that when the only one at fault was him. He's been doing this for how long? Why is it only such an issue now? Why wasn't it an issue before?
It was. I've hated it since he got here. It's not a reason for me to not want him here or for me to think any less of him as a goaltender or anything, but it does annoy the hell out of me.

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11-18-2011, 11:56 AM
  #122
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I keep thinking about a teary eyed, emotional Ryan Miller in the locker room... and Robyn Regehr thinking "what the **** is this ****..."
I can just see Jimmy Dugan right now. "Are you crying? Are you crying? ARE YOU CRYING? There's no crying! THERE'S NO CRYING IN HOCKEY!


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11-18-2011, 01:16 PM
  #123
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How do you guys explain the stare downs of his defenseman? Is it just him just saying that one's on me? Because to me that sure all hell looks like him saying wtf to his defenseman. Miller defenders will say what they want, but the guy is a bit of an arrogant jerk, and it's always been there.

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11-18-2011, 01:25 PM
  #124
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How do you guys explain the stare downs of his defenseman? Is it just him just saying that one's on me? Because to me that sure all hell looks like him saying wtf to his defenseman. Miller defenders will say what they want, but the guy is a bit of an arrogant jerk, and it's always been there.
I stare down my teammates when they do something stupid. They do the same to me.

Guess what? We get along fine.

It's painfully obvious to me that most of you guys have never played team sports. It's not all happy kumbaya songs and lavender scented incense in the locker room. Teammates argue. They fight. They yell at each other.

And they still win games.

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11-18-2011, 01:25 PM
  #125
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OK, so twice.

Like I said I'd rather see him do nothing than be demonstrative about it, like the article was referring to. But just like how other players may perceive it because that is there personality, maybe that is the way he has to deal with it.
Ok, show me some proof of him definitively staring down his defensemen. I think people have tried so hard to negatively construe what the shrug means--and, TBH, I can't believe it's had this much mileage because it's so absurd. Does it mean, "Sorry, I didn't see it." Does it mean, "Weird deflection and I couldn't adjust." Is it a personalized quirk that he does habitually to tell himself it was a fluke and there wasn't anything he could do about it? Nobody knows what it means, yet so many want to argue with certainty that he's showing up his teammates, and he's the worst teammate ever, and on and on.

We'd all like the goaltender to show no emotion when he gets scored on, but players are going to be themselves. I'd like Thomas Vanek not to mope and stare at the ceiling so much (he's reduced it, but it sometimes reappears). I'd like Derek Roy to not act like he won the Stanley Cup when he scores a run-of-the-mil regular season goal. I'd like to see Pat Kaleta not stick his chin out and act like an ******* so much. I'd like Nate Gerbe not to yap at the ref so much. If one wants to subjectively dislike a player for reasons like these, go for it. But I think this whole discussion of how his teammates feel about him, or whether he's a quality teammate is a bit silly.

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